How many ranks can I invest in UMD?

[theboss]

As far as I know, when a class doesn't have a key skill he can invest 0.5 point each level instead of the normal 1. Correct me if im wrong.
So how many ranks can I invest in UMD with the following build : Fighter 2, Exotic weapon master 3, Revenant Blade 5, Hexblade 3, Swordsage 3?

ty in advance

[Gruftzwerg]

As far as I know, when a class doesn't have a key skill he can invest 0.5 point each level instead of the normal 1. Correct me if im wrong.
So how many ranks can I invest in UMD with the following build : Fighter 2, Exotic weapon master 3, Revenant Blade 5, Hexblade 3, Swordsage 3?

ty in advance

For class skills you get 1 rank per point invested, for all other skills 0.5 ranks per point invested.

As far as I can see, none of your classes has UMD as class skill and thus your 16th character lvl gives you a cap of 8 ranks in UMD.

Humans (and Doppelgangers) can take the feat "Able Learner" to get the full benefit for points in crossclass skills, but they still have the same cap (in your chase still max 8, it would just save you 8 skill points at the cost of a feat).

[Fliggl]

At level 16 you can have (16+3)/2= 9 1/2 ranks in a cross class skill.
See table 3-2 in PHB p22 for more info

Keep in mind that your build is ilegal when built in this order. Read the prerequisites of the exotic weapon master prestige class again :)

Edit:
For class skills you get 1 rank per point invested, for all other skills 0.5 ranks per point invested.

As far as I can see, none of your classes has UMD as class skill and thus your 16th character lvl gives you a cap of 8 ranks in UMD

You missed the “3+level“

[Elkad]

At level 16 you can have (16+3)/2= 9 1/2 ranks in a cross class skill.
See table 3-2 in PHB p22 for more info

Keep in mind that your build is ilegal when built in this order. Read the prerequisites of the exotic weapon master prestige class again :)

Edit:

You missed the “3+“

The 3+ doesn't apply to cross-class skills. Specifically limited to half CL.
Nevermind, I'm wrong. Half "that number". So 9.5

The maximum rank in a class skill is the character’s level + 3. If it’s a cross-class skill, the maximum rank is half of that number (do not round up or down).

[theboss]

For class skills you get 1 rank per point invested, for all other skills 0.5 ranks per point invested.

As far as I can see, none of your classes has UMD as class skill and thus your 16th character lvl gives you a cap of 8 ranks in UMD.

Humans (and Doppelgangers) can take the feat "Able Learner" to get the full benefit for points in crossclass skills, but they still have the same cap (in your chase still max 8, it would just save you 8 skill points at the cost of a feat).


At level 16 you can have (16+3)/2= 9 1/2 ranks in a cross class skill.
See table 3-2 in PHB p22 for more info

Keep in mind that your build is ilegal when built in this order. Read the prerequisites of the exotic weapon master prestige class again :)

Edit:

You missed the “3+level“


Thanks all, My DM said that UMD skill cannot be taken unless you have it as a class skill, So I had to check it out myself.

[Fliggl]

Thanks all, My DM said that UMD skill cannot be taken unless you have it as a class skill, So I had to check it out myself.

Maybe because it's a “trained only“ skill. But this means you have to invest ranks to be “trained“

[Gruftzwerg]

At level 16 you can have (16+3)/2= 9 1/2 ranks in a cross class skill.
See table 3-2 in PHB p22 for more info

Keep in mind that your build is ilegal when built in this order. Read the prerequisites of the exotic weapon master prestige class again :)

Edit:

You missed the “3+level“

oh yeah..^^ it's getting late here. I'm sry..

[DrMotives]

Thanks all, My DM said that UMD skill cannot be taken unless you have it as a class skill, So I had to check it out myself.

That sounds like the 3.0 rule that 3.5 got rid of, "exclusive skills". In a few cases, certain skills are off-limits for putting points into if they aren't on your class list. 3.5 doesn't have that anymore, but it still does have "trained only". All "trained only" means is that until you have at least 1 whole rank in a skill, you aren't allowed to make a skill check. You can still buy that rank crossclass.

[ShurikVch]

Thanks all, My DM said that UMD skill cannot be taken unless you have it as a class skill, So I had to check it out myself.Is it too late to slightly tweak your build?

For example, Fighter-Survivalist - from Dragon #310 - have UMD as class skill (lose Handle Animals, Intimidate, and Ride; slightly different bonus feat list)

Also, feats - Apprentice (spellcaster), Flexible Mind, and Wedded to History - could give you UMD as class skill too

[theboss]

Is it too late to slightly tweak your build?

For example, Fighter-Survivalist - from Dragon #310 - have UMD as class skill (lose Handle Animals, Intimidate, and Ride; slightly different bonus feat list)

Also, feats - Apprentice (spellcaster), Flexible Mind, and Wedded to History - could give you UMD as class skill too

I just wanted to know how hard it's going to be for me to cast Rhino's Rush. If I have 18 cha it's going to be fine DC. I'm happy with my build tho, thanks.

[Fouredged Sword]

I would check out your options for what item you are using for UMD to get that spell. The SRD has a shield that holds a scroll in the back, that can hold up to 4 casting and grants a reduction in cost to craft a scroll into it. Most weapons can hold a wand chamber and allow you to UMD a wand while holding it.

Do not that many items default to a standard action. Read the rules carefully about what the type of item you are using requires. You may lose out of the swift action casting time.

[theboss]

Sorry to bring this back top again, but can I have some RAW statments for this? Just in case my DM won't approve.

[Bebbit]

Sorry to bring this back top again, but can I have some RAW statments for this? Just in case my DM won't approve.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/skillsSummary.htm

[Deophaun]

It's really difficult to give RAW citations that state a rule only exists in your DM's head. You're trying to prove a negative. The designers aren't going to waste valuable page space to say "Use Magic Device works just like any other trained-only skill; you can use it as long as you put at least one rank into it regardless of whether it is a class skill or not."

[rrwoods]

He is probably remembering a 3.0 rule, as someone else pointed out. 3.0 had class-exclusive skills. 3.5 does not.

The best thing you could show him is the table in the PHB that says which skills are class and cross class. Note that UMD is a cross class skill for fighters.

[theboss]

That sounds like the 3.0 rule that 3.5 got rid of, "exclusive skills". In a few cases, certain skills are off-limits for putting points into if they aren't on your class list. 3.5 doesn't have that anymore, but it still does have "trained only". All "trained only" means is that until you have at least 1 whole rank in a skill, you aren't allowed to make a skill check. You can still buy that rank crossclass.


He is probably remembering a 3.0 rule, as someone else pointed out. 3.0 had class-exclusive skills. 3.5 does not.

The best thing you could show him is the table in the PHB that says which skills are class and cross class. Note that UMD is a cross class skill for fighters.

Thank you, you are right. That's the best explanation I can give.

[ksbsnowowl]

That sounds like the 3.0 rule that 3.5 got rid of, "exclusive skills". In a few cases, certain skills are off-limits for putting points into if they aren't on your class list. 3.5 doesn't have that anymore, but it still does have "trained only". All "trained only" means is that until you have at least 1 whole rank in a skill, you aren't allowed to make a skill check. You can still buy that rank crossclass.

Close. Half a rank is actually enough to be considered trained.. It just don't give you a modifier to the roll, since it isn't a full rank.