Tactics for Opposing Druid Factions?

[Palanan]

Imagine a scenario in which one group of druids is using their skills and magic for large-scale industrial applications, i.e. stone shape to build walls, soften earth and stone to facilitate diverting streams, etc.

Another druidic sect is violently opposed to this activity, seeing it as a perversion of the natural order, and they’re making sporadic attacks on the first group’s centers of production.

Assume that most of the druids on both sides will be fifth through tenth level, and assume that this conflict is waged exclusively with druidic magic—both factions are too prideful to call in any other traditions of magic.

Given this, what sorts of tactics would develop in the clash of druid factions?

[Hellpyre]

I'd imagine a lot of intrigue with Wild Shaped spys, burning of sanctuarys, and straight-up physical ambushes would be prevelant. If one side is primarily industrial, I expect that they would use large scale destruction, and the primarily naturalist side would use more subtle sabotage (accelerating wear on structures through creating and freezing water, for example).

[Psyren]

The industrial ones would probably use a lot of elemental themed magic (earth and water in particular) since they're already using that to terraform the place. The other group would probably be using plants and aniimals (especially plants) to interfere with their work and clog things up. Hard to divert a stream to a waterwheel when it's mired and brackish, that sort of thing.

This of course is assuming one or both don't go too far and simply fall.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Hellpyre
If one side is primarily industrial….


Originally Posted by Psyren
The industrial ones….

Interesting responses so far, thanks.

Let me clarify: when I say “industrial,” I don’t mean steam and steel towers; I’m just using the term for large-scale production of certain items. The mass-producing druids (if that’s a better term) aren’t wholesale terraforming, just cooperating with a major geopolitical power to keep it stable and secure, which they see as helping the living world in the long run.

The eco-purist group sees large-scale cooperation with civilization as going too far down the slippery slope, so their aim is to disrupt production whenever possible. The two groups were always a little tense to begin with, and this will go fratricidal fast.


Originally Posted by Psyren
This of course is assuming one or both don't go too far and simply fall.

Hm. What do you mean by “fall”?

Maybe it’s just these boards, but that puts me in mind of a paladin. Although the eco-purists certainly consider the mass-producers to be on the road to a fall….


Originally Posted by Hellpyre
…the primarily naturalist side would use more subtle sabotage (accelerating wear on structures through creating and freezing water, for example).

And I especially like this idea. Practical and poetic at once.

[AngrySheep]

Ok, Im gonna go on and call one side the Builders and the other side the Hippies

Builders should be easy to track given the man-made land they leave behind :smallfrown:
Builders could be sieged since they, probably, fixed locations where they live :smallfrown:
Builders should have some communication method to request help should such siege take place :smallredface:
Builders should have more coin and thus better gear and provisions :smallsmile:
Builders could make use of industrial things in the clash, such as powder :smallsmile:
Builders could lay traps around their buildings, forged by magical means :smallsmile:
Builders could hire mercs, if their pride doesn't concern non-casters :smallsmile:

Hippies should be more attuned to the animals and the forest and should have more access to them :smallsmile:
Hippies could poison or sabotage the Builders goods, not the means of production itself to hamper Builders business (No ones likes a tool that easily breaks, or a apple that rots too fast) :smallsmile:
Hippies could spread rumors about builders, its not like the Builders could hurt them with such a thing. :smallsmile:
Hippies could make the surroundings of Builders homes and business to look grim, like filled with cobwebs and distorted trees, again a RP move :smallsmile:

PS.:
:smallsmile: for Positive
:smallfrown: for negative
:smallredface: for neutral

[Psyren]

Interesting responses so far, thanks.

Let me clarify: when I say “industrial,” I don’t mean steam and steel towers; I’m just using the term for large-scale production of certain items. The mass-producing druids (if that’s a better term) aren’t wholesale terraforming, just cooperating with a major geopolitical power to keep it stable and secure, which they see as helping the living world in the long run.

The eco-purist group sees large-scale cooperation with civilization as going too far down the slippery slope, so their aim is to disrupt production whenever possible. The two groups were always a little tense to begin with, and this will go fratricidal fast.

I know you didn't mean metal. I mentioned terraforming because you used the phrase "diverting streams."



Hm. What do you mean by “fall”?

Maybe it’s just these boards, but that puts me in mind of a paladin. Although the eco-purists certainly consider the mass-producers to be on the road to a fall….

Druids fall when they cease to revere nature. If neither group does, it suggests that both are in fact revering nature with their activities. Which necessarily begs the question - if neither side has stopped revering nature, why should there be conflict between them? Clearly whatever activities the industrial ones are doing, aren't sufficiently disruptive to nature, or they'd lose their powers. In other words, nature itself can be an impartial arbiter here. The druids can even check with nature to see how it feels about the whole thing.

[Zaq]

So, both sides have access to fundamentally the same spells and abilities, right? Druids are famous for being profoundly flexible, since most of their major abilities are chosen on a day-by-day basis (spells) or a round-by-round basis (Wild Shape) rather than a level-by-level basis (feats & etc.), so if they're basically the same level, they probably have basically the same tricks. It's basically just that the Builders (to use AngrySheep's term) are engaging in activities that the Hippies find to be distasteful. Meaning that the Builders are willing to do at least one class of thing that the Hippies aren't.

Now, that thing that they're doing isn't necessarily something that can or should be directly optimized as a combat strategy, but nonetheless, when you've got two groups starting from fundamentally the same place but one side is willing to do something that the other isn't, that would seem to indicate at least a slight tactical imbalance, no?

However, you're the GM, and you're in control. Is there something that the Hippies are willing to do that the Builders find to be distasteful? Actually, let me frame that more provocatively—what are the Hippies willing to do that the Builders aren't? If there isn't such a thing, then you should probably make such a thing. That could lead to a more interesting stalemate, which is of course ripe for disruption (in either direction!) by the PCs. That could be a fun campaign, or at least a fun arc to a campaign. But as described, unless the Hippies have some kind of raw numerical advantage (there are simply more of them, or they have access to more useful land, or they're just straight up higher level for some reason, or whatever), the Builders seem to have a nontrivial tactical advantage just from the fact that they can (theoretically) do anything the Hippies can do, but they also do things that the Hippies won't, and they probably have stronger alliances than the Hippies do (at least going strictly off of the description from the OP).

[Fouredged Sword]

Tamed faction - Modify nature to work with society
Untamed faction - Nature should be left untouched

I could see the Untamed faction using sickness and disease, not as a weapon to strike at the other druids themselves, but to strike at the workers and such who use their "impure modifications of the natural order." Cast contagion on a few rats and let them find their way into a work camp's larder and cause a now nonmagical outbreak of disease. It won't do much to stop the other druid faction itself, but it is really hard to stop and goes a long way to making it costly to encroach into any area they don't want you to. They don't need to defeat the opposing druids, they need to make their partners change their minds about cooperation.

Control weather to make extreme weather uphill from and dams or river diverting projects could cause chaos as well. A sudden flash flood from a foot of rainfall unexpectedly can flood a valley miles away.

The Untamed druids can afford to be more grossly destructive. They are on the offense, so can pick their targets, and are trying to restore nature to it's default state. That means if they cause a flash flood that wipes out a valley or two, well, that's a win condition for them because nature will regrow.

[AngrySheep]

They don't need to defeat the opposing druids, they need to make their partners change their minds about cooperation.

I think this is the heart of the Untamed/Hippies they don't need to target the Tamed/Builders, just the idea that their work is worthwhile and deteriorate the alliance the other faction has with whoever is in power