Heavy Gunner - Character Design

[casper5632]

I am trying to come up with a way to build a character that fights like a heavy gunner. What I am imagining in my head is a heavy gunner from Monster Hunter, but I cant figure out anything that fits the bill. I want to be able to sacrifice mobility for damage, but from what I have found any ranged user ends up zipping around the battlefield like a dancer firing off shots like legolas, or the rogue who ends up doing much more sneak attack damage than actual weapon damage.

My concept so far is a goblin/rogue with a crossbow, but I would need to take an entire feat just to get a 2 handed crossbow just for the theme. That combo seems to be the best way to do the most per hit damage, but hes extremely mobile to the point where it would be almost impossible to really ambush him. I am looking for class features or feats that allow me to sacrifice mobility for ranged damage, and the -5 attack for +10 damage seems fun, but it with all my other damage going up that would quickly end up being more of a burden than a blessing.

[RickAllison]

Is Unearthed Arcana allowed? Because the Gunsmith Artificer sounds right up your alley. He has to devote both action and bonus action to his Gunnery (so no bonus action Dash), he later gets a variety of alternative ammunition types, and I'm sure you could pick other options that work with the concept.

[8wGremlin]

Goblin Artificers are not bad actually, Gnomes are slightly better.
The gunsmith version has reasonably good damage as well, plus their 6th level companion can be awesome.
- I recommend either a giant eagle, or the crag cat (from storm kings thunder)

[PeteNutButter]

I'm not entirely sure I know what you're going for, but when I think heavy gunner, I think LMG, as in rapid fire. That makes me think fighter is the best class for this role, as he gets the most attacks. Crossbow expert seems like a good feat, although it lends itself better to hand crossbow. You can dump strength and wear heavy armor giving yourself a 20 ft base speed, if you really want that slow feel.

Crossbow expert allows you to fire in melee without issue and gives you a bonus action attack if you attack with a hand crossbow. To best utilize it you can start combat with the heavy crossbow, fire with it 1-2 times (level dependent) then draw the hand crossbow and shoot it twice. To me, it has the feel of firing your pistol when your rifle is out of ammo.

There is another route to get 4 attacks a round via the swift quiver spell. It allows two attacks on bonus actions, but requires either 17 levels in ranger or the much more feasible 10 levels in valor bard.

Also from a general power standpoint, the sharpshooter feat is extremely strong. The -5/+10 becomes free damage if you can regularly hit, which isn't hard by mid to late game.

[Slipperychicken]

Fighter, crossbow expert, wear heavy armor without meeting the strength requirement. That'll cut your speed and make you a hard, slow, high damaging turret.

[casper5632]

I am allowed to take UA content, but they dont want us taking entire classes from it.

I was originally looking at rogue, but I didnt realize rogues cant use 2 handed crossbows normally, and I dont want to waste an entire feat just to turn a 1d6 into a 1d8. This spec also doesnt lend itself well to the -5 attack +10 damage feat since the sneak attack damage would eclipse everything else and almost exclusively rely on just being able to hit the target when you have the chance at it.

I also looked into fighter, but there would be an entire level where I have 2 shots a turn available to me and be unable to use them because I couldent get the free reload feat yet. That entire level would be the most disappointing thing ever and would probably put me off to the character altogether. This spec would also benefit a LOT from the -5 attack +10 damage feat since I could rapid fire and potentially get 10-20-30-40 damage a turn. This spec would meet my demands the most but it wouldent be until level 8 that he actually played like a heavy gunner.

[8wGremlin]

You could re fluff the following: (similar to what I have done)
VHuman

Fighter (your choice, I took EK, for shield, and familiar) to 6,
then Revised ranger (dark stalker) 3 - take humanoids as your fav enemy

Take Archery as your fighting style, then defensive when ranger.
Take the feats: Crossbow mastery @1st, Sharp shooter @4th, + one more @ftr6

re-fluff your hand crossbow to be a big gun-like weapon, with a magazine, with a pump action cocking mechanism.
you need one hand to hold the handle, and the other to 'load' **** and steady it.

You get 2 attacks with Fighter 6 + 1 bonus action attack with crossbow mastery
+ 1 on the first round of the fight, with Dark Stalker Ranger
You can action surge for another 2 (possibly 3 depending on GM interpretation of the wording of revised ranger)

You advantage on all these attacks, for the first round, and have advantage on initiative.

If the AC of your opponent is around 15 then use sharpshooter -5/+10 aspect.

If you think that hand crossbows do small damage, think again.
You do 1d6+dex mod+10 (if sharp shooting) + magic item bonus +2 (if favoured enemy) = per shot.

I do 17+1d6 to any humanoid/shot with 6 shots in the first round (with +7 to hit with advantage) and then 3/round after that.

They call me the machine gun...

[Slipperychicken]

I also looked into fighter, but there would be an entire level where I have 2 shots a turn available to me and be unable to use them because I couldent get the free reload feat yet. That entire level would be the most disappointing thing ever and would probably put me off to the character altogether. This spec would also benefit a LOT from the -5 attack +10 damage feat since I could rapid fire and potentially get 10-20-30-40 damage a turn. This spec would meet my demands the most but it wouldent be until level 8 that he actually played like a heavy gunner.

The typical race for crossbow expert builds is variant human, using the free feat to take crossbow expert at level 1. That gets you two shots a turn right out the gate, and you can pick up sharpshooter at level 4.

[DarkKnightJin]

If UA is allowed, you could grab a Ranger (pick a race you think would work), and go for tue Monster Hunter/Slayer archetype. I know for sure it's in the UA Compendium. I wouldn't gimp the movement speed on purpose, for survival.

Use a Heavy Crossbow, like a Bowgun, and go nuts with your 1 attack per round. Not sure you get a second attack, but you don't need to use it.

Maybe put some points into Int, and find a way to get Tinker Tools prof somehow. So you can craft specialty bolts on downtime, to emulate the special ammo from the MH games.

[casper5632]

I dont mean thematically like a heavy gunner from monster hunter, but mechanically like one. I want to be the dude with a big gun just wreckin people with explosions at a distance.

Are there any rules about making specialty ammo in 5e? I couldent find any hard info about it.

[8wGremlin]

I dont mean thematically like a heavy gunner from monster hunter, but mechanically like one. I want to be the dude with a big gun just wreckin people with explosions at a distance.

Are there any rules about making specialty ammo in 5e? I couldent find any hard info about it.

So there are a bunch of Ideas above for what we believe you mean.
but it appears that you have a different idea.

so can you answer us some questions.



Does your GM allow the Artificer from Unearthed Arcana?
Does your GM allow any Unearthed Arcana articles?
what exactly do you expect to be doing in the game, the more specific the better.


You will have to re flavour some to get what you want.

You could approach this in a number of ways.
you could re flavour a Warlock and have Eldritch blast using a special rod or want that looks and feels like your 'gun'
you could even take some invocations that help with more damage and pushing your targets.

[casper5632]

My general goal in this game is to be the guy in the back of the party shooting heavy bolts at enemies. The better comparison would actually be a warhammer 40 havoc marine with single fire.

I want to be a dude with a giant bolter that is a borderline ballista just nailing people to walls from a distance (Not Literally, but focusing on extreme damage over multiple shots). I want to have the biggest gun possible, and the entire idea of using heavy armor and just eating the penalty does sound appealing. I want to effectively be a walking LITERAL tank, with heavy armor and a big gun that you dont want pointed at you.

[RickAllison]

I dont mean thematically like a heavy gunner from monster hunter, but mechanically like one. I want to be the dude with a big gun just wreckin people with explosions at a distance.

Are there any rules about making specialty ammo in 5e? I couldent find any hard info about it.

There is specialty ammo in the form of magic items, though they might not do what you are hoping for. There might be a few more in the adventure books, but the only arrows in the DMG are the +1/2/3 ammo and the Arrow of Slaying, which just deals extra damage to a type of creature. (Interestingly, I just noticed that since the damage on an Arrow of Slaying only triggers if the target is the right type and the magic only ends if you deal the extra damage, an archer with a few random Arrows of Slaying can have a reusable magic weapon with a nonmagical bow. Not useful, but fun.)

Ranger has some nice spells that could help be your "specialty ammo". Here are a few:

Conjure Volley (5th): You create a 40-foot radius AoE from an arrow, which could be flavored instead as an explosive arrow rather than a volley of them. This would be a very rare, but powerful ammo for you, considering its high level.

Lightning Arrow (3rd): A smaller explosive arrow, and much more easily obtained.

Conjure Barrage (3rd): A cone of damage from arrows. I'm sure you can find some equivalent, but I don't know much about Monster Hunter.

Flame Arrows (3rd): 12+ augmented, single-target arrows.

Swift Quiver (5th): You increase your damage output by getting two bonus action attacks. You can even fluff your multiple attacks (four, by this point) as being one, very powerful arrow.

It really is sad that Artificer is off the table. It is not particularly powerful, but the trick shots of the subclass would fit your concept perfectly.

[8wGremlin]

My general goal in this game is to be the guy in the back of the party shooting heavy bolts at enemies. The better comparison would actually be a warhammer 40 havoc marine with single fire.

I want to be a dude with a giant bolter that is a borderline ballista just nailing people to walls from a distance (Not Literally, but focusing on extreme damage over multiple shots). I want to have the biggest gun possible, and the entire idea of using heavy armor and just eating the penalty does sound appealing. I want to effectively be a walking LITERAL tank, with heavy armor and a big gun that you dont want pointed at you.

Gunsmith Artifier variant Human.
put points in Dexterity > Intelligence > Constitution
You get Medium armour for free, so you could wear half plate*.
or spend you feat on Heavy armour*


* = not that you can buy it at 1st level.

[Vorpalchicken]

I really think 1 level in fighter for Archery style, heavy armour (maybe intentionally too heavy for your strength score so you can lumber around in it) and heavy crossbows, followed by rogue (maybe swashbuckler for easy sneak attack) is a lot better than a gunsmith.
The only advantage to the artificer I can think of is you get to be the loudest dude on the battlefield.

You do more damage with a crossbow and sneak attack than you do with the thunder cannon. And it's not completely thwarted by a second level cleric spell.

Also you can potentially find a magic crossbow and bolts to improve your accuracy. With the gun all you can do is rely on the DMs mercy to contrive something for you.

Also rogues are cool and artificers are dorks.

[Quoxis]

My general goal in this game is to be the guy in the back of the party shooting heavy bolts at enemies. The better comparison would actually be a warhammer 40 havoc marine with single fire.

I want to be a dude with a giant bolter that is a borderline ballista just nailing people to walls from a distance (Not Literally, but focusing on extreme damage over multiple shots). I want to have the biggest gun possible, and the entire idea of using heavy armor and just eating the penalty does sound appealing. I want to effectively be a walking LITERAL tank, with heavy armor and a big gun that you dont want pointed at you.

Take whatever race you want, dump str, go dex all the way, go fighter 1 for the archery fighting style and heavy armor, and then straight rogue.
Your idea isn't the typical fighter who's shooting multiple arrows within a few seconds like a machine gun, so scrap multiattack, you're going for single high-damage shots, and that screams rogue, plus you won't need the crossbow expert feat (unless you want to bolt the opponent in melee).
By going with low str you can still don heavy armor, not meeting the requirements means you'll lose 10ft of speed, but that's what you want anyways.
At 5th level you get the sharpshooter feat, and your build is done.

Regarding special ammo: ask your dm, maybe you can work out that a local artificer gives you exploding bolts, but i wouldn't count on it.
Maybe look into ranger, they have spells to make their ammo burn and features for cool tricks, but that's up to you.

[Throne12]

Ok here
Race: goliath
Class: AT rogue
Weapon: a Modified ballista

Let me start off by saying you can use any weapon no matter what class you are. Now I went with AT to pick up the spells mage hand and unseen servant to help load and prep the ballista to fire each turn. Goliath is for the strong build ability.

[Joe the Rat]

Ranger - particularly going Hunter Ranger - really fits your shooty needs. Between the shot enhancing spells and your choice of boosters (horde breaker for more targets, or colossus slayer for doing more single-target damage), you'll be killing it. Feel free to splice in Rogue at some point.

VHuman: Out the gate, you can either grab Sharpshooter (for range and accuracy and crazy damage boost on easy targets) or Heavily Armored (to get the armor). As a twist on this, start Fighter for heavy armor and sharpshooter, then swap ranger for the goodies. Mind you, you'll still need dex, so you might be as happy with medium armor master.

If you really want to stick with the crossbow imagery, then you should grab crossbow expert by 4 - one level ahead of extra attack at the latest. This makes your weapons loadout Heavy Crossbow, with a backup weapon of Hand crossbow. You're shooting big ass bolts, then go Fistfull of Dollars with a boilerplate and fanning a pistol.

---

And now for something completely different:
If what you want is the image of someone in the back, blasting things to pieces, and tanked to the nines... Have you considered Warlock? Vhuman or Mountain Dwarf will let you start medium armor, or start with a Fighter, Paladin, or Life/Nature/Tempest/War Cleric for Heavy Armor prof. You'll be spamming eldritch blast, and with agonizing blast will be keeping up with Fighter with heavy crossbow and crossbow expert for shots/damage. Normally you've got one other add-on for your blast (repelling blast), but thanks to UA access, you can grab a couple of other fun tricks from the latest subclass UA - kiss of Mephistopheles to turn one of your blast targets into ground zero for a fireball (thereby not having to learn fireball... though you probably want the fiend patron), and grasp of Hadar to drag a creature closer (Grasp one, Repel any others - great way to break up a line!)

For feat support, you'll want Warcaster, so you can keep your hands full, and more specifically make your Eldritch Blasts fire out of the excessively large Rod or Staff you are using as an arcane focus. Spell Sniper will help with range and cover, but is secondary. It would also let you grab shocking grasp for point blank fighting... assuming you don't go Tome and grab that, or other goodies like shillelagh or Primal Savagery (UA: Beginner Spells) for melee, or sacred flame or toll the dead to hit someone with a save or ouch with no minimum range. Starting 'lock or Cleric (why I suggested it) let's you grab Warcaster at 1.

But that's just me.

[casper5632]

Artificer looks pretty solid with what I was trying to get. I am assuming they are going to be included in the book releasing in november, along with the mystic? I like classes that have magic available to them, but dont depend on it as their primary combat focus.

It really fits the focus, as I dont really care about being stealthy, I just want to be a dude with a big gun causing a lot of problems. I do expect this class to change a bit though. I cant see any reason for a gunning focused artificer to have int until later level abilities become available, so until them its basically a wasted stat unless you are using spells that use your int mod. I guess if you build him with dex and int equal value you could make a solid artillery/healer dude.

[Throne12]

Artificer looks pretty solid with what I was trying to get. I am assuming they are going to be included in the book releasing in november, along with the mystic? I like classes that have magic available to them, but dont depend on it as their primary combat focus.

It really fits the focus, as I dont really care about being stealthy, I just want to be a dude with a big gun causing a lot of problems. I do expect this class to change a bit though. I cant see any reason for a gunning focused artificer to have int until later level abilities become available, so until them its basically a wasted stat unless you are using spells that use your int mod. I guess if you build him with dex and int equal value you could make a solid artillery/healer dude.

No Artificer and mystic will not be in the new book coming out in nov.

[CaptainSarathai]

Sorlock is by far the best ranged blaster you'll get. Quickened Eldritch Blast is a beautiful thing.
Heck, get really creative and mix the two:
11 levels of Fighter, 4 levels of Sorcerer, 2 levels of Warlock, and 3 levels of whatever you want (rogue)

Level 1-2: Fighter
Archery Style for +2 to Hit. Action Surge because heck yeah

Level 3-4: Warlock
Hex, and Agonizing Eldritch Blast

Level 5: Sorcerer
Upon hitting level 5, you have 2 shots with Eldritch Blast, for 2d8+2d6(Hex) +2*Cha

Level 6-9: Sorcerer
Metamagic and a Feat. At this point, you're still using your bread-and-butter: Eldritch Blast, Quickened Eldritch Blast, Action Surge

Level 10-12: Fighter
Extra Attack, Feat, additional Eldritch Blast
Now you shoot twice and blast 3 times, so your attack is
2d10+20+2*Dex (32+2Dex), and 3d8+3d6+3*Cha (24+3Cha).
You can Action Surge and Quicken to Nova with 32+48+2Dex+6Cha

This is a turning point in the build. If you'll get to Level17, you can stay Fighter for that third attack. Otherwise, it might be better to actually have taken Ranger and get some of their Hunter tricks.

[Desteplo]

First level fighter for weapons and archery
-2-20 rogue thief (gives you chances to set up bombs mid fight (dmg has rules for gunpowder etc so bombs)
-sincecthe point is a single attack you don't need the crossbow feat and you can just roll (disengage) out of range
-(all this talking about bonus action) everyone unequipped can run the same speed (dash) though during combat just use disengage to keep the feel

[DarkKnightJin]

First level fighter for weapons and archery
-2-20 rogue thief (gives you chances to set up bombs mid fight (dmg has rules for gunpowder etc so bombs)
-sincecthe point is a single attack you don't need the crossbow feat and you can just roll (disengage) out of range
-(all this talking about bonus action) everyone unequipped can run the same speed (dash) though during combat just use disengage to keep the feel

I feel you have captured the MH Bowgunner feel the best. Single attack per round, but it's going to be devastatingly powerful if/when it hits.

OP can get enough points into Str to not have the penalty on speed(or go Dwarf..), and be a heavy armored backline artillery unit. 2nd story work from Thief would help him get to higher places for better vantage, too.

I might steal this idea, actually..