[3.5] Which Is Better? Cerebremancer or Thrallherd

[Nautilust]

Which Prestige Class is better for a Telepath. Cerebremancer or Thrallherd.

Cerebremancer loses no manifester levels (by itself, multiclassing loses you 3) and maybe i could make a good Telepath/Enchanter/Cerebremancer. I'd hit Manifester level 17 and Caster level 13. I'd have to be level 6 to hit the requirements for Cerebremancer.

Thrallherd has a few more relevant class abilities, but loses a manifester level. I'd be manifester level 19 by 20th level. Gm might be a little weary about the Thrallherd ability. Might even decline the class all together. I hear alot of Gm's don't allow the Leadership feat.
Might be able to make a good Telepath/Thrallherd. I'd have to be atleast level 5 to hit the requirements for Thrallherd

[Rebel7284]

I mean, Thrallherd can give you TWO wizards with their own set of actions every round and at significantly higher levels then you could achieve with Cerebremancer. It's clearly more powerful.

If you want both Arcane and Psionic casting, you can also look at Spell to Power Erutide http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a

Thrallherd can add a bunch of headache for your DM as they now have dozens of extra NPCs to co-manage, but power-wise, they are perhaps the best class in the game.

[Nautilust]

Spell to Power Erudite wouldn't be allowed because it's not printed in a book. No need to go through that hassle again.

Thrallherd looked obviously alot more powerful but i don't think the GM is going to allow it. Right now i'm researching the Cerebremancer as it looks like the more possible of the two. I'll find out in the morning if I can play Thrallherd.

[Nautilust]

But I don't want to be outshadowed by the rest of the party so if I can't play Thrallherd maybe I should go with a different Prestige class

[frogglesmash]

But I don't want to be outshadowed by the rest of the party so if I can't play Thrallherd maybe I should go with a different Prestige class

That depends on what everyone else is playing.

[Nautilust]

we're going to have a wizard and a sorcerer casting 9th level spells by the time we hit 20th. And a Gish who if they take my advice will also be casting 9th level spells. Aswell as a cleric who if they're smart will also reach 9th level spells by 20th level.

I feel sorry for everybody else in later levels to be honest.

The remainder of the party are a gunslinger, a shaman (who may or may not hit 9th level spells aswell), and a rogue.

So too bad for the gunslinger and rogue, and maybe the shaman. But I think this is going to turn into an arms race.

My ultimate goal with the thrallherd is to take a Bard as my thrall and then i'll be able to buff the party so everyone is better.

[Tohsaka Rin]

I'm tempted to suggest taking Thrallherd, then assigning the gunslinger, rogue, and shaman as 'captains' of your various thralls.

Split up the NPCs evenly between the players, to command, and give them a little more to do. Up their respective 'oomph' levels a bit. Sure, it won't be enough to keep up with the rest of the party's casters, but it's something.

Plus, secret upside? You get the PrC you want, without having to keep track of everything by yourself. :smallbiggrin:

[Nautilust]

Not a bad idea. might have to pass that by the GM

[Psyren]

I don't advise Thrallherd, it sounds like you have a pretty big party already. There's no reason for you to take 3 turns to everyone else's 1. In fact, I don't advise Cerebremancer either, you already have a wizard AND a sorcerer.

It's not as bad if you make two of the other party members your thralls, but they'd have to be totally okay with you technically controlling their characters; I'm not sure that would work out in the long run.

If you really want to be a psion, focus on something the other casters can't do as easily, like Constructor for powerful Astral Construct minions, Crystal Master for constant Touchsight, or Meditant for indefinite etherealness.

[Nautilust]

Gm declined Thrallherd and i'm already like three builds ahead by now. But now he's accusing me of getting every single idea from the internet. Which isn't true.

[Psyren]

It shouldn't matter where it came from as long as you're not overshadowing everyone. Is he okay with you being a Psion at all?

[Nautilust]

Yes he is okay with me being a psion. I'm just out of good PrCs that don't lose too many manifester levels

I've looked through the whole 2 books that they made.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Yes he is okay with me being a psion. I'm just out of good PrCs that don't lose too many manifester levels

I've looked through the whole 2 books that they made.My favorite psionic PrC is the 3.5 constructor (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040625b). Print it out if you have to, because it's one of the best, best-balanced PrCs ever made by WotC. It massively improves astral constructs at the fairly light cost of 1 ML. (I only take 9 levels and instead use Linked Power to manifest ACs as a standard, swift, or immediate action, because 2 lost MLs isn't really worth the capstone when a single feat or a chronocharm of the uncaring archmage simulates it well enough to be getting on with.) With your very large party, I'd suggest mainly using ACs as utility between fights or as mobile walls during. You can always use the astral construct spreadsheet (https://sites.google.com/site/dotditto/excel2) on a laptop to make your ACs on the fly, even, and it includes options for the constructor PrC.

Alternately, you might consider the anarchic initiate, from CPsi. Also a really good PrC, especially since it doesn't lose any MLs.

When I gestalt, I often go totemist 2/factotum/swordsage skill monkey on one side and psion/anarchic initiate 1/constructor on the other.

Also, Hyperconscious is a 3rd party book written by the same man who wrote the XPH and CPsi (Bruce Cordell), and Untapped Potential is another fantastic 3rd party book written by several guys from various forums (including here) who really knew what they were doing when it came to content creation; they do the official content for PF psionics, now. Both books (along with The Mind's Eye, linked above) are easily lauded as some of the best content available in 3.5.

[Nautilust]

Thank you for the suggestions however I think that my Gm might decline those aswell. I've finally found something that he'll accept so i'm probably going with it.

[noob]

Gunslinger is pathfinder.
If the gm allows pathfinder content maybe try psionic wizard and get 20 levels of wizarding as well as the ability to manifest some powers as high as eighth level powers(like mind seed on your familiar for awesome shenanigans)

[Segev]

Thank you for the suggestions however I think that my Gm might decline those aswell. I've finally found something that he'll accept so i'm probably going with it.

What is it you've found that you think he'll accept? I'm curious. :)

[Nautilust]

Either Shugenja X/Void Disciple X or Warblade 1/Wu Jen X/Jade Pheonix Mage X. He said I could play either one himself

[Nifft]

Yes he is okay with me being a psion. I'm just out of good PrCs that don't lose too many manifester levels

Psion 20 is a fine way to play. You get a bunch of bonus feats, and your skill list is good because each Psion type gets distinct bonus skills.

Psion 8 / Slayer 10 / Psion +2 is also neat. You lose one manifester level, in trade for +5 BAB.

Ranger 1 / Psion 6 / Slayer 10 / Psion +3 is also great.

[Nautilust]

I'm not pushing another character idea by the Gm i found two that will work i'm going with one of the two.

[lord_khaine]

You could ask for a psionic adaption of the Jade Phoenix Mage? that should be pretty easy to make.

[Nautilust]

For some reason I feel like he wouldn't go for that