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Scathain

2017-10-07, 03:54 PM

MrWesson22

2017-10-07, 04:02 PM

Wood elf Battlemaster fighter 12/assassin rogue 5/Hunter or deep stalker revised ranger 3. Longbow or hand crossbow both work very well.

Zene

2017-10-07, 04:05 PM

Any good 2-class MC can be modded to 3 quite easily by adding 2 levels of fighter. Nobody can’t do cool stuff with Action Surge.

Some particularly good ones:
Fighter 2 / Warlock 2 / Sorc 5
Barb 6 / Fighter 2 / Rogue 3
Life cleric 1/ Fighter 2/ Lore Bard 8

Also:
Pal 2 / Warlock 3 / any full caster class 6
Ranger 3 / War Cleric 1 / Fighter 7

Zene

2017-10-07, 04:09 PM

If you dislike missing ASIs, Fighter 6/Rogue 4/Full Caster 1 can be quite nice; just go from there to F8/R10 and take the last level in whichever class you like best (I’d go rogue in most cases)

Zene

2017-10-07, 04:21 PM

Oh and, sorry to spam but, with three classes those otherwise-kinda-ridiculous nova builds actually start to be a decent option. Usually Rogue 3, Fighter 2, Pal 2 is the base. If UA is allowed I’m sure you can construct some pretty crazy stuff.

For that matter, since UA is allowed, there are some really out-there ideas that work with three-plus multiclasses. I never pay much attention to UA since it’s never allowed in the games I play, but I’ve seen threads on things like tunnel fighter builds, twilight druid/evocation wizard craziness, that kind of thing.

Also I love grapplers, so I would instantly start playing around with Barb 5 / Rogue 1 / Mystic X builds. Damage reduction, advantage on grapples, and extra attack from Barb, Expertise in athletics from rogue, and then all kinds of extra things from mystic —giant growth, teleportation, movement bonuses, etc. The Barb levels could be subbed with Fighter if that’s more your style; you can pick up the damage reduction and advantage on grapples from Mystic instead.

Spacehamster

2017-10-07, 04:28 PM

Mountain Dwarf starting stats after point buy and racial: 17/14/17/8/10/8
Fighter Champion 6, Bear totem barbarian 3, rogue 2.

ASI 1: +1STR/+1CON
ASI 2: GWM

Attack with advantage while taking half damage, use cunning action to up mobility and get more bonus action options.

Remaining levels either all fighter or get a rogue subclass or a 4th level barb for an additional ASI, use remaing ASI´s on
mobile feat and upping STR and CON. :)

JellyPooga

2017-10-07, 04:40 PM

Dips are your friend here; Fighter 2, Warlock 2, Sorcerer 3, Wizard 2, Paladin 2 and Cleric 1 are all popular dips. If PHB only, then Ranger 3 can be attractive for Horde Breaker. Rogue can be a nice dip for a couple of extra Sneak Attack damage dice and Cunning Action.

The question is; what do you want to be your focus? Spellslinger? Melee guy? Archer? Buffer? Blaster? Choose a Class and look at what other Classes will boost your schtick.

PeteNutButter

2017-10-07, 06:00 PM

For a martial pick one class to get extra attack, and splat on a few. Your breakpoints for paladin and fighter are usually level 6, with ranger or barb they are level 5. Throw on four levels of any other martial and the last one or two for a dip.

Examples:

Barbarian 5/Hunter Ranger 4/Fighter 2. Raging, Horde breaking, action surging.
Ranger 5/ Eldritch Knight 4/War Cleric 2. Shooting, shielding, and buffing.
Paladin 6/Warlock 2/Sorcerer 3. Smiting, Save making, EBing, Quickening.
Battle Master 6/Barbarian 2/Ranger 3. Raging, Reckless Attacking GWM, Hordebreaking.

etc.

moveable feats

2017-10-07, 06:03 PM

This is a build that I've wanted to try. It really gels starting at level 11 which is perfect in your case.

Fighter 1, Bearbarian 5, Swashbuckler 5. Both ASIs go into strength.

Race suggestions: Half-Orc, Mountain Dwarf, Earth Genasi, Goliath etc.

It's a strength-based dual-wielding build using shortswords or scimitars to take advantage of sneak attack. From Rogue you get Uncanny Dodge and from Bearbarian you get resistance meaning you're often taking 1/4 damage. You're attacking 2-3 times a turn with +7 damage each, and you have reckless attack (if necessary) to virtually guarantee Sneak Attack hits.

Mortis_Elrod

2017-10-07, 06:07 PM

I have a favorite HexBow build:

Hexblade (pact of blade) 12/Revised Ranger 4/Arcane Archer 4 (or ranger 6/fighter 2). Any Revised Ranger subclass will do but Deep stalker, Hunter, and Beast conclaves are my choices. Its a really nice but incredibly mad build. You're gonna want to dump Str, but you also want usable INT and CHA and DEX while WIS needs to be minimum 13.

You can make it work with VHuman 8/16(+1)/11/13/13/14(+1) Grab Sharpshooter as your feat then use all asi's on dex and cha(For 8/20/11/13/13/20). Your Arcane Shots are gonna suffer and your ranger spells should be picked for non stat dependency but You can be the best magical archer. Grab Archery and Close Quaters Shooter fighting styles, Pick a favored enemy and when you see him bonus action Hexblade Curse fire magical arrows with your magical bow smite while you at it. Your to hit is gonna Proff+Dex+Archery+Close Quarters Shooter+Improved Pact Weapon+Magic Arrow or +16 at 20th level (+11 with SS) with 19-20 crit on Curse target. and your damage is amazing too.

Hexblade Curse + Magic Arrow +Improved pact weapon + Dex + Lifedrinker + Eldritch Smite + Arcane shot+Favored Enemy+Longbow+Sharpshooter + Thirsting Blade (and arcane shot effect) and target prone. Thats a lot.

Smite 5th level + Arcane Shot Attack Action. +11 to hit
= 8d8 +60 +2d6 = 103 avg damage. Target prone and Arcane shot effect. Min= 70; Max= 136
Add Action Surge = 172avg damage. Target prone and Arcane shot effect. Min= 132; Max= 212

With a crit of 19-20.

Sadly you can only smite and arcane shot once per turn but this is pretty hilariously consistent damage while also being fueled by short rest. This isn't touching Hunters mark/Hex or smite spells that hexblade could learn, the potential of magic items, ranger subclass abilties. There are some weaknesses though. You have crap HP and if you accidentally shot yourself in the foot you would likely die. Thanks to Armor of Hexes, and potential defensive options spells (shield primarily) and the ability to shoot at 0-600 feet in range and ranger abilities, you should mostly be ok.

Will say this build is best late game and still doable (and fun) early to mid game. For starting in your group i would suggest Hexblade 5/Revised Ranger 3/ Arcane Archer 3 . This way you only need a couple levels and then the only thing you are missing is Higher spell slots for smite and Life drinker being your Level Cap ability.

And there's the Paladin/Monk/Barbarian route. But thats just as Mad unless you don't care about stunning and dump wis. I like Monk/Barbarian/Druid as well. If you want to be full spellcaster try the classic Bard 6/Sorcerer 6/Warlock 6 and add 2 levels in wherever you want. Be a Tiefling too.

bid

2017-10-07, 06:49 PM

Lore bard 7 / life cleric 1 / tomelock 3.
Bladesinger 2 / swashbuckler 3 / mystic 6.

Citan

2017-10-07, 07:47 PM

Hello again, here for another oddball build question for the Playground.

So in our session zero for an upcoming campaign, a few of the more veteran players, myself included, decided we’d try to flex our munchkin muscles in the form of heavily multiclassed characters. We’re no stranger to multiclassing, but the idea came up when we all realized none of us had ever gone past 2 classes. The DM was intrigued, and allowed (but did not require) us to “go crazy”.

Here’s the hitch: not all of the party is seasoned veterans, but the entire party wants to give it a shot. As most of these players look to the vets for build advice, that brings me to the question at hand:

If you were designing a character for the sole purpose of meeting the requirement of 3+ separate classes, what would you choose?

Some notes:
1) starting level 11, point buy
2) for the sake of definitions, triple (or more) multiclassing, dips work. It would be foolish to ask for effective builds heavily invested in so many classes (though I’m quite willing to be proven wrong!)
3) Feats, UA, DMSGUILD, and some homebrew/third party material, and obviously multiclassing, are allowed.
4) as this is build advice for an entire party, specific rolls are not stated on purpose. The idea is that once we decided on our progression we’d “fill in the gaps” of our backstory and reasoning behind choosing each class etc. etc.
Wow, this is the kind of thread I could spend hours into pouring in dozens of builds. XD

Let's keep reasonable.

Devotion Paladin 3 / Tome Warlock 3 / Sorcerer 5.
Half-Elf or Variant Human.
Make it CHA-only character, with 14 STR/DEX/CON, specialized in smiting hard, using short-rest powercheese to create more slots than usual.
++: extreme fuel smite if your DM is lenient, at least balanced fuel otherwise.
Uses a staff as primary weapon, either with Polearm Master for extra attack smiting, or with Shield Master for extra resilience.
Recommended spells: Bless/Hex/Haste, Mirror Image, Armor of Agathys, Shatter, Blindness, Comprehend Languages, Booming Blade, Greenflame Blade, (Repelling) Blast, Ray of Frost.
Recommended metamagics: Twin, Quicken.

Phoenix Sorcerer 5 / Undying Light Warlock 1 / Vengeance Paladin 5 : use Green-Flame Blade with +CHA*2 bonus damage.
You are an avenger that dispatches his enemies in hellish blade.
For some stupidity, considering later levels, you could instead go Oathbreaker for more thematic fluff and another +CHA on melee weapon attacks.
Haste is not necessarily the best here because of risks, better get Blur. You can also start with decent DEX and grab Mirror Image for added resilience.

Life Cleric 1 / Grassland Druid 3 / Longdeath Monk 7: Life Goodberries and Pass Without Trace for the party, self-buff Longstrider and Fear as action during combat, plus usual Monk greatness.
Max WIS, wield a quarterstaff with Shillelagh empower, Bless yourself, grab Mobile as a feat if you want to play Monk strengths, or bump WIS by 2, go all heavy&shield turtle, use Ki solely on Dash/Dodge as bonus action while using Thorns Whip to reposition enemies or the Fear as action ability from Monk (which does not care about heavy armor).

Arcane Trickster 9 / Fighter 1 / Wizard 1
no need to explain much I think, grab Bladesinger at level 12 then continue pumping Wizard only, unless you'd like the Reliable Talent.
Fighter for TWF and heavy armor for all that time until you will get Bladesinger. Start with 16 DEX & INT, bump DEX to 18 and grab Mobile feat, you're golden.

Battlemaster 6 / War Cleric 1 / Thief Rogue 4: grab Dual Wielder and Sharpshooter and hurl away Disarming or Tripping javelins/daggers, while using Healer feat on comrades and yourself.
Or ditch Healer feat because you don't care about healing other and instead pick another die (Martial Adept), utility (Ritual Caster) or caster fear (Mage Slayer), or bump STR. Good thing you will have great STR by the way, because you'll need to carry a lot of javelins. :)
If you can find some Giant magic item, you'll be golden.
For later levels, aim Rogue 7 and whatever else you want (Battlemaster 11 can be afforded because thanks to Thief+Dual Wielder you can still grab 2 other javelins as bonus action: it's costly so not optimal as far as mechanical efficiency goes, but it works well still).

Grassland Druid 5 / Monk 5 / Rogue 1 with Mobile or Resilient:Constitution feat: Grappler expert, bringing back enemies from afar with Expertise in grappling and Longstrider + Haste. Or make an enemy go merry-go-round on a Spike Growth. Works well too. ;)

Tempest Cleric 3 / Draconic Sorcerer 6 / Evoker Wizard 2: it's difficult to make it more mad like this, the good thing is that CHA is all you need. Make it a dwarf so you can dump STR, keep WIS and INT to minimum for multiclass, and enjoy being a great help to your party, between Extended Aid and Sanctuary, whatever other metamagic you like (Distant being a great one for such a multiclass) and maximized Lightning Bolt / Shatter with no friendly fire problem whatsoever.
Recommended metamagics: Extended + either Distant, or Twin, or Empowered depending on your spells and focus.
Recommended spells: Shocking Grasp / Lightning Lure / Shatter / Lightning Bolt /Fireball as Sorcerer, Shield of Faith / Healing Words / Sanctuary / Aid as Cleric plus whatever else you like.

Naanomi

2017-10-07, 08:11 PM

~~Sorcerer 4/Warlock 4/Rogue 1/Fighter 2 - eldritch blast focused Sniper, big nova barrages from extreme long range. Pick up Rogue +2 (for assassin autocrits) then finish Sorcerer/Warlock to taste

~~Rogue 2/Warlock 3/Monk 6 - Ultimate Ninja, exploiting Darkness/Devil's Sight to the max. Everything else goes into Rogue levels

~~Rogue (scout) 3/Bard (lore) 3/mystic (nomad) 1 - variant human, skilled feat... proficient in everything! Lots of room to still grow as a build

I don't know any 3rd party/DMs guild stuff, so these could be improved on I'm sure

ghost_warlock

2017-10-07, 08:33 PM

If UA material is allowed, Paladin 2/Hexblade 5/Lore Bard 13 served me very well and was a ton of fun.

Improved Pact Weapon, Thirsting Blade, Dueling Fighting Style, and a max Charisma meant two attacks for 1d8+8 apiece, plus tons of spell slots for divine smite.

Outside of combat, all of my feats were UA skill feats, so the final build would end up with expertise in eight different skills (every skill the character had trained). Adding Enhance Ability into the mix means you pretty much guarantee success with those skills.

For spells, you've got healing from paladin & bard, utility from bard, and combat from warlock. Plus, you can cherry pick exactly the spells you want from other class lists with lore bard's Magical Secrets. And, while you miss out on 9th level spells, you'd at least end the campaign with 7th level spells known.

AttilatheYeon

2017-10-07, 08:37 PM

Lore Bard6/Life Cleric4/Druid1. Be the ultimate healer with Goodberry/Aura of Vitality Cheese. This will of course be dependant on your DM letting both our at least one benifit from Desciple of Life.

Crgaston

2017-10-07, 08:45 PM

I've got a reserve character built who is my first attempt at triple classing. Pretty underwhelming compared to some of y'all's ideas, but should be a fun character to play if my current monk does.

Half elf standard array with +1's on Int and Wis
S8 D14 C12 I16 W14 Ch12
So far...
Acolyte background
Rogue 1
Knowledge Cleric 1
Wizard 2+

7 languages, proficient in 10 skills with expertise in 4, only 1 level behind in spell slots, but 2 in Wizard spell level.

As she progresses, another rogue level for cunning action or another cleric level for the CD and spell slot would probably be in order at some point, but maybe not. Shes rocking a breastplate for 16AC and only 25 hp, so she's a bit squishy.

Cantrips:
Guidance, Thaumaturgy, Mending, Message, Mage Hand and Chill Touch

Spells:
Cleric-Command, Identify, Protection from Evil, Detect Evil, Sanctuary

Wizard Book- Cause Fear
Color Spray, False Life, Find Familiar, Disguise Self, Grease, Magic Missile, Puppet

Arelai

2017-10-07, 08:46 PM

The Warlord Support, caster/fighter.
Half elf. Prioritize Cha-STR-con

Bard 6 - lore
Fighter 3 - battlemaster
Paladin 2 OR Warlock 3(bard 5 then)

Take martial adept as your feat at bard 4.

You get a pool of 5 bardic inspiration, 5 maneuvers, all refresh on short rest. Paladin 2 or warlock 3 lets you use smites on attacks(if UA is allowed for your warlocks).

It's dope.

Scathain

2017-10-07, 08:51 PM

Wow, this is the kind of thread I could spend hours into pouring in dozens of builds. XD

Let's keep reasonable.
Devotion Paladin 3 / Tome Warlock 3 / Sorcerer 5.
Half-Elf or Variant Human.
Make it CHA-only character, specialized in smiting hard, using short-rest powercheese to create more slots than usual.

Phoenix Sorcerer 5 / Undying Light Warlock 1 / Vengeance Paladin 5 : use Green-Flame Blade with +CHA*2 bonus damage.

Life Cleric 1 / Grassland Druid 3 / Longdeath Monk 7: Life Goodberries and Pass Without Trace for the party, self-buff Longstrider and Fear as action during combat, plus usual Monk greatness.

Arcane Trickster 9 / Fighter 1 / Wizard 1
no need to explain I think, grab Bladesinger at level 12.

Battlemaster 6 / War Cleric 1 / Thief Rogue 4: grab Dual Wielder and Sharpshooter and hurl away Disarming or Tripping javelins, while using Healer feat on comrades and yourself.

Grassland Druid 5 / Monk 5 / Rogue 1 with Mobile feat: Grappler expert, bringing back enemies from afar with Expertise in grappling and Haste.

Tempest Cleric 3 / Draconic Sorcerer 6 / Evoker Wizard 2: it's difficult to make it more mad like this, the good thing is that CHA is all you need. Make it a dwarf so you can dump STR, keep WIS and INT to minimum for multiclass, and enjoy being a great help to your party, between Extended Aid and Sanctuary, whatever other metamagic you like (Distant being a great one for such a multiclass) and maximized Lightning Bolt / Shatter with no friendly fire problem whatsoever.

See my issue is I’m usually the one in the group to spend hours creating everybody’s characters, so I figured I’d let the Playground do some of the work for me this time lol. But hey, other than obeying forum rules I don’t mind if you post more as you think of em!

By the way, all of these are fantastic suggestions, thanks! I’m positive there will be at least one build in here that hits home for someone. I knew I could count on you guys!

thereaper

2017-10-07, 10:33 PM

Rogue 2 (cunning action), Barbarian 2 (danger sense), Fighter 2 (action surge), and Paladin 2 (smite) are all great dips.

Falcon X

2017-10-08, 02:18 AM

Rogue/Paladin/Sorcerer

The gimmick here is being both a grapple build and a sorcadin build.

My favorite route:
Rogue1/Treachery Paladin7/Shadow SorcererX
Feats: Shield Master, War Caster (or Resilient)

All sorts of shenanigans here. Your maneuverability let's you pick your targets wisely. You find your mark, make it prone, grappled, and stab it once in the same round. If the enemy has allies nearby, you have advantage against all of them and can redirect their attack while you are hacking away at your grappled enemy.
The mixture of Dex proficiency and shield master is worth noting.
I'm not even going to touch the Shadow sorcerer traits. To many cool stuff. The DM might not allow it, but it fits the feel of the character the best.

Foxhound438

2017-10-08, 02:53 AM

shadow monk 6/ hunter ranger 3/ thief rogue x for great mobility from monk, high sustained dpr from hunter's mark+martial arts bonus attack, high burst damage from sneak attack+colossus slayer. You don't get a rogue archetype at 11, but thief isn't half bad for better jump distance. I'd probably try to end up rogue 5/ ranger 3/ monk 12 for more ki points, but rogue 11/ ranger 3/ monk 6 is just as fine honestly. More sneak attack, less stunning strike.

grumbaki

2017-10-08, 03:09 AM

The True Half-Orc
* Bear Totem Barbarian (4)
- Rage, resistance to everything but psychic
* Champion Fighter (6)
- Extra attack and criticals
* Bard (1)

You're a skald. Skalds are Nordic bards who are also warriors of great strength, skill, and virtue; their songs are inspiring sagas of battle and valor, and the Skalds devote their lives to those pursuits.

Stolen from Baldur's Gate, but it works. You crit more often, as a champion. You crit harder as a half-orc. You have out of combat use as a bard due to more and better skills/magic.

MrStabby

2017-10-08, 04:41 AM

I think I would go for fighter 6, warlock 3, rogue 2.

Warlock gives you loads of utility with pact of the tome and level 2 spells (and say devils sight). Rogue adds a little sneak attack to the build, expertise but most importantly cunning action. Fighter gives 2 ASI as well as the standard fighter goodness. Aim is to not be too MAD and use the ASIs to boost stats (cunning action takes pressure off feats to use bonus actions)

Citan

2017-10-08, 10:23 AM

See my issue is I’m usually the one in the group to spend hours creating everybody’s characters, so I figured I’d let the Playground do some of the work for me this time lol. But hey, other than obeying forum rules I don’t mind if you post more as you think of em!

By the way, all of these are fantastic suggestions, thanks! I’m positive there will be at least one build in here that hits home for someone. I knew I could count on you guys!
A few others... :)

Blade Pact Fiend Warlock 7 / Rogue 1 / Paladin 2
Make it a variant human, start with 16 STR and CHA and grappler feat, pick Warcaster as your other feat.
Rogue means Expertise obviously. Pick Hex, Armor of Agathys, and Fire Shield.
Idea here is to rely on Booming Blade and GreenFlameBlade usually, while having the option of using Extra Attack to grapple for resilient targets before smacking them good.
Rogue is here to allow you to use concentration on something else, like Bless or Shield of Faith from Paladin. But you could still use Hex if you really want to be really sure.
For the biggest fights, use upcast Armor of Agathys / Fire Shield before using this tactic. This will make you a very nasty target for that poor grappled creature, especially if you keep Shield of Faith or have someone else's Sanctuary active.
If you don't care about Fire Shield, instead of Warlock 7 / Paladin 2, go Warlock 1 / Crown Paladin 9: better resilience and Spirit Guardians will stack as easily with Armor of Agathys.

Same idea, different tactic
Fiend Warlock 7 / Bear Barb 3 / Fighter 1
Next level pick Fighter 2 for Action Surge.
Now each short rest you can make yourself an incredibly dangerous barbarian, cast both spells with action surge before raging as a bonus action and rush into melee.
Beware that once enemies understand how dangerous you are they will avoid you so you will need some help from others to keep yourself as the most attractive target. :)

Hexblade Warlock 1 / Fighter 10 (whatever archetype except Champion).
Hex and Hexblade ability will just make you too powerful for your DM to handle, combined with Archery, Sharpshooter and possible Crossbow Expert if your fights tend to last more than 3/4 rounds.
On next level you get yet another attack per Attack.

Lore Bard 6 / whatever martial 5, or Devotion Paladin 10 / starting Fighter 1 built as Dex. Just use Elemental Weapon as your go-to tactic. Sharpshooter is a given, Mage Slayer another good pick for later.

Devotion Paladin 3 / Fiend Warlock 1 (FLUFF ALERT!!!) / Light or Trickster Cleric 3 / Draconic Sorcerer 4
Cleric & Sorcerer for Extended Aid, Devotion Paladin to help offset MADness, Light Cleric mainly for extra cantrip and Warding Flare (or Trickster for Mirror Image and Pass Without Trace), Draconic Sorcerer for extra HP and Shield + possibly Mirror Image or Blur depending on your DEX and metamagics, Warlock here only for THP on kill although also brings some spells and cantrips.
The idea here is to alternate between Warlock's THP on kill thanks to smite, possible Armor of Agathys and other defensive spells to stay firm. Obviously requiring a multiclass 3 into Cleric mainly for Aid is suboptimal, especially with Paladin requirements added (so you cannot make a DEX build).
If DM legitimately says there is gonna be a problem combining Fiend and Devotion, then ditch the whole Paladin's smite and spells idea and instead combine Draconic Sorcerer 3 / Nature or Trickster Cleric 3 / Long Death Monk 5 to still get THP and Aid. At least now you can make a proper WIS build with DEX & CON as second, CHA just enough to multiclass.

Note that all of this is clunky because of requiring Sorcerer's greatness. Once UA is gotten into account all breaks. I'll show it in another post. :)

This is obviously a Half-Elf job.
Go Bard 6 / Sorcerer 4 / Life Cleric 1.
Never care about bumping stats. Just grab Inspiring Leader and Healer feat.
With Magic Secrets, grab (Extended) Aid and either (Twin) Warding Bond, (Extended) Beacon of Hope or (Extended) Aura of Vitality.
Aura of Vitality is always a great spell to have, but if you are the only healer of the group, Beacon of Hope will be immensely better, since it will maximize healing from potions, hit die mechanics, Healer feat, die-based healing class features etc.
Paired with a Leomund's Tiny Hut (which is on Bard spellist), just Healer feat should allow you to put a party to full HP, so you could argue that Beacon of Hope may be overkill...
But it's not always that easy or that smart to take rests in LTH when in hostile zone... :)

Crown Paladin 5 (Bless, Command, Compelled Duel spells, Protection fighting style) / Undying Tome Warlock 3 (Shillelagh, Thorns Whip, Guidance) / Battlemaster Fighter 3 (Menacing Strike, Trip Attack, Commander's if Rogue)
Command enemies to drop prone, keep them angered against you with your Channel Divinity, give your Rogue pal an extra attack at the best moment with Commander's Manoeuver...

There are several ways to emulate a "Warlord" feeling because it had several facets. This is the battlefield control one being represented. Of course Inspiring Leader is a given for that one, possibly Shield Master on next level.

Note that all these or official only. I'll come back when I can for some crazy UA goodness. :)

wilhelmdubdub

2017-10-08, 11:03 AM

Mood druid 10, paladin 2, bearbarian 4,Battlemaster 3, war cleric 1,

Start druid 6: paladin 2: barbarian 3

Either Vhuman with tough or protector Aasimar

JBPuffin

2017-10-08, 01:55 PM

I’d suggest looking into the Pugilist class for a Barbarian-matched monk. Maybe some feature overlap, but it helps you ignore Dex, and the “ki” features? Woah Nelly.

Scathain

2017-10-08, 05:00 PM

I’d suggest looking into the Pugilist class for a Barbarian-matched monk. Maybe some feature overlap, but it helps you ignore Dex, and the “ki” features? Woah Nelly.

Where can I find this intriguing class?

XmonkTad

2017-10-08, 09:46 PM

Devotion Paladin 3 / Tome Warlock 3 / Sorcerer 5.
Half-Elf or Variant Human.
Make it CHA-only character, with 14 STR/DEX/CON, specialized in smiting hard, using short-rest powercheese to create more slots than usual.
++: extreme fuel smite if your DM is lenient, at least balanced fuel otherwise.
Uses a staff as primary weapon, either with Polearm Master for extra attack smiting, or with Shield Master for extra resilience.
Recommended spells: Bless/Hex/Haste, Mirror Image, Armor of Agathys, Shatter, Blindness, Comprehend Languages, Booming Blade, Greenflame Blade, (Repelling) Blast, Ray of Frost.
Recommended metamagics: Twin, Quicken.

I endorse this with the caveat: probably needs to be an elf to avoid taking penalties for replacing sleep with coffee. At level 11, an equally good mix could be Lock 2/ Sorc 4/Paladin 5. Extra attack and 2 ASI's, though less spellcasting. I hate breaking off sorc at level 4, especially with how good haste is, so next level would probably be in sorc.

But yes, if your DM agrees, you can have n-infinite smite fuel and healing potential.

guachi

2017-10-08, 10:48 PM

Elf for GFB.
2 levels of Barbarian for Reckless Attack.
Elven Accuracy feat for three attack rolls on your attack.
7 levels of Rogue.
2 level of... fighter?

You'll need both Strength and Dexterity for this. GFB is a cantrip so dipping into any other class doesn't reduce its damage.

You can wander around wearing Plate and Shield for a high AC.

Quoxis

2017-10-09, 08:26 AM

The polar bear

Fey Warlock 1/totem warrior barbarian 3/Moon druid x

Upcast "armor of agathys", turn into a bear as a bonus action, enter rage as next round's bonus action (or vice versa), enjoy having 40(?) temporary hp ON TOP of what your beast form offers, and then squeal overjoyous as you see that bear rage makes it essentially last twice as long.
Each time you get hit you deal massive damage, so you don't even need to invest in high AC etc., and as a moon druid you can pretty much dump everything except wis (and leave cha and str at 13...).
The downside is that it only works after 1 1/2 rounds (except if you somehow get hasted or dip 2 levels of fighter - moon druids can use their action OR bonus action to wildshape, so the bonus action is free for rage now).

Easy_Lee

2017-10-09, 09:00 AM

In true munchkin fashion, here's one that's only barely possible and requires an item to function.

Monk 1 / Paladin 2 / Wizard (Bladesinger) X
Race: Elf (any)
Stats: 13/14/10/13/14/13
Items: Headband of Intellect, keep an eye out for anything that increases your dexterity, intellect, or wisdom.
Feats: None, all ASIs go to Dexterity, then Wisdom.
Armor: Wizard robes
Weapon: Wizard staff (quarterstaff)

You'll have 18 dexterity at level 11. With headband of intellect, your AC while Bladesinging will be 20. Add Blur and Shield to that and you're mostly untouchable.

Weapon cantrips scale off level, so your damage won't suffer.

With superior wizard spell slots, you can smite harder than the party paladin. If you want to smite twice in one round, forgo your weapon cantrip to do one quarterstaff attack with one unarmed strike as a bonus action (martial arts).

And oh, by the way, you're a wizard. Go ahead and prepare all of the support, AoE, control, and contingency spells you want. You've got damage and AC covered, so no need to waste extra slots on those.

Scathain

2017-10-10, 12:36 AM

djreynolds

2017-10-10, 02:03 AM

X3r4ph

2017-10-10, 03:03 AM

Look At Me, I Am Captain Now.

Fighter Knight 4/ Mystic Immortal 4/ Wizard Bladesinger 2.

You mark you oppenent and tell them that you are captain now. They now have disadvantaged on all attacks that isnt against you. You AC is nuts btw. When dancing you get dex + int + con to AC. Buff with Shield spell and Beast Form Tough Hide if necessary.
So, discouraged they attack youR friends, and forget that you are captain. So you slap them back boosting you many reaction attacks with Beast Claws.

LOOK AT ME!!!

Scathain

2017-10-10, 01:24 PM

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?502248-Ultimate-Optimizer-s-Multiclassing-Guide

Here just use PeteNutButter's guide, it is very good

Oh, I love that guide! Some good stuff in there, helped me build some potent combos in the past. I didn't even think to show my party members...(alas I'm the only one in the group on gitp:smallfrown:)

I've got a reserve character built who is my first attempt at triple classing. Pretty underwhelming compared to some of y'all's ideas, but should be a fun character to play if my current monk does.

Half elf standard array with +1's on Int and Wis
S8 D14 C12 I16 W14 Ch12
So far...
Acolyte background
Rogue 1
Knowledge Cleric 1
Wizard 2+

7 languages, proficient in 10 skills with expertise in 4, only 1 level behind in spell slots, but 2 in Wizard spell level.

As she progresses, another rogue level for cunning action or another cleric level for the CD and spell slot would probably be in order at some point, but maybe not. Shes rocking a breastplate for 16AC and only 25 hp, so she's a bit squishy.

Cantrips:
Guidance, Thaumaturgy, Mending, Message, Mage Hand and Chill Touch

Spells:
Cleric-Command, Identify, Protection from Evil, Detect Evil, Sanctuary

Wizard Book- Cause Fear
Color Spray, False Life, Find Familiar, Disguise Self, Grease, Magic Missile, Puppet

Underwhelming?! That is a badass skill set. Further, I literally know the player in our group that would jump on a build like this. Thanks!:smallbiggrin:

A few others... :)

Blade Pact Fiend Warlock 7 / Rogue 1 / Paladin 2
Make it a variant human, start with 16 STR and CHA and grappler feat, pick Warcaster as your other feat.
Rogue means Expertise obviously. Pick Hex, Armor of Agathys, and Fire Shield.
Idea here is to rely on Booming Blade and GreenFlameBlade usually, while having the option of using Extra Attack to grapple for resilient targets before smacking them good.
Rogue is here to allow you to use concentration on something else, like Bless or Shield of Faith from Paladin. But you could still use Hex if you really want to be really sure.
For the biggest fights, use upcast Armor of Agathys / Fire Shield before using this tactic. This will make you a very nasty target for that poor grappled creature, especially if you keep Shield of Faith or have someone else's Sanctuary active.
If you don't care about Fire Shield, instead of Warlock 7 / Paladin 2, go Warlock 1 / Crown Paladin 9: better resilience and Spirit Guardians will stack as easily with Armor of Agathys.

Same idea, different tactic
Fiend Warlock 7 / Bear Barb 3 / Fighter 1
Next level pick Fighter 2 for Action Surge.
Now each short rest you can make yourself an incredibly dangerous barbarian, cast both spells with action surge before raging as a bonus action and rush into melee.
Beware that once enemies understand how dangerous you are they will avoid you so you will need some help from others to keep yourself as the most attractive target. :)

Hexblade Warlock 1 / Fighter 10 (whatever archetype except Champion).
Hex and Hexblade ability will just make you too powerful for your DM to handle, combined with Archery, Sharpshooter and possible Crossbow Expert if your fights tend to last more than 3/4 rounds.
On next level you get yet another attack per Attack.

Lore Bard 6 / whatever martial 5, or Devotion Paladin 10 / starting Fighter 1 built as Dex. Just use Elemental Weapon as your go-to tactic. Sharpshooter is a given, Mage Slayer another good pick for later.

Devotion Paladin 3 / Fiend Warlock 1 (FLUFF ALERT!!!) / Light or Trickster Cleric 3 / Draconic Sorcerer 4
Cleric & Sorcerer for Extended Aid, Devotion Paladin to help offset MADness, Light Cleric mainly for extra cantrip and Warding Flare (or Trickster for Mirror Image and Pass Without Trace), Draconic Sorcerer for extra HP and Shield + possibly Mirror Image or Blur depending on your DEX and metamagics, Warlock here only for THP on kill although also brings some spells and cantrips.
The idea here is to alternate between Warlock's THP on kill thanks to smite, possible Armor of Agathys and other defensive spells to stay firm. Obviously requiring a multiclass 3 into Cleric mainly for Aid is suboptimal, especially with Paladin requirements added (so you cannot make a DEX build).
If DM legitimately says there is gonna be a problem combining Fiend and Devotion, then ditch the whole Paladin's smite and spells idea and instead combine Draconic Sorcerer 3 / Nature or Trickster Cleric 3 / Long Death Monk 5 to still get THP and Aid. At least now you can make a proper WIS build with DEX & CON as second, CHA just enough to multiclass.

Note that all of this is clunky because of requiring Sorcerer's greatness. Once UA is gotten into account all breaks. I'll show it in another post. :)

This is obviously a Half-Elf job.
Go Bard 6 / Sorcerer 4 / Life Cleric 1.
Never care about bumping stats. Just grab Inspiring Leader and Healer feat.
With Magic Secrets, grab (Extended) Aid and either (Twin) Warding Bond, (Extended) Beacon of Hope or (Extended) Aura of Vitality.
Aura of Vitality is always a great spell to have, but if you are the only healer of the group, Beacon of Hope will be immensely better, since it will maximize healing from potions, hit die mechanics, Healer feat, die-based healing class features etc.
Paired with a Leomund's Tiny Hut (which is on Bard spellist), just Healer feat should allow you to put a party to full HP, so you could argue that Beacon of Hope may be overkill...
But it's not always that easy or that smart to take rests in LTH when in hostile zone... :)

Crown Paladin 5 (Bless, Command, Compelled Duel spells, Protection fighting style) / Undying Tome Warlock 3 (Shillelagh, Thorns Whip, Guidance) / Battlemaster Fighter 3 (Menacing Strike, Trip Attack, Commander's if Rogue)
Command enemies to drop prone, keep them angered against you with your Channel Divinity, give your Rogue pal an extra attack at the best moment with Commander's Manoeuver...

There are several ways to emulate a "Warlord" feeling because it had several facets. This is the battlefield control one being represented. Of course Inspiring Leader is a given for that one, possibly Shield Master on next level.

Note that all these or official only. I'll come back when I can for some crazy UA goodness. :)

Alright Citan, I've had some time to mull these over.

The Warlord
Now I've never played 4e, but I've heard the Warlord was a favorite of that edition, and I can see why if this build is any indication.
Oath of the Crown seems underwhelming at a glance when you compare its higher level abilities, but Divine Allegiance / Protection FS provide some HARDCORE damage mitigation.
Battlemaster is great too, but I think I'd choose Maneuvering Attack and Rally, only keeping Trip Attack as an offensive maneuver.
I love your use of Undying, I'm the only one in our group to have ever tried it out. What Invocations would you pick?
Finally, for UA spin-off, replace the Undying with Hexblade, pick up Aura and Divine Allegiance early.

The Healer
Why am I always drawn to support classes? I love Bards in this edition, the cherry picking of spells makes them one of the most versatile MC's out there. I could see replacing sorcerer with Thief Rogue for fast hands Healer, but only if I was the only source of heals, as you suggest.

Icyfire Grappler / Bipolar Rageous
And people say warlocks are only good for Eldritch Blasts:sabine:

The Catcher
Only comment is to add Tabaxi and stir.

The Stormbringer
I love the classic Tempest Cleric / Draconic Sorcerer combo, and wizard makes this even better. Planeshift material is also available at my table, so I wonder what would change if it went Zeal Domain instead. Obviously you could choose Red OR Blue (Gold OR silver) heritage, and fire spells are more abundant...

Citan

2017-10-10, 04:31 PM

Oh, I love that guide! Some good stuff in there, helped me build some potent combos in the past. I didn't even think to show my party members...(alas I'm the only one in the group on gitp:smallfrown:)

Underwhelming?! That is a badass skill set. Further, I literally know the player in our group that would jump on a build like this. Thanks!:smallbiggrin:

Alright Citan, I've had some time to mull these over.

The Warlord
Now I've never played 4e, but I've heard the Warlord was a favorite of that edition, and I can see why if this build is any indication.
Oath of the Crown seems underwhelming at a glance when you compare its higher level abilities, but Divine Allegiance / Protection FS provide some HARDCORE damage mitigation.
Battlemaster is great too, but I think I'd choose Maneuvering Attack and Rally, only keeping Trip Attack as an offensive maneuver.
I love your use of Undying, I'm the only one in our group to have ever tried it out. What Invocations would you pick?
Finally, for UA spin-off, replace the Undying with Hexblade, pick up Aura and Divine Allegiance early.

The Healer
Why am I always drawn to support classes? I love Bards in this edition, the cherry picking of spells makes them one of the most versatile MC's out there. I could see replacing sorcerer with Thief Rogue for fast hands Healer, but only if I was the only source of heals, as you suggest.

Icyfire Grappler / Bipolar Rageous
And people say warlocks are only good for Eldritch Blasts:sabine:

The Catcher
Only comment is to add Tabaxi and stir.

The Stormbringer
I love the classic Tempest Cleric / Draconic Sorcerer combo, and wizard makes this even better. Planeshift material is also available at my table, so I wonder what would change if it went Zeal Domain instead. Obviously you could choose Red OR Blue (Gold OR silver) heritage, and fire spells are more abundant...
And yet, I didn't even start with UA...

Basically, even barring the obviously stupidly broken option (the Wizard that can learn Cleric spells earlier than a Cleric oO), there are some stupidly good things there...
- Favored Soul Sorcerer: makes any CHA-based metamagic support much easier obviously since you can just pick them "normally" as you progress (the fact that you "eat" at offensive spells should not be a great deal for a support character. Beyond that, the only ones really useful you can't get with one-level dips are Aid, Warding Bond, Revivify, Spiritual Weapons, Spirit Guardians. Unless you want them all you still have some spare for offense).
- Hexblade Warlock: SADness + better than Champion, Vengeance Paladin and Hunter all united, against one target every short rest? I'll take it any day.
- Sheperd Druid: that level 2 aura has 3 great effects, so you always have a chance to use it for good effect every short rest.
- Mystic: well, there are so many powerful things to do at first glance that honestly I didn't even try to really study it. I'm sure you can do some pretty OP things with that, whatever class you pair it with...
- College of Satyre (if I'm not mistaken): Dodge and Dash as bonus action, I'll take it...
- Phoenix Sorcerer: stupidly broken good with all fire spells, particularly Scorching Ray. Stack this on Hexblade and Action Surge and enemies will cry.
- Barbarian UA that makes him have a spike aura: perfect for the Icerager build.

Sorry I have no time to detail before at least tomorrow afternoon. :)

By the way, about the Warlord, there are several ways to build it truly. If you are interested use the search motor with "warlord" as keyword, and me as post author, you should quickly find the relevant interesting discussions.

Zene

2017-10-11, 02:48 PM

If you are interested use the search motor with "warlord" as keyword, and me as post author, you should quickly find the relevant interesting discussions.

I just went back and read a bunch of your warlord-related posts using this method. I didn't play anything between 2e and 5e, so I've never played a warlord nor seen one in action. However, I'm fascinated by the concept, and some of those builds you've put together for it sound like they'd be super fun to play.

Any thoughts on consolidating your warlord musings into one place (guide or otherwise)? I think it'd be a great contribution --I know I'd love to use it as a resource.

For that matter, would you ever consider putting together something on grappling? I've seen a lot of your creative comments/thoughts/builds on grappling strewn through various threads; it'd be awesome to have all that consolidated in one place.

Citan

2017-10-11, 05:37 PM

I just went back and read a bunch of your warlord-related posts using this method. I didn't play anything between 2e and 5e, so I've never played a warlord nor seen one in action. However, I'm fascinated by the concept, and some of those builds you've put together for it sound like they'd be super fun to play.

Any thoughts on consolidating your warlord musings into one place (guide or otherwise)? I think it'd be a great contribution --I know I'd love to use it as a resource.

For that matter, would you ever consider putting together something on grappling? I've seen a lot of your creative comments/thoughts/builds on grappling strewn through various threads; it'd be awesome to have all that consolidated in one place.
I'll be honest with you.
I'm already spending faaaaaaar too much time on these forums for my own good, when I should be trying to learn technical skills for my "very-probably-coming-soon" new job, or at least putting my brain back on my long-due homebrew. XD
(I've been seriously considering asking a "willing ban" for some days/weeks to force me to work, that's how weak-spirited I am these days ^^)

Plus I feel it's a bit of a pain to structure guides with this forum conventions (although they are very good as a reader for sure ^^).
But if some people prove interested I'll put these items on my "to-do before next month" list. :)
At least i'll take some time to put them into my signature (has been months since I'm telling myself to do that XD).

Anyways, glad you found some ideas you like.
Don't hesitate to open a dedicated thread if you want some help to tailor a character, there are always at least a dozen people that can advise you whatever hour of the day you post it. ;)

Zene

2017-10-11, 06:29 PM

I'll be honest with you.
I'm already spending faaaaaaar too much time on these forums for my own good, when I should be trying to learn technical skills for my "very-probably-coming-soon" new job, or at least putting my brain back on my long-due homebrew. XD
(I've been seriously considering asking a "willing ban" for some days/weeks to force me to work, that's how weak-spirited I am these days ^^)

Plus I feel it's a bit of a pain to structure guides with this forum conventions (although they are very good as a reader for sure ^^).
But if some people prove interested I'll put these items on my "to-do before next month" list. :)
At least i'll take some time to put them into my signature (has been months since I'm telling myself to do that XD).

Anyways, glad you found some ideas you like.
Don't hesitate to open a dedicated thread if you want some help to tailor a character, there are always at least a dozen people that can advise you whatever hour of the day you post it. ;)

Haha, oh man, I totally get the 'need to focus time on more productive things' angle. No worries at all :)

Ivor_The_Mad

2017-10-12, 08:27 AM

Mortis_Elrod

2017-10-12, 08:33 AM

I think that triple multiclass could make for a very interesting character. It would allow for more variation in abilities. I might try randomly rolling classes...*role*...*role*...*role*.. Ranger, Monk, Druid.

Shadow/long Death/sun soul
Moon Druid
Revised ranger

Not bad

Citan

2017-10-12, 09:33 AM

I think that triple multiclass could make for a very interesting character. It would allow for more variation in abilities. I might try randomly rolling classes...*role*...*role*...*role*.. Ranger, Monk, Druid.
Pff, it's a cheat roll: you cannot go wrong with any mix of those three classes really. ;)

Scathain

2017-10-12, 09:48 AM

Pff, it's a cheat roll: you cannot go wrong with any mix of those three classes really. ;)

I was about to say, that’s a pretty good roll, considering all three of those classes can work in a number of ways together lol

Spiritchaser

2017-10-12, 09:57 AM

Lore Bard6/Life Cleric4/Druid1. Be the ultimate healer with Goodberry/Aura of Vitality Cheese. This will of course be dependant on your DM letting both our at least one benifit from Desciple of Life.

I really prefer life cleric 1 lore bard 6, sorcerer for this. You can extend spell to get 240 hp off a 3rd level cast and a sorcery point.

Life cleric 1, lore bard 6, warlock 5 is probably even better since you can heal 120 hp with each short rest slot, which can lead to a style of play that is otherwise not well supported in 5e... but that requires one too many levels... ah well

DivisibleByZero

2017-10-12, 10:06 AM

I played a Monk 1 / Bladesinger 2 / Arcane Trickster, who used Dex to fight with an arcane focus Q-staff. He had pretty decent AC (10+Dex+Wis+Int), and with Polearm Master I'd get an OA whenever a creature came to attack me, and another on my turn, then using Cunning Action to Disengage.
Good AC, good damage output, amazing bonus action choices, great mobility, fantastic scout, skill monkey, and casting. All he was missing was healing.
Technically allowing sneak attack with a staff isn't RAW, but the DM allowed it as a Monk's Martial Arts basically makes any simple weapon finesse (but without the tag, which is why it isn't RAW). But it was a whole lot of fun!

tieren

2017-10-12, 10:09 AM

Woodsman Archer:

I had an idea for an archer, before the revised ranger came out, that would address many of the weaknesses I saw in the PhB ranger.

Idea is to be a summoner using conjure beasts to keep an ally in 5' of your targets to get sneak attack damage.

Ranger 5/druid 8/rogue 7

Ranger got you extra attack, colossus slayer, archery fighting style; druid got you the better spell list and slots for the summoning, plus the wildshape for utility to get into good sniper positions; rogue got you cunning action, expertise, and sneak attack. Also high level ranger stuff (like evasion or uncanny dodge) are low level rogue stuff (like evasion AND uncanny dodge). Land druid grasslands gets you invisibility and haste as circle spells. I was thinking AT for the rogue subclass to keep some spell progression going.

The build is primarily based around dexterity, so it isn't MAD for a MC build, you'll need wisdom 13 or up but don't plan on casting many saves or attack spells so the DC doesn't matter too much.

RumoCrytuf

2017-10-12, 10:58 AM

Lombra

2017-10-12, 11:04 AM

Quoxis

2017-10-12, 11:10 AM

Why is everyone talking about using a q-staff as a focus on a non-druid PC, when the only focus it coud be used as is a druidic one, as per the arcane focus description in the items section of the PHB?

"An arcane focus is a special item—an orb, a crystal, a rod, a specially constructed staff, a wand-like length of wood, or some similar item—designed to channel the power of arcane spells. A sorcerer, warlock, or wizard can use such an item as a spellcasting focus, as described in chapter 10. (PHB, p. 151)"

By RAW you could have a wand-like club and channel magic and beatings through it, though quarterstaffs are far mor common.

Rhedyn

2017-10-12, 11:34 AM

Paladin 5/Warlock 2/Bard X

Fighter 5/Rogue 2/Wizard X

Barbarian 5/Fighter 2/Druid X

Fighter 1/Warlock 2/Sorcerer X

Joe dirt

2017-10-12, 02:05 PM

become the greatest spymaster,
be able to kill the king and take his place as the "true" ruler

start alternative human for "actor feat"
warlock 3 for mask of the many and devils sight and imp for a spy and darkness spell and hex
rogue (assassin or arcane trickster for utility) 7+X for cunning action and back-stab ability and evasion
fighter 2 for gaining additional actions when the going gets tuff

typical combat goes as follows, 1 cast darkness with devil's sight u can see while enemy cant... this translates that u gain advantage on attacks and they gain disadvantage to hit you... (assuming they can even see you) but you also have cunning action as a bonus action so this means that you can hide in the darkness that u cast every round then attack with backstab bonus damage. if enemy gets pissed cause they cant see you they typically throw fireballs and other area effect spells at you, dont worry u have evasion ;) so now u are untargetable by normal attacks as well as area effect ones too (as long as u make ur save). and u do massive damage thanks to ur every round sneak damage so congrats you now have a death machine...

out of combat use hex, first cast it on a frog, or mouse. then kill it, now u have a spell that nobody even knows u cast gives enemies disadvantage to detect u picking pockets for example. or cheat at games of chance... it last for an hour so hex away.

for cantrips, i would choose eldritch blast, friends, and green flame blade... u can go around as someone else and cast friends on someone then with ur advantage to all charisma checks u can make ur enemies turn on eachother... because the friends spell makes people enemies after they realize they been charmed

for feat choice besides actor, i would either choose lucky... nice when that save of yours occasionally fails

further i would have everone in the party take 2 levels of warlock for "devils sight" and make that the bond that binds them. cool roleplay plus everyone can see thru magical darkness... it would provide the dm a unique problem though so i would discuss before hand

Ivor_The_Mad

2017-10-12, 02:18 PM

I was about to say, that’s a pretty good roll, considering all three of those classes can work in a number of ways together lol

Ok fine I didn't actually role but I didn't put much thought into it. I just picked 3 classes

Lombra

2017-10-12, 03:56 PM

"An arcane focus is a special item—an orb, a crystal, a rod, a specially constructed staff, a wand-like length of wood, or some similar item—designed to channel the power of arcane spells. A sorcerer, warlock, or wizard can use such an item as a spellcasting focus, as described in chapter 10. (PHB, p. 151)"

By RAW you could have a wand-like club and channel magic and beatings through it, though quarterstaffs are far mor common.

I'm sorry but a staff is not a quarterstaff. Especially a specially constructed one for the purposes of magic focus. You can't call it RAW. The only RAW that connects arcane focuses and quarterstaves are when they get mentioned as being eligeable to be used as a druidic focus.

DivisibleByZero

2017-10-12, 04:04 PM

I'm sorry but a staff is not a quarterstaff. Especially a specially constructed one for the purposes of magic focus. You can't call it RAW. The only RAW that connects arcane focuses and quarterstaves are when they get mentioned as being eligeable to be used as a druidic focus.

The game designers disagree with you.
A staff is a staff is a staff. An arcane focus, which happens to be a staff, does not cease being a staff.
Mearls says yes. (https://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/09/11/focus-staff/)
JC says that he allows it. (https://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/03/20/can-i-use-arcane-focus-staff-as-a-quarterstaff-in-melee/)

Lombra

2017-10-12, 04:26 PM

The game designers disagree with you.
A staff is a staff is a staff. An arcane focus, which happens to be a staff, does not cease being a staff.
Mearls says yes. (https://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/09/11/focus-staff/)
JC says that he allows it. (https://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/03/20/can-i-use-arcane-focus-staff-as-a-quarterstaff-in-melee/)

Nice RAI, still not RAW. A staff designed to fight is clearly not necessairly or exclusively the same object as a staff to cast spells. Plus the name of the weapon is different from the name of the focus: the former is a quarterstaff, the latter is a staff, specifically constructed.

Can you have staves specifically constructed to perform as a quarterstaff and as a focus? Why not? But that's not RAW.

DivisibleByZero

2017-10-12, 04:47 PM

Nice RAI, still not RAW. A staff designed to fight is clearly not necessairly or exclusively the same object as a staff to cast spells. Plus the name of the weapon is different from the name of the focus: the former is a quarterstaff, the latter is a staff, specifically constructed.

Can you have staves specifically constructed to perform as a quarterstaff and as a focus? Why not? But that's not RAW.

That's your reading of RAW.
JC says that he allows it.
Mearls flat out says that it is.
To each his own.

Incidentally, the DMG disagrees with what you just said as well.

Unless a staff's description says otherwise, a staff can be used as a quarterstaff.
The description for an arcane focus staff does not say otherwise.

LordEntrails

2017-10-12, 05:10 PM

Scathain

2017-10-12, 05:21 PM

I think if the whole party is doing this, then everyone should take at least 2 levels worth of casting and 2 levels worth of fighting. This, imo, would give a real rough and tumble sort of group where everyone can mix it up a bit and do some cool magic too.

Good point! If everyone plays some caliber of gish, all the roles are much easier to fill. The only foreseeable thing lacking would be higher level spells. But when everyone is rocking heavy armor / unarmored defense / etc., I suppose that matters less.

Edit: and that brings up another question! We have six party members including myself, so there’s ABSOLUTELY going to be overlap in main classes at least. What are some team comps you guys can think of given all this?

Citan

2017-10-12, 05:33 PM

Rhedyn

2017-10-12, 09:16 PM

Quarter staffs are clearly staffs to suggest otherwise is just combative DMing.

Citan

2017-10-13, 08:03 PM

Hey ;)

It's very late for me so I won't bring many builds right now, but I felt I still needed to provide a few... ^^

So... Lets rock UA (just, know that there won"t be any Mystic in there because I still didn't have time to properly read and analyse it).

First for a revamp of some builds I suggested earlier...

WIS-based: Fighter 2 / Revised Hunter Ranger 6 / Shepherd Druid 4 OR Shepherd Druid 2 / Revised Ranger 2 / Arcane Trickster Rogue 7
This variant takes power from having Druid's Shepherd ability that can give you advantage on ranged attacks.
Honestly Fighter is just here in case you want to use Action Surge to cast a spell and still attack. Otherwise ditch it without regret to replace it with the classic Rogue 2 for Cunning Action.
Efficiency also depends on whether you prefer granting advantage to others and/or if DM lets you use reaction on yourself (although that's a bit strange). Hence the Rogue or Ranger propositions.

INT-based: Eldricht Knight 7 / Sheperd Druid 2 / (Bladesinger/Evoker) Wizard 2.
So far it's plain inferior to the WIS one, but once you get EK 10 there will be awesome synergy with Shepherd's aura (aura > advantage on attacks > better chance of enabling Eldricht Strike > better chance of landing save or suck spells).
Note that I made this split only because you wanted triple-class stat.
Otherwise, I'd push Wizard multiclass for much later.
Also, technically, you could make it a WIS-based instead of INT-based, since both Druid and Wizard have great offensive spells.

Remember how we had to pick Lore Bard 6 just to pick some great spells?
With Favored Soul and available, no need anymore.
Not that the previous one was bad, it would still have some strengths of its own (short-rest Bardic Inspiration, Extended Aura of Vitality).
BUT...
For someone that boast as being the healer, better go like this...

Life Cleric 1 / Druid 1 / Tome Warlock 3 / Favored Soul Sorcerer 6
Only get those great buffs spells that are 2nd and 3rd level...
Spend day preparing Life Goodberries with short rest, just keeping enough for extended Aid...
Alternative: Life Cleric 1 / Favored Soul 10: much more reliable because you get Raise Dead and you can cast much higher Extended Aid. May be more acceptable by your DM compared to Life Goodberry cheese.

Raven Tome Warlock 3 / Revised Ranger 2 / Lore Bard 6
Or Raven Warlock 3 / Lore Bard 5 / Swashbuckler Rogue 3.
Or Raven Warlock 5 / Favored Soul Sorcerer 5 / Rogue 1.
First feels more thematic for a Hunter, thanks to Hunter's Mark and freedom of movement + favored enemy. And has Magic Secrets.
Second has the advantage of being more mobile overall and having better guaranteed Initiative.
Third has more fuel for metamagic and rituals and one more ASI.

In any case, the idea is having a versatile character that shines extremely when tracking a creature and more generally perceiving any threat.
So you will need to grab the Observant feat.
Add that to Raven's 1st level benefit, and you now have a +8 or +9 extra bonus to your passive Perception and Investigation
In addition to that, you have Expertise (Rogue/Bard) in Perception, and potentially natural advantage (Ranger). Otherwise, you can just cast an (Extended?) Enhance Ability or use your Hunter's Mark. You also get Darkvision and See Invisibility to help you keeping your eyes peeled.

This one is as stupid as one could expect...
a) Fighter 2 / Undying Light Tome Warlock 5 / Phoenix Sorcerer 5 (balanced coffeelock, sustainable all day) or
b) Fighter 2 / Undying Light Warlock 1 / Phoenix Sorcerer 8 (best nova damage).
Obviously take Elemental Adept feat just to be sure.
Activate your Mantle of Flame as bonus action, Action Surge & Action cast highest level Scorching Rays available.
Since each is a separate attack roll, you roll damage separately for each, so you get +4 to each (or +5 is you went Warlock 5, because then you can start as Variant Human and use both ASI to bump CHA, while getting Devil's Sight to still get darkvision).

Build a) can thus deal a great nova, each short rest, equal to 2*(4*(2d6+5)) for an average of 40+56=106 provided everything hits of course. Add to that Undying Light "bonus damage per cast" so 10 extra so 116.
Big advantage of this one is that you can also convert use the coffeelock technic to convert short rest slots into extra long ones, so you could stack enough 3rd level slots to cast them every round for the one big fight (obviously don't use it everyday of your DM will legitimately ban it or compensate in ways that will harm you or your party).
Plus you get up to 3rd level rituals.

Build b) has the edge in the one big nova of the day by casting SR as 4th level, although it will definitely eat grealy into its resources (since coffeelock thing is obviously near useless with 1 extra SP per short rest):
Basically take the previous average and add another two rays for an added average of 24.
Plus you get better spells including Wall of Fire (although not sure it works with Mantle of Flame: per ROC I'd say it works, per RAW I'd say it doesn't: Mantle of Flame requires YOU to roll damage, and I'd argue a creature that starts its turn in the area has damage rolled by the DM).

Both builds can also cast Flaming Spheres and Fireball with each getting +8 or +10 (depending on your build). These Fireball especially, with Empower metamagic stacked onto its, will wreak havoc among enemies.

Ok so my usual take at this concept is...
The Unkillable: Shadow Sorcerer 1 (chance at avoiding 0 except if triggered by radiant damage) / Undying Light Warlock 1 (resistance to radiant damage) / Long Death Monk 11+ (use ki to avoid 0), then adapt. But it does not fit the "level 11" requirement.
Le's enter UA's Stone Sorcerer. ;)
Let's enter the Mystic!!! (I went out of my way because I remembered it had some "change your saving throw" ability). Alternative: Barbarian.
Let's welcome back the Cleric!

a) Stone Sorcerer 4 / Life or Nature Cleric 3 / Mystic 4
b) Stone Sorcerer 4 / Nature or Life Cleric 3 / Bear Barbarian 4

Both are extremely MAD, but you don't care that much about that. Pick one "offensive" stat to focus on (either physical or mental) and Constitution, you don't care about anything else.
Start as an Half-Elf or Hill Dwarf to help getting a starting 16 CON and 16 in whatever other stat you want. Use one ASI on bumping Constitution, and another one on Tough.
a) has the advantage of chancing your saving throw on a short rest (provided you manage to get information on what lies ahead, that's a pretty broken ability).
b) has the advantage of reducting all damage except psychic, but prevents casting.

In both case, you cast the highest extended Aid you can, which is a level 4 one, for some extra 15 HP, not THAT great but always helpful.
Just "features & spells" combined amount to 4 (Stone Sorcerer) + 15 (Aid) + 22 (Tough) + 44 (CON mod*level) = 85. Add to that your HP dice roll. Let's say it's all d8 for simplicity, taking average: 11*5=55.
So total HP for this character, at least 140 HP.
Should be pretty resilient. ;)

To compare, a tanky Barbarian of the same level so 20 CON, taking average rolls on die, would have 11*(5+6) = 121 HP.

Plus you are still fairly useful overall, whatever way you want to build... Except melee, for now. The 12th level will correct this: Extra Attack for Barbarian, Hexblade Warlock dip if you wanted to main CHA.

To be honest this is not, by far, a "broken" build: you have many other ways to achieve similar resilience, and much less convoluted. But I just wanted to try and make something that plays on Stone Sorcerer's strength.

"Pull! Push! Pull! Push!"
"Go front, go back, go front, go back"
Rings a bell? Yeah, those are things you usually hear in fitness groups.
Why not give a "fitness lesson" to those hostiles?

Warlock 3 / Favored Soul Sorcerer (him again, yet again, always) / whatever (yea, really, although I'd be partial to a Rogue depending on the kind of Favored Soul you choose)
I'd probably go like this: Rogue 1 / Tome Warlock 3 (whatever Patron you like, although I'd be partial to Fiend for Command spell) / Old Favored Soul (War) Sorcerer 7.

What is the basic idea here? Well...
Warlock side: Repelling Blast Invocation, with or without Agonizing Blast (really up to you, I'd rather pick the one that reduces enemy speed or the one for rituals), then Shillelagh, Thorns Whip and Booming Blade.
Sorcerer side: Shield, Web/Stinking Cloud, Wall of Fire and whatever else you like, together with Quicken and either Twin or Careful (this one is better if DM follows RAW and disregard tweets, unless you plan on using mainly Spirit Guardians or Wall of Fire) metamagics. Bonus point on grabbing Spell Sniper is you'd like.
The idea here is basically to set up whatever "damaging area spell" you like (don't forget you also have Spirit Guardians available) and spend your time (twin) pulling enemies with Thorns Whip or instead (quicken) pushing them with Repelling Blast to force them into harmful zones, maybe (twin) stopping them with Command or Booming Blade or Extra Attack Expertly (Rogue) grappling them while staying just outside yourself.
Of course if you can have any Spike Growth from a friend stacked onto your own, even better. ;)

This seem like a very lackluster build at first, but played smartly it can make a big difference.
Of course if you don't care about armor proficiencies, and extra attack, you can safely ditch old Favored Soul to instead pick "new" one. Or maybe you are not interested at all in Command, Guiding Bolt, Bless and Spirit Guardians, in which case Stone Sorcerer (for extra resilience) or Sea Stone (once per turn increase a forced movement by 15 feet on a marked creature).
In any case, yet again short rest slots can be used to create some "extra reserve long rest slots" which can then be converted back as SP for Quicken/Twin (like how humans can convert food into fat, then back into energy ;)).

Another way to make this, although quite different mechanically and thematically, is mixing Tempest Cleric 6 (push on lightning damage) with Storm Sorcerer 3 (Lightning Lure, Quicken) and Warlock 2 (Repelling Blast) but that cantrip only deals damage if creature is close to you and it feels awfully clunky resource-wise...

Warlock 1 / Lore Bard 4 / Shadow Sorcerer 6
Honestly I'd happily ditch Warlock to get Lore Bard 5 for Bestow Curse on that one, but hey, it's a triple-class challenge. :)
So, here, very simple: give enemies your worst single-target debuff spell (Hence Bestow Curse would be nice) thanks to Shadow Hound as a bonus action.
If you don't care about getting Bestow Curse, down Bard to 1 (Longstrider and Dissonant Whispers to help your Shadow and its target meet and stay together sometimes, Healing Words because always helpful) and probably go Sorcerer 9 to get better single-target spells.
Obviously Heightened would be redundant here, so instead take Distant (GREAT for Bestow Curse which is normally a touch spell, unless you also grab a familiar by going Warlock 3 which can deliver it for you) or Quickened or Extended (great for Polymorph, Hold Monster). I'd probably take Extended whatever happens. Because, you want to know the true broken thing about Shadow Hound? Contrarily to probably 100% other such feature, per RAW, the hound ability will not only affect initial saving throw, but also any and every other saving throw as long as the distance requirement is fullfilled. So every one of those spells which you usually hesitate to cast because they generally don't last more than one/two turns, have a great chance to stick as long as you need to now. ;)

Easy_Lee

2017-10-13, 08:38 PM

Quarter staffs are clearly staffs to suggest otherwise is just combative DMing.

Agreed. Honestly, why is this even in doubt?

Speaking of which, back in Neverwinter Nights it was possible to TWF with wizard staves. I'm glad to see that it's possible again in 5e.

Crgaston

2017-10-13, 09:06 PM

Agreed. Honestly, why is this even in doubt?

Speaking of which, back in Neverwinter Nights it was possible to TWF with wizard staves. I'm glad to see that it's possible again in 5e.

Egads, it is! Are dual wielding Q-staff PAM Pally/Druid/Sorcerer builds are the next big thing? Twinned Smiting Shillelagh? With twinned Smite spells?? And double Divine Smite???

Naanomi

2017-10-13, 09:07 PM

Quarter staffs are clearly staffs to suggest otherwise is just combative DMing.
Um... maybe the other way around. After all, Spell-focus staves do cost 25X as much as just a weapon

Asmotherion

2017-10-13, 10:13 PM

My favorite combination of 3 classes is Sorcerer/Warlock/Paladin.

I usually go Sorcerer 7/Warlock 7/Paladin 6 end game, with this progression:

Sorcerer 1
Warlock 3
Sorcerer 2
Paladin 2
Sorcerer 3
Warlock 3
Paladin 4
Sorcerer 1
Warlock 1

A lot of spell slots, 2 of them rechargable on a short rest, and your Cha bonus on Dex Saves. By taking Pact of the Tome and Shillelagh you can also use your Cha on your attack/damage rolls and if a Fire Dragon Sorcerer, you can quicken Green-Flame Blade + Booming Blade to add a lot of damage to your melee attacks, in addition to your Divine Smite damage. Madness is minimum, as all you need besides Charisma-focus for this build, is a minimum of 13 Strength for the Paladin Multiclass pre-requisits. Then, you can focus the rest on Constitution, and use Heavy Armor and a Shield for AC, instead of Dexterity (you can get proficiency in it by swiching the first level to Paladin, I just use this build as I usually have a high point buy, granting me a high Dexterity that goes well with the Dragon Scales). For Ranged combat, you have Eldritch (Agonising) Blast, and finally a better selection of spells than most Half-Casters/Gish builds out there.

I have more to suggest, but this is my favorite, as all 3 key off Charisma and it's simply wonderfull how well they can work together. You can try other percentages of each class obviously, and it works too, but I think this gives the best of all 3, at a nice pace.

I know most people don't like multiclassing before extra attack and/or feats, but you're a Sorlock damn it. Be a man, and Quicken your Eldritch Blasts like one till you can effectivelly Gish better. You can't do everything greatly, but at least you're great at something. :) You'll eventually get to the point where you melee better than everyone in the party, so for now just wait...

JeffreyGator

2017-10-13, 10:13 PM

Looking for a theme you can be a elite operations team. Every can do everybody's job and some people do it better.

Everyone has some stealth, skills and nova ability, some healing, some magic and fighting.

RogAT4+, ShadowMonk 6, Cleric(arcane) 1

RogAss 6, FTR 2, Rgr 3(beast)

Rog(AT)3, EK(3), Wiz (5)

Another good theme is a group that can all see in magical darkness and make darkness
all have shadow sorcerer or warlock levels

I am currently building a triple class for a new campaign
Will be Rog (at)4, Cleric(know) 1, Artificer(bombs) 6 at level 11.
Feral Wing teifling 11 16 14 14 14 8 at level 3 with extra feat per Zman rules (tiefling +1 con cold and poison resist)
ASIs into dex and int

Citan

2017-10-15, 05:45 AM

Good point! If everyone plays some caliber of gish, all the roles are much easier to fill. The only foreseeable thing lacking would be higher level spells. But when everyone is rocking heavy armor / unarmored defense / etc., I suppose that matters less.

Edit: and that brings up another question! We have six party members including myself, so there’s ABSOLUTELY going to be overlap in main classes at least. What are some team comps you guys can think of given all this?
Ok, for my "final" (credible? :smallbiggrin:) post here, let's go with party comp.

These are not geared at munchkinism (although they will have a few tricks), more like putting together a party on the assumption everybody has known each other from a long time, while covering all bases...

In a small galaxy, far far away... Er, no, wrong plot sorry.
In a small mountainy village, somewhat hidden from all civilization around, a small tribe of people with innate magic tried to cultivate this gift to develop it over generations.
Among those, a group of youngst particularly adept developed a strong friendship towards one another. As they grow though, each went his separate way to accomplish his/her aspirations, but they all decided to meet again ten/fifteen years later back into their village (just to drink, or maybe to accomplish some stupidly ambitious plan they made up as children, whatever)

An opening I like because so many plots can start from here (among others the classic trope of village having been raided for exploitation/xenophobism reasons)...

Sooo... All people level 11, we will definitely put at least 3 levels of Sorcerer here. :)
Enter...

Storm or Draconic Sorcerer 3 / Tempest Cleric 6 / Paladin 2:
(Or if you don't care about 2nd CD and push on lightning damage, instead go Sorcerer 6 / Cleric 2 / Crown Paladin 3)
this one has always been obsessed with lightning, and made his personal goal of mastering lightning as if it was an emanation of its own body, looking for every source of inspiration to do so.
In fighting, it's the tank: Sword & Board + heavy armor, using Booming Blade and Thunderous Smite against single enemies, Shatter sometimes, otherwise keeping Bless or Spirit Guardians active...
Outside fighting, well, he can Enhance Ability as needed, take care of all STR related checks, maybe Charisma.
Choice of metamagics depend on what you pick.

Favored Soul Sorcerer 4 / Life Cleric 1 / Lore Bard 6
This one has always been gentle at heart, sometimes too bad for his/her own good. This character was always the caring one for the group, trying to find compromises, taking care of the small wounds children usually make on themselves...
This one screams "HEaaaaaleeeer" whatever way you look at it.
As illustrated in my previous suggestions, the definitive metamagics here are Extend and Distant.
Grab Command, Aid, Warding Bond as Favored Soul, Goodberry and Aura of Vitality (grab Beacon of Hope when you get Favored Soul Sorcerer 5).
Prepare Bless, Sanctuary, Shield of Faith as Cleric.
Learn Healing Words, Heat Metal and whatever you want as Bard spells.
You don't care that much about offensive spells so you don't care about having high CHA either: use both ASI to grab Inspiring Leader and Healer.

Phoenix Sorcerer 6 / Undying Light Tome Warlock 3 / Paladin 2
this one lives and die by fire.
Built as medium armor+board, this one applies tremendous heat on his sword attacks (Branding Smite? GreenFlame Blade). Make it preferably a DEX-based character with Shield Master.
In fight, he is a damaging meatshield, sometimes going as far is his passion for burning things crisp that he will rush into enemies before unleashing a Fireball close to himself, because "Burning Hands is not big enough".
Obviously Empower is his best Metamagic, with any second other.
Outside fighting, he can take care of some of those rituals that always help a party.

Draconic Sorcerer 1 / Swashbuckler Rogue 3 / Bladesinger Wizard 7
This one is a devious one. As he struggled to master his inner power, he instead dropped the ball, arguing that "this is just ****, Wizards are the ones with true power". His quest for wizardry led him towards interlope people, and he slowly fell into thievery as he deemed it the fastest way to gain the resources he wanted to study. As such, he didn't develop a strong sense of cooperation.
In fighting, well, he is a bladesinger: Haste is his usual tactic, unless big threats mandate a Greater Invisibility. His Roguish mindset makes him prefer killing by the blade rather by the spell. ;)
Outside fighting, well, he is a Wizard: his obsession for magic led him to favor rituals because "hey you can use those as often as you want, much better than all this crappy 'just cast two and be tired' spells".

Wild Magic Sorcerer 3 / Raven Warlock 2 / (whatever) Druid 6.
This one, troubled at the fact every time he tried to use magic he created strange and imprevisible effects, spent his life trying to master it. First he followed the teachings of his village, to no avail. He then concluded that the best way to master his power would come from communion with nature, but it was still not enough. From despair, he decided to make a pact to bring some superior power to keep his magic in check.
This one obviously has high WIS and grab Observant feat.
Perception and Investigation are his expertise fields (honestly I would have rather "eaten" a Druid level for Rogue expertise -true for all characters- but well you asked for a tri-class, not quadri-class ^^).
Besides that, he can Extend many of the best Druid spells, as well as Empower/Distant others.
Obvious ones are Goodberry, Healing Words, Heat Metal, Absorb Elements, Earth Tremor, Conjure Animal, Plant Growth, then whatever you want.

Shadow Sorcerer 1 / Shadow Monk 7 / (any) Rogue 3
or Sorcerer 3 / Shadow Monk 7 / Rogue 1.
"The dark side is strong with this one".
The closest to "evil" of that group of friend, always planning some things.
Take Alert feat, and be the other one that always know what's coming for you all.
You could also go Variant Human to grab another feat if you'd like depending on your choice of Rogue archetype.
Obviously Dex is primary here, with WIS if you want Stunnign Strike, otherwise just CON.
This is the skillmonkey and bait of the group, using extreme mobility to lead people to him, sometimes being the focal point of a friendly Fireball, no sweating thanks to Evasion and high DEX.
He is also the one laying traps and distractions or doing kidnappings thanks to his Monk spells.

So, here it is for a first group.
Note that these are not "optimized" in that I priorized feats and fun over "better stats". I'm pretty sure they would be still overall balanced and fun.
The bad point of it is having no real strong caster, but I felt like making "triple-class" splits like 1/1/X was a shame for this group. :)
On the plus side, each has a more or less easily identified primary role in which it's really good, while having strong options in at least two other areas.
Also, while none is particularly resilient, none is particularly weak either. :)

This is a full party of gishes, each based on a specific stat, each trying to fullfill the classic tropes of Warlord: covering for his friends, shaping the battlefield, commanding around.
There are multiple ways to go, so I don't pretend these are the best (even more since those are a bit "on-the-fly" builds).

STR-based aka the BattleGrappler.
Battlemaster Fighter 6 / Lore Bard 3 / Rogue 2
Expertise in Athletics + potential Enhance Ability and Cutting Words from Bard, Cunning Action from Rogue and otherwise Commander's Strike, Trip Attack and Menacing Attack make you a versatile fighter.
You can build it however you want, depending on how often you want to grapple or not, how often you want to get extra attack from bonus action, etc.
You are basically a Fighter who always has something to do with his bonus action for a change.
On level 12, you could either go Bard 4 for an ASI, or Arcane Trickster to get better defense with Shield/Absorb Elements.

DEX-based aka The Bee
Rogue 2 / Revised Ranger or Druid 1 / Open Hand Monk 8.
Grapple or Shove prone people, keeping Ki for Stunning Strike preferably.
Expertise in Stealth and Athletics.
Either grab Ranger for better initiative and other traveling benefits, or Druid for Wild Shape scouting and Lonstrider buff.

CON-based aka the Sentinel
Bear Barbarian 8 / Stone Sorcerer 1 / Fiend Warlock 2
Grab Sentinel and either Shield Master or Polearm Master.
Best here would be Variant Human because you can take one of those feats and still bump CON by 2, while still using Devil's Sight to get Darkvision.
I'd personally go for Shield Master but really up to you.
Idea here is to stand right in the front (possibly inside a harmful AOE from your friends, hence Shield Master if DEX-based, although the best would be Plant Growth or Stinking Cloud).

INT-based aka the Ritual Blaster
Phoenix Sorcerer 3 / Undying Light Warlock 1 / Evoker Wizard 7
I think this is pretty straightforward: pick Empower and either Distant or Extended metamagic depending on your favorite AOE blasty spell (Distant Fireball is a joke, but Distant Bestow Curse is a blast -pun intended-... Then again extended Hypnotic Pattern/Phantasmal Force/Wall of Fire is some serious trick too).
So in fight, blasting first, other spells after that. Keep Shield, Absorb Elements, Dispel Magic and Counterspell whatever happens.
Out of fight, obviously INT skills and rituals (Alarm, Detect Magic, LTH)

WIS-based aka the Fearsome
Long Death Monk 7 / Life Cleric 1 / Moon Druid 2
Wild Shape as a bear or tiger and instill fear into your enemies as your roar away. What's not to like? ;)

OR WIS-based aka the Protector (I'd pick that one personally)
Life Cleric 1 / Favored Soul Sorcerer 3-4 / Land Druid 7-6
Covered that kind of combos many times already, no need to detail: Extended metamagic + Aid/Sanctuary, Distant Healing Words (although Twin Heat Metal / Warding Bond or Twin Haste from Grassland Druid could be nice too).
Land Druid is up to you, the basis here is to pump out as many Life Goodberries as you can where preparation is available, then using all those great Druid spells to reduce enemy threats: Plant Growth, Wind Wall, Conjure Animals, Heat Metal etc...

CHA-based aka the Healer
Life Cleric 1 / Favored Soul Sorcerer 4 / Lore Bard 6
Extended Aid/Warding Bond/Aura of Vitality/Beacon of Hope as you like... Grab Healer feat if you take Beacon of Hope, Inspiring Leader otherwise (or both, after all why choose? ;))

OR CHA-based aka the Controller (I'd pick that one personally)
Shadow Sorcerer 6 / Tempest or Knowledge Cleric 2 / Fiend Tome Warlock 3
Fiend for THP and Command spell, Tome for Thorns Whip, and Shillelagh, Warlock for Hex, Mirror Image and Repelling Blast among others.
Tempest Cleric if you want a powerful Shatter, Knowledge if you want to be alternate skill monkey, anyways it's here mainly for armor and healing/buff spells.
Honestly if you aren't interested in CD, better go Life Cleric 1 and go Sorcerer 7 for Polymorph and Banishment.
Main thing here is Sorcerer's Shadow, making sustained debuff much more sticky than usual.
Beyond that, you can pick whatever metamagic you want depending on your spell choice, although I'd be partial to Careful Metamagic if your DM follows RAW (chosen allies are immune during all spell duration, not only cast turn).

Anyways, this party has no ground-breaking ability but each covers much ground, all are fairly resilient AC-wise with some melee capability, ranged capability, healing and utility included.
This is a party that can set up many different tactics, from the boldest one to the most gambling ones.

Susanaki

2022-01-18, 01:06 PM

Some combination of. Fighter and sorcerer and rogue, the end goal is for a fighter8 champion/sorcerer 8 draconic heritage/rogue 4 assassin

The idea is to be able to cast fireball then use the quick cast of sorcerer to cast fireball again then use action surge and repeat

Peelee

2022-01-18, 01:17 PM

The Mod on the Silver Mountain: Multiclassing into Necromancy is not advised.