Best powers for a wilder?

[Soranar]

So I'm making a wilder with the following

race: human (for the extra skillpoints and feat)
template : necropolitan (to dump CON and get immunities)

My character will use a heavy shield 2 handed as a weapon (using improved shield bash to keep the AC bonus)

I get 5 bonus powers

1 from hidden talent at level 1 (which will likely be astral construct)
4 from expanded knowledge (from the educated wilder ACF at level 5,9,13,17)

I already have my heart set on taking astral construct (at level 1 with hidden talent)

I'm debating taking charm person:
- I'm already CHA based and I'll probably get diplomacy from martial study, I also have bluff and sense motive

or

- I can probably replace all of that with charm person

taking dominate person seems like a no brainer however

that still leaves 3 slots open for cherrypicking powers from any discipline or class

So, any thoughts?

[ExLibrisMortis]

Are you playing a melee wilder, or is that shield just for fun?

Metamorphosis and greater metamorphosis are great 4th- and 9th-level egoist powers, respectively.
Schism is a great 4th-level telepath power.
Fusion and fission are great egoist powers, 8th- and 7th-level, respectively.
Astral seed has some really cool applications in high-OP builds. 8th-level shaper power.
Inconstant location is a very practical 6th-level psychic warrior power.
Hustle from the psychic warrior list is a 2nd-level power that can be used to quickly focus yourself. Much better than the 3rd-level egoist version.
Quintessence is a really good 4th-level shaper power, but it requires some creativity to use, and your DM may not like it very much :smalltongue:.

The Mantled Wilder ACF is a bit annoying, because you're forced to take all the powers from one mantle, but if you can convince your DM to allow Substitute Powers, it can be a very good choice for expanding your reportoire.

[Fizban]

Dimension Hop lets you teleport as a swift action for a single power point. I'm given to understand that swift action teleportation is fairly huge. Blackstone Hammer is pretty cool- one or more charges of Flesh to Stone on weapon hit. Telekinetic Boomerang is the power that lets a throwing build full attack if you want to Captain America. Gemstone Breath seems pretty cool and has a bunch of different effects that might be useful to a Wilder, especially with some Metapsionics to make the lower options a bit stronger, and as a breath weapon with a slight cooldown it goes with a melee style.

[Psyren]

Instead of Charm (which is a discipline power and will thus cost you a feat) take the general power Attraction for your social needs instead. This gives you an untyped bonus to all interactions you make with a subject, and combined with your high Charisma it will work as well as Charm if not better in most situations. It also works on all creature types right at level 1 without needing to be augmented, and frees up one of your precious Expanded Knowledges for something else.

A cheap offensive power is Control Flames, which lets you deal decent area damage every round without constantly spending PP or risking enervation. At higher levels, you can get your second mind or psicrystal to concentrate on it for you, giving you bonus DPR you can add onto whatever else you're doing.

[Soranar]

Attraction does sound like a decent compromise to charm person. If I max out my social skills it should work on virtually anything not immune to mind affecting (which negates charm person anyway).

Dimension hop... I have two options to get it. Take the mantled wilder ACF and go for the Freedom mantle

even if I'm stuck taking all of their powers, most of the freedom mantle powers are awesome though I would probably rely on magic items for freedom of movement and evasion.

or I can just use exp knowledge to get it
or I make do without

but a 10 ft teleport + a 5 ft step means I can usually get where I need to be and full attack

or setup a charge for a shield slam

But then I lose the bonus CHA to touch AC and I'm stuck taking redundant powers.

I'll have to think about that one

[Soranar]

As for control flames or the other combat suggestions, I find astral construct gets the job done in most situations, I'm still debating how much I'll invest in my own combat abilities (through melee).

Metamorphosis is definitely a strong choice if I go that route.

[jdizzlean]

if it's allowed for you, dragon 319 has a subrace of humans, Athasian Humans that get bonus PP's/Powers. In our games we can do +1 LA free at creation. Either way, it might be worth it to if you have to pay the cost assuming no buyout:

Atrhasian Human: +2 to any 2 ability scores, Inborn Powers: at 1st lvl +3 bonus PP and a 1st lvl psionic spell from the wilder/psion list. at 5th lvl +6 PP total and 2nd lvl spell, at 10th lvl +11 PP and 3rd lvl spell, at 15th lvl +18 PP and 4th lvl spell. all inborn powers are known at a manifestor lvl of class lvl. LA+1

[Psyren]

I like Control Flames because it gives you something cheap to do every round even while your construct is out without pulling out the crossbow. There is also combo potential with Schism + Energy Conversion for even more free DPR. It's a personal preference though.

[Fizban]

Dimension hop... I have two options to get it. Take the mantled wilder ACF and go for the Freedom mantle
Unless there's something I've missed that specifically bars mantle powers from Expanded Knowledge, you just Expanded Knowledge. More reason the Mantled Wilder ACF is terrible.

Make sure to take Enervation Endurance and either Delay Enervation or Quick Recovery, 'cause he only reason to be a Wilder is to Wild Surge your pants off.

[Soranar]

Well according to the shied slam feat undead (and constructs, oozes or plants) cannot be dazed so I'm already immune to enervation as a necropolitan.

[jdizzlean]

So I'm making a wilder with the following

race: human (for the extra skillpoints and feat)
template : necropolitan (to dump CON and get immunities)



So, any thoughts?

Is your DM waiving this:


Libris Mortis page 115
Immediately upon opening its undead eyes, a new necropolitan loses a level as if the spell
raise dead had been used on it and it was alive instead of animate. (If the subject
has no levels to lose, it is simply destroyed.) It then also loses an additional 1,000 XP. If the loss of this much XP forces the necropolitan to lose another level, then it loses another level. No spell, not even restoration, can restore this lost XP.

Petitioners may not spend experience points they don’t have—if the level loss and the 1,000 XP cost drains a creature to 0 XP or less, it is destroyed, turned to dust, and can never be raised or revived
again using any means.

or are you planning on soaking the level drain and additional xp cost after creation?

[Rijan_Sai]

Well according to the shied slam feat undead (and constructs, oozes or plants) cannot be dazed so I'm already immune to enervation as a necropolitan.

That's true, although the Undead (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/typesSubtypes.htm#undeadType) type details what they are immune to in general, so that "can not be dazed" line may be specific to the feat...


•Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects).
•Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, stunning, disease, and death effects.
•Not subject to critical hits, nonlethal damage, ability drain, or energy drain. Immune to damage to its physical ability scores (Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution), as well as to fatigue and exhaustion effects.
•Cannot heal damage on its own if it has no Intelligence score, although it can be healed. Negative energy (such as an inflict spell) can heal undead creatures. The fast healing special quality works regardless of the creature’s Intelligence score.
•Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude save (unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless).


Daze, unfortunately, is not among the immunities. But by the gods, I wish for my own purposes that the feat wording would override that!

[Soranar]

Is your DM waiving this:



or are you planning on soaking the level drain and additional xp cost after creation?

We're starting the game at level 3. My DM gave us all an extra 500 gold than normal WBL because we're in a fairly challenging campaign so I'm completley broke (I spent 200 gp on a scroll of desecrate and I had the ritual done near an altar) and I'm eating the 1000 xp penalty. I'll be a little behind for a while but eventually it's barely noticeable unlike a real LA +1 which never goes away.

I've played it straight before (it was a sorcerer but essentially a low hitpoint caster with a CON penalty on top of it) and it makes you paranoid for sure but most low level characters are 1 bad roll away from dying anyway and there's always negative hitpoints to keep give you a chance until you become undead. Undead also gives tricky roleplay issues to deal with (and vulnerabilities to certain enemies like clerics) but getting d12+2 hitpoints and using CHA for concentration is just hard to beat.

I'm confused about the daze interpretation.

In Shield Slam, they clearly state undead are immune to daze effects but, as someone pointed out, it's not stated in the undead description. Is there an errata or a FAQ anywhere that I'm not aware of?

[ExLibrisMortis]

I'm confused about the daze interpretation.

In Shield Slam, they clearly state undead are immune to daze effects but, as someone pointed out, it's not stated in the undead description. Is there an errata or a FAQ anywhere that I'm not aware of?
I think most people would read that as "[...], undead, [...] cannot be dazed (by this feat)". Context is often problematic in RAW, because people tend to read the rules as uncooperatively as possible, but at an actual table, I don't think you'll be able to use that as blanket immunity (though it's not impossible).