Demigod Race

[Clarkson]

I'll soon be playing in a campaign, and the DM has decided to homebrew the races that are going to be available to fit better with the theme he's going for. He's mostly worried about how they're balanced with each other, rather than with the PHB or Volo's races. Since none of us in the group really homebrews we figured we'd check with the internet for suggestions.

Ability Score Increase: One ability score of your choice not increased by your Subrace increase by 2
Size: Your size is Medium
Speed: Your base walking speed is 30 feet
Trance: As stated in PHB.
God Blood: You have advantage on saving throws against being charmed and can't be put to sleep.
Toughness: Your hit point maximum increases by 1, and it increases by 1 every time you gain a level.
Languages: You can speak, read, and write Common.
Subrace: Choose one Subrace

Subraces:

Ability Score Increase: Your Charisma score increases by 1
Feat: You gain the Actor feat
Magic: You can cast the Faerie Fire once. When you reach third level you can instead cast Flaming Weapon*. This recharges when you take a long rest.
Sunlight: Once per short rest you can cast the light cantrip on yourself as an action. When you do, you shed bright light for 60 feet and dim light for an additional 20 feet rather than the values given in light.

Ability Score Increase: Your Dexterity score increases by 2
Speak with Beasts: Through sounds and gestures you can communicate simple ideas with beasts.
Fleet of Foot: Your base walking speed increases to 40 feet.
Magical Quiver: When you use a piece of ammunition to make a ranged attack if the attack hits the piece of ammunition returns back to your quiver automatically.

Ability Score Increase: Your Charisma score increases by 1
Feat: You gain the Silver-Tongued Feat (Feats for Skills UA)
Let's be Friends: Once per short rest you can cast the Friends cantrip without the target becoming hostile when the spell ends.

Ability Score Increase: Your Wisdom score increases by 2
Luck of the Divine: Once per short rest you can cast the Guidance Cantrip on yourself, except the spell does not end after the d4 has been used and the die can be added to any Saving Throws, Ability Checks, and Attack Rolls.
Cunning: You have advantage on all Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma saving throws against magic.

Ability Score Increase: Your Constitution score increases by 2
Feat: You gain the Tough Feat
Natural Armor: When not using a shield or armor your armor class is equal to 14 plus your constitution modifier
Relentless Endurance: When you are reduced to 0 hit points but not killed outright, you can drop to 1 hit point instead. You can't use this feature again until you finish a long rest.

Ability Score Increase: Your Charisma score increases by 1
Feat: You gain the Gourmand (Feats UA) and Tavern Brawler Feats

Ability Score Increase: Your Wisdom score increases by 1
Magic: You can cast the Entangle once except the range becomes Self, and the radius is 50 feet. This recharges when you take a long rest. Wisdom is the spellcasting ability for this.
Feat: You gain the Medic feat
Cantrip: You gain the Druidcraft Cantrip

Feet of Wind: Your base walking speed is 40 feet. In addition, you have 20 foot climb, fly, and swim speeds
Nimble: You can move through the space of any creature with a size larger than yours
Cantrip: You gain the Minor Illusion Cantrip
Darkvision: You can see in dim light within 60 feet of you as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light. You can't discern color in darkness, only shades of grey

Ability Score Increase: Your Strength score increases by 2
Ability Score Decrease: Your Charisma score decreases by 1
Cantrip: You gain the Mending Cantrip
Quick Smithing: When using tools you are proficient in, it takes half the usual amount of time as normal
Tool Proficiency: You gain proficiency with the artisan's tools of your choice: smith's tools or mason's tools
Living Construct: As a living construct you gain a number of benefits
- Your Armor Class is 16 when you do not wear armor
- You cannot use armor
- Roll on the Living Construct Table**

Ability Score Increase: Your Intelligence score increases by 2
Anywhere's my home: You gain proficiency in the Survival skill, and you have advantage on Charisma checks while inside someone's home
Extra Languages: You gain three additional languages of your choice

*
Flaming Weapon:
Casting Time: 1 Bonus Action
Range: Self
Components: Verbal
Duration: Instantaneous
As a part of this spell make a melee attack. In addition to the damage the weapon does, whether the attack hits or not each target within five feet of
you must make a dexterity saving throw. A target takes 2d6 fire and 2d6 radiant damage on a failed save, or half of that on a successful one. The caster is also hit, but has advantage on their saving throw.

**


Number
Result


1-11
-


12-17
Breath Attack: You can use your action to exhale destructive energy. Each creature in a fifteen foot cone must make a Dexterity Saving Throw. A creature takes 2d6 fire damage on a failed save, and half as much on a successful one. This damage increases to 3d6 at sixth level, 4d6 at eleventh level, and 5d6 at sixteenth level. The DC for this saving throw is equal to 8 + your proficiency bonus + your Constitution modifier


18-19
You gain Sunlight Sensitivity, and Superior Darkvision


20
You have a Bag of Holding embedded in your waist



_________________

We're aware that Hestia is rather lower power than any of the other ones, but weren't sure how to make it as powerful as the others while making it feel like it was actually the off-spring of Hestia. So we are looking for suggestions for how to make Hestia better in addition to just seeing whether the rest of them were balanced with each other.

Thanks in advance.

[JNAProductions]

Most of these are significantly too powerful.

'Specially Atlas. +3 HP per level, +2 to Con and another stat, 14+Con AC... This is absolutely insane as a caster, since you have better armor than Mage Armor gives you, tons of extra HP, and even SADder than usual.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Most of these are significantly too powerful.

'Specially Atlas. +3 HP per level, +2 to Con and another stat, 14+Con AC... This is absolutely insane as a caster, since you have better armor than Mage Armor gives you, tons of extra HP, and even SADder than usual.

Hi JNAProductions I am the DM mentioned. We agree that relative to other races these are powerful but in this campaign they are the only races. Relative to eachother how do you think the power balances out? We really appreciate the help!

[JNAProductions]

They seem... Okay against each other? I haven't looked overly closely at them, because there's a LOT.

But nothing sticks out as immediately game-breaking, especially relative to each other.

[Mage_of_Doom]

They seem... Okay against each other? I haven't looked overly closely at them, because there's a LOT.

But nothing sticks out as immediately game-breaking, especially relative to each other.

Awesome thank you. We are worried about hestia, atlas, and also what you think of artemis the enchanted quiver?

[JNAProductions]

Hestia might be a little weak.

Atlas is, as mentioned, kinda bonkers strong.

Artemis' Magic Quiver is basically fluff, unless you really track ammo.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Hestia might be a little weak.

Atlas is, as mentioned, kinda bonkers strong.

Artemis' Magic Quiver is basically fluff, unless you really track ammo.

Well one thing is Magic ammo I was thinking of giving only one or two but they can use them again after a short respawn period. This would require more work on the players part but could be a life saver given an arrow of slaying. What do you think? But as said it is fluff.

[JNAProductions]

Well one thing is Magic ammo I was thinking of giving only one or two but they can use them again after a short respawn period. This would require more work on the players part but could be a life saver given an arrow of slaying. What do you think? But as said it is fluff.

If you give out magic ammo, be careful of that. Especially since magic ammo DOES STACK with a magic bow.

So, under normal circumstances (as in, I've literally NEVER SEEN magic ammo outside of theorycrafting) it's fluff. But it can be useful.

[Sariel Vailo]

Aphrodite the goddess of love who lets more pipe be laid than the roman aqueducts and she gets a friend ability. Give her some sort of dominate humanoid or monster make sabe dc cha and maybe. Give her like god lime beauty advantage on persuasion.thats all im thinking fluff it up

[Mage_of_Doom]

If you give out magic ammo, be careful of that. Especially since magic ammo DOES STACK with a magic bow.

So, under normal circumstances (as in, I've literally NEVER SEEN magic ammo outside of theorycrafting) it's fluff. But it can be useful.

Okay I will watch out for that but I was hoping to make magic arrows more of the focus then bows. It makes more sense to me.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Aphrodite the goddess of love who lets more pipe be laid than the roman aqueducts and she gets a friend ability. Give her some sort of dominate humanoid or monster make sabe dc cha and maybe. Give her like god lime beauty advantage on persuasion.thats all im thinking fluff it up

Okay that sounds cool I will put some thought into that.

[Caelestion]

I wouldn't expect Hera to have any bastards of her own, but did you run out of ideas before reaching Ares, Hades, Poseidon and Zeus?

[Mage_of_Doom]

I wouldn't expect Hera to have any bastards of her own, but did you run out of ideas before reaching Ares, Hades, Poseidon and Zeus?

Those gods have children but I am not letting my players use them. I wanted to avoide the big three. Just a personal choice.

[Caelestion]

So why did you include Atlas over Ares? He's a Titan, not an Olympian.

[Mage_of_Doom]

So why did you include Atlas over Ares? He's a Titan, not an Olympian.
Honestly no Idea, I just have always loved Atlas I guess and I felt the need to include him.

[Lalliman]

Essay incoming.

Let’s bring out my beloved race creation guide (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ViqLSEN67mmd2Lo_OJ-H5YX0fccsfI97kFaqx7V1Dmw/pub). This attributes points to various race features, which gives an easy (albeit not always accurate) view of how powerful they are.

I calculated the power levels of all the subraces below, with my own arbitration on the original features.

Base power: 2 (ASI) + 0.5 (Trance) + 0.5 (GB) + 1 (Toughness) = 4
(The document says that +1 HP per level is 1.5 points, but I think this is overcharging, so I used 1 point instead.)

Apollo: 4 + 1 (Cha) + 2 (feat) + 0.5 (spellcasting) = 7.5

Artemis: 4 + 2 (Dex) + 0.5 (SwB) + 1 (speed) + 0.5 (MQ) = 8

Aphrodite: 4 + 1 (Cha) + 2 (Feat) + 0.5 (LbF) = 7.5

Athena: 4 + 2 (Wis) + 1 (LotD) + 2 (Cunning) = 9

Atlas: 4 + 2 (Con) + 2 (feat) + 4 (NA) + 1 (RE) = 13
(Note that Natural Armour 13 is listed as 2 points. Atlas gets 14, and can use Con to calculate his AC, which is an upgrade for any character who doesn't main Dex. Crazy powerful.)

Dionysus: 4 + 1 (Cha) + 4 (feats) = 9
(Slightly more points than the others, but both feats are quite ribbon-y, so nothing out of line.)

Demeter: 4 + 1 (Wis) + 2 (feat) + 1 (spells) = 8

Hermes: 4 + 1 (speed) + ??? (alternate speeds) + 0.5 (nimble) + 0.5 (cantrip) + 0.5 (Darkvision) = 7.5 + ???
(Fly speed is immensely difficult to appraise. The guide I linked provides some rickety guidelines for it, but I’m not even going to try. My advice is to avoid racial fly speeds like the plague unless you’re willing to build the entire campaign around it.)

Hephaestus: 4 + 2 (Str) – 1 (Cha) + 0.5 (cantrip) + 0.5 (QS) + 0.5 (TP) + ??? (LC) = 6.5 + ???
(Why does the living construct table have an option to get nothing? That’s both annoying for the player and harder to balance. Anyways, either of those three benefits would be worth around 1 point, I guess. I have no idea what to make of the static AC. It’s a nice boost to casters who don’t have access to proper armour, but it’s a downgrade for most martials, who seem to be the target demographic of this subrace. Seems like a conflict of interest.)

Hestia: 4 + 2 (Int) + 1 (AMH) + 1.5 (languages) = 8.5
(The points say she’s balanced, but only if languages actually matter. I steadfastly tell people that they don’t. Many DMs don’t use them, and most of the ones who do only put them in to make that one player feel better about having them. After all, you can’t put in a true “if they know this language, this happens” scenario, because you already know the player has the language up front. So unless you’re playing a module or some kind of crazy-expansive sandbox, having extra languages does nothing. So really she has only 7 points.)

Conclusions

- Apollo, Artemis, Aphrodite, Dionysus and Demeter are balanced.

- Athena is a bit strong, but not so much that it definitely needs changing.

- Hermes is hard to appraise. I would suggest removing his flight and giving him something akin to the limited flight of the Eagle Totem Barbarian.

- Hephaestus is hard to appraise. Definitely remove the option of getting no special feature, that’s lame. I would also replace the static AC completely, it’s a balance nightmare. But evidently you liked it when you wrote it up, so that’s up to you.

- Atlas is totally out of line, I think that’s become evident now that we have the numbers. My suggestions:
-- Change the absurd natural armour. You could give them normal natural armour (AC = 13 + Dex), or give them the barbarian’s Unarmoured Defence, or let them use their Con to calculate AC instead of their Dex. The first is worth two points. The latter two are harder to estimate, but I would guess them both at maybe 1.5. (Edit: I suggest the third choice, since the other two encourage Dex builds.)
-- Choose between the Tough feat or Relentless Endurance. Both are evidently excessive.
-- Consider changing the +2 Con to +2 Str. Why? As is, all the bonuses make him an amazing caster, but only an average fighter or barbarian. (Armour proficiency and Unarmoured Defence are wasted, and +HP is less valuable if your class has high HP anyways.) I’m assuming you want Atlas players to be drawn to martials, for thematic reasons, thus this change. Besides, Atlas is known for his strength more so than Hephaestus, I think. He carries the world, for god’s sake.

- Lastly, Hestia is a bit weak unless the DM truly cares about languages.

[Caelestion]

I'd agree with Lalliman. Atlas is renowned for his strength and his slow wits (and for being petrified by Medusa's severed head), rather than his relentless endurance and resistance to damage.

(Fun fact: the Olympians could be wounded by mortal weapons, as happened at least a couple of times.)

[Mage_of_Doom]

Essay incoming.

Let’s bring out my beloved race creation Guide. This attributes points to various race features, which gives an easy (albeit not always accurate) view of how powerful they are.

I calculated the power levels of all the subraces below, with my own arbitration on the original features.

Base power: 2 (ASI) + 0.5 (Trance) + 0.5 (GB) + 1 (Toughness) = 4
(The document says that +1 HP per level is 1.5 points, but I think this is overcharging, so I used 1 point instead.)

Apollo: 4 + 1 (Cha) + 2 (feat) + 0.5 (spellcasting) = 7.5

Artemis: 4 + 2 (Dex) + 0.5 (SwB) + 1 (speed) + 0.5 (MQ) = 8

Aphrodite: 4 + 1 (Cha) + 2 (Feat) + 0.5 (LbF) = 7.5

Athena: 4 + 2 (Wis) + 1 (LotD) + 2 (Cunning) = 9

Atlas: 4 + 2 (Con) + 2 (feat) + 4 (NA) + 1 (RE) = 13
(Note that Natural Armour 13 is listed as 2 points. Atlas gets 14, and can use Con to calculate his AC, which is an upgrade for any character who doesn't main Dex. Crazy powerful.)

Dionysus: 4 + 1 (Cha) + 4 (feats) = 9
(Slightly more points than the others, but both feats are quite ribbon-y, so nothing out of line.)

Demeter: 4 + 1 (Wis) + 2 (feat) + 1 (spells) = 8

Hermes: 4 + 1 (speed) + ??? (alternate speeds) + 0.5 (nimble) + 0.5 (cantrip) + 0.5 (Darkvision) = 7.5 + ???
(Fly speed is immensely difficult to appraise. The guide I linked provides some rickety guidelines for it, but I’m not even going to try. My advice is to avoid racial fly speeds like the plague unless you’re willing to build the entire campaign around it.)

Hephaestus: 4 + 2 (Str) – 1 (Cha) + 0.5 (cantrip) + 0.5 (QS) + 0.5 (TP) + ??? (LC) = 6.5 + ???
(Why does the living construct table have an option to get nothing? That’s both annoying for the player and harder to balance. Anyways, either of those three benefits would be worth around 1 point, I guess. I have no idea what to make of the static AC. It’s a nice boost to casters who don’t have access to proper armour, but it’s a downgrade for most martials, who seem to be the target demographic of this subrace. Seems like a conflict of interest.)

Hestia: 4 + 2 (Int) + 1 (AMH) + 1.5 (languages) = 8.5
(The points say she’s balanced, but only if languages actually matter. I steadfastly tell people that they don’t. Many DMs don’t use them, and most of the ones who do only put them in to make that one player feel better about having them. After all, you can’t put in a true “if they know this language, this happens” scenario, because you already know the player has the language up front. So unless you’re playing a module or some kind of crazy-expansive sandbox, having extra languages does nothing. So really she has only 7 points.)

Conclusions

- Apollo, Artemis, Aphrodite, Dionysus and Demeter are balanced.

- Athena is a bit strong, but not so much that it definitely needs changing.

- Hermes is hard to appraise. I would suggest removing his flight and giving him something akin to the limited flight of the Eagle Totem Barbarian.

- Hephaestus is hard to appraise. Definitely remove the option of getting no special feature, that’s lame. I would also replace the static AC completely, it’s a balance nightmare. But evidently you liked it when you wrote it up, so that’s up to you.

- Atlas is totally out of line, I think that’s become evident now that we have the numbers. My suggestions:
-- Change the absurd natural armour. You could give them normal natural armour (AC = 13 + Dex), or give them the barbarian’s Unarmoured Defence, or let them use their Con to calculate AC instead of their Dex. The first is worth two points. The latter two are harder to estimate, but I would guess them both at maybe 1.5.
-- Choose between the Tough feat or Relentless Endurance. Both are evidently excessive.
-- Consider changing the +2 Con to +2 Str. Why? As is, all the bonuses make him an amazing caster, but only an average fighter or barbarian. (Armour proficiency and Unarmoured Defence are wasted, and +HP is less valuable if your class has high HP anyways.) I’m assuming you want Atlas players to be drawn to martials, for thematic reasons, thus this change. Besides, Atlas is known for his strength more so than Hephaestus, I think. He carries the world, for god’s sake.

- Lastly, Hestia is a bit weak unless the DM truly cares about languages.

This is really great advice thank you. I was going to be reworking the ones you suggested later today and you gave some ideas on how to change them thank you. And i do care about languages but for the campaign as planned it wont matter to much. I am also removing the the random chance and will be removing the static armour from Hephaestus.

[Lalliman]

This is really great advice thank you. I was going to be reworking the ones you suggested later today and you gave some ideas on how to change them thank you. And i do care about languages but for the campaign as planned it wont matter to much. I am also removing the the random chance and will be removing the static armour from Hephaestus.
Glad I could help! I made a last-second edit about Atlas that you probably didn't see: of the three natural armour options I listed, I advise using the third, since the other two encourage Dex builds.

[paddyfool]

Could you give Hestia a cantrip or two? Mending and produce flame probably fit best, EDIT: Or possibly prestidigitation, especially with relation to food.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Glad I could help! I made a last-second edit about Atlas that you probably didn't see: of the three natural armour options I listed, I advise using the third, since the other two encourage Dex builds.

The changes should be up later tonight.( us central time) I wont be able to truly work on them untill 4.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Could you give Hestia a cantrip or two? Mending and produce flame probably fit best, EDIT: Or possibly prestidigitation, especially with relation to food.
I was planning on giving her a cantrip, not 100% which one.

[paddyfool]

On reflection I'd lean towards produce flame, as goddess of the hearth with fires burning in her name in every house, and a public hearth that was never allowed to go out in every town. You could even fluff it as drawing on these :-)

[Mage_of_Doom]

On reflection I'd lean towards produce flame, as goddess of the hearth with fires burning in her name in every house, and a public hearth that was never allowed to go out in every town. You could even fluff it as drawing on these :-)

Oh thats a good suggestion

[Sariel Vailo]

Give aphrodite a better use ability

[Caelestion]

It's traditional, when posting requests, to specify why you're making them.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Hello everyone I would like to apologize for not putting up the rebuilt races. I made alot lf changes as suggested by you all and my players agreed they were all balance and liked them. I dont know if my player will up date them or not but I will fome back later and post a link to a google docs so you can see the final form if you wish. Thank you all for your help.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Hello everyone I would like to apologize for not putting up the rebuilt races. I made a lot lf changes as suggested by you all and my players agreed they were all balance and liked them. I dont know if my player will up date them or not but I will foe back later and post a link to a google docs so you can see the final form if you wish. Thank you all for your help.

If some one screws with this I may never fix it so be ware. Also please don't screw with it.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jOuXAr67wNXOmc0Stm55XskRFXhEyg2AJINlxEJMvT0/edit?usp=sharing

[Sariel Vailo]

Firstly you set it to view only. Second better aphrodite has better abilities now thank you.

[Mage_of_Doom]

Firstly you set it to view only. Second better aphrodite has better abilities now thank you.

Oh good glad the edit only worked. Glad you like the changes.

[Caelestion]

It would make more sense for scions of Hermes to have Athletics, rather than Deception.

[Mage_of_Doom]

It would make more sense for scions of Hermes to have Athletics, rather than Deception.

That makes sense. not sure if i will change, but still a good idea.

[cdax]

Essay incoming.

I calculated the power levels of all the subraces below, with my own arbitration on the original features.

Base power: 2 (ASI) + 0.5 (Trance) + 0.5 (GB) + 1 (Toughness) = 4
(The document says that +1 HP per level is 1.5 points, but I think this is overcharging, so I used 1 point instead.)


This math astounds me. Is there a sheet that also applies this to classes?

[paddyfool]

That makes sense. not sure if i will change, but still a good idea.

I wouldn't change it. He already has plenty of mobility-related abilities; best have something to fit his status as a trickster god.