PDA

View Full Version : Optimization Fighter, Rogue, or Other Levels?



2D8HP
2017-11-06, 05:22 PM
So I have a Fighter1/Rogue 4 (Swashbuckler) PC,...


Race: Half-elf
48 yrs, 6'2", 200 lbs, grey/red hair, blue eyes, sunburned skin
Class: Fighter1/Rogue 4
Subclass: (Swashbuckler)
Background: Folk Hero:The girl screamed while the soldiers laughed.
He's forgotten so much, but he could remember that.
He didn't understand.
When the Queens soldiers took Paw away, Ma said Paw "was going to the Queen to be a hero", but they were hurting her! Heroes didn't do that!
Ma said that he was as strong as Paw now, maybe stronger, even though he didn't have a beard yet.
Ma said he needed to do what Paw used to, cut the tree's, dig the wells, and when the time came slaughter the pigs. With axe, hammer and shovel he would swing his arms and do what Ma said.
Ma said "Ossian, you listen now to your cousin Gwen, she's got a good head".
Maw was the only one who called him "Ossian", everyone else called him "Ox".
Gwen was screaming!
Maw said "you need to do what your Paw would do".
Paw was a hero.
So he swung his arms.
The soldiers stopped laughing, but Gwen still screamed.
"You've got to run Ox, they'll kill you"! "Run far, go to the rebels".
So he ran.
He ran far and met the rebels.
They gave him a sword.
And he did what they told him.

He swung his arms.

While life on the farm was hard, life in the forest was worse. For years they snipped at the Queen's men and hid and waited, till enough of the people knew that the time had come. Buried under homes, and hidden in wells and the walls of cottages were long stored weapons.
Out they came, by the thousands, and they marched on the capitol.

To defeat the tyrant.

And by the thousands they were slaughtered.

The brave and the good died.

Ox tore off the crimson flower of the rebels, ran and survived.

The gallow men had much work to do.

The walls of the capitol were decorated with the heads of rebels, as were the crossroads of the country, and every village square, to remind the foolish.

For years the heads rotted.

So much he has forgotten.
But he remembered somethings.
He remembered Maw's, Paw's, and Gwen's faces.
Now when he looked into the water he saw Paw's face, but Paw's beard was never grey was it?
He remembered that they called him "hero" once, now if anyone used that word about him they put "was a" in front of it.
He remembered he used to be strong.
He was still strong, but not like he was.
And he remembered the Queen.
And he remembered her hunters, who were now her son, the King's hunters.

And he would have to swing his arms again.

Uncomfortable amidst such strange opulence, and distrustful of nobility in the city, "Ox" closes his eyes in the hopes it will prove a dream, only to remember how that morning he saw a man who looked how Paw looked when the Queens men took him away, and the young lady that man was with looked like cousin Gwen.
But they couldn't be. Ossian was now older then Paw had been when he last saw him, so "Paw" could not be Paw, and Gwen? She would now have grey hairs as well.
More and more he saw memories walking in the day, which wouldn't do. Best not to remember.

Can I get a drink, sir?

AC 17 (Studded leather, and shield) HP 25/25 (10+5+5+5) Init +11 Speed 30ft. Passive Perception: 15

Str 14 Dex 16 Con 10 Int 8 Wis 12 Cha 16

Alignment: Chaotic Good
Personality Traits
• If someone is in trouble, I'm always ready to lend help.
• Thinking is for other people. I prefer action.
Ideal: Tyrants must not be allowed to oppress the people.
Bond: I have a family, but I have no idea where they are. One day hope to see them again.
Flaw: I have a weakness for the vices of the city, especially hard drink.

• Common
• Elven
• Goblin

Proficiency Bonus: +3

• Animal Handling
• Athletics
• Insight
• Perception
• Survival
• Medicine
• Stealth


• Strength
• Constitution

• Thieves' Tools
• Woodcarver's Tools
• Land Vehicles


• All Armour
• Simple Weapons
• Martial Weapons

Str: 14 (+2)
Dex: 16 (+3)
Con: 10
Int: 8 (-1)
Wis: 12 (+1)
Cha: 16 (+3)

Rapier:1d20+6 / 1d8+3,
Magic +1 Crossbow: 1d20+9 / 1d8+4
Sneak Attack: 2d6

Racial: Darkvision,
Background: Rustic Hospitality (Can find a place to hide, rest, or recuperate among commoners, unless I have shown myself to be a danger to them. They will shield me from the law or anyone else searching for me, though they will not risk their lives for me.)
Class:Archery Fighting Style:
Gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls made with ranged weapons.

Second Wind:
Have a limited well of stamina that I can draw on to protect myself from harm. On my turn, I can use a bonus action to regain hit points equal to 1d10 + my fighter level. Once I use this feature, I must finish a short or long rest before I can use it again.

Expertise: Perception and Stealth,

Sneak Attack: 2d6,

Cunning Action:
Quick thinking and agility allows me to move and act quickly. Can take a bonus action on each of my turns in combat. This action can be used only to take the Dash, Disengage, or Hide action,

Fancy Footwork:
During my turn, if my PC makes a melee attack against a creature, that creature can't make opportunity attacks against my PC for the rest of my turn.

Rakish Audacity:
My PC adds Charisma to initiative rolls, and doesn't need advantage to Sneak Attack if no creature other than my PC's target is within 5 feet of my PC.

Feat: Alert
+5 bonus to initiative
Can't be surprised while conscious.
Other creatures don't gain advantage on attack roles as a result of being hidden.


None!


• A set of woodcarver's tools (1gp)
• a shovel (2gp)
• an iron pot (2gp) 10lb
• a set of common clothes
• a belt pouch containing 10gp
• my fathers old knife
• Studded leather armor
• Rapier
• Hand crossbow
• Light crossbow
• case of 30 crossbow bolts (2gp)
• Dungeoneers Pack (12gp) - Includes:
a backpack,
a crowbar,
a hammer,
10 pitons,
10 torches,
a tinderbox,
10 days of rations,
a waterskin, and
50 feet of hempen rope strapped to the side of it
• +1 magic Light crossbow (gift from Zanan)
• ,Healer's kit
• Thieves tools

• 12 Fire arrows


• Fire Arrows
Cost: 5 gp.
Weight: 2 lbs.
This arrow can be lit before using it either by spending an action from a Tinderbox, or spending a free action from an open flame, such as a torch, a bonfire, or a burning tree. When lit this arrow sets alight any highly flammable materials on impact, and does the normal attack damage from the base weapon plus an extra 1d4 fire damage to the target. It will continue to do 1 fire damage until an action or bonus action is spend to remove it. One of the disadvantages of using the fire arrows is that you loss any advantage when attempting a surprise attacks with it due to it clear visibility even during night time.

• Greatbow - Martial Ranged Weapon
Cost: 65 gp
Damage: 2d6 piercing
Weight: 10 lbs.
Properties: Ammunition (range 200/800), heavy, special, two-handed
This bow's substantial size necessitates the use of specialized great arrows.
Special. When using this weapon to attack a target within 10 feet, you have disadvantage on the attack roll.

• Slingstaff

Simple Ranged Weapons
Weapon Cost Damage Weight Properties
Slingstaff 2 sp 1d6 bludgeoning 2 lb. Ammunition (range 30/120), two-handed
This sling is attached to the end of a wooden rod, which increases the force of the projectile. It's about as accurate as a normal sling.
.

....and I'm not sure which class to "level-up" in.

Another level of Fighter, and getting "Action Surge" and an extra 6HP is appealing, so is a 5th level of Rogue and more "Expertise" and a 3d6 "Sneak Attack", and afterwards?

I really don't know.

After the next level, getting another ASI, putting them into Wisdom, and getting a level of Ranger and thus "Natural Explorer" has appeal, so does the "fluff" of an "Oath of Ancients" Paladins, but I find the spell-casting rules of 5e mentally taxing as I do the "maneuvers" of the Battlemaster Fighter Sub-class.

The "Improved Critical", "Extra Attack", and an "Additional Fighting Style (Defense) of Champion are nice and simple, while still seeming useful, so maybe Fighter after a 5th level of Rogue?

If an option is too complex for my age-addled mind, and I forget to use it, then my PC won't be much help to the party, but neither will a sub-optimal PC.

What should the PC's future "build" be?

Kane0
2017-11-06, 05:25 PM
What are your circumstances at the moment?
What adventure are you currently doing?
Are you the party tank, second-in-line or a flanker?
Where do you see your character heading in a story sense?

lunaticfringe
2017-11-06, 05:45 PM
I would probably grab Fighter 2 now if you are after Action Surge. Then Rogue to at least 8-10. Panache is sexy, especially if you like Off Tanking or Facing. Also feats/asi Uncanny Dodge, Evasions, Sneak Attack Progression, and Moar Expertise.

2D8HP
2017-11-06, 06:28 PM
What are your circumstances at the moment?

Surrounded by enemies, trying to survive!
Character Sheets

Altiui "Wing" (https://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=1104635),
Arkhen Arrowsoul (https://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=1153644),
Da'ar Myastan (https://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=1103427),
Ossian/"Ox" (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=22543519#post22543519)
Zanan EyePicker (http://paizo.com/people/ZananEyepicker/profile),
Zuzu Greycastle (http://upload.jetsam.org/documents/Zuzu%20(Human%20Mystic).pdf),

Unresolved Character Hooks

General

How to deal with the fruit, "Curse of the Marksman"? Eat it and gain strange powers and debilitating weaknesses, or sell it for 700 gold?


Altiui

Altiui's king has instructed her to negotiate with mischievous fey acting up on Sunart Island


Arkhen

The ring Arkhen is wearing seems to want to take control of her...


Da'ar

Free brother


Ox

See comrades settled and safe
Stop hallucinating presence of family
Reunite with family
Free homeland from tyranny (since Tyrant is dead and her son occupies the throne, it may not be so bad and news of a pardon is enough)
Achieve leisure without toil (would he get restless?)
Find "dream girl" (had eyes for his cousin Gwen in the homeland he's exiled from; had eyes for Sarissa who is now petrified)
Wants another drink!


Zanan

Long-term goal is to get rich, buy his half-orc community tons of political influence, and break the chains of prejudice


Zuzu

Zuzu still wants to save Sarissa from her petrification curse
Zuzu received a letter from "Portalcrafter". What does Bres the Fomorian Prince want with Zuzu?
What is the fey creature, and why does it want Zuzu to go through a portal?


http://upload.jetsam.org/images/Gluteus.png

What adventure are you currently doing?
Trying to free another PC's brother


Are you the party tank?

Tank=Attack magnet/sponge?

No not that.


second-in-line or a flanker?

"Second-in-line"?

"Flanker"?

????

My PC mostly urges caution, other PC's attack, my PC puts arrows and crossbow bolts into the antagonists that my comrades are fighting, occasionally stabs enemies with a rapier, and then dashes out of melee range.

When other PC's fall, my PC carries them to safety and applies first aid if the spell-casters in the party haven't cast healing spells.


Where do you see your character heading in a story sense?


I foresee little development, mostly my PC just tries to keep other PC's alive after they rush into combat.



.....especially if you like Off Tanking or Facing..


What is "Off Tanking", and "Facing"?

Chugger
2017-11-06, 06:29 PM
Rogue sneak attack scales up. There's not much point to landing sneak attacks at higher levels if you don't have the handful of dice to scatter across the table .... unless you're using a rogue dip to make some other multi combo work very well. As others said what is your main purpose? Rogues with expertise and so on are very handy out of combat, too.

lunaticfringe
2017-11-06, 06:31 PM
Well what I meant.

Off Tanking: getting the monster to try and attack/focus on you. Easy peasy with the old Panache & Dash.
Facing: Being the charming talky guy.

Panache is very useful for keep your friends alive. Might get it a once over.

2D8HP
2017-11-06, 06:46 PM
....As others said what is your main purpose?


Primarily, sneak attacking what the Barbarian in the party is fighting.

Secondarily, dragging comrades to safety, and anything that requires dashing.


Rogues with expertise and so on are very handy out of combat, too.

True, but except for one lock picked, my PC's skills just don't come up much.


Well what I meant.

Thanks!


Off Tanking: getting the monster to try and attack/focus on you. Easy peasy with the old Panache & Dash.

I could see my PC doing that to draw fire away from another PC.


Facing: Being the charming talky guy....

My PC has the CHA for that, unfortunately his player's (me) verbal inventiveness is mostly of Captain Haddock like invective ("You tiresome Troglodyte trash!", etc.).

Kane0
2017-11-06, 07:41 PM
I'd take that second fighter level for action surge. Never know when you'll need another action for getting an ally out of a pickle or another chance at a sneak attack.

From there I'd focus on more rogue, the barbarian has things mostly covered and sneak attack / uncanny dodge / evasion is more useful all round than crits on a 19 or battlemaster tricks you'll forget to use. More expertise is also fun, try putting it on things that nobody else bothers with (like history!)

2D8HP
2017-11-10, 09:53 PM
.


.


.


Thanks for the great advice guys!

Much appreciated!

:smile:

Specter
2017-11-11, 07:22 AM
With 10 CON, you really can't afford to boost any secondary stats. Follow the Rogue/Fighter way in the way that gives you the most ASI's so you can get better stats.

Talamare
2017-11-11, 07:26 AM
I would go 5 for Uncanny Dodge

Then 3 into Fighter