Giving aggro back to dark speech feat.

[Boggartbae]

In the original appearance of Dark Speech in the 3.0 BoVD, there was an ability that allowed you to force opponents to attack you, but it has since been removed in the later printings. I think this is a real shame, because it was a feat that gave any martial the power to draw aggro, so I've decided to home-brew it back in. I'm also make the Dread ability work more like blasphemy, in that low HD monsters will suffer the same effects as the high HD monsters, but also more. What do y'all think of this? (changes from original bolded)

Dread: Whenever you use Dark Speech in this manner, you take 1d4 points of Charisma damage, and every other creature in a 30-foot radius must attempt a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 your character level + your Cha modifi er). The result of a failed save by a listener depends on the listener’s character level and alignment, as detailed on the table below. Any affected creature is subject to the effect based on it's hit dice, as well as all effects for higher level creatures.

Level (alignment)
1st–4th (non-evil) Listener is staggered for 1d10 rounds
5th–10th (non-evil) Listener is shaken for 1d10 rounds.
11th+ (non-evil) Listener is filled with loathing for you, and must exclusively target you with it's ranged attacks, melee attacks, and offensive spells, as well as include you in the area for any offensive AoE spell it casts, on it's next turn.

1st–4th (evil) Listener cowers in fear for 1d10
rounds.
5th–10th (evil) Listener is charmed by you (as charm monster) for 1d10 rounds.
11th+ (evil) Listener is impressed, and you gain a +2 competence bonus on attempts to change his attitude in the future

There. Now it's like a Knight's Challenge that only lasts one round and has a more limited range, but it's available to any class ('cept paladin)

Some questions I have:
Is this balanced at all?
what action should it take to activate?
is the inability to aggro evil creatures too limiting?
should it only effect enemies?

Anyway thanks in advance for your time

[Akal Saris]

Huh, I had no idea that it used to have that ability!

Is this balanced at all? >>
(1) It's a strong feat due to targeting multiple opponents within 30ft. I'm inclined to make the new effect a separate feat with Dark Speech as a prerequisite (like Malevolent Whispers in Elder Evils). Also, this would keep the original feat relevant for classes that DON'T want to taunt others (I used to play a Binder/Wizard with dark speech for example).
(2) The 'must attack you' clause should activate at listener level 1-4, right? Otherwise there is a weird progression of staggered (bad) > shaken (not a big deal) > must attack you (potentially really bad).
(3) I would add 'Creatures are immune to this feat for 24 hours after the first time they are affected'

what action should it take to activate? >> A 30ft burst seems like a Standard action to me.

is the inability to aggro evil creatures too limiting? >> Perhaps, but I feel like the action should be different for evil characters. Why not keep the bonus to interaction, and add "If the listener takes an action in the next round that benefits multiple allies, such as casting a healing or beneficial spell, or taking the aid another action, the listener must include you as a target."

should it only effect enemies?>>
No, I feel like the potential drawback is part of the challenge of the feat. The 24 hour clause that I suggested above can allow you to make sure your normal allies are immune from the start of the day.

[Boggartbae]

Huh, I had no idea that it used to have that ability!

Yeah in the 3.0 BoVD it just said this: "Level 11+, Nonevil: Characters are filled with loathing for the speaker and must attack him on their next action." no mention of what that entails exactly


Is this balanced at all? >>
(1) It's a strong feat due to targeting multiple opponents within 30ft. I'm inclined to make the new effect a separate feat with Dark Speech as a prerequisite (like Malevolent Whispers in Elder Evils). Also, this would keep the original feat relevant for classes that DON'T want to taunt others (I used to play a Binder/Wizard with dark speech for example).
(2) The 'must attack you' clause should activate at listener level 1-4, right? Otherwise there is a weird progression of staggered (bad) > shaken (not a big deal) > must attack you (potentially really bad).
(3) I would add 'Creatures are immune to this feat for 24 hours after the first time they are affected'

Nice. I really like the idea of making this it's own feat, because Dark Speech has always been a bit all over the place, but powering up each of the 4 modes and then splitting them up would make for a cool group of feats. (maybe merging the hardness reducing one with whatever I give to melee to encourage door breaking)

Yes, the "Must attack you" clause would effect a listener of any hit dice. That was one of the things that bothered me about the original Dread effect; lower level enemies were immune to the effects that the high level enemies suffered, so I'm changing that to make everyone take their tier+everything above them (i.e., shaken, staggered, and must attack for the weakest opponents) I'll make that more clear.

As for the 24 hour clause, do you think that that would be better then the charisma cost? 1d4 charisma damage for every encounter of the day is a lot. I think I'll take the charisma damage off, up the duration of the aggro to 1d10 rounds, and make them immune for 24 hours after exposure. That way you can't spam it at an evil king until he grovels at your feat, and you never run the risk of going comatose :smalltongue:


what action should it take to activate? >> A 30ft burst seems like a Standard action to me.

but speaking is a free action! Yeah if i'm increasing the duration that makes a standard action investment not as scary


is the inability to aggro evil creatures too limiting? >> Perhaps, but I feel like the action should be different for evil characters. Why not keep the bonus to interaction, and add "If the listener takes an action in the next round that benefits multiple allies, such as casting a healing or beneficial spell, or taking the aid another action, the listener must include you as a target."

How about allowing a diplomacy check, in the middle of combat?


should it only effect enemies?>>
No, I feel like the potential drawback is part of the challenge of the feat. The 24 hour clause that I suggested above can allow you to make sure your normal allies are immune from the start of the day.

Yeah, and if everyone in your party is evil then it doesn't matter anyway.

Thanks for the input! Here's the new version (for pathfinder so the skill ranks are different than normal)

Vile Insult:
Prerequisites: Knowledge (religion) 5 ranks, Cha 13, ability to speak the dark speech. (Note: might make this a trait or something, because a language being tied to a feat is weird)

You invoke the dark speech to make the most vile insults. Using this feat is a standard action. Every other creature in a 30-foot radius must attempt a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 your character level + your Cha modifier). The result of a failed save by a listener depends on the listener’s character level and alignment, as detailed on the table below. After a listener is exposed to your dark speech, it is immune to your use of this feat for 24 hours, regardless of the result of it's save.

Level (alignment)
1st–4th (non-evil) Listener is staggered, shaken, and must attack you1 for 1d10 rounds
5th–10th (non-evil) Listener is shaken, and must attack you1 for 1d10 rounds.
11th+ (non-evil) Listener must attack you1 for 1d10 rounds

1Must attack: Listener is filled with loathing for you, and must exclusively target you with it's ranged attacks, melee attacks, and offensive spells, as well as include you in the area for any offensive AoE spell it casts, on it's turn. It is free to make attacks of opportunity as normal, and doesn't need to take offensive action at all if it doesn't wish to (although if it changes it's mind it must direct those action at you for the duration of this feat's effect)

1st–4th (evil) Listener cowers in fear, and is charmed for 1d10
rounds.
5th–10th (evil) Listener is charmed for 1d10 rounds.
11th+ (evil) Listener is impressed, and has an attitude of indifferent. You gain a +2 competence bonus on attempts to change their attitude in the future, and may make an immediate diplomacy check to improve their attitude.