Paladin/Hexblade Build PEACH

[PeteNutButter]

In response to the lack of AL rebuild from Xanathar's Guide I'm building my replacement character that I'm going to bump to level 7 with all my DM xp. Please help me critique it before I play it and make it final.

Devotion Paladin 6/Hexblade 1
Variant Human
15, 8, 16, 8, 8, 18(+2 from ASI)

I am planning to use my DM quest to give him a +2 Shield. I know a GWM build is optimal but since I can't use cha for that without 2 more levels in hexblade, I figured I'd just lean into the S&B build. A sitting AC of 22 is not half bad, and combined with the +cha to saves makes for one tanky dude. I could bump my AC to 23 with defense FS, but I would rather boost the offense with dueling FS.

For the Feat choice, I'm a bit torn. I'm leaning towards Inspiring Leader, as it's a good buff to the whole party, basically every short rest. None of the current regulars at the table, have anything that would conflict with it. I'm also considering Sentinel to encourage foes to stick to me, but I'm worried my damage output is a bit low to really benefit from that reaction attack. Shield Master is on the table, but it's got further issues of my only +2 str and no expertise, and bonus action competition. I figure I'll spend a lot of bonus actions fiddling with Hex and the Hexblade's curse.

As for progression, I figured I can stay in hexblade for a while, and pick up invocations to boost me in melee. Improved Pact Weapon would be at level 9, and Eldritch Smite at level 11. After the 5th Hexblade level, I'm not sure where to go. I could continue it longer, or go back into paladin, or take a level in bard/sorcerer just to get 3rd level long rest slots.

Let me know what you guys recommend, and thanks for your input.

I'm not going to be a Half-Elf. I hate elves, and just being half way with it is no better than making a half turd sandwich. It ruins the whole thing. I don't care how busted elven accuracy is.

[Chugger]

I hear ya about elves. And half elves. The only kind I've ever thought I could roleplay is half drow maybe or a drow. I just don't feel them. I think the prob is that to care about being an elf you need to be in something more like a Tolkien world, maybe like DnD was decades ago. Not arguing to go back - we're here - we're gonna stay here. But yeah, to give a crud about an elf character, I'd need some sort of epiphany - some sort of ray of understanding or a new way of seeing them. Disco elves? ... nah ... But it hurts not going half elf, cuz you're taking a -1 in Dex. Well, aura will cover for that - guess you're okay there.

Anyway, I've been thinking about the same build but after Pal Conqu (probably) 6/ Hex 1 ... I'd probably go sorc. Which kind, I'm not sure. Maybe missing invocations on lock is not smart, but I like the idea of getting slot management and more flexible casting. Going for sorc lvls - well at lvl 8 you'll be caster level five for slot calculation, right? (I may not be doing that right - if 1 lock level just gets you that lock slot on the side and doesn't count over all, then it's lvl 9). You can only do lvl 1 and 2 spells, but you have 2 lvl 3 slots for either upcasting, heavy divine smites, or get lots more fresh lower level slots back for casting and lower lvl smiting.

I can see advantages to sticking in lock. Your slots refresh on shorties. Lots of modules have no long rests but might allow a shortie. Not hard to get a warlock item that refreshes a lock slot once a day - at least two of them drop in AL - you can trade for one or get someone to run that module and hope you get it.

I gotta try to get my head into Pal lock and see how it'd go. You could do all sorts of crazy stuff, like getting devil's site and fighting out of darkness. You can go sorcadin and get that now too, by going shadow sorc. Oh, why would you take Eldritch smit? If you're a pal can't you use _any_ slot to Divine Smite? Even a lock slot?

Inspiring Leader is not bad. Tough or Toughness scales up better but only helps you. What about war caster or resil con? Are you going to be keeping a conc spell running in most fights? Like bless or shield of faith from Pal? Or hex?

Oh, if you start Pal you have wis save prof. If you go resil con (you can put that +1 elsewhere, you can start w/ a 15 con and boost it w/ the feat) you'll have conc spells covered and con saves. To help you w/ dex saves, you can be zentarim and do a secret mission and get a ring of ... blanking on what it is called (evasion?) - it lets you make 3 dex saves a day. So with those and your aura, you'll be doing well on saves. But aura might be enough.

If you go shield master you get a plus on your dex saves iirc (does it get the shield's +2 or does this require a magic shield w/ a +1 or more to ac to get that dex save boost?). You could go ... that new feat, a racial one - prodigy. You could have athletics expertise and make shield master work more often.

But if you're oath of conq, aren't you going to be popping spiritual weapon all the time? That's a bonus action attack. If you're a shield master, you got a bonus action conflict there. You could take vengeance and have other spells - and go shield master.

[PeteNutButter]

I hear ya about elves. And half elves. The only kind I've ever thought I could roleplay is half drow maybe or a drow. I just don't feel them. I think the prob is that to care about being an elf you need to be in something more like a Tolkien world, maybe like DnD was decades ago. Not arguing to go back - we're here - we're gonna stay here. But yeah, to give a crud about an elf character, I'd need some sort of epiphany - some sort of ray of understanding or a new way of seeing them. Disco elves? ... nah ... But it hurts not going half elf, cuz you're taking a -1 in Dex. Well, aura will cover for that - guess you're okay there.

Anyway, I've been thinking about the same build but after Pal Conqu (probably) 6/ Hex 1 ... I'd probably go sorc. Which kind, I'm not sure. Maybe missing invocations on lock is not smart, but I like the idea of getting slot management and more flexible casting. Going for sorc lvls - well at lvl 8 you'll be caster level five for slot calculation, right? (I may not be doing that right - if 1 lock level just gets you that lock slot on the side and doesn't count over all, then it's lvl 9). You can only do lvl 1 and 2 spells, but you have 2 lvl 3 slots for either upcasting, heavy divine smites, or get lots more fresh lower level slots back for casting and lower lvl smiting.

I can see advantages to sticking in lock. Your slots refresh on shorties. Lots of modules have no long rests but might allow a shortie. Not hard to get a warlock item that refreshes a lock slot once a day - at least two of them drop in AL - you can trade for one or get someone to run that module and hope you get it.

I gotta try to get my head into Pal lock and see how it'd go. You could do all sorts of crazy stuff, like getting devil's site and fighting out of darkness. You can go sorcadin and get that now too, by going shadow sorc. Oh, why would you take Eldritch smit? If you're a pal can't you use _any_ slot to Divine Smite? Even a lock slot?

Inspiring Leader is not bad. Tough or Toughness scales up better but only helps you. What about war caster or resil con? Are you going to be keeping a conc spell running in most fights? Like bless or shield of faith from Pal? Or hex?

Oh, if you start Pal you have wis save prof. If you go resil con (you can put that +1 elsewhere, you can start w/ a 15 con and boost it w/ the feat) you'll have conc spells covered and con saves. To help you w/ dex saves, you can be zentarim and do a secret mission and get a ring of ... blanking on what it is called (evasion?) - it lets you make 3 dex saves a day. So with those and your aura, you'll be doing well on saves. But aura might be enough.

If you go shield master you get a plus on your dex saves iirc (does it get the shield's +2 or does this require a magic shield w/ a +1 or more to ac to get that dex save boost?). You could go ... that new feat, a racial one - prodigy. You could have athletics expertise and make shield master work more often.

But if you're oath of conq, aren't you going to be popping spiritual weapon all the time? That's a bonus action attack. If you're a shield master, you got a bonus action conflict there. You could take vengeance and have other spells - and go shield master.

Thanks for the feedback.

I was planning on going oath of devotion, but mostly for flavor reasons. I would take Eldritch Smite because it's a separate ability that has it's own trigger, potentially allowing even more damage. If I were to get a lucky crit on the BBEG I could blow both my warlock slots on Divine Smite AND Eldritch Smite. The dice get out of hand really quickly.

For feats, I was thinking resilient con, but that's probably overkill. I have +7 to con saves already. If I go Order of the Gauntlet, I can grab a cloak of protection to give me +8 (and stack that AC more). At some point I might want Warcaster, but can't start with it since I can't cast at level 1 paladin. Warcaster is necessary to cast shield spell while holding weapon and shield.

Shield Master is an interesting choice, as that +4 would add to my dex save, making it +7 and effectively evasion if I make it... It might be worth it just for the defensive feature, basically resilient dex and evasion combined. True evasion makes you take half on a fail and doesn't take a reaction, but shield master effect is still good. I do want this guy to be as unkillable as possible, and the ability to negate fireballs and dex breath weapons would certainly aid that.

[PeteNutButter]

I ended up going with Shield Master. Having +6 or more to every save except int is just too strong: +6, +7, +7, +3, + 6, +11.

Also Hexing opponents before shoving them over is plenty enough to make up for my weak (+5) athletics.

I was also surprised with how much the damage output the character did. 1d8 + 1d6 + 6 twice, plus smite potential is pretty solid.

Hexblade is OP.

[Raif]

I ended up going with Shield Master. Having +6 or more to every save except int is just too strong: +6, +7, +7, +3, + 6, +11.

Also Hexing opponents before shoving them over is plenty enough to make up for my weak (+5) athletics.

I was also surprised with how much the damage output the character did. 1d8 + 1d6 + 6 twice, plus smite potential is pretty solid.

Hexblade is OP.
Pick up booming blade and add some more damage to your melee attack and make enemies stick to you as you're pretty hardy

Ignore that, didn't see it was for AL

[Galadhrim]

I ended up going with Shield Master. Having +6 or more to every save except int is just too strong: +6, +7, +7, +3, + 6, +11.

Also Hexing opponents before shoving them over is plenty enough to make up for my weak (+5) athletics.

I was also surprised with how much the damage output the character did. 1d8 + 1d6 + 6 twice, plus smite potential is pretty solid.

Hexblade is OP.

What are your thoughts on invocations in these next few levels? I have a Paladin crown 6/hexblade 1 that is about to level. I was thinking agonizing blast and the new invocation from XGtE that allows a pull whenever you attack with eldritch blast. I function as the tank so pulling creatures off of my allies with no save sounds nice.

I have been using my concentration for other things but will have to give hex a try.

[PeteNutButter]

What are your thoughts on invocations in these next few levels? I have a Paladin crown 6/hexblade 1 that is about to level. I was thinking agonizing blast and the new invocation from XGtE that allows a pull whenever you attack with eldritch blast. I function as the tank so pulling creatures off of my allies with no save sounds nice.

That's a good question. I was thinking AB and then probably just Devil's Sight, not to use with darkness, but just because I'm a human. Going from being blind in the dark to super dark vision is nice.

The pull ability might be pretty helpful. I wonder if the pushing from Repelling Blast would be just as good. It requires different positioning, but you could potentially move two enemies with it instead of just one. The coolness of the "Get over here"/Scorpion effect might make Grasp of Hadar my choice.

Either way I'll probably swap it for improved pact weapon at warlock 3, and pick up eldritch smite at warlock 5. So it isn't something I could fit into the build long term.

[Galadhrim]

That's a good question. I was thinking AB and then probably just Devil's Sight, not to use with darkness, but just because I'm a human. Going from being blind in the dark to super dark vision is nice.

The pull ability might be pretty helpful. I wonder if the pushing from Repelling Blast would be just as good. It requires different positioning, but you could potentially move two enemies with it instead of just one. The coolness of the "Get over here"/Scorpion effect might make Grasp of Hadar my choice.

Either way I'll probably swap it for improved pact weapon at warlock 3, and pick up eldritch smite at warlock 5. So it isn't something I could fit into the build long term.

That makes sense. I still haven't decided if I will stop at Warlock 2 and go back to Paladin or just keep going warlock. I will also take improved pact weapon at 3 if I keep going but I would probably drop agonizing blast instead of grasp of hadar since my role as tank has me wanting to be in melee as much as possible anyway.

[PeteNutButter]

That makes sense. I still haven't decided if I will stop at Warlock 2 and go back to Paladin or just keep going warlock. I will also take improved pact weapon at 3 if I keep going but I would probably drop agonizing blast instead of grasp of hadar since my role as tank has me wanting to be in melee as much as possible anyway.

Yeah I'd like to go back to paladin or even sorcerer but warlock is such a slippery slope until level 5. That third level gives me +1 to hit and damage in improved pact weapon. That 4th level maxes out my charisma. That 5th level gives me 3rd level slots and spells and eldritch smite. That 6th... is junk as far as I'm concerned, and will be back in paladin or start sorcerer.

[PeteNutButter]

Actually after hitting level 8, I'm going to go with fiendish vigor. 8 Temporary hp maynot be that much, but at this level it's the same hp as a con boost with the added perk of coming between every fight. For tanking, it'll give me the most real benefit.

I don't find myself casting eldritch blast that much, and may even forgo Agonizing Blast (*GASP!*), but there really aren't that many valuable options in just two levels. Devil's Sight or Eldritch Blast boosting effects is all that really stands out.

I think I've cast EB twice in about 20 rounds of combat.

[Aaramis]

Yeah I'd like to go back to paladin or even sorcerer but warlock is such a slippery slope until level 5. That third level gives me +1 to hit and damage in improved pact weapon. That 4th level maxes out my charisma. That 5th level gives me 3rd level slots and spells and eldritch smite. That 6th... is junk as far as I'm concerned, and will be back in paladin or start sorcerer.

Agreed 100%.
1h + shield allows you to stop at Hex 1. But if you want 2h, you need to dip as far as level 3 for IPW. At which point an ASI is only 1 level away. At which point level 3 spells and more invocations is only a level away. At which point....yeah, you get the point.

I'm in a similar boat to you, I'm not a fan of the 6th level ability. I can fluff off a Hexblade dip as far as lore goes, but ripping someone's soul out and using it as a weapon is a bit too evil to justify. Good call on that one :)

Anyways, sorry for the bump - how's the build working out for ya? Still going?

[Caelic]

What I like about the direction you're going is that the build's a team player. Everybody loves to have a level 6 paladin on the team, because he doesn't just make himself tankier, he makes the group tankier.

I personally like Vengeance for Lockadins, but as you say, the background story and RP concerns have an impact on that. If Devotion is what makes sense for yours, Devotion is what makes sense for yours.

[PeteNutButter]

Agreed 100%.
1h + shield allows you to stop at Hex 1. But if you want 2h, you need to dip as far as level 3 for IPW. At which point an ASI is only 1 level away. At which point level 3 spells and more invocations is only a level away. At which point....yeah, you get the point.

I'm in a similar boat to you, I'm not a fan of the 6th level ability. I can fluff off a Hexblade dip as far as lore goes, but ripping someone's soul out and using it as a weapon is a bit too evil to justify. Good call on that one :)

Anyways, sorry for the bump - how's the build working out for ya? Still going?

It's fantastic. I just hit level 9. It looks like I'll get my special mission done via DM quests, so the next time I play this character I'll have a whopping 25 AC sitting still, with saving throws averaging at +9 via aura of protection and a +1 cloak and ring. I got myself a Flame Tongue Longsword which is now a +1 via Improved Pact Weapon. So basically I have or will have every magic item I could hope to have, except maybe higher + x armor/shield. That obviously makes me even more overpowered.

I play with my smite slots very conservatively and usually deal about 2nd most damage per combat, behind the GWM fighter. The fights I need to end fast, I am top or near the top damage for the party via smites. The real kicker is that I've been the last one standing in 3 fights now, because I just won't go down. Up until this point I've had a 22 AC and it's enough to make me very hard to kill. In big fights that turn south, I've been dropping Hex for Shield of Faith to bump AC to 24.