[Pathfinder] Allow players to use Campaign Traits outside the campaigns they're for?

[KillianHawkeye]

I'm starting a Pathfinder game, an adventure I've written myself, and one of my players wants to take a Campaign Trait originally written for one of the official Adventure Paths (the ones that act as plot hooks and/or are heavily tied into the events of the actual campaign).

My question is do any of the Playground's Pathfinder GMs allow players to this kind of thing?

[FocusWolf413]

I usually don't allow it. Either it's a useless trait or they try to force something into my game that I don't care about. There are a few exceptions.

Does the trait fit in your world? Will it be a problem? Will it positively contribute? What are the downsides? What are the upsides?

[Geddy2112]

My general rule for AP/campaign/setting specific things is that if I cannot find a reason to say no, I allow it. This goes for being a GM in general-any races/feats/whatnot I did not explicitly ban, but a player wants to use are generally allowed unless I can justify it on something more than DM fiat. I try to say yes unless I have a hard reason to say no.
That said, I second this:
Either it's a useless trait or they try to force something into my game that I don't care about.

[Shark Uppercut]

Either it's a useless trait or they try to force something into my game that I don't care about.

I have the reverse opinion, AP traits can be more powerful than other traits. One from Mummy's Mask gives trapfinding, letting you skip a rogue for a better class. One from LoF gives you x2 favored class bonus. Tons of them give +1 to a save. I understand that DMs don't allow them because they come with backstory, but I would understand disallowing some from the pure power.

[Florian]

No. They´re quite powerful but very connected to the main story of an AP. To find Haleen, there must be a Haleen to find in the first place, and so on.

[KillianHawkeye]

No. They´re quite powerful but very connected to the main story of an AP. To find Haleen, there must be a Haleen to find in the first place, and so on.

It's funny that you mention this one, because that's the one that my player wants to take. :smallamused::smallsigh:

[Kurald Galain]

Tons of them give +1 to a save.
Tons of non-campaign traits also give +1 to a save; that's not exactly a big deal.


One from LoF gives you x2 favored class bonus.
But this one is. Yep, that's the Finding Haleen trait. As written, it gives you one hit point and one skill point per level in addition to your normal favored class bonus (so effectively it triples your favored class bonus; the intent was probably to double it). That one's pretty cheesy as traits go.

[Rerednaw]

I'm generally in the "sure players can have nice things" camp.
I usually ask:
Will this cause unfun?
Will this be a major headache for everyone else (including the GM)?

Unless the trait does something that irreparably breaks your campaign idea (and then I'd have a talk the player and find out why he/she wants/needs it) I'm cool with it.

One of my home games only has 2 PCs...so I was perfectly fine with someone getting the Trapfinding Trait...because they were short 2 folks.

The rules are a framework of guidelines but no one's campaign including yours has to follow them to death...even Society Play which is customized but what rules they do use are supposed to be by the book can have tremendous table variation.

So go with what works for you.

[zlefin]

iirc there's already plenty of traits to choose from that are setting-agnostic, so there shouldn't be much need. It'd depend why they want the particular trait rather than one of the generic ones.

my default inclination would be to say no, unless the trait fits the campaign i'm planning quite well.

i'm not famliar enough with the power level of these traits, but it's certainly something to be mindful of.

[ChrisAsmadi]

I have the reverse opinion, AP traits can be more powerful than other traits. One from Mummy's Mask gives trapfinding, letting you skip a rogue for a better class. One from LoF gives you x2 favored class bonus. Tons of them give +1 to a save. I understand that DMs don't allow them because they come with backstory, but I would understand disallowing some from the pure power.

On the other hand, if your campaign actually needs Trapfinding, then that trait means someone can have it without being forced into playing a certain class (that's why it's there in Mummy's Mask - the AP is full of traps), and if it doesn't come up very often, the trait isn't actually hugely powerful.

[Firest Kathon]

But this one is. Yep, that's the Finding Haleen trait. As written, it gives you one hit point and one skill point per level in addition to your normal favored class bonus (so effectively it triples your favored class bonus; the intent was probably to double it). That one's pretty cheesy as traits go.

So over the course of 20 levels it will give you 20 hp and 20 skill points. On my cheese-o-meter this would rate "American" (may contain cheese-like substances :smalltongue:), I would think about giving this as a bonus trait to all characters...

[ChrisAsmadi]

So over the course of 20 levels it will give you 20 hp and 20 skill points. On my cheese-o-meter this would rate "American" (may contain cheese-like substances :smalltongue:), I would think about giving this as a bonus trait to all characters...

If your intent is for your players to have a broader set of skills - take a look at the Background Skills (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/skills/background-skills/) optional rule, it might serve the purpose better.

[Ellrin]

As long as the trait fits into their backstory (and isn't just obviously tacked on) and fits the campaign with minimal refluff, I would generally allow it. The main exception for this is Finding Haleen, partially because it's more powerful than an existing feat (Toughness), and partially because it's from an adventure path that was written for PF back when PF was a 3.5 setting.

Trap Finder seems like it invalidates rogues, but there are already plenty of archetypes that grant actual trapfinding to better classes than rogues (not to mention the Investigator gets it by default), so it's not like trapfinding is a particular advantage for rogues, either way. If somebody wants to make a more roguish Paladin and add Trap Finder to it, for instance, I've got no problem with that.

[Pugwampy]

Wow a whole hp and sp per level . The horror man. To get fully spanked by this trait , you gonna have to play to level twenty . That's multiple years . I have yet to run a game longer than a year or higher then level 12 before players get bored and kill the game themselves .

I see no reason not to allow it . I don't even see a problem if player wants to stack it with toughness. Players should be rewarded for doing their homework .

It is a trait and those are meant for back story making . If the player is prepared to give you a page or two toilet reading , give him what he wants .

My favorite DM took a funny OP trait as a player . It made stealth a class skill for his 100 average damage archer god which tied perfectly with my you sneak up on a hoser , you get a free smack on him before the fight starts . That hurt more than any extra hp or sp .

[Elder_Basilisk]

I would not allow it because it misses the whole point of campaign traits. The point of campaign traits is to subtly nudge players into creating characters who are appropriate to the campaign and which have a shared history or reasons to work together. Divorce campaign traits from the campaign they are intended for and they will end up doing the opposite.