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View Full Version : DM Help Binder//Incarnum combos for e6?



Zeb
2017-11-28, 07:42 PM
Short version:
For my sandbox e6 game the players could run into some gestated binder//incarnum users, while I have the basics done- Human binder 6//incarnum user 6 and one feat locked in to improved pact binding i'm looking for some good/interesting combos that make them feel unique and not just cookie cutter encounters.

If there are some different pacts that work with specific binds especially hands, feet, crown and totem that would be excellent.

Long version with some spoilers so my players please keep out.

The Campaign is historic inspired based on a map of the Roman empire at the height of its power. Historically inspired in that myths legends and gods are all real but also mapped to real world geography and with lots on historic nods.

There are 4 Great Powers who all have global domination goals. Rome is currently the greatest power thru the use of teamwork, and creativity, artificers provide wonders and clockworks that support Legions who wish to become full citizens and thus train for teamwork fighting benefits and widespread use of auras, marshals and large group tactics. their expansionist prowess and conversion tactics have actually cowed 2 of the other powers into "peace" with them.

Once the masters of the known world the undying "God Pharaohs" of Egypt have suffered many setbacks over the last millennia. The defection of Archimedes from Rome and the Arcane MightTM in their Tomb Cities mean that while they are cowed the remain unbroken.

Stronger, faster, heartier and just better(statwise) than the other races of men; from the far north are the AEskman or Vikings. While they hold the least territory they are the most feared in battle.

Finally and most pertinent to this request are the Greeks, lead by Atlantis they wish to reclaim the glory they had of old, but the number of Godblooded is so few and the last Great unifying leader was Alexander.

The Party is completely open to do whatever in world, the only constraint was that they could only have PCs from just one of the Great powers to avoid them working at cross purposes. Currently they have a Viking seeking to reclaim his throne, a Celtic druid summoner working to bring down the oppressive roman invaders, A desert nomad Assassin who kills the most dangerous targets for the most coin, An African Spirit shaman seeking his lost tribesmen who were ransomed into slavery in the north, A Chinese candle maker who wears a yellow turban and doesn't speak of his homeland, a Chinese monk who speaks much of his homeland and seeks a wan to regain the Emperors favor, A young druid lass who spends more time as a beast than woman, and the player whose current record is four sessions without losing a character- a strange man tormented by whispers only he can hear, with an unnatural interest in the unliving.

After a summer of genocide and mayhem the party has come across/caught up to a Greek adventuring party, killing all but the spartan commander 4 soldiers and the slave rowers they sorta pirated the ship, but now want to go follow up with what the Greeks were doing. The Greeks had broken into an Egyptian tomb complex and stolen the information about as well as tools for the ritual to create necropolitians. The party wants to see where this is going so they are sailing with them.

Where it is going: The Greek plan for World Domination-
Step One: constrain roman naval power via hit and run guerrilla warfare and undersea operating Atliantians.
Step Two: unleash Monsters in Roman occupied areas to draw out the legions and cause mass causalities.
Step Three: Steal the process to create free-willed undead that retain the powers they have.
Step Four: Find the titan formerly in charge of Death *current step
Step Five: Free Death titan into undeath
Step Six: Use control over undead to force undead Pharaohs to work for Greece, and the new piles of bodies as hosts for souls of fallen Greek heroes and take over the world!

Each Great power has some plan for world domination and I adjust how they are progressing based on the actions of the heroes.

So on the current step they are going to the island of Cyprus the first home of mount Olympus to find something of the former Dearth titan (Erbros) hopefully his weapon. With one of the titan's possessions as a focus they will go to Crete and get Theseus string wich will work to Find the path to the titan who I have trapped in a mountain in Romania and whose blood is being drank to create a clan of proto-Vampires, but that is a bit far forward for the party, their attention span is not so good.

So I have States some Roman cavalry who is garrisoned on Cyprus for them to Avoid or fight so between getting there and then dealing with them they might just chase a squirrel in a different direction.

But if/when they get to Olympus I want them to find these hermits who are their communing with fallen titans(pact magic) but also use the residual power from the Gods and titans a la incarnum style. So perhaps a hermit who regularly binds Eurynome (http://therafimrpg.wikidot.com/eurynome) would use a different incarnum load-out than one who binds Haagenti (http://therafimrpg.wikidot.com/haagenti). Obviously there are only so many hand, feet and crown binds available but I would rather not have them all just using the same ones and only be distinguished by the vestige bound.

So any cool vestige/incarnum combos that I should use or include?


I incorporate most 3.X or pathfinder material with setting tweaks if it is reasonable.

Nifft
2017-11-28, 08:18 PM
#1: Don't lock that feat. For a PC who wants options, the Improved Binding feat is great. For an NPC who might bind the same Level 3 vestige every day, it's utterly worthless. ONLY give the feat to people who will use it.

#2: Make a list of worthwhile Vestiges. Post them. Then we can help you optimize for each one. Paimon the Dancer seems like one good & obvious choice, for example.

Zeb
2017-11-28, 08:50 PM
#1: Don't lock that feat. For a PC who wants options, the Improved Binding feat is great. For an NPC who might bind the same Level 3 vestige every day, it's utterly worthless. ONLY give the feat to people who will use it.

Since it is an e6 game it gives them the option for the level 4 vestiges, if they really need a 4th feat or more then I can give them a flaw or 2 or drop it if they don't need it.


#2: Make a list of worthwhile Vestiges. Post them. Then we can help you optimize for each one. Paimon the Dancer seems like one good & obvious choice, for example.

Generally I pull from here (http://therafimrpg.wikidot.com/vestiges) since I use electronic copies of my books and online resources to reduce physical clutter at the table. While some might use expel vestige and switch to another lower level one since they aren't PCs then they probably wont get a change to be versatile land completely change their setup each day.

Nifft
2017-11-28, 09:19 PM
Since it is an e6 game it gives them the option for the level 4 vestiges, if they really need a 4th feat or more then I can give them a flaw or 2 or drop it if they don't need it. "Help me optimize within strict constraints."

Then later: "... btw the constraints don't matter."

Okay so throw on Power Attack, Leap Attack, Shock Trooper and EWP: Spiked Chain for all of them, plus Improved Initiative, Combat Reflexes, and 5x Toughness. Constraints don't matter and a few more feats can't hurt, right?


Generally I pull from here (http://therafimrpg.wikidot.com/vestiges) since I use electronic copies of my books and online resources to reduce physical clutter at the table. While some might use expel vestige and switch to another lower level one since they aren't PCs then they probably wont get a change to be versatile land completely change their setup each day.

I'm not asking for a list of all vestiges.

I'm asking for a short list of the specific vestiges that you think could be most relevant to the NPCs that might appear in your game.

Zeb
2017-11-28, 10:41 PM
"Help me optimize within strict constraints."

Then later: "... btw the constraints don't matter."

I'm not asking for optimized but rather


i'm looking for some good/interesting combos that make them feel unique

So I don't just end up with all of them shaping Airstep Sandals even the ones who bound Agares, or the redundancy of Cerulean Sandals with Eurynome bound.

I'm not asking for someone to build a meal(character) from the ground up, Just if anyone knows any good pairings or combos for this type of build.


I'm asking for a short list of the specific vestiges that you think could be most relevant to the NPCs that might appear in your game.

If there is a vestige that is required for or fun in a combo I would rather just re-fluff it to something that works in the setting rather than exclude what could be part of a fun encounter/combo.

Eurynome and Haagenti slides into the setting with no change needed. Buer, Agares, Focalor, Malphas, Naberius, Leraje and Amon only need some minor re-fluffing.

I would rather hear/see something interesting that someone knows/comes up with and maybe it not be a fit for this than exclude an idea that might work, if not for this then for later.

Nifft
2017-11-28, 11:26 PM
I'm not asking for someone to build a meal(character) from the ground up, Just if anyone knows any good pairings or combos for this type of build. Oh! Okay.

Dissolving Spittle + Sighting Gloves + Leraje (ricochet).

Thunderstep Boots (Soulborn, so a feat) + Focalor (aura of sadness) + Sphinx Claws (Totemist, so another feat or just be a Totemist) => multiple Fort saves at a penalty, or get Stunned.


If there is a vestige that is required for or fun in a combo I would rather just re-fluff it to something that works in the setting rather than exclude what could be part of a fun encounter/combo.

Eurynome and Haagenti slides into the setting with no change needed. Buer, Agares, Focalor, Malphas, Naberius, Leraje and Amon only need some minor re-fluffing.

Does the Blackflame of Astaroth, Diabolus of Baator work with fire damage from Soulmelds? I think it should.

If so, Lammasu Mantle (Totemist) has a Totem Bind effect which is very interesting.

Nifft
2017-11-29, 12:11 AM
Cerulean Sandals (for +speed) + Paimon => extra-long Dance of Death

Girallon Claws (totemist; totem bind) + Sphinx Claws (totemist; hand bind) + Malphas, the Turnfeather for Sudden Strike => Pounce for lots of attacks which each deal +2d6 sudden strike damage

Zeb
2017-11-29, 08:18 PM
Dissolving Spittle + Sighting Gloves + Leraje (ricochet)

Wow that is actually pretty cool since I never realized sighting gloves and Leraje work with non-manufactured ranged attacks.


Thunderstep Boots (Soulborn, so a feat) + Focalor (aura of sadness) + Sphinx Claws

Sad storms with thunder and lighting would be great for someone channeling the former titan if the sea and sky.

Vile fire damage might be a bit much for this group to handle.

Extra-long Dance of Death might cause them to give better thought to positioning.

I had built an opponent around getting lots of sudden/sneak/skirmish damage but he never got the chance to hit any of them so pounce sudden strike might make them think twice, and while i'm not really trying to kill them, if they die because then don't deal with a real threat then the death is on them.

Nifft
2017-11-29, 08:28 PM
Another way to go might be to get a Bite attack and Hand-bind the Worg Pelt (totemist) for a free Trip attack. (Several Totem binds can get you a Bite attack.)

Then follow up with any remaining melee attacks + Andromalius, the Repentant Rogue for +2d6 Sneak Attack.

Zeb
2017-11-30, 04:55 PM
Sounds good, we will see if they make it that far tonight, looks like we will be down 2 PCs because of RL stuff.

Thanks for the responses :smallsmile: