As a pure Druid, how to access Teleport?

[Endarire]

Intro
Thanks, all, for your suggestions! Some (like valiant steed) I'd never heard about or seriously considered before.

I'm well aware of Eggynack's Guide (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?439991-Being-Everything-Eggynack-s-Comprehensive-Druid-Handbook) and have referred to it extensively while building and playing this character. I have read the spell lists for Druid spell level 7 and below and wanted further input.

Regarding feats, Dderwydd Chymdeithas Initiate was what I wanted (and my character Uriel will likely take it after rebuilding post-personal quest) to have teleport available at L9. I read this feat before but forgot about it when making this post originally.

Island Info
-The island is Nymm in the Faerun setting.

-The GM's map of Nymm makes it to be between about 300 miles and 400 miles across

-The terrain has been a combination of mountains, swamps, snowy plains, snowy forests, and one desert.

-This is an isle where prisoners are sent, meaning civilization's resources are scarce. There's one intact town (Frostfall), one ruined town (Old Frostfall), and a buncha adventure sites.

-There is exactly one working ship on or near this island, but it's a highish level quest for us to get it.

-It is open to planar travel (like via plane shift) for those who can access such abilities. (Our group of level 6ish can't do that yet.)

-Flying for prolonged periods to escape this island proved impossible for the last Wizard who tried it. He just wrapped around the other side like he were in a Pac-Man maze. (We found his diary.)

Party
-We have a party of 6 PCs, 1 animal companion, 1 GMPC helper, and some NPCs in the background we could rotate in if we wanted. Our main party (who just got an opportunity to level to 6 last session) has been...

--Uriel, Human Druid6. He's a bit of everything aside from traps and scouting. Wild Shape recently happened and Natural Spell came to him last session. Once he completes his personal quest, he'll rebuild around level 8 (with GM permission of course) to Druid5/Planar Shepherd of LamanniaX. Uriel has Craft Wondrous Item and has made 2 Healing Belts for the group, but our group has been hesitant to spend more time not gaining EXP. My player knowledge of D&D 3.x has been akin to that of a college major, but more in studying optimization theory than playing.

---Kelly, Riding Dog Animal Companion. She's been the group's favorite pet and off-tank/off-DPS. When it's convenient, I planned to swap her Riding Dog form for Dire Eagle form since long-term flight is handy and the GM has let us respec feats and skills from default for newly-gained animal companions. No Natural Bond feat due to the GM's interpretation.

--Illias, Human Cleric of Heironeous6. He's been 'clank the tank,' or the guy who's primarily acted as the group's main tank. His D&D knowledge has largely been of the core rules and nothing else.

--Salutis, Bladeling Paladin of Heironeous5. Early in the campaign, we beat his Bladeling group into submission and purposely spared one for information. He was willing and able to convert from his position as an Underdark slave to learning what it meant to be [Good]. He's the disciple of Illias and our secondary tank.

--Rudy Clay, Silverbrow Human Bard2/Healer3/Mystic Theurge1. Originally a full Bard going for Sublime Chord, the GM respecced her to do more support stuff in combat after she finished her personal quest at L5. She's loved her Dragonfire Inspiration +4d6 (Bard1 + inspirational boost + Song of the Heart feat + how the GM ruled the Words of Creation feat) and the group has too.

--Haroun, Human Warmage6 going Sand Shaper after rebuilding post-personal quest. He's artillery and fine with it. His spells have been surprisingly useful (despite his class's tier 4 status) since having spontaneous damage spells has helped against swarms. He's played Warmages before, and his D&D 3.x knowledge has been enough for what he's tried to do.

--Blake, Wood Elf Scout/Ranger mix. He's new to the group and acting as our group's trapper since the previous player quit due to being too busy with work. He wants archery to the max and seemingly doesn't yet understand the power of buff and utility spells. Despite GMing for about 4 years, his D&D knowledge has largely been of the core rules and nothing else.

--Pitac, Phrenic Neraph Psychic Rogue1/Barbarian1/Swordsage4 after rebuilding. (He's just Swordsage4/Barbarian1 now and can level to 6.) He's been our group's 'ninja,' sneaker, and main physical DPS. (The GM gave him the Phrenic template as part of his personal quest except for the stat increases.) So far, he's been the group's main DPS, but Uriel's Wild Shape is changing that. His D&D knowledge started very low (initially insisting on being a Human Monk with Vow of Poverty), but we've talked extensively and he's learned a lot; hence, the Neraph Psychic Rogue1/Barbarian1 (with Pounce and Whirling Frenzy)/Swordsage4.

Campaign Info
-This campaign has been Undead-heavy, but has had plenty of other creature types. Most things we've faced have been type-immune to crits.

-We've been on a strict in-game timer. Undead are scheduled to overrun the island at the end of Armageddon's Clock around day 80. (We're on day 28.) We want to traverse this isle quickly and possibly warp out.

-This campaign is scheduled to last until level 20ish and span Faerun and the planes, BUT this Nymm Island section is scheduled to last until level 11 or thereabouts depending on what we do. (We've seen the adventure sites and quest descriptions and we're likely to be, at max, level 11 or thereabouts before Armageddon's Clock expires and the invasion hits; hence, the desire to get teleport ASAP.)

-Generally, all official material from books, web, and magazines is available, but the GM said he would more thoroughly scrutinize magazine material.

-Likely no Leadership. The GM has enough characters and units to consider already.

-Magic items have been scarce. Most items have been scrolls or partially-charged wands.

ORIGINAL POST
Greetings, all!

As a pure Druid, how to access the teleport spell or its errorless version?

Contemplative is an option for the Travel and Spell domains, but this character is not built for it. Items for these spells (including a Belt of the Wide Earth from Magic Item Compendium) are not guaranteed. Templates are also likely off-limits.

The intent is to be able to warp around an island quickly (and very preferably at the lowest level) and reliably due to a strict time limit in this campaign. Any option requiring more than level 11 is unlikely to work, and level 11 is already pushing it.

[noob]

there is a feat that allows to count as an arcane spellcaster then you take that feat for arcane spellcasters that allows access to a domain.

[Crake]

Well, if you're on an island, presumably there are trees, so wouldn't transport via plants (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/transportViaPlants.htm) fit your needs?

[noob]

Well, if you're on an island, presumably there are trees, so wouldn't transport via plants (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/transportViaPlants.htm) fit your needs?

The problem is that you get it as late as level 11.
While with my trick you get teleport as early as level 9.
the only way to get teleport earlier is through summoning outsiders.(or shenanigans to get spells earlier like using the feat combo I mentioned then become mystic theurge and progressing druid twice per level)

[Eldariel]

The Master Earth [Spell Compendium] spell is pretty much Teleport. Or as close as Druid gets natively anyways. Without dipping it's kinda hard to get it otherwise; yeah, you can take Southern Magician/Alternative Source Spell and Arcane Disciple it up or go through some feat chains to gain a Domain or Fey Circle something that gets it for you, but Master Earth is hard to beat for ease of access vs. effect. But yeah, getting it on 9 would require hrm...a lot of work. Well, one option is of course picking up some of the fancier Wildshape feats and...hmm, Black Unicorn, Archons get it but Magical Beasts and Outsiders are pretty much the hardest types to access...

[noob]

The Master Earth [Spell Compendium] spell is pretty much Teleport. Or as close as Druid gets natively anyways. Without dipping it's kinda hard to get it otherwise; yeah, you can take Southern Magician/Alternative Source Spell and Arcane Disciple it up or go through some feat chains to gain a Domain or Fey Circle something that gets it for you, but Master Earth is hard to beat for ease of access vs. effect.

You get it way too late: he said " Any option requiring more than level 11 is unlikely to work, and level 11 is already pushing it."
So it means that he is probably not going to epic levels like 13+
I found that getting an outsider ally is probably the fastest way(use sacrifice rules to summon an outsider with teleport at will) then have a team which weights less than 25kg(become necropolitans and then buy some scrolls of haunt shift)

[ayvango]

Raiment of Four magic item set has belt that provides teleport. Precisely speaking it allows to convert any 5th level spell (or higher) to teleport

[noob]

A runestaff of lesser planar ally or teleport could work great too and is less cheesy than the use of sacrifice rules.
You can also use Create Lantern Archon(no need for spell access sheanigans and is level 3)+ having a team that weights less than 25kg for teleportation at will for one hour per casting of create lantern archon.(can be done at level 5 but can only teleport you at safe places)

[ShurikVch]

Fiendish Legacy - [heritage] feat in Complete Mage - gives Teleport 1/day SLA at 9th level

The Catalogues of Enlightenment planar touchstone (Planar Handbook): it's Higher-Order Ability allow to cast domain spell of available level 3 times; 5th-level spell in Travel or Portal domain

Dderwydd Chymdeithas Initiate feat (Dragon #332) gives you 9 extra spells, and 5th-level one is the Teleport!
Since the only prerequisite is "Ability to spontaneously cast Summon Nature's Ally", this feat was clearly intended for Druid.

[Crake]

A runestaff of lesser planar ally or teleport could work great too and is less cheesy than the use of sacrifice rules.
You can also use Create Lantern Archon(no need for spell access sheanigans and is level 3)+ having a team that weights less than 25kg for teleportation at will for one hour per casting of create lantern archon.(can be done at level 5 but can only teleport you at safe places)


Raiment of Four magic item set has belt that provides teleport. Precisely speaking it allows to convert any 5th level spell (or higher) to teleport

except runestaves explicitly require arcane spell slots, and the feat you referred to earlier, alternate spell source, is dragon mag, so not necessarily acceptable

[Bronk]

Check Eggynack's druid handbook: There might be some combination of wild shape form and the 'assume supernatural ability' feat that would help.

The level 6 'transport via plants' has been mentioned, but what about the level 5 'tree stride'?

You can also get the Travel Domain to get teleport with a level of 'Seeker of the Misty Isle' if you're an elf or half-elf.

There's also a druid specific portal system from Magic of Faerune called 'crossroads' you might try to use.

Otherwise, are you sure that the island is so big you can't use fast wild shape forms or something like that? Or by riding another animal... These can be augmented by spells like 'Fire Wings', 'Favor of Yathaghera', or 'Cloud Wings'. 'Phantom Stag' can be pretty fast too.

[ayvango]

Belf of the Wide Earth is not a runestaff. So it is free from its limitation and provide druid with teleport spell for 8k gold investment.

[Darrin]

The druid's primary "teleport" spell is usually tree stride. So... plant a lot of trees on the island? If you don't want to use trees, you could use pools of water with swamp stride (Spell Compendium). A command-activated item of unlimited swamp stride would cost... hmm, maybe 81K. That's a bit much. Domain Staff of Travel would be a lot cheaper.

If you plant enough trees to establish a forest on the island, then a unicorn might be able to use greater teleport 1/day. You can get a unicorn via SNA4 or valiant steed (Book of Exalted Deeds, cast sheltered vitality first). The forest has to be it's "home", although the rules don't really say how that's established. The unicorn is intelligent and can speak, so presumably you can ask it if it can move it's home to the island.

If the island counts as a "mountain", then summoning an oread (Fiend Folio) might work. They can teleport around their mountain at will (as with unicorn, no indication from rules on how "ownership" is established). They can be summoned with SNAVI, or As a 7HD fey you could use fey ring.

Lowest level you can get teleport would probably be 5th, at which point you can cast create lantern archon (Champions of Valor). However, you'd want sheltered vitality to negate the Con drain, so more likely 7th level. The tricky part there is they can only teleport themselves and up to 50 lbs of objects, so... figure out how it could carry a bag of holding, maybe? If you can craft magic items, you could ask it to lend it's teleport SLA towards creating a teleport item. Craft Skull Talisman + create lantern archon allows you to create essentially "potions" of teleport. Or have it cast teleport into a spell-storing item (greater glyph seal, chardalyn, spell-storing shuriken, etc.).

[Eldariel]

Summons can't normally use teleportation abilities as per the spell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/summonNaturesAllyI.htm).

[Bronk]

There's also the White Hart, from Dragon 343. They're a kind of fey deer that can appear in forests with elves and fey in them, and they can planeshift to Arboria, Ysgard, and the Beastlands and back. You'd just need to catch a round trip.

[weckar]

The druid's primary "teleport" spell is usually tree stride. So... plant a lot of trees on the island?

THIS is why you carry those silly feather tokens, people!

[Darrin]

THIS is why you carry those silly feather tokens, people!

Well, that and the 20d6 falling object damage...

[Bronk]

Well, that and the 20d6 falling object damage...

... +1d6 for every 200 pounds of initial weight...

[Darrin]

... +1d6 for every 200 pounds of initial weight...

Only if you're just using the DMG. If you use the Rules Compendium, the damage caps at 20d6 regardless of weight.

[noob]

On the dmg it also caps for both kind of damage(falling and weight) with a given way of reading.
But not all players make their gm see that way of twisting the rules to get that effect.
Read again the falling damage rules from the dmg you can find a way of reading it that makes the damage capped to 20d6(at least with the french version)

[ben-zayb]

Is eggynack the only person who knows Stormwrack's Stormwalk? Because that's pretty much what the spell is, except with a bit of 10-minute* storm theatrics.


* 10 minutes is still relatively fast for warping around an island, considering the "no teleport" alternative

[ShurikVch]

Is eggynack the only person who knows Stormwrack's Stormwalk? Because that's pretty much what the spell is, except with a bit of 10-minute* storm theatrics.


* 10 minutes is still relatively fast for warping around an island, considering the "no teleport" alternativeI know about it, but I'm don't see the RAW which says you can actually choose where you will appear 10 minutes later

[noob]

I know about it, but I'm don't see the RAW which says you can actually choose where you will appear 10 minutes later
At the start of the description there is written "as teleport, save that"
So you choose a destination the same way you choose one for teleport.

[ShurikVch]

At the start of the description there is written "as teleport, save that"
So you choose a destination the same way you choose one for teleport.Correct point

Sill, caveat there is a need for storm to actually use it
(And it doesn't says what's will happen if the storm actually ends during those 10 minutes. Mishap?)

[Mr Adventurer]

I can't see anything in the spell which requires a storm already be where you are? It's not part of the targeting, components, or range; and "drawing on the power of a storm" doesn't mean there's one right there. Plus, it explicit sly creates a mini-storm for you at the exit point.

[ShurikVch]

I can't see anything in the spell which requires a storm already be where you are? It's not part of the targeting, components, or range; and "drawing on the power of a storm" doesn't mean there's one right there. Plus, it explicit sly creates a mini-storm for you at the exit point.Ahem...
Upon casting the spell, the storm suddenly intensifies in the area where the spell was castHow it can to intensify, if there wasn't any storm to begin with?

[Mr Adventurer]

Ahem...How it can to intensify, if there wasn't any storm to begin with?

But there is one. It's the one you're drawing power from. Whether it's anywhere near you at the time, or even on the same plane, doesn't seem to be important.

[Bronk]

The problem with Stormwalk for is that you lose 10 minutes every time you cast it.

You could take the 'dragon wild shape' feat and take the form of any of the gem dragons to get their planar travel ability, then move around the island by traveling back and forth between one of the elemental planes.

[Mr Adventurer]

The problem with Stormwalk for is that you lose 10 minutes every time you cast it.

You could take the 'dragon wild shape' feat and take the form of any of the gem dragons to get their planar travel ability, then move around the island by traveling back and forth between one of the elemental planes.

Doesn't plane shifting put you 5d100 miles away from target? Can you make that in 10 minutes?

[Bronk]

Doesn't plane shifting put you 5d100 miles away from target? Can you make that in 10 minutes?

It's an incompletely worded ability, but it isn't actually casting the plane shift spell... it's its own thing.

Even if it had to miss the target, you can just keep trying every other round to get as close as possible - maybe by offsetting your desired target - and worst case scenario, you're still in a fast dragon form.

[Mr Adventurer]

It's an incompletely worded ability, but it isn't actually casting the plane shift spell... it's its own thing.

Heh, fair enough. Not like it's alone there.


Even if it had to miss the target, you can just keep trying every other round to get as close as possible - maybe by offsetting your desired target - and worst case scenario, you're still in a fast dragon form.

This still wouldn't come close to equalling or beating an accurate teleport with a 10 minute delay, though.

[Bronk]

Heh, fair enough. Not like it's alone there.

This still wouldn't come close to equalling or beating an accurate teleport with a 10 minute delay, though.

It looks like a dragon with a movement of 150' that starts from a height and flies down at an angle to double their speed, who is hurrying by using the running option to bring the speed with DnD's multiplication rules to X5, would make it 750' per six second round, or about 14.2 miles in ten minutes. So that's something, I guess.

Unless this counts as a real world calculation, so that would be a total of X8, or 22.7 miles in ten minutes.

We still don't know how big this island is! Is it small, or big like Iceland or a Hawaiian island?

[Hiro Quester]

What Darin said. Tree stride (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/treeStride.htm) and a bunch of Feather tokens (or already existing trees).

At 9th level you know this 5th level spell, and can use one casting to warp around an island, up to 3000 ft (0.57 miles) per stride, nine times over 9 hours.

If the island is too big for that to help, then transport via plants is your other bog-standard druid option.

The other options would be to just wildshape into a bird (albatross can do long-distances in a reasonable time) and fly about in disguise.

But perhaps your best alternative is Dderwydd Chymdeithas Initiate feat (Dragon Magazine #332) that grants Teleport as a 5th level spell (among several other goodies).

Edit: I didn't initially see that ShurikVch had already suggested that feat.

[ShurikVch]

But there is one. It's the one you're drawing power from. Whether it's anywhere near you at the time, or even on the same plane, doesn't seem to be important.:smallconfused: Do you even reading?..
It says:
the storm suddenly intensifies in the area where the spell was cast So, once again:
How it can to intensify, if there wasn't any storm to begin with?

[Fizban]

Stormwalk requires a storm, there are multiple spells below the level of Stormwalk which create storms. More pertinently the OP says 6th level spells aren't good enough, and Stormwalk is 6th level.

Without any details on the island ("island" gives no indication of size) or character, just Belt of the Wide Earth- if this is such a specific adventure I hardly see why you'd be able to pull up random dragoon mag or other setting stuff so your character can just so happen to have the perfect solution beforehand. If specific magic items are not guaranteed, take Ancestral Relic and have a friendly Druid give you a masterwork belt- the belt is from someone of your religious order and thus qualifies right in the feat description. You need a consecrated or hallowed site, 8 days, and 8,000gp of stuff. You can cast the Hallow yourself at 9th level if you can scrounge up herbs oils and incense worth 1,000gp. If you don't have magic items to burn, you can use art objects or straight cash. A Druid of a less preservationist persuasion could sacrifice goods in the form of valuable bushes or possibly ritually sacrificing livestock- elephants are a whopping 2,000gp each.

[noob]

The lowest level options stays create lantern archon(level 3 spell) combined with having a very low mass(and having team mates that all have a low mass too).(that or cheese like sacrifice rules or pun pun)

[ShurikVch]

The lowest level options stays create lantern archon(level 3 spell) combined with having a very low mass(and having team mates that all have a low mass too)The problem with Archon-based teleportation: RAW says: "... creature can transport only itself and up to 50 pounds of objects."
Neither you're, nor your teammates are objects

[Darrin]

The problem with Archon-based teleportation: RAW says: "... creature can transport only itself and up to 50 pounds of objects."
Neither you're, nor your teammates are objects

Mitigated with a bag of holding, portable hole, or some considerably elaborate flesh to stone/shrink item/break enchantment shenanigans.

[daremetoidareyo]

Wild shape into an albatross?

The node spell-casting feats allow you to use notes the transport out of my third level slot. I think the seats up to feats though. As well as access to an earth node.

[Endarire]

Intro
Thanks, all, for your suggestions! Some (like valiant steed) I'd never heard about or seriously considered before.

I'm well aware of Eggynack's Guide (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?439991-Being-Everything-Eggynack-s-Comprehensive-Druid-Handbook) and have referred to it extensively while building and playing this character. I have read the spell lists for Druid spell level 7 and below and wanted further input.

Regarding feats, Dderwydd Chymdeithas Initiate was what I wanted (and my character Uriel will likely take it after rebuilding post-personal quest) to have teleport available at L9. I read this feat before but forgot about it when making this post originally.

Island Info
-The island is Nymm in the Faerun setting.

-The GM's map of Nymm makes it to be between about 300 miles and 400 miles across

-The terrain has been a combination of mountains, swamps, snowy plains, snowy forests, and one desert.

-This is an isle where prisoners are sent, meaning civilization's resources are scarce. There's one intact town (Frostfall), one ruined town (Old Frostfall), and a buncha adventure sites.

-There is exactly one working ship on or near this island, but it's a highish level quest for us to get it.

-It is open to planar travel (like via plane shift) for those who can access such abilities. (Our group of level 6ish can't do that yet.)

-Flying for prolonged periods to escape this island proved impossible for the last Wizard who tried it. He just wrapped around the other side like he were in a Pac-Man maze. (We found his diary.)

Party
-We have a party of 6 PCs, 1 animal companion, 1 GMPC helper, and some NPCs in the background we could rotate in if we wanted. Our main party (who just got an opportunity to level to 6 last session) has been...

--Uriel, Human Druid6. He's a bit of everything aside from traps and scouting. Wild Shape recently happened and Natural Spell came to him last session. Once he completes his personal quest, he'll rebuild around level 8 (with GM permission of course) to Druid5/Planar Shepherd of LamanniaX. Uriel has Craft Wondrous Item and has made 2 Healing Belts for the group, but our group has been hesitant to spend more time not gaining EXP. My player knowledge of D&D 3.x has been akin to that of a college major, but more in studying optimization theory than playing.

---Kelly, Riding Dog Animal Companion. She's been the group's favorite pet and off-tank/off-DPS. When it's convenient, I planned to swap her Riding Dog form for Dire Eagle form since long-term flight is handy and the GM has let us respec feats and skills from default for newly-gained animal companions. No Natural Bond feat due to the GM's interpretation.

--Illias, Human Cleric of Heironeous6. He's been 'clank the tank,' or the guy who's primarily acted as the group's main tank. His D&D knowledge has largely been of the core rules and nothing else.

--Salutis, Bladeling Paladin of Heironeous5. Early in the campaign, we beat his Bladeling group into submission and purposely spared one for information. He was willing and able to convert from his position as an Underdark slave to learning what it meant to be [Good]. He's the disciple of Illias and our secondary tank.

--Rudy Clay, Silverbrow Human Bard2/Healer3/Mystic Theurge1. Originally a full Bard going for Sublime Chord, the GM respecced her to do more support stuff in combat after she finished her personal quest at L5. She's loved her Dragonfire Inspiration +4d6 (Bard1 + inspirational boost + Song of the Heart feat + how the GM ruled the Words of Creation feat) and the group has too.

--Haroun, Human Warmage6 going Sand Shaper after rebuilding post-personal quest. He's artillery and fine with it. His spells have been surprisingly useful (despite his class's tier 4 status) since having spontaneous damage spells has helped against swarms. He's played Warmages before, and his D&D 3.x knowledge has been enough for what he's tried to do.

--Blake, Wood Elf Scout/Ranger mix. He's new to the group and acting as our group's trapper since the previous player quit due to being too busy with work. He wants archery to the max and seemingly doesn't yet understand the power of buff and utility spells. Despite GMing for about 4 years, his D&D knowledge has largely been of the core rules and nothing else.

--Pitac, Phrenic Neraph Psychic Rogue1/Barbarian1/Swordsage4 after rebuilding. (He's just Swordsage4/Barbarian1 now and can level to 6.) He's been our group's 'ninja,' sneaker, and main physical DPS. (The GM gave him the Phrenic template as part of his personal quest except for the stat increases.) So far, he's been the group's main DPS, but Uriel's Wild Shape is changing that. His D&D knowledge started very low (initially insisting on being a Human Monk with Vow of Poverty), but we've talked extensively and he's learned a lot; hence, the Neraph Psychic Rogue1/Barbarian1 (with Pounce and Whirling Frenzy)/Swordsage4.

Campaign Info
-This campaign has been Undead-heavy, but has had plenty of other creature types. Most things we've faced have been type-immune to crits.

-We've been on a strict in-game timer. Undead are scheduled to overrun the island at the end of Armageddon's Clock around day 80. (We're on day 28.) We want to traverse this isle quickly and possibly warp out.

-This campaign is scheduled to last until level 20ish and span Faerun and the planes, BUT this Nymm Island section is scheduled to last until level 11 or thereabouts depending on what we do. (We've seen the adventure sites and quest descriptions and we're likely to be, at max, level 11 or thereabouts before Armageddon's Clock expires and the invasion hits; hence, the desire to get teleport ASAP.)

-Generally, all official material from books, web, and magazines is available, but the GM said he would more thoroughly scrutinize magazine material.

-Likely no Leadership. The GM has enough characters and units to consider already.

-Magic items have been scarce. Most items have been scrolls or partially-charged wands.

[Mr Adventurer]

It looks like a dragon with a movement of 150' that starts from a height and flies down at an angle to double their speed, who is hurrying by using the running option to bring the speed with DnD's multiplication rules to X5, would make it 750' per six second round, or about 14.2 miles in ten minutes. So that's something, I guess.

Unless this counts as a real world calculation, so that would be a total of X8, or 22.7 miles in ten minutes.

We still don't know how big this island is! Is it small, or big like Iceland or a Hawaiian island?

I'm not sure you're allowed to use run speeds for overland movement; there's a table of true dragon overland move speeds.

Even if so, it's 5d100 miles off-target with Plane Shift, you'll be lucky to roll less than 14!


:smallconfused: Do you even reading?..
It says:So, once again:
How it can to intensify, if there wasn't any storm to begin with?

No need to be rude, now, is there?

What part of the spell says that a storm needs to be present in order for the spell to function?

The part you're quoting looks like the spell effect, to me. Parts of a spell can fail to come about when you cast it due to local conditions; that's OK. It doesn't negate the other parts of the effect as a general rule.

[Bronk]

-The island is Nymm in the Faerun setting.

-This is an isle where prisoners are sent, meaning civilization's resources are scarce. There's one intact town (Frostfall), one ruined town (Old Frostfall), and a buncha adventure sites.

-It is open to planar travel (like via plane shift) for those who can access such abilities. (Our group of level 6ish can't do that yet.)

-Flying for prolonged periods to escape this island proved impossible for the last Wizard who tried it. He just wrapped around the other side like he were in a Pac-Man maze. (We found his diary.)


This sounds so familiar, but for the life of me I can't find this anywhere. Any idea where your DM got this from?


I'm not sure you're allowed to use run speeds for overland movement; there's a table of true dragon overland move speeds.

Even if so, it's 5d100 miles off-target with Plane Shift, you'll be lucky to roll less than 14!


In this case, it's not for that long, and the idea is that you'd pop out at a high altitude and be gliding downwards the entire time.

The idea is that if the DM ruled that the supernatural ability worked exactly like the plane shift spell, you'd make more than one attempt, and use tricks like putting an offset on your destination... but it should be it's own power anyway, without the chance for missing the target. Of course, in that case, it would probably be personal use only, and he'd have to use tricks to take passengers. It would also come online at level six, and it happens that they're at level six now. Maybe they could retrain that last feat...

On the other hand, it's a moot point if the DM only has a game planned for adventuring on this one island for now. I mean, he'd be able to leave whenever he wanted, but then what? It would probably just ruin everyone's fun. I'm glad a solution was found with that initiate feat.

[Endarire]

The GM is very well prepared for this campaign, on this island and beyond!

[ericgrau]

No need to be rude, now, is there?

What part of the spell says that a storm needs to be present in order for the spell to function?

It says it draws on the power of a storm to teleport in the first sentence. No storm = no teleport. The 2nd sentence presumes the existence of a storm before it can intensify it. No storm = no intensified storm = still no teleport.

He's probably frustrated at the sheer level of ridiculous, not rude. Perhaps a bit incredulous that anyone could actually believe someone needs to be told in the rules that something can't function without its source.

Tree stride is 5th level anyway.

I found node door, druid 3, Champions of Ruin pg. 32 or Underdark pg. 59. But that requires a feat plus knowing the location of 2 natural nodes on and off the island. I found a few others that offer limited hops but I wouldn't be surprised if your DM gave those the pacman wrap around too. That's all I could find for actual Conjuration (teleportation) spells. Planar effects similar to shadow-walk might hold something (5th level non-druid, but maybe something else similar). Or indirect ways of teleporting without the spell itself somehow. Items could do it too. Like 21,000 gp for a set of ivory goat figurines of wondrous power (DMG). Maybe there's something cheaper.

[Mr Adventurer]

It says it draws on the power of a storm to teleport in the first sentence. No storm = no teleport.

Your conclusion is not supported by your premise. As well, you didn't state the rest of your conclusion, which would make that more obvious: you conclude that no storm in the area precludes the spell's function. There's nothing to support that; and there will always be storms somewhere to draw on - you can draw a parallel with various spells that draw on nonspecific draconic, elemental, planar, or divine power, if you like. I refer to this in one of my earlier posts, perhaps you missed it.


2nd sentence presumes the existence of a storm before it can intensify it. No storm = no intensified storm = still no teleport.

Your conclusion is not supported by your premise.


He's probably frustrated at the sheer level of ridiculous, not rude.

The latter isn't precluded by the former, so you're mistaken to make this assertion.


Perhaps a bit incredulous that anyone could actually believe someone needs to be told in the rules that something can't function without its source.

Again, this is irrelevant.

Nothing in the spell specifies you be near a storm, so you're merely repeating yourself without restating your premises, which themselves are not supported by the text.

[ExLibrisMortis]

I'm not sure you're allowed to use run speeds for overland movement; there's a table of true dragon overland move speeds.
You can, but you have to get immunity to fatigue, or you'll collapse a few minutes in. Undead, for example, are explicitly called out as being able to run at full speed all day, on account of their Con --.

Wild Shape into a mercury dragon can get you a 250' fly speed, so that's about 1000' per round, or 2000' if descending (good for travelling across small islands without plane shift). However, Dragon Wild Shape requires 15 ranks in Knowledge (nature), and that's out of reach at ECL 9-11.

[ShurikVch]

What part of the spell says that a storm needs to be present in order for the spell to function?

The part you're quoting looks like the spell effect, to me. Parts of a spell can fail to come about when you cast it due to local conditions; that's OK. It doesn't negate the other parts of the effect as a general rule.By your "reading", you can even cast it, say, in the Underdark :smalltongue:
"So what if there is currently no storm in Underdark, never wasn't, and never will happen? But somewhere, right now, it's certainly going!"

In short: the spell is badly-written, and any sane DM will either house-rule the hell out of it, or just ban it altogether

[Mr Adventurer]

By your "reading", you can even cast it, say, in the Underdark :smalltongue:
"So what if there is currently no storm in Underdark, never wasn't, and never will happen? But somewhere, right now, it's certainly going!"

Yes, of course, the spell does allow that. It's not even an absurd thing, in the context of what magic spells already allow you to do, despite what you imply.

I'll not engage with your passive-aggressive scarequotes other than to call them out.


In short: the spell is badly-written, and any sane DM will either house-rule the hell out of it, or just ban it altogether

That may or may not be, but it's not what we've been discussing so that's an attempt to move the goalposts.

In fact, your position until now has been that the spell is written fine, just that we have different interpretations.

[ShurikVch]

In fact, your position until now has been that the spell is written fine, just that we have different interpretations.:smallsigh: When and where, exactly, I said the spell in question is "written fine"? Quotes, please!
I just pointed certain common-sense problem with your reading of the spell in it's very own text
Since you're still refusing to acknowledge the problem, I said my final opinion about the spell: it's badly-written
While it may be not as bad as "invulnerable Pugilist", it's "bare RAW reading" still fly in the face of common sense
DM, when somebody will try to use it without any actual storm going, can just say: "But there is no storm now!" Will you argue with DM?

[Mr Adventurer]

:smallsigh: When and where, exactly, I said the spell in question is "written fine"? Quotes, please!

Well, I admit I made an assumption there - since you've only ever talked about how the spell does work, rather than (as you have just started doing) talking about how it doesn't work. Does that mean all of the rest of your argument up until that point was in bad faith? I'm not sure what to make of your approach.


I just pointed certain common-sense problem with your reading of the spell in it's very own text
Since you're still refusing to acknowledge the problem, I said my final opinion about the spell: it's badly-written

Well, thank you for providing evidence. I don't think it actually supports your claim, but you made the effort.

Meanwhile, I have in fact acknowledged the issue you're referring to - that's the whole basis of our discussion. For you to say otherwise, now, reinforces the growing suspicion I have that you're not actually interested in the argument, and just want to exchange words. (I don't of course accept the issue, which is a different proposition.)


While it may be not as bad as "invulnerable Pugilist", it's "bare RAW reading" still fly in the face of common sense

I have no idea what you're talking about here, I am afraid! Perhaps if you were a little more explicit?


DM, when somebody will try to use it without any actual storm going, can just say: "But there is no storm now!" Will you argue with DM?

I don't know what you're trying to do here. Are you genuinely asking me if I'd contest a ruling a DM made? How is that relevant to our discussion?

[noob]

I still think that getting a bag(does not needs to be magical) and then using create lantern archon and shape-shifting in a low mass small animal(such as a 20 pounds dog) for entering the bag is the lowest level way of teleportation.(if not ready to go through sacrifice cheese and other similar cheese)

[Bronk]

You can, but you have to get immunity to fatigue, or you'll collapse a few minutes in. Undead, for example, are explicitly called out as being able to run at full speed all day, on account of their Con --.

Wild Shape into a mercury dragon can get you a 250' fly speed, so that's about 1000' per round, or 2000' if descending (good for travelling across small islands without plane shift). However, Dragon Wild Shape requires 15 ranks in Knowledge (nature), and that's out of reach at ECL 9-11.

I definitely missed the skill prerequisite, that's such a bummer!

I looked around online, thinking that I'd seen something about this prison island before, but I must have been thinking about something else. I did find a pay to play site with what looked like the exact background storyline posted as a teaser. If this is the same game, since everyone is paying 15 bucks a game (!), maybe double check with all the other players to make sure that any trick you use won't affect anyone else's fun.

[ShurikVch]

Well, I admit I made an assumption there - since you've only ever talked about how the spell does work, rather than (as you have just started doing) talking about how it doesn't work. Does that mean all of the rest of your argument up until that point was in bad faith? I'm not sure what to make of your approach.It may work - with houserules
My houserules - you need actual storm for this spell
Your housrules - you using Schrödinger's Storm, which is going even when it isn't
Without houserules this spell is too unclear
(And Teleport is available one level earlier...)



Meanwhile, I have in fact acknowledged the issue you're referring to - that's the whole basis of our discussion. For you to say otherwise, now, reinforces the growing suspicion I have that you're not actually interested in the argument, and just want to exchange words. (I don't of course accept the issue, which is a different proposition.)Po-tay-to po-tah-to... :smallsigh:
Honestly, it's look like you're both incapable to accept you're wrong, to prove you're right, and to leave it "as is" without any agreement



I have no idea what you're talking about here, I am afraid! Perhaps if you were a little more explicit?It's OK - after all, it's not the most well-known problem in 3.5
Dragon #310 printed bunch of "alternative classes" based on Core mundanes and half-casters
One of Fighter's variants was called "Pugilist"
Important part there is - it allow to take certain special abilities instead Fighter's bonus feats, and one of those is "Shake it Off":
Shake it Off: The pugilist develops
non-lethal damage only and reduces the
duration of all stunning effects by 1
round, with a minimum of 1 round. The
Pugilist can take this ability multiple
times; it's effects stack.As you can see, "as is" this special ability doesn't make any freaking sense:
"The pugilist develops" ... what?
What's it's mean by "non-lethal damage only"?
There is no point to search a sense in there - because there is no sense
Probably, it was some severe editing error
But some people on TO board invented "creative solution": Pugilist always takes the "non-lethal damage only"!
(Lethal damage is either converted to non-lethal, or ignored altogether)
Yes, just like that!
And if you somehow get immunity to "non-lethal damage", you will be immune to damage completely!



I don't know what you're trying to do here. Are you genuinely asking me if I'd contest a ruling a DM made? How is that relevant to our discussion?Spell which can't be used in any real game is useless

[Endarire]

To clarify, this campaign is the $15 per session one (https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/2391017/frostfall-sunday-dnd-campaign) but so far has felt like a well-done video game. I'm unsure whether calling it a tabletop 3.5 version of Baldur's Gate in terms of quality is a fair comparison, but it may be close.

[jmax]

The Master Earth [Spell Compendium] spell is pretty much Teleport. Or as close as Druid gets natively anyways. Without dipping it's kinda hard to get it otherwise; yeah, you can take Southern Magician/Alternative Source Spell and Arcane Disciple it up or go through some feat chains to gain a Domain or Fey Circle something that gets it for you, but Master Earth is hard to beat for ease of access vs. effect. But yeah, getting it on 9 would require hrm...a lot of work. Well, one option is of course picking up some of the fancier Wildshape feats and...hmm, Black Unicorn, Archons get it but Magical Beasts and Outsiders are pretty much the hardest types to access...

As others have noted, this is too high-level, but I'd like to +1 it as one of my favorite spells because it is not teleportation and therefore bypasses wards against teleportation.



Belf of the Wide Earth is not a runestaff. So it is free from its limitation and provide druid with teleport spell for 8k gold investment.

Thanks for calling out this item - I'd never noticed it before. It actually makes it plausible to have a Sor/Wiz-free party at high levels without resorting to shenanigans.



THIS is why you carry those silly feather tokens, people!

No adventuring kit is complete without Feather Token: Tree.



Stormwalk

Neat spell, nice and flashy, has some writing problems, multiple people think someone is wrong on the internet (https://xkcd.com/386/).



Now then, for an actual contribution. In addition to the various suggestions regarding transport via plants and tree stride (which should be very effective on an island that size because the flora should be largely homogenous), the island is small enough that you may not need teleport all the time if you have access to Spell Compendium. Phantom stag starts you off with 180-ft land movement at ECL 9. Traveler's mount bumps that up to 200-ft land speed and lets you hustle without penalty (assuming phantom stag is real enough that fatigue and exertion are even relevant). That's 45.5 mph. Add wind at back to double that - now you're at 91 mph. It's not instantaneous, but you can really haul stag when you need to. Between that and transport via plants, you should be able to get anywhere on the island in minutes without needing any magic items at all.

[Fizban]

Ah, I'd forgotten about Phantom Stag. It's still a 5th level spell, and the spell effect isn't an animal or magical beast for Traveler's Mount to work on it, but it's the Druid's Phantom Steed.

Or rather, it would be, except Druids also have Bottle of Smoke in the same book, which is their actual 3rd level version of Phantom Steed, which is actually better in almost every way except that it doesn't gain the higher level air walking and the bottle takes up space in your hand. It's actually immune to damage and has no hit points, so if it's allowed to hustle then it can do so indefinitely even without Traveler's Mount. Actually.

[Mordaedil]

I feel like it'd suck to be a sorcerer and pick stormwalk as one of your spells and be stuck there with a spell that can't actually be cast unless conditions are absolutely perfect, so I'd let it work as long as they were in an environment I'd consider "outside" enough for it to work.

This includes, presumably, a large enough cave in the Underdark. I'd be hesitant to allow it anywhere underground, but enough for there to be moisture that can gather and create storm-like conditions would be my ruling.

Otherwise, why even have the spell?

[jmax]

Ah, I'd forgotten about Phantom Stag. It's still a 5th level spell, and the spell effect isn't an animal or magical beast for Traveler's Mount to work on it, but it's the Druid's Phantom Steed.


Derp. Forgot about the type restriction. Still, if the DM determines it's neither Animal nor Magical Beast, it wouldn't be wholly unreasonable to assert that (since there's no explicit Constitution score mentioned anyway), it probably can hustle without penalty on its own.


Or rather, it would be, except Druids also have Bottle of Smoke in the same book, which is their actual 3rd level version of Phantom Steed, which is actually better in almost every way except that it doesn't gain the higher level air walking and the bottle takes up space in your hand. It's actually immune to damage and has no hit points, so if it's allowed to hustle then it can do so indefinitely even without Traveler's Mount.

That works, too, although the 10-minute cast time is a drag if you don't know you want it in advance. Being able to pause the duration limits that drag considerably, though - I'll have to add that to my list of spells to cast before bedtime if I have open slots at the end of the day. The point is that there are ways to travel beyond teleport, and build contortions probably aren't worthwhile unless you really, really need instantaneous travel to wholly arbitrary locations.



I feel like it'd suck to be a sorcerer and pick stormwalk as one of your spells and be stuck there with a spell that can't actually be cast unless conditions are absolutely perfect, so I'd let it work as long as they were in an environment I'd consider "outside" enough for it to work.

This includes, presumably, a large enough cave in the Underdark. I'd be hesitant to allow it anywhere underground, but enough for there to be moisture that can gather and create storm-like conditions would be my ruling.

Otherwise, why even have the spell?

Out of respect for the OP, this should probably be taken to a new thread if the discussion is worth continuing.

[P.F.]

Clearly "you draw upon the power of a storm" is flavor text.

The pertinent game rule would be, "As teleport."

You can do whatever you want with the fluff, storm on another plane of existence, sunshine storm, **** storm, brainstorm, whatever. The crunch stays the same, right?

[Endarire]

For the Nymm name: According to Races of Eberron 144 in the Moonspeaker PrC entry, "In moonspeaker lore, this ability derives from the blessing of Nymm, the largest moon in the night sky, which is said to watch over planar pathways."