Dual Majors: A Not-Quite-Gestalt Variant Idea (PEACH)

[Dr_Dinosaur]

Gestalt's been a popular variant practically since it was introduced, but I could see how it might be much more of a burden on the DM in 5e, where player capabilities are kept on such a tight leash compared to 3.P. So here's an idea to scratch that itch a bit while still avoiding the difficult questions of gestalt (EG how do Extra Attacks/ASIs work?).

Simply put, the first time a player would be allowed to choose a class archetype, they instead choose two, gaining all the features and benefits of both at the indicated levels. This doesn't apply to any class but the first to reach that point (so taking 2 levels of Fighter first wouldn't preclude picking two Paladin oaths later, but Fighter 3 would).

So, thoughts? Critiques? Ideas for fun combinations? I think a Thief/Swashbuckler Rogue sounds like a great way to replicate the acrobatic style of the classic cinematic swashbucklers, personally.

[PhantasyPen]

I think this sounds fun, but I also feel like It would be too easy to cheese

[Kane0]

So does a warlock get two patrons or two pact boons?

[JNAProductions]

Gestalt's been a popular variant practically since it was introduced, but I could see how it might be much more of a burden on the DM in 5e, where player capabilities are kept on such a tight leash compared to 3.P. So here's an idea to scratch that itch a bit while still avoiding the difficult questions of gestalt (EG how do Extra Attacks/ASIs work?).

Simply put, the first time a player would be allowed to choose a class archetype, they instead choose two, gaining all the features and benefits of both at the indicated levels. This doesn't apply to any class but the first to reach that point (so taking 2 levels of Fighter first wouldn't preclude picking two Paladin oaths later, but Fighter 3 would).

So, thoughts? Critiques? Ideas for fun combinations? I think a Thief/Swashbuckler Rogue sounds like a great way to replicate the acrobatic style of the classic cinematic swashbucklers, personally.

It varies power too much. Ranger, for instance, gains a TON of power from their Subclass. Rogue... Not so much.

[Dr_Dinosaur]

It varies power too much. Ranger, for instance, gains a TON of power from their Subclass. Rogue... Not so much.

Gestalt’s the same thing, only moreso, isn’t it?


So does a warlock get two patrons or two pact boons?

I would say Patrons (first branch in the class), but Boon makes more sense. Up to the DM.

[JNAProductions]

Gestalt’s the same thing, only moreso, isn’t it?

Not really, no. While some gestalt combos are more powerful than others, each class is more or less equal. There are no massive power discrepancies between classes, so a Rogue//Fighter should be pretty much equal to a Rogue//Paladin.

[Kane0]

Doesnt sound like a bad idea, gove it a go and let us know how it turns out!

[JNAProductions]

Doesnt sound like a bad idea, gove it a go and let us know how it turns out!

I'll actually echo this. While it might produce people of varying power, it can still be pretty cool. Just keep an eye on relative player power.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Gestalt’s the same thing, only moreso, isn’t it?
Not at all. The problem is that while BASE classes are balanced around each other, but SUBCLASSES are not. Some classes get a lot from their subclass, like Ranger; others get mostly flavor, like the Rogue.

[nickl_2000]

You keep shooting down Rogue, but can you imagine a mastermind and arcane trickster combined? You would be an incredible character.

That being said there are others that would probably get more. I struggle most with the Cleric who gets more than one domain. It would be hard since the domain is usually based off your character's God.

The key to all of this would be the DM being good at adjusting on the fly. Your encounters would be a lot easier since everyone would be better in combat and more versatile.

[Kane0]

Or you could get one step crazier and do cross-class second subclassing. Like a Paladin with both an oath and a fighter archetype.

[SkipSandwich]

How about the following:

Instead of the normal multiclassing rules, after choosing one class to be thier primary class, the player can also choose one secondary or two tertiary classes.

If you have a secondary class, at every even class level of your promary class you gain the class Features as if you gained a level of your secondary class, with the exception of subclass features or ASI's, which you only gain from your primary class.

Tertiary classes work the same, but at every 4th level of your primary class you gain the class Features of one level for each of your two tertiary classes.