Low level Shepherd seeking advice and a question about storm Herald barbs

[Mikaleus]

Hello everyone.

So started the Abyss campaign and it's been fun and a little brutal in some parts (self inflicted ) and I'm finding that a lot of the spells may hinder my allies.Namely Spike growth and entangle.

At this level (3) am I better to just concentrate on moonbeam and barkskin, throw out healing words and use my Totem for when things get dicey? Goodberry has been good too.

My fellow adventurers include a monk, Hexblade, Warlock and Cleric. Most of the group likes to rush in, and I'd rather adapt to help them than hinder their fun - unless the situation really calls for it.

At four I don't know whether to grab resilient con or +2 wisdom to max it to 20.

Also are storm Heralds really that bad?
I see/hear a lot of discussion that's it fairly weak. I'm not exactly sure why as I'm still new to the game and currently only playing a Druid and Paladin.

Thanks :)

[OldTrees1]

The idea behind spike growth and entangle is to target areas the enemies are/will be but that your allies are not/will not be.

Since your allies like to rush in, consider casting entangle at the rear of the enemy force. That way several of the enemies are restrained but your allies can still reach them without treading on any entangling ground. End result:

Your allies have advantage on attacks
Your enemies have disadvantage on Dex saves
Your enemies have disadvantage on attacks
Your enemies cannot move

[hymer]

I'm finding that a lot of the spells may hinder my allies.Namely Spike growth and entangle.
Remind your friends to leap as they enter difficult terrain, and whenever they can while traversing it. That should reduce the irritation. Other than that, aiming your Entangle is a learning process. I wouldn't give up on it too soon, as it's a really good spell.


At this level (3) am I better to just concentrate on moonbeam and barkskin, throw out healing words and use my Totem for when things get dicey? Goodberry has been good too.
Moonbeam is an excellent spell when used well. It really shines (pardon) when you can put it down and leave it there, and it keeps damaging enemies. If you have to move it every round, because enemies move out of the AoE or die off, then it doesn't live up to its full potential.
Barkskin for caster form sounds dire. What sort of defensive equipment and dexterity do you have?
Goodberry is great, no doubt there.
In what sort of situation are you using Healing Word? Depending on your table's view of yo-yo healing, or meatball healing, you may want to reserve it for when people are down. The initiative order also plays a big role. If your friend can make it through the fight to get some goodberries instead, that will be a more efficient healing use of your spell slot.
As for your totems, ideally you will know in the first round when things are going to get dicey. The earlier you use them in a fight, the better. Also, if you can, try to keep a mind to your resting rhythm. It will affect when you can afford to use your totems. If you're looking at an easy fight, but you know you will be resting just after, you may as well use your totem, e.g.


My fellow adventurers include a monk, Hexblade, Warlock and Cleric. Most of the group likes to rush in, and I'd rather adapt to help them than hinder their fun - unless the situation really calls for it.
Well, you're all new to the game, I'm guessing. It may be that you will want to elevate your tactical sophistication, or the sameness may get you down eventually. Or the difficulty of the fights might.


At four I don't know whether to grab resilient con or +2 wisdom to max it to 20.
What's your current Con?
At any rate, both are good options, as is Warcaster.

[Mikaleus]

I'm a hill dwarf.
Rolled for stats and after racials have

St 11 Dex 16 con 19 int 12 Wis 18 ch 11.

Equipment so far all I have is a wooden shield and a recently acquired flaming scimitar (woot).

[hymer]

I'm a hill dwarf.
Rolled for stats and after racials have

St 11 Dex 16 con 19 int 12 Wis 18 ch 11.

Equipment so far all I have is a wooden shield and a recently acquired flaming scimitar (woot).

Nice stats! I'd definitely pick a feat now, and I'd go with Warcaster (but Resilient is next at lvl 8).
As for Barkskin, you already have AC 15 (+2 shield, +3 dex). The spell only raises that by 1, so it doesn't seem worth it. And since you're not a moon druid, protecting your wild shapes (if you should do some fighting in one of those) seems less important, and not worth your highest slot.

[Talamare]

"Help" less and take it easy
If when you're trying to "help" you end up being a hassle to the team, then you used a lot of effort for nothing. (or even worse than nothing)

Be strategic with your spells, don't just use them because you have them.

Also, Wait until when you get Summons. Summons are insane in this game, and Shepherd brings them beyond 11.


Oh, and remember. You can take "Help" as an action to give an ally advantage. Surprisingly strong at low levels.

[hymer]

Oh, and remember. You can take "Help" as an action to give an ally advantage. Surprisingly strong at low levels.

But he's got a flaming scimitar! :smallsmile: Now is the perfect time to get the most use out of that.

[Mikaleus]

Nice stats! I'd definitely pick a feat now, and I'd go with Warcaster (but Resilient is next at lvl 8).
As for Barkskin, you already have AC 15 (+2 shield, +3 dex). The spell only raises that by 1, so it doesn't seem worth it. And since you're not a moon druid, protecting your wild shapes (if you should do some fighting in one of those) seems less important, and not worth your highest slot.

Thanks for the advice. Wasn't sure if max wisdom was a priority and hadn't fully appreciated the worth of war caster.

[Mikaleus]

"Help" less and take it easy
If when you're trying to "help" you end up being a hassle to the team, then you used a lot of effort for nothing. (or even worse than nothing)

Be strategic with your spells, don't just use them because you have them.

Also, Wait until when you get Summons. Summons are insane in this game, and Shepherd brings them beyond 11.


Oh, and remember. You can take "Help" as an action to give an ally advantage. Surprisingly strong at low levels.

Thanks I totally forgot about Help as an action option.

[Strangways]

Thanks for the advice. Wasn't sure if max wisdom was a priority and hadn't fully appreciated the worth of war caster.

I would max Wisdom. Your CON, at 19, is already far, far higher than it normally would be under a point buy (as opposed to rolled stats) system at your level. In other words, you’ve already got far more CON than is really necessary at your level, so it would be preferable, IMO, to max your WIS and thereby increase the effectiveness of your healing and the difficulty of your saving throw attacks.

Also, aren’t you wearing studded leather armor yet? It’s not that expensive and should be readily available. With studded leather, a DEX of 16 and a shield you’ve have an AC of 17, which means Barkskin would have no effect on you at all.

Spike Growth and Entangle are two of the Druid’s very powerful battlefield control spells. But if you’re not first in initiative and your allies are fond of charging into combat immediately, you have to be careful about using them. Depending on the combat, you may end up not using them at all, or carefully selecting the area of effect to hit your enemies but not your allies, and the latter takes a bit of practice. Don’t forget a third battlefield control spell, Faerie Fire. Giving advantage on attack rolls to anyone affected by FF is extremely strong, and can end combats quickly. As a Druid you’ve got the best battlefield control spells in the game (only the Wizard competes for that title) so as you level up and get more experience, you’ll find that you’re really, really effective at it.

[SharkForce]

just to be clear, entangle only restrains enemies in the initial use. afterwards, it is still difficult terrain, but as long as your allies are not in the initial burst, all it will do is slow them down, and it won't even do that very much if the area doesn't go much in front of them. beyond that initial restrain effect, entangle should cause just as many problems for your enemies as it does for your allies, so unless there are archers on the far side of where the entangle would go, i wouldn't worry too much about it (and if there are, try and land it on the archers instead, they'll have a hard time with the strength save most likely, and the strength checks to break free, and they would have to give up their action to even try to break out).

later on, you should be able to use speak with plants to remove the difficult terrain effect if you want, as a free action for as long as the spell is active. although that does cost a level 3 slot, and those are pretty valuable to you for other reasons.

depending on your DM, speak with plants may also be able to do something about the spike growth effect.

in any event, you can always place the spells to work against your enemies, deal with the enemies, and then if for some reason it is getting in the party's way... you can always just stop concentrating on it and it goes away, you know.

[Strangways]

You should also keep in mind that Faerie Fire requires a DEX save, Entangle requires a STR save, and Spike Growth has no save, so you want to use the right spell on the right targets. There's very little point on using Spike Growth against a bunch of archers firing at you from a distance. They weren't going to want to get close to you anyway. Use it to make things difficult for melee types who start out at a distance and try to get close to you. Save the Faerie Fire for the bulky, beefy types who are likely to have low DEX saves (anyone in plate armor, for example) and use Entangle on those scrawny casters and others who are likely to have lousy STR saves.

Part of the key to being a successful full caster with a wide range of spells is being able to target the weak points of your opponents.

[Mikaleus]

I would max Wisdom. Your CON, at 19, is already far, far higher than it normally would be under a point buy (as opposed to rolled stats) system at your level. In other words, you’ve already got far more CON than is really necessary at your level, so it would be preferable, IMO, to max your WIS and thereby increase the effectiveness of your healing and the difficulty of your saving throw attacks.

Also, aren’t you wearing studded leather armor yet? It’s not that expensive and should be readily available. With studded leather, a DEX of 16 and a shield you’ve have an AC of 17, which means Barkskin would have no effect on you at all.

Spike Growth and Entangle are two of the Druid’s very powerful battlefield control spells. But if you’re not first in initiative and your allies are fond of charging into combat immediately, you have to be careful about using them. Depending on the combat, you may end up not using them at all, or carefully selecting the area of effect to hit your enemies but not your allies, and the latter takes a bit of practice. Don’t forget a third battlefield control spell, Faerie Fire. Giving advantage on attack rolls to anyone affected by FF is extremely strong, and can end combats quickly. As a Druid you’ve got the best battlefield control spells in the game (only the Wizard competes for that title) so as you level up and get more experience, you’ll find that you’re really, really effective at it.

Haven't found a vendor yet. We found an NPC who was able to provide some basic items. There was a metal chain mail (our Cleric was happy with that) but no leather armor at the moment.

We're about to get into a neutral city where I'm hoping to be able to get some armor negating the need for barkskin for the time being.

Also started the game in chains bereft of our gear (dm was happy to allow my Druid to have hidden my focus in my beard :D )

I've since found it's a modified version of Out of the Abyss to fit in with the story the DM wants to provide.


Thanks to everyone providing answers. Been some great advice

[History_buff]

Moonbeam is a great spell that will absolutely trivialize any encounter against werebeasts and shapechangers.

I still remember my first 5e campaign where my Druid decimated werewolves attacking a village with this spell. Everyone was holed up in the mill and the werewolves kept getting knocked out of were form by the spell.