[3.5] Healing On A Beguiler?

[Thurbane]

Hey all,

So I'm looking for some ways to get some healing abilities into a straight classed Beguiler.

UMDing wands and Arcane Disciple are obvious, but what other options are there?

Are there any full-casting PrCs that would add healing spells or other healing ability to a Beguiler?

Just a thought exercise at the moment. Likely to be for an NPC.

Cheers - T

[PhantasyPen]

I mean, there's that Prstige class which adds all cleric spells to your class' spell list.

[Goaty14]

Hey all,

So I'm looking for some ways to get some healing abilities into a straight classed Beguiler.

UMDing wands and Arcane Disciple are obvious, but what other options are there?

Are there any full-casting PrCs that would add healing spells or other healing ability to a Beguiler?

Just a thought exercise at the moment. Likely to be for an NPC.

Cheers - T

Rainbow servant adds all cleric spells to their spell list, and as a beguiler, you can then spontaneously cast cleric spells.

EDIT: Swordsage'd

[DrMotives]

So a Prestige Bard, as written, gives access to no new spells from the class list. However, the sidebar "unique spells" suggest that they be able to access bard-exclusive spells. While the cure line is hardly unique to bards in general, it is unique to bards compared to other arcane casters. So perhaps a beguiler going into Prestige Bard, at some tables, would be able to cast the arcane versions of the cure line. Beguiler 6 / Prestige Bard 14 still gets 9ths as well, although a 7/13 mix gets an extra advanced learning for no real trade off.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Goaty14
Rainbow servant adds all cleric spells to their spell list, and as a beguiler, you can then spontaneously cast cleric spells.

If I’m reading it correctly, this doesn’t come online until the tenth level of Rainbow Servant, which is pretty late in the game—about sixteenth level for a Beguiler/Rainbow Servant.

Are there any ways to do what the OP is asking at an earlier level?

[Telonius]

Prestige Bard could possibly grant this, depending on how you read "unique." (I've seen two separate readings: "Unique," meaning spells that are on the Bard list and not on the list of the class you use to enter it; and "unique" meaning spells that appear only on the Bard list and nowhere else). Even if it's the less favorable reading, you'd gain about 78 spells (per this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=16684876&postcount=4) nice resource).

[Thurbane]

I'd forgotten about Rainbow Servant.

It's a solid option, possibly the best, but it's also very cheesy, and as noted, comes on-line at high levels. Also, in our games, we play RS as 6/10 casting progression, not 10/10.

[A.A.King]

Recaster is not a fullcasting prestige class (it loses you one caster level) but on the upside the entry is free, outside of the skill requirement obviously, for a Beguiler 10. Beguiler 11/Recaster 4 gains 2 spells known of ANY list (even divine ones). One of Level 5 and one of Level 6. Meaning you can pick up the great Heal spell (made better with the ability of casting it spontaneously) and a 5th level or lower spel (maybe the 4th Level Restoration?). It's very late, but it's the best one I can come up with

Healing Abilities are usually things they keep away from Arcane Prestige classes.
Combat Medic gives you the ability to sponanously cast Heal and without losing caster levels, but you'd have to use Arcane Disciple to qualify first (to get Cure Light Wounds)
The only other prestige class I can think of that gives Arcane Casters acces to healing spells is Silver Pyromancer but that one explicity doesn't work with casters like the warmage/beguiler (as well not being a full caster and requiring a cleric dip)
((and there is of course the Wyrm Wizard, which does the same thing as the recaster but loses you more caster levels and has a feat tax for beguilers).

[Nifft]

The Extra Spell feat might allow you to learn a spell from any list, depending on how your DM reads it.

[DEMON]

Prestige Bard might do the trick, depending how you/your DP read the unique spells clause.

[daremetoidareyo]

If you have a seventh level spell slot, you can make a dragonpact with a gold dragon for lesser restoration and mass cure light wounds, which might be fudgeable to get into combat medic. The only problem is that dragonpacts are only textually available to sorcerers, although, the dragontouched feat might be fudged to allow beguilers in.

Another option is the 5th level sorcerer spell, dragonblood spell pact from dragon magic. Buy a scroll and use UMD it to cast it a few times and swap spells with bards or clerics. Then go combat medic 5 to get heal. That puts your first opportunity for cure spells at whatever level you can use UMD on the scroll, if you take the dragontouched feat, be dragonblood, or be a dragonborn.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by A.A.King
Recaster is not a fullcasting prestige class (it loses you one caster level) but on the upside the entry is free….

Recaster requires you to be a changeling, which could be an issue depending on the circumstances.


Originally Posted by A.A.King
Combat Medic gives you the ability to sponanously cast Heal and without losing caster levels, but you'd have to use Arcane Disciple to qualify first (to get Cure Light Wounds)….

This gets you Heal after five levels of Combat Medic, but you’re not doing much healing before that. Arcane Disciple specifies that you can only cast one domain spell per spell level per day, so the healing utility is pretty limited. Not useless, but not spectacular either.

[Thurbane]

Snowsong (Frostburn) is a Bard 6 spell: it's Enchantment, and gives Fast Healing, but because it's Bard, a Beguiler can't pick it up with Advanced Learning...

[Zaq]

I’m up past my bedtime and don’t have my books available, so there’s likely to be one or more major issues with this idea, but maybe you could use one of those janky feats that blurs the line between arcane and divine and then get into Skypledged somehow?

[Crake]

Does picking up a domain with planar binding, and calling healbots count?

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

If you gain healing spells (Arcane Disciple), you can use the Touch of Healing reserve feat in CC.

The Animal domain gets Summon Nature's Ally IV which can summon a Unicorn. The Spontaneous Summoner and Spontaneous Healer feats can allow you to cast Arcane Disciple domain spells more often.

You can take Magic of the Land in RotW and add healing to your other spells.

Take Leadership and get a Cleric cohort.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Bloodline feats grant one spell known per spell level, and there are dozens of 'em. I'd be surprised if there wasn't at least one that included a cure spell.

[Inevitability]

Bloodline feats grant one spell known per spell level, and there are dozens of 'em. I'd be surprised if there wasn't at least one that included a cure spell.

Celestial Bloodline does not grant healing, unless you count summoning Leonals and such with Summon Monster IX, but Necromantic Bloodline grants Vampiric Touch, which can be used to recover HP. I couldn't find any that gave 'true' healing spells, though.

[Grim Reader]

Fiend-blooded lets you cherrypick necromancy spells of any list. Are there any necromantic healing spells out there?

[Inevitability]

Fiend-blooded lets you cherrypick necromancy spells of any list. Are there any necromantic healing spells out there?

Vampiric Touch comes to mind.

[DrMotives]

Fiend-blooded lets you cherrypick necromancy spells of any list. Are there any necromantic healing spells out there?

Looking at fiend-blooded in the dragon compendium it doesn't. What source has a cherry pick list for the bloodline?

[Inevitability]

Looking at fiend-blooded in the dragon compendium it doesn't. What source has a cherry pick list for the bloodline?

I believe Grim Reader is referring to the Fiend-Blooded prestige class from Heroes of Horror, which gains the following ability:


Fiendish Sorcery: You gain insight into the power of your fiendish heritage, and this insight strengthens your spellcasting prowess. At 2nd level, and again at 4th, 6th, 8th, and 10th level, add one additional spell to your spells known list. Each new spell must be of a level that you can cast but can be any spell having the fire descriptor or any spell from the schools of enchantment, illusion, or necromancy. Thus, you could add fireball (a fire spell) or speak with dead (a necromancy spell) to your 3rd-level spells known (even though you are an arcane caster and speak with dead is normally a divine spell), but not lightning bolt (which neither carries the fire descriptor nor belongs to one of the three specified schools).

[radthemad4]

If you want healing spells before you get 10 levels in Rainbow Servant, you can use the substitute domain trick. Worship any deity that grants domains with healing spells on them, e.g. Healing (http://ftm3.altervista.org/ASMoNM/domains.html#Healing), Renewal (http://ftm3.altervista.org/ASMoNM/domains.html#Renewal). Take any prc that grants a domain (e.g. Rainbow Servant, Divine Oracle). UMD Substitute Domain (Complete Champion, p. 128) from a wand or something to swap out the Good Domain for one day per level. You have the spells from your chosen domain on your spell list while the spell is in effect.

[Anthrowhale]

Take Channel Charge from Lost Empires of Faerun and pick up a wand or staff with 1 charge for whatever spell you want to cast. Maximize Use Magic Device and have fun. This works for all spells 1 level below the maximum you can cast.

[Thurbane]

My main issue with Arcane Disciple is that you need Wis to use the spells, and Wis is usually a (semi-) dump stat for beguilers.


Does picking up a domain with planar binding, and calling healbots count?

It's definitely an option.


If you gain healing spells (Arcane Disciple), you can use the Touch of Healing reserve feat in CC.

The Animal domain gets Summon Nature's Ally IV which can summon a Unicorn. The Spontaneous Summoner and Spontaneous Healer feats can allow you to cast Arcane Disciple domain spells more often.

You can take Magic of the Land in RotW and add healing to your other spells.

Take Leadership and get a Cleric cohort.

Those all sound decent (although I would rather not rely on a cohort).


Fiend-blooded lets you cherrypick necromancy spells of any list. Are there any necromantic healing spells out there?

None that I know of, but it's worth looking into.


If you want healing spells before you get 10 levels in Rainbow Servant, you can use the substitute domain trick. Worship any deity that grants domains with healing spells on them, e.g. Healing (http://ftm3.altervista.org/ASMoNM/domains.html#Healing), Renewal (http://ftm3.altervista.org/ASMoNM/domains.html#Renewal). Take any prc that grants a domain (e.g. Rainbow Servant, Divine Oracle). UMD Substitute Domain (Complete Champion, p. 128) from a wand or something to swap out the Good Domain for one day per level. You have the spells from your chosen domain on your spell list while the spell is in effect.

That's very clever. I like it.


Take Channel Charge from Lost Empires of Faerun and pick up a wand or staff with 1 charge for whatever spell you want to cast. Maximize Use Magic Device and have fun. This works for all spells 1 level below the maximum you can cast.

That's another solid option. Thank you.

[Thurbane]

Fiend-blooded lets you cherrypick necromancy spells of any list. Are there any necromantic healing spells out there?

OK, I found a couple, but they each have some drawbacks:


Blood of the Martyr (BoED): Heal creatures, but you take that amount as damage.
Healing Touch (SC): Heal creatures, but you take half the amount as damage.
Weighted in the Balance (SC): Acts as a Heal spell, but only for true neutral living creatures. Harms everybody else.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Weighted in the Balance (SC): Acts as a Heal sepll spell, but only for true neutral living creatures. Harms everybody else.
So long as you're Neutral, this one seems like a really good deal. It's both offensive and healy!

You could always become undead or take Tomb-Tainted Soul and a one-level dip into dread necromancer.

[Thurbane]

Is there any way for a Beguiler to get turn attempts without losing caster levels? There's feats that allows you to convert turn attempts to healing (Sacred Healing, Sacred Purification). I've checked the list, but can't find one that involves losing no caster levels:


Poison UseTurn/rebuke Undead

grants turn/rebuke undead - anything that grants turning generally stacks
Cleric 1
Paladin 4
Blackguard 3, ecl, command or rebuke only
Sacred Exorcist 1, ecl 8, Complete Divine, turn only
Ur-priest 2, ecl 7, Complete Divine, rebuke only
Divine Mind 4, Complete Divine, class variant (here (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a))
Dread Necromancer 1, base class, Heroes of Horror, rebuke only
Death Delver 1, ecl 6, Heroes of Horror, rebuke only
Chameleon 3, ecl 8, Races of Destiny, see text
Master of Radiance 1, ecl 6, Libris Mortin, turn only - unclear whether you gain turning or if it only stacks
Tenebrous, vestige, ecl 7, Tome of Magic, unlimited use but see text
Knight of the Raven 3, ecl 7, Expedition to Castle Ravenloft
Apostle of Peace 1, ecl 8, Book of Exalted Deeds
Soldier of Light 1, ecl 6, Deities and Demigods
Deadgrim 1, ecl 6, Magic of Eberron - unclear whethero you gain turning or if it only stacks

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Is there any way for a Beguiler to get turn attempts without losing caster levels? There's feats that allows you to convert turn attempts to healing (Sacred Healing, Sacred Purification). I've checked the list, but can't find one that involves losing no caster levels:



Sacred Exorcist 1 does it, if you can get Dismissal (Balance domain, UMD a custom Runestaff).

[A.A.King]

Is there any way for a Beguiler to get turn attempts without losing caster levels? There's feats that allows you to convert turn attempts to healing (Sacred Healing, Sacred Purification). I've checked the list, but can't find one that involves losing no caster levels:


"Necromantic Bloodline" + "Kin Mastery" from the Dragon Compendium gives you Turn/Rebuke Undead. Keep in mind though that taking Necromantic bloodline specifically prohibits you from learning or casting spells from the Conjuration (healing) subschool so you can't combine it with anything else that gives you acces to healing spells (other than UMD and wands I guess). It's also a 1/day ability but once you have a single use of Turn Undead you can use a Nightstick to gain 4 extra uses.

[ayvango]

Are there any ways to do what the OP is asking at an earlier level?
You could take rainbow servant starting from the second character level. Just spend two feats (use flaws if needed) - precocious apprentice and sanctified spell. Now you are capable of casting 3rd level spells and therefore qualify for the Rainbow Servant prestige class

[Goaty14]

You could take rainbow servant starting from the second character level. Just spend two feats (use flaws if needed) - precocious apprentice and sanctified spell. Now you are capable of casting 3rd level spells and therefore qualify for the Rainbow Servant prestige class

Sanctum spell, actually.

[Inevitability]

Is there any way for a Beguiler to get turn attempts without losing caster levels? There's feats that allows you to convert turn attempts to healing (Sacred Healing, Sacred Purification). I've checked the list, but can't find one that involves losing no caster levels.

Dragon 305 has the God-Touched and Divine Channeler feats. Only prerequisite is worshipping a deity.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Inevitability
Dragon 305 has the God-Touched and Divine Channeler feats. Only prerequisite is worshipping a deity.

Divine Channeler is once per day, at a cleric level of half your character level, so might not be very high-wattage for healing.

God-Touched doesn’t give turn attempts, only a +1 luck bonus to a single roll once per day.

[daremetoidareyo]

1 level spellthief dip + godsblood spelltheft (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/frcc/20070606) + master spellthief will allow you to steal your own beguiler spells and turn them into spells from a list of domains.

[Grim Reader]

I am away from books, but I believe the general rules for spontaneous spell casters learning off-list spells states that they have to give up a spells known pick to learn it, but thereafter are not restricted by 1/day restrictions ? I am away from books (complete divine) but it was something like that?

Not sure how that would interact with the beguilers advanced learning, which restricts spells known to enchantment and illusion, but there is an argument to be made, I think, that if you already had Arcane Disciple and drop an advanced learning pick on it, you should be able to treat it like any other spell on your list.

[DrMotives]

I am away from books, but I believe the general rules for spontaneous spell casters learning off-list spells states that they have to give up a spells known pick to learn it, but thereafter are not restricted by 1/day restrictions ? I am away from books (complete divine) but it was something like that?

Not sure how that would interact with the beguilers advanced learning, which restricts spells known to enchantment and illusion, but there is an argument to be made, I think, that if you already had Arcane Disciple and drop an advanced learning pick on it, you should be able to treat it like any other spell on your list.

I'm sure exactly what issue, but there is a warmage ACF where you trade in an advanced learning to instead add any wiz/sor spell regardless of school. The spell has to be one spell level lower your highest though, so a normal advanced learning choice lets you nab more powerful spells. I freely adapt that ACF for beguilers and dread necromancers. You suggestion is along the same idea.

[Thurbane]

The Channel Charge feat sounds like the best option for the build I had in mind. Possibly a dip into Sacred Exorcist if I can swing the reqs.

Depending on the stat array, I might also take Arcane Disciple/Touch of Healing.