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The Giant
2006-06-07, 06:50 AM
New comic is up.

Since there was no comic Monday, there will definitely be one Fridayish this week, so there will still be two.

aegron
2006-06-07, 06:51 AM
It's here! Finally!! :)

And a fine one at that :D

Edit to say: first!!

Rei_Jin
2006-06-07, 06:52 AM
Ah, internal consistency. I've done that to my players before.

"what happened to our horses?"

"did you remember to tie them up at any point, feed them, brush them down, or in general do anything but ride them?"

"no, but I don't see what this has to do with anything..."

*forehead slap*

koumdros
2006-06-07, 06:53 AM
ohohohoh
adventure begins!

vanishing horses :)

and kudos to the estra smart vamishing act:

"what do you mean i am not wearing my armor, that i ditched yesterday in order to get out of the river"

"diud you tell me that your character would TRY to recover it? "
"no uhm but i would never...."

and

Go elan!

Guancyto
2006-06-07, 06:54 AM
A retcon joke? Marvelous!

It's setup rather than progression but I'll take what plot I can get!

semcapital
2006-06-07, 06:54 AM
First page, Uhu!!!
And the world didn't end! :D

Hahaha, great comic! I'm still laughing my "wrr" off.

jellyroll713
2006-06-07, 06:54 AM
FIRST PAGE! Great comic giant!

KayJay
2006-06-07, 06:54 AM
Yay it's up, been waiting for this :)
Edit: Ok read the comic now :) Have to say I didn't see the punchline coming up... trust Elan to show intelligence at the most inopportune moment :)

houseofcommons
2006-06-07, 06:56 AM
Great comic, Rich. Hope things are well for you! The wait is definately worth it.

Edit: First page! Woot! A first for me.

Crusher
2006-06-07, 06:56 AM
Wow, first page.

Gary_Howard
2006-06-07, 06:57 AM
NEW COMIC INCOMING!

How many times has this happened to our group? The druid has lost her horse, had to leave it behind, or had it die so many times that she refuses to get another on the grounds that it would be cruelty.

And we're only, like.. level 5.

kaairn
2006-06-07, 06:57 AM
nice one giant :D got to love retconn jokes. the amount of times I've had to do similar things :D

*my first "first page" 'cheers'*

Gerrtt
2006-06-07, 06:57 AM
Nice one.

Illirion
2006-06-07, 06:58 AM
Hahaha,
That's why I like the adventuring comics!
I can't even begin to count how many times that happened during one of our campaigns ;D .

Oh I almost forgot:

First page, whooptiedoo! (my first time!)

(Edited for typos)

dragonfly83h
2006-06-07, 06:59 AM
Great comic, Giant. You haven't lost your touch ;)

Heh, looks like the DM realised that they weren't supposed to have those horses, and corrected the mistake.

[edit] Yehaa! First time I ever made first page! :D

terrainmonkey
2006-06-07, 06:59 AM
excellent! i've had this happen too many times in my own games so it's a cute strip. great stuff. keep it up

Darn, thought i was going to be on the first page today, oh well. i'll settle for 1st of second. WOOT!

TheJet31619
2006-06-07, 07:00 AM
Awesome comic yet again Giant. The horses/dog going POP! was awesome.

Ronald_saveloy
2006-06-07, 07:01 AM
There are questions, that should never be asked!

Nikolai_II
2006-06-07, 07:02 AM
Heh - Roy had the right idea when he tried to ignore Elan ;)

Kanashimi
2006-06-07, 07:02 AM
So funny! I think everyone who has gamed knows that feeling. Wait, we're not supposed to have these, aw crap they would have been really useful.

Great job!

armatil
2006-06-07, 07:04 AM
call it internal consistency, reality backflow, or whatever... eveybody's been there, and to see it depicted in oots is just hilarious ;D

it's funny because it is true...

Spit_Dog
2006-06-07, 07:04 AM
My dwarf cleverly forgot a pack horse with all his gold on it once. I was so distraught that the DM threw some role-playing XP my way....

Denizen_Smith
2006-06-07, 07:05 AM
Had to sack a DM once for doing that to our party

Us: "we tie our horses up for the night"

DM: "what horses? you didn't say you were riding your horses when you left the citadel three days ago. They're still in the stables"

Us: ::)


EDIT: First and most likely last time my post will be as high as page 2. I believe "WOOT!" is the accepted expression

ElCapitanStormcrow
2006-06-07, 07:06 AM
weee second page.

yay that was a very cool joke in the end :D

/me dances to the room, laughing and full of hurt as he stabs on something stabby.

Ronald_saveloy
2006-06-07, 07:07 AM
ohohohoh
adventure begins!

vanishing horses :)

and kudos to the estra smart vamishing act:

"what do you mean i am not wearing my armor, that i ditched yesterday in order to get out of the river"

"diud you tell me that your character would TRY to recover it? "
"no uhm but i would never...."

Yeah, I know this! Last weekend, our party crossed the whole realm to get the the starting point of the new adventure and we completely cut out the part of careing for your mount:
"You leave the city of Trallop, capital of the duchy of willows. After two weeks of travel, you reach the port-town of Perricum."

Heck, we even cut out the complete voyage! :o

tee_kay_one
2006-06-07, 07:07 AM
yeah, the riding dachshund is back! i love it. oh, wait... it's gone again... ;D


EDIT: is dachshund a word at all? i mean, dackel, you know, the ugly longish dogs... ah, never mind

Kruul
2006-06-07, 07:10 AM
Here I aaaaaaaaaam.... on the road again........ here I gooooooo... Turn the paaaaaaaaaaage!

dan4ster
2006-06-07, 07:11 AM
Huzzah! The comic returns! Great comic!

Tekar
2006-06-07, 07:11 AM
Yay, been a long time since there was another wink to real life p&p mistakes that everybody makes. They were one of the reasons I liked OotS back in the days. (like #18 and #34)

Gamaliel_the_Bard
2006-06-07, 07:12 AM
Absolutely Hi - larious!!!!!

Being the guy who keeps notes during the D&D adventures and can reference the details three or four nights later...ELAN Rules with the memory...and the unfortunate side effect of such detail recall.

ROFLMAO!

Blaznak
2006-06-07, 07:15 AM
Cheers for the wiener dog horse! Boos as it disappears!

Ah, the zany madcap misadventures begins again...

Aeek
2006-06-07, 07:18 AM
It's all Roy's fault, Elan would have asked something different had he got in first but all the good questions had gone.

Tokeloshe
2006-06-07, 07:24 AM
That is precisely why I view Elan as being a perfect example of a high intelligence, low wisdom character.

Castamir
2006-06-07, 07:33 AM
And Durkon is a lucky bastard (http://giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=251).

Aiani
2006-06-07, 07:34 AM
That was pretty funny stuff. This is why I love Elan though cause you can count on him to be smart in a stupid kind of way if that makes any sense at all.

carais
2006-06-07, 07:36 AM
Questions like these generally lead to something like 'Hush! Don't. Ask. That' when suggested in our group. A good thing we don't take ourselves too serious.

And so close a relative of the mystically (dis)appearing pet...

rcuhljr
2006-06-07, 07:39 AM
Man I hate the guy who does that. "You never said you picked up your priceless family heirloom after setting it down"

tothecornfield
2006-06-07, 07:42 AM
I love how Roy realizes that the challenges will be scaled to the level and size of the party.

Bakta
2006-06-07, 07:43 AM
The most important questions is : Are both Belkar and Roy kings in their own countries?.

Before one throw a dead horse (real or not) at me, consider the following :

Both Belkar and Roy knows the meaning of "answer me these question three", which is the bridge of death thingy for those of you not in the know.

That imply in turn they both know the airspeed velocity of and unleaden swallow.

And since you have to know this when you're a king you'know...


One has to wonder.

Adventurer
2006-06-07, 07:51 AM
ROFL! We've had lots of mistakes like that in my D&D sessions, but none of them looked that funny :D

Lundegaard
2006-06-07, 07:51 AM
LOL, we all know this don't we???

Similar things have happened so often in our group, that we have made our own inventory list. It's split into four parts;
1) what we are carrying on person inside a town
2) What we are carrying on person when dismounted
3) --- || --- when dismounted and in battle
4) --- || --- when mounted

Ofcourse that means that we will have to write the 'Singing and dancing broadsword +5' 4 different places, but it saves a LOT of playtime as we only have to tell the DM when we do it differently from standard!!!


WOOT: first page!!!
EDIT: No I don't understand the hype about being on first page, especially when people can ad nothing but 'haven't read the comic yet' or 'great comic'. But since it seems to be so great to yell "woot first page", I'm not the one to abandon such fine traditions - I'll gladly yell it even at page 17! In my country there's an old proverb saying something like "follow tradition, or leave"

The Vorpal Tribble
2006-06-07, 07:56 AM
*guffaws*

Ok, this made up for even Haley's last comic.


(And btw, will you guys STOP with the 'first page, I'm the king!' business. Its really annoying, especially if you are doing it on the third page... ) ::)

warmachine
2006-06-07, 07:56 AM
Wouldn't the GM just tell the players to lose the cost of the horses? Haley would be upset that some of her money has simply disappeared.

DeathQuaker
2006-06-07, 07:57 AM
I laughed out loud. As with many others, this one made me think a lot of my own gaming sessions.

Of course, I would expect one of the characters' players to say, "Can't we just _say_ we got new horses before we left Azure City?" or "Surely Lord Shojo would have provided us with mounts." And there would be another player who would go, "No! No we screwed up, we'll just have to suck it up." And then Durkon's player would say (while everyone else is beating the previous player senseless), "Yeah, but I have MY pony still, so that's not fair to everyone else...."

Arian
2006-06-07, 07:58 AM
is dachshund a word at all?

It is a word, and what's more, it's exactly right. That's what they're called. :)

KuH
2006-06-07, 07:58 AM
It's absolutely astounding to me that within 10 minutes of the comic going up the first page of comments has filled up, and within another 10 minutes the second page has filled!!

Fun comic. I've been spoiled by all these multi-joke panels ... having a single joke one almost feels like a let-down.

Eldhrin
2006-06-07, 08:07 AM
;D ;D ;D

Fantastic! Much applause for The Giant.

Ronald_saveloy
2006-06-07, 08:20 AM
Wouldn't the GM just tell the players to lose the cost of the horses? Haley would be upset that some of her money has simply disappeared.

Last time this happened, it broke Haley's mind. Since then she's talking gibberish.

http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=245

a1057soul
2006-06-07, 08:24 AM
genius giant! pure gaming genius.

:-)
Dan

Nyax
2006-06-07, 08:25 AM
lol I laughed so much, this one was good, and a change from the less funny part lately (although they were very good too, i mean it). Thank you Giant for making me laugh out loud at work and everyone think i'm crazy ::).

But, now that the horses and the riding sausage dog are gone because of a paradox, how are travel on the "Road to adventure"?

edit:just noticed the poney actually didnt disappear

TreesOfDeath
2006-06-07, 08:27 AM
Doesn't this make you think of The Gamers? :p

So is Elan high int low wis? I knew he'd have a valid but annoying question

Beelzebub1111
2006-06-07, 08:28 AM
Haha, You almost got away with that one giant. I was about to call you on that about halfway through the comic.

Antina
2006-06-07, 08:31 AM
Sooo GREAT!

How did that idea come to you?

Imagine:
The giant sitting at his desk working hard and nearly finished (thinking about something stupid for elan to say) and there appears his lovely girlfriend looking at the screen.
Then she opens her mouth just to spit out exactly Elans phrase.

Any way - GOOD WORK GIANT!!! ;D

Antina
2006-06-07, 08:33 AM
MESSAGE TO THE GIANT:

Sorry - but you missed Vīs arm in panel 5 (counted backwards from the end of the strip).

Itīs just hanging there in midair and clearly belonging to the next panel below it (where the arm is missing).

Archonic Energy
2006-06-07, 08:34 AM
you have got to love retroactive contiunity

MrSokkie
2006-06-07, 08:38 AM
Great comic, I never saw it coming.

Still, DM's who pull stuff on my group tend not to DM for very long. The players usually start to describe every little thing they're doing (like inhaling and exhaling) and most DM's get the point pretty quickly.

Who cares about details when adventure is waiting?

Still, good joke for a comic ;D

TroyXavier
2006-06-07, 08:47 AM
Who knew...Elan the logical one. ;D

Jacen
2006-06-07, 08:50 AM
Liked the comic and it made me smile widely, but there is something I need to get out of my heart even that it is not directly about comic.


Ah, internal consistency. I've done that to my players before.

"what happened to our horses?"

"did you remember to tie them up at any point, feed them, brush them down, or in general do anything but ride them?"

"no, but I don't see what this has to do with anything..."

*forehead slap*

Sigh, there are too many DM's like that. When playng a character that has handle animals and had the same horse for few years DM says you didn't say you take care of it. That is something you always do. And if you have not even seen a horse IRL how are you supposed to know how to take care of it. In most cases some of the characters does!

Almost like saying that "Of course you sthink - you didn't say that you went to toilet and you have been travelling few months so you must have ****ted on your pants. " Or "You didn't say that you take your backbag with you after camping over night."

Almost liker saying that we camp a few km away from road so (so we can't be seen from road and put up fire). And after that DM says that you are attaced by orcs at night. They saw your fire and camp which was at top of bold hill. How in the hell we are supposed know that we went to hide the most visible place at all continent if it is not told to us. DM may know the place in his mind but players know only what DM says.

But back to comic from rant.

How about being a lawfull good the captor (Miko) should have taken care of their mounts. Either pay someone to take care of them or take them with her. It is just plain evil and cruel to leve them behind without care. Durkon did take his mont from stable so why to leave others behind? Even if Miko put them to walk mounts could have tied to Durkons pony and following behind out of picture. Just like there is no Durkon in newest comic.

WTFWWD
2006-06-07, 08:50 AM
Excellent! I can't wait to see what's in store next.

This comic reminded me of the many times I've been shushed for saying very Elan like things. "We haven't done anything with those horses in like 5 levels. I think they're dead." Cheers!

Swashbuckler
2006-06-07, 08:54 AM
Someone just needs to SMACK Elan ... ;D

Awesome comic!

5tephen
2006-06-07, 08:55 AM
GOLD!

That and Vaarsuvius' here-again-gone-again familir are some of the best running gags in the series.

Rokiyo
2006-06-07, 09:02 AM
Ahh, classic OoTS at its best. Well done Giant.

Samiam303
2006-06-07, 09:06 AM
Gods... This is the OoTS I love. Best strip in a LONG TIME, keep it up! :)

Dark_Stalion
2006-06-07, 09:07 AM
That's a point. We haven't heard from blackwing in a while. What is it... since the trial? Hehe, the trial where blackwing testified against the OotS.

Loved this one. I was sitting here for ages before I had enough controll over my self to be able to click on the posts button.

Sebastian
2006-06-07, 09:08 AM
Had to sack a DM once for doing that to our party

Us: "we tie our horses up for the night"

DM: "what horses? you didn't say you were riding your horses when you left the citadel three days ago. They're still in the stables"

Us: ::)



What? You had even to tell him every time you go the bathroom or else he make your character's bladders explode? :D

Alfryd
2006-06-07, 09:12 AM
I see the Belkster is back on top form.


How about being a lawfull good the captor (Miko) should have taken care of their mounts. Either pay someone to take care of them or take them with her.
Of course, if the stables were actually adjoined to the Inn, they might all have died instantly in the explosion. Oh, those poor hapless quadrapeds. Though Durkon's mount is something of a mystery, then. Perhaps he got lucky? And shouldn't he still have one?
In any case, we have no evidence the mounts *weren't* looked after, possibly by the King of Somewhere at Miko's behest.

dsollen
2006-06-07, 09:17 AM
that sneaky giant had Durkon riding off to the side this entire comic; that way he could have all the mounts in sight disappear even as Durkon kept his.

and nice comic giant. I'm afraid my role playing knowledge is limited to Everquest and what my roommate use to tell me about D&D so I never experianced this, but as always it's still funny even if not from personal experiance

ADRegner
2006-06-07, 09:18 AM
Great comic. One of my top 30 favorites.

After reading the replies here, I now count myself thankfull that the players I DM are smarter then that. They know to tell me they get thier horses, and they know I remember when they ditch them :P

Neopolis
2006-06-07, 09:20 AM
This comic actually made me laugh. That didn't happen in a while. Good punchline. :D

ed
2006-06-07, 09:27 AM
i love that it's elan that points it out. :>

i propose henceforth a statting contest: stat the retcon fairy! :>

ed

mastroyo
2006-06-07, 09:35 AM
:-/

Winged One
2006-06-07, 09:38 AM
So, rather than popping out of existance when you don't need them (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=173), they pop out of existance when you do need them? ;D

TreesOfDeath
2006-06-07, 09:40 AM
Who knew...Elan the logical one. ;D

Elan is quite logical, he just demonstrates an utter lack of common sense

Gary_Howard
2006-06-07, 09:44 AM
They were being taken care of. The problem is that they were left in the stables of the inn that got blown up.

Brother_Hood
2006-06-07, 09:46 AM
Who knew the reality fairy threw such hard body checks?

Funny. :D

Varian7
2006-06-07, 09:46 AM
Loved the Monty Python and the Holy Grail tie-in! Way to go Giant!

Valda, Adlav and Samiam: the Jacked-Up Trinity
2006-06-07, 09:58 AM
Good to see you haven't forgotten your roots after all, Giant. Good stuff. Good stuff. Takes me back.

Me: Back when I was yer age, OoTS was funny every day, and didn't go 70 strips without a bona fide gaming gag ever!

Kid: I think Grampa's crazy...

Oh! Pwned you ya damn ugly kids! No really... I need to lay off the cough syrup for a while... it's making me weird...er... than usual...


that sneaky giant had Durkon riding off to the side this entire comic; that way he could have all the mounts in sight disappear even as Durkon kept his.

I kinda noticed that too. Where the deuce was Durkon the whole time? Everyone but he and Haley had lines, she didn't speak but was at least present.

Durkon did nothing! WTF?!

battleburn
2006-06-07, 10:03 AM
It hasn't got to do anything with Elan's intelligence. Elan's player just was the first to remember.
Or
more likely the first to think of it and be stupid enough to mention it.
If the DM don't remember that there are no horses. Don't say a word.

TroyXavier
2006-06-07, 10:04 AM
Elan is quite logical, he just demonstrates an utter lack of common sense

I know. That's why it irks me when people say he's stupid. He's not, he just has no Wisdom at all.

Schattendrache
2006-06-07, 10:08 AM
Buwahahahahaha!

'nuff said.

DOOM2099
2006-06-07, 10:11 AM
Thank you for the self contained, straight forward strip.

Now back to Cerberus.

tee_kay_one
2006-06-07, 10:19 AM
hey, re-reading the comic i remember a story from a gaming session which a similar event, only the other way around. after an extended dungeon crawl and a longish journey we remembered that we still dragged a captured bandit around. Bound and gagged. Poor bastard.
I played a young zealot-ish paladin, he wanted to hand the bad guy over to the authorities at all cost... but I got distracted by the sidequest... hehehe.

Otterella
2006-06-07, 10:34 AM
I don't understand why people are griping about stickler DM's. Just because *your* DM is a stickler doesn't mean that's what is going on here. If you look back at the strip where they left the inn, they were *clearly* chained up and on foot behind Miko, and forced to leave the horses behind (except for Durkon, of course). It's not a question of simply forgetting to mention that, oh yeah, we really did bring them with us after all. Big difference.

tee_kay_one
2006-06-07, 10:38 AM
I don't understand why people are griping about stickler DM's. Just because *your* DM is a stickler doesn't mean that's what is going on here. If you look back at the strip where they left the inn, they were *clearly* chained up and on foot behind Miko, and forced to leave the horses behind (except for Durkon, of course). It's not a question of simply forgetting to mention that, oh yeah, we really did bring them with us after all. Big difference.


hm? i don't get your point. did you read the comic??

Bruendor_Cavescout
2006-06-07, 10:38 AM
Great punchline, Giant! While I usually snicker or snort at the jokes, today's actually elicited a guffaw, followed by a few chuckles!

And by the way, Elan is dumb. Remember, mind flayers wouldn't eat him. Apparently eating Elan's brain is a small step up from skipping lunch. He does have ranks in Perform, and is likely remembering the flow of the story better than anyone else right now. He knows very little, but one thing he knows is DRAMA! ;D

sniffles
2006-06-07, 10:50 AM
That one almost made me snort tea out my nose!!
:D

Eldred
2006-06-07, 10:52 AM
Haha, I see that as what happens when the DM messes up ;D

NullAshton
2006-06-07, 10:53 AM
So.... Do you think that any of them got falling damage from their mounts spontanously disappearing?

Iruka
2006-06-07, 11:00 AM
Funny! :D Hope this never happens to me

btw, V's right arm is missing in the second last panel

orcmonk89
2006-06-07, 11:03 AM
So.... Do you think that any of them got falling damage from their mounts spontanously disappearing?

I would say that the following did:

V
Elan
Belkar

I believe the rest have ride as a class skill, and I doubt they put any points into cross-classing. Belkar, if I remember, doesn't seem the type of guy to put the points in, as he'd have to ride a riding dog, and I believe he hates that.

Sorcha_Ravenlock
2006-06-07, 11:11 AM
hehehe, that made me laugh out loud! ;D
Thank you for cheering up my day, Giant!

Priceless_Ming
2006-06-07, 11:16 AM
Ah, my favorite virtue: patience. And this is one of the best. Bards.

Bards.

And they're always played by that friggin' guy.

Good times.

Cheers from Dub V, Rich.

theKOT
2006-06-07, 11:17 AM
Though Durkon's mount is something of a mystery, then. Perhaps he got lucky? And shouldn't he still have one?
Durkon's not in the picture.

molonel
2006-06-07, 11:23 AM
Story advancement by explanation, followed by a gag in the last frame.

This was a rush job, despite being late.

No smiles or laughs.

chibibar
2006-06-07, 11:25 AM
Heh... I had a few GM (and sometimes I even do it to my players) to keep track of "stuff"

what is "stuff" I usually consider things like odd supplies. Generally we make sure players have the basic essential while traveling like tent, bed roll, tinder box (this has to be listed) and such...

Naturaly function like bathroom and feeding pets is "automactic" unless it requires special attention like if you have horses and travelling in the middle of the desert.. now what?

Showering? It all depend on the character really :) Unless I have a river along the way. After TWO weeks I would presume most of the character smells bad. BUT in medival times... a lot of people smell bad :) so it is normal.

I love the horse bit. I personally have done that once or twice.

Solmage
2006-06-07, 11:26 AM
It hasn't got to do anything with Elan's intelligence. Elan's player just was the first to remember.
Or
more likely the first to think of it and be stupid enough to mention it.
If the DM don't remember that there are no horses. Don't say a word.

Heh agreed. Elan is lucky I'm not V, or I'd polymorph him into a horse 8)

Fun comic

gallow
2006-06-07, 11:26 AM
Hey, the Acme effect :D It's there if you don't know it isn't there.

Loved this one, I haven't laughed out loud, which I haven't done (at an OotS comic) in a long time.


I would say that the following did:

V
Elan
Belkar

I believe the rest have ride as a class skill, and I doubt they put any points into cross-classing. Belkar, if I remember, doesn't seem the type of guy to put the points in, as he'd have to ride a riding dog, and I believe he hates that.
Umm, Elan is actually the group's best rider. See #141 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=141) - Roy only has 1 skill rank in Ride, Haley has none, and seeing as Durkon too is ready to have Elan telling them what to do/how to do it, I don't think he has that many ranks in Riding, either. And hey - didn't YOUR mommy tell you that cross-class learning is the key to a rich and fulfilling life? :P

//edit: Haha, the simuninja got you!

EscherEnigma
2006-06-07, 11:26 AM
I would say that the following did [take falling damage for their mounts disappearing]:

V
Elan
Belkar

I believe the rest have ride as a class skill, and I doubt they put any points into cross-classing. Belkar, if I remember, doesn't seem the type of guy to put the points in, as he'd have to ride a riding dog, and I believe he hates that.
but... remember 141? (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=141) Elan DOES have cross-class ranks in ride, and Haley DOESN'T.

Aside from that though, I'm pretty sure that you only take falling damage for falls of 10 feet or more. Are there special rules for damage from falling off a horse?

Oh, and aside from rules/comic geekery: Nifty comic!

EDIT: Darn! Simu-posted! I'll get you for this! And your little dog too!

TinSoldier
2006-06-07, 11:27 AM
Story advancement by explanation, followed by a gag in the last frame.

This was a rush job, despite being late.

No smiles or laughs.I don't know. I got a chuckle from the last panel.

It reminded me a bit of the earlier comics.

Mouser
2006-06-07, 11:28 AM
Finally, we're back.

Thanks, Rich. It's been a long time since I laughed at an OOTS punchline.

That kind of thing has happened to almost every party I've been in.

I look forward to more of the same.

molonel
2006-06-07, 11:30 AM
I don't know. I got a chuckle from the last panel.

It reminded me a bit of the earlier comics.


Oh, it's moving toward a story again. Don't get me wrong. I'm not complaining about that.

theKOT
2006-06-07, 11:30 AM
Yeah, it was ok. Kinda reminds me of those prequel strips before Dungeon crawling fools. I miss miko.... and I'm pretty sure I'm pretty much alone on this one.

TinSoldier
2006-06-07, 11:33 AM
Oh, it's moving toward a story again. Don't get me wrong. I'm not complaining about that.Okay.


Yeah, it was ok. Kinda reminds me of those prequel strips before Dungeon crawling fools. I miss miko.... and I'm pretty sure I'm pretty much alone on this one.Nope, you're not alone. After reading all the pro/con Miko stuff I certainly would like to see her again.

I just think it's going to be a long while. As much as I would like to see her we need a lot more OotS/LG/Xykon after the last stretch of comics.

Arachnophile
2006-06-07, 11:38 AM
This reminds me of the time our DM got a look at one of the character's inventory. She only had 3 horses in her backpack and somehow the DM objected. ;D

Xenon
2006-06-07, 11:50 AM
Elan should really stop trying to help. before his freinds have to kill him.

Ronald_saveloy
2006-06-07, 11:52 AM
It hasn't got to do anything with Elan's intelligence. Elan's player just was the first to remember.
Or
more likely the first to think of it and be stupid enough to mention it.
If the DM don't remember that there are no horses. Don't say a word.

Oh yeah, we had a similar situation once too:
A mages academy was planing an expedition and was seeking adventurers to protect the expedition. So, when one of the PCs (a female mage) arrived at the academy, there was a large queue of adventurers yet to apply for the job. Of course she didn't qeue up at the end of line, but casted a chaming spell on a barbarian standing near the academy's entrance. So she got a forward place, while the Barbarian was protecting her as long as beeing charmed.

ME (the DM): After one hour of waiting, you haven't reached to office to apply...
SHE (Player): Wait a sec! If I stand in the line for one hour, my charming spell weared off 15 Minutes ago.
ME: Oh yes... Eh, in this case, the barbarian gets really angry on you...

If she hadn't mentioned it, I'd never recognized.

Glorfindel
2006-06-07, 11:53 AM
An Elan can ask more questions than a thousand wise men can answer ::)

Great comic again!

Aerysil1
2006-06-07, 11:56 AM
That last panel made me laugh out loud :)

kadh2000
2006-06-07, 12:00 PM
I wonder if Durkon wasn't there as a test to see if anyone remembered he still had his pony.
Love the pencil dog for Belkar.
I had a DM like that once. After the entire party died over not mentioning they put on armor and weapons to go down to breakfast at an inn, we shot him.

Chancelikely
2006-06-07, 12:17 PM
There's a term for this phenomenon that came up quite frequently in our campaigns: "Spontaneous Existence Failure".

Eriol
2006-06-07, 12:25 PM
hm? i don't get your point. did you read the comic??
Otterella's point was that it's the difference between characters just "travelling" to a different destination, not explicitly saying they took their mounts with them, and therefore leaving a "grey area" where the players said "of course we took our mounts and just didn't mention it explicitly" and the DM says "well you didn't say it, therefore it didn't happen" and the debate therein.

But this is different, as we explicitly see in #251 the group all chained up and walking, except for Durkon, who was on his pony. This also eliminates a further loophole, as you could say that if Durkon was walking behind them, then they may have just been "on the way" to get the mounts (while chained), whereas the way it was shown in the comics, they would have gotten their mounts if they could have, since Durkon did get his. Therefore, they definitely do NOT have them (with the possible exception of Durkon, if he picked it up on the way out of Azure City).


I'll admit, the one thing that really disappointed me here was the continual referring to of the Oracle as male. Both Durkon AND Roy refer to the Oracle as female in OTOOPCs, and so the continual referral here as male is quite disturbing. A very unfortunate ret-con IMO if that's what The Giant is doing, especially since the entire focus of this strip is consistency in the storyline.

:(

BlythraB
2006-06-07, 12:30 PM
Great, Elan. Thanks a bunch.

Krytha
2006-06-07, 12:49 PM
Last panel FTW hahaha

I think Roy would have learned his lesson by now. Bind, gag Elan at all times.

Vanidel
2006-06-07, 12:52 PM
That one almost made me snort tea out my nose!!
:D

Drinking tea while reading OotS, something Elan would do :-)

Thanx for the weird faces at work again Giant *grin*

tee_kay_one
2006-06-07, 12:57 PM
Otterella's point was that it's the difference between characters just "travelling" to a different destination, not explicitly saying they took their mounts with them, and therefore leaving a "grey area" where the players said "of course we took our mounts and just didn't mention it explicitly" and the DM says "well you didn't say it, therefore it didn't happen" and the debate therein.

But this is different, as we explicitly see in #251 the group all chained up and walking, except for Durkon, who was on his pony. This also eliminates a further loophole, as you could say that if Durkon was walking behind them, then they may have just been "on the way" to get the mounts (while chained), whereas the way it was shown in the comics, they would have gotten their mounts if they could have, since Durkon did get his. Therefore, they definitely do NOT have them (with the possible exception of Durkon, if he picked it up on the way out of Azure City).



thanks for clarifying that. Seems I'm a little low on blood-sugar and my brain didn't work properly... ;D

Panzar_NSidious
2006-06-07, 01:07 PM
New comic is up.

Since there was no comic Monday, there will definitely be one Fridayish this week, so there will still be two.

Thank you Giant!

Both my daughter and I were concerned when there was no comic Tuesday morning. It was then that I realized just how integrated your comic has become into our weekly routines.

Shea Landford
2006-06-07, 01:10 PM
Yay new comic!!! ME like very much! I liked the horses vanishing in a puff of logic, that was very funny. Hooray for Rich!

infiniteviking
2006-06-07, 01:11 PM
Great character interaction. And yay, a quest with different tests and everything! This is going to be good....

*keels over laughing at the last panel*

Great comic, Giant!

saraswati
2006-06-07, 01:22 PM
I'll admit, the one thing that really disappointed me here was the continual referring to of the Oracle as male. Both Durkon AND Roy refer to the Oracle as female in OTOOPCs, and so the continual referral here as male is quite disturbing. A very unfortunate ret-con IMO if that's what The Giant is doing, especially since the entire focus of this strip is consistency in the storyline.

:(

On the other hand, if you thought today's disappearing horses were funny, wait until you see what happens when the Giant retcons the Oracle from Male to Female :o :o

And speaking of retcons... wah! No more "fierce canine, barely domesticated, more wolf than dog" for Belkar!

edit: horrible misquotey badness

ref
2006-06-07, 01:28 PM
hehe... thanks Giant, you made my day :)

SimonMoon5
2006-06-07, 01:29 PM
I'll admit, the one thing that really disappointed me here was the continual referring to of the Oracle as male. Both Durkon AND Roy refer to the Oracle as female in OTOOPCs, and so the continual referral here as male is quite disturbing.
:(

Perhaps the oracle in question is Tiresias?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiresias

Otterella
2006-06-07, 01:31 PM
Yes, tee_kay_one, that is exactly what I was trying to say. Thanks for clarifying.

And I've decided not to worry too much about the (s)he oracle issue until they actually get there, for at least two reasons, which I will mark as [SPOILERS], just in case they count as such:
1. The oracle at Delphi actually consisted of the female Pythia, who "received" the message in a drug-induced stupor, AND the male priests who "interpreted" the unintelligible language of the Pythia. While the oracle in question is not necessarily based on the Delphic oracle, there is nothing to prevent it from being set up in a similar manner.
2. Unless the oracle is immortal, maybe Roy and Durkon originally visited a female oracle, who has since retired or reached a term limit or whatever, and has been replaced by a male oracle.

Zann
2006-06-07, 01:39 PM
What better birthday present than another great punchline?

Thanks a lot, Giant. ;)

Quirinus_Obsidian
2006-06-07, 01:43 PM
I will put Roger Clemens' salary on betting that this exact thing happens in every single campaign. AWESOME!

Lostboy
2006-06-07, 01:52 PM
I have been a lurker here ever since episode #191. I read all 191 episodes in a day, then followed the comic faithfully from then until now. And in all that time, I never registered for the forum.

Why did I do so today? Because I had to tell the Giant that I am SO HAPPY he's getting back to the roots of what I love about this comic: inside jokes and meta-humor about D&D gaming. It's things like these -- the failed spot checks, up-a-level/down-a-level, convenient pop-in/pop-out familiars, and now disappearing horses at the mention of their being left behind at an inn -- that resonate with me.

All of the in-depth story stuff about Azure City, Haley's speech problem, etc... they're nice, but without a good hearty dose of this kind of gaming humor thrown in fairly often, I found myself very much missing it. It's nice to see this kind of thing being done again.

I'm so excited that the OotS is about to be in a dungeon again. I can't wait to see where this leads!

Inky
2006-06-07, 02:08 PM
We always let stuff like this slide in our campaigns. That, or went back to the point that was causing the problem and worked out what really would have happened from there.

Too much trouble otherwise. After all, if they really don't have their horses, Durkon is now separated from the party. He has been traveling at pony speed and the rest have been traveling at walking speed since they left Azure city.

Holy_Knight
2006-06-07, 02:14 PM
I liked the classic "ignore the guy whose question you don't want to answer for as long as you possibly can" bit.


Yay it's up, been waiting for this :)
Edit: Ok read the comic now :) Have to say I didn't see the punchline coming up... trust Elan to show intelligence at the most inopportune moment :)
Yep. Just like the thing with the King Giants.

"Now is not the time to start being entirely reasonable, Elan."

tee_kay_one
2006-06-07, 02:15 PM
All of the in-depth story stuff about Azure City, Haley's speech problem, etc... they're nice, but without a good hearty dose of this kind of gaming humor thrown in fairly often, I found myself very much missing it. It's nice to see this kind of thing being done again.


WAH, what is it... oh, don't be afraid, it's a lurker surfacing...
You put that nicely (see quote above), I agree very, very much. And welcome in your new state of post-lurkdom

Valda, Adlav and Samiam: the Jacked-Up Trinity
2006-06-07, 02:21 PM
btw, V's right arm is missing in the second last panel

*Checks* Holy damn! You're right... hehehe... that's funny.

ambra
2006-06-07, 02:23 PM
wooohooo!

that's the kind of comic i love!

Sabishii_Kouen
2006-06-07, 02:28 PM
yeah, the riding dachshund is back! i love it. oh, wait... it's gone again... ;D


EDIT: is dachshund a word at all? i mean, dackel, you know, the ugly longish dogs... ah, never mind

Yay! The riding Dachshund! I love the riding Dachshund! *has two of them for pets* they are NOT ugly. They are beautiful and above all CUTE! :-P

chibibar
2006-06-07, 02:28 PM
Otterella's point was that it's the difference between characters just "travelling" to a different destination, not explicitly saying they took their mounts with them, and therefore leaving a "grey area" where the players said "of course we took our mounts and just didn't mention it explicitly" and the DM says "well you didn't say it, therefore it didn't happen" and the debate therein.

But this is different, as we explicitly see in #251 the group all chained up and walking, except for Durkon, who was on his pony. This also eliminates a further loophole, as you could say that if Durkon was walking behind them, then they may have just been "on the way" to get the mounts (while chained), whereas the way it was shown in the comics, they would have gotten their mounts if they could have, since Durkon did get his. Therefore, they definitely do NOT have them (with the possible exception of Durkon, if he picked it up on the way out of Azure City).


I'll admit, the one thing that really disappointed me here was the continual referring to of the Oracle as male. Both Durkon AND Roy refer to the Oracle as female in OTOOPCs, and so the continual referral here as male is quite disturbing. A very unfortunate ret-con IMO if that's what The Giant is doing, especially since the entire focus of this strip is consistency in the storyline.

:(

This I have to agree with. OoTS DID lose their mounts at the hotel (when it burned down) and all their treasure. AND the OoTS was taken to town in chains. We can interpret that Durkon only took his pony and the other mounts are lost at the hotel.

In situation like this, as a GM I would say they DON'T have their mount UNLESS the players expressly said "We are going to buy new mounts" but no such thing was mention (at least in the comic) so everyone except Durkon lose their mount.

Of course if the OoTS (or the players) DID have their mount when they enter the city, I would normally "assume" that they "check in" their mount at a stable and check out again (again... assuming nothing bad happen to the stable or the players in the meantime)

There are many things you can assume "it is automactic" in terms of gameplay like going to the bathroom, eating (if players bough ration at least and we just deduct one meal) caring for the mount (again.. unless situation prevents "normal" interaction) Not many GM will be totally nitpick on every single details... It can really ruin a game :)

Dragonmaster_Crono
2006-06-07, 02:33 PM
And thus we see the usefulness of the Phantom Steed spell. :P

Spanxxx
2006-06-07, 02:33 PM
Stellar! Great comic!

This is the kind of thing that makes this comic what it is Giant. You can tell Rich has for sure played the game forever because this always happens sooner or later and it's always funny to see who brings it up.

Our campgaign generally has a lot of these moments in the form of someone not having their weapon out, but finishing 3 rooms before we say, "Hey, didn't you drop your weapon back there to pull out a potion during combat?" or us traversing halfway through a dungeon before someone says, "Who's carrying a torch?" and we all groan because we realize we SHOULDN'T have been able to see the whole time, and now the DM is pissed about it because he didn't catch it earlier and will make sure to enforce the radius of every single light for the rest of the night.

CatBoris
2006-06-07, 02:34 PM
Nice comic, good to be out of the city.

efi
2006-06-07, 02:36 PM
Great one. I couldn't defend against laughing out loud!

;D

Elan's just too... Argh. Too funny.

tee_kay_one
2006-06-07, 02:38 PM
Yay! The riding Dachshund! I love the riding Dachshund! *has two of them for pets* they are NOT ugly. They are beautiful and above all CUTE! :-P

By the nine hells, did I really say ugly? Of course they're not ugly... but all the Dachshunde (correct germ plural... tehehe) I knew were very annoying. It's quite aggressive breed, is it? They probably try to compensate something...

DarkCorax
2006-06-07, 02:42 PM
this is one of the first comics to make me LoL!... Great! ;D

Roy is sure going to be annoyed with Elan about this....

killer_rabbit
2006-06-07, 02:53 PM
WOOHOO!! page 10!!!!11one

....

;D


Uhm, anyway, I loved this comic, it's some time since we last had a decent gaming joke. And, as stated about a billion times before in this thread, it is probably a situation we've all experienced. At both sides of the DM screen.

Felinoid
2006-06-07, 02:53 PM
First and foremost, let's get the bragging out of the way. ;) Who was it that predicted W-F comics? :P

Okay, now that that's over, I was literally LOL at the last panel. I have been the guy who asks that question more than once, having a mind for trivia and being a stickler for details. Of course, half the time I was doing it specifically to cheese off my companions. (They may be mad now, but they'll have a good story to tell later. :D )

Example:
Fighter - "I tie up and gag the unconscious guard."
Me - "Um, do any of us have any rope? ... Ow!"

Swordsaint
2006-06-07, 03:27 PM
Well, good thing the comic is up. Just got back from work, and was hoping to see some OOTS action. Yay!

Nasrudith
2006-06-07, 03:27 PM
That's Elan, acting smart at the wrong time.

Thortok2000
2006-06-07, 03:38 PM
There was this one time when our D&D group was just learning to have an actual map representing our positions during combat. Our group wasn't particularly ready for it.

The barbarian won initiative and went into a berserker rage and charged the nearest goblin. "But the dwarf is between you and the goblin." "Oh. Uh, I throw him out of the way." "Roll for how hard you throw him." "Nat 20." "The dwarf FLIES out of the way and embeds in a nearby tree, upside down." We move the dwarf's token to where he is now.

So the barbarian charges the goblin. "Roll." "Critical miss." "The goblin gets an attack of opportunity." "Whatever. My AC is so high he'd have to get a critical hit to even hit me at all." "The goblin crits you for *rolls* three damage."

It's the Ranger's turn. (The ranger other than myself.) He takes a shot at a goblin that had advanced closer to the party. He misses. And this is the part that today's comic reminded me of. I was looking at the position of the players, and I drew a line from the archer to the goblin and extended it, and it went to the dwarf that was in the tree. And I was like: "If he missed the goblin, then wouldn't he hit the dwarf?" And the DM is like "Roll for hitting the dwarf." "Nat 20." "The dwarf is now impaled to the tree by your arrow."

The bard couldn't fight, he was too busy laughing. The barbarian critically missed every roll and the goblins critically hit about 95% of their rolls (but only against the barbarian). The other ranger and I eventually took the goblins down and there was much bickering, especially from the dwarf and bard, about how you're supposed to fight goblins.

Heh...good times. Anyway, great comic, and it's funny because it's true. ^_^

Marller
2006-06-07, 03:49 PM
Yeah, it was ok. Kinda reminds me of those prequel strips before Dungeon crawling fools. I miss miko.... and I'm pretty sure I'm pretty much alone on this one.
No, you are not but i would rather not dwell on it.

Otterella
2006-06-07, 03:55 PM
Of course, when you think about it, the horses don't matter much, for the following reasons:

1. Vaarsuvius proved that no matter how far point A is from point B, there will only be one random encounter. So it doesn't matter if it takes them longer to get there, since it won't make the journey more dangerous.

2. Both OotS and Xykon will move at the speed of plot, so they will each arrive back at Azure City (or meet on the way) when they are supposed to, regardless of the speed of (or lack of) mounts.

3. I had a third reason, but now I can't remember it.

The fact that nobody noticed this for 10 pages just shows how funny the joke is.

ShadeMoon64
2006-06-07, 04:00 PM
The vanishing horses made me laugh out loud! ;D Great job! (as usual)

Chrono_Crow
2006-06-07, 04:05 PM
Haha. It's strange, but I just knew something was off about the horses. I just couldn't tell what. Excellent idea. ;D

Nixie
2006-06-07, 05:03 PM
hahahah! If i could accually talk straight (stupid numbing stuff) i would laugh and congradulate you on a strip well done.


P.S. Do you think Book #2 will be at Origins? I REALLY want to buy it ASAP (since I'm going to Origins AND GenCon...)

EladrinStarmist
2006-06-07, 05:05 PM
I felt that way too.. "Something's not right here..." and pop! Away the horses go.

GREAT comic today, Giant! And nice foreshadowing the upcoming quest. :-*

Haggis_McCrablice
2006-06-07, 05:18 PM
Elan's like that kid in class who reminds the teacher she forgot to assign homework two minutes before the last bell on Friday.

Re: Tiresias--first, he was a soothsayer, which is markedly different from an oracle. Secondly, he didn't have that power as a woman; he only got it later in life, after he'd become a man again, to make up for being blinded (after he upset Hera by giving the wrong answer to the question of who enjoys sex more).

Tobimaro
2006-06-07, 05:26 PM
;D

Great comic, Rich. And to think that Elan has a problem with logic. :P

G

The Glitter Ninja
2006-06-07, 05:30 PM
Roy really should know better than to let Elan speak at all. And here I was all happy that Belkar got his weiner dog back!

bosssmiley
2006-06-07, 05:59 PM
A true gamer's comic today - complete with a ret-conning of reality when required. ;D

baltor85
2006-06-07, 06:40 PM
Nice job, Giant. That was a hilarious punchline. Also liked the quoting of Monty Python. Heh. I was happy when I saw the group out and about again!

P.S. Why did the weiner dog have to go?!?!?!

maputo
2006-06-07, 06:46 PM
And here I was thrilled to death to see the riding dog again. Bring back the war dachshund!!!

Lydia
2006-06-07, 06:47 PM
And the Monty Python joke. ;D

walkeronthehorizon
2006-06-07, 07:00 PM
Well I think the riding dog was so funny great job :D

LordOfNarf
2006-06-07, 07:01 PM
Great comic Giant, this tis the old school gaming humor that this strip is built on, Best laugh since the 14th level aristocrat punchline.

Nightfall
2006-06-07, 07:32 PM
I've lost count of how many horses we killed/lost/blew up in a friend's campaign. Of course, we kept teleporting all over the freaking continent and I NEVER knew what the point of that campaign was, but it was funny when we realized we'd ditched our horses yet again! :)

razmafft1
2006-06-07, 07:39 PM
Wow. A gaming referance, a Looney Tunes referance (sort of), and a Monty Python referance. That's just awesome.

CelestialStick
2006-06-07, 08:32 PM
Not every strip has to have a punchline in the last frame, but I enjoyed it anyway. I especially love the look of rage on Belkar's face has he falls from the great height of two inches. ;)

I must say that I really love that little weiner dog that Belkar rides. It's so appropriate for his character. Actually I love just about anything bad that happenst to Belkar, but the dog is the ultimate indignity--assuming, of course, that V doesn't come to his senses and use Evan's spiked tentacles of intrusion on Belkar. :D

Oh yes, I loved the Python reference. You can never have too many Python references! And thus as our brave heroes set off in the face of murderous evil, I offer them this send-off:


Bravely bold Sir Robin rode forth from Camelot.
He was not afraid to die,
O brave Sir Robin.
He was not at all afraid to be killed in nasty ways,
Brave, brave, brave, brave Sir Robin!

He was not in the least bit scared to be mashed into a pulp,
Or to have his eyes gouged out and his elbows broken,
To have his kneecaps split and his body burned away
And his limbs all hacked and mangled, brave Sir Robin!

His head smashed in and his heart cut out
And his liver removed and his bowels unplugged
And his nostrils raped and his bottom burned off
And his pen--

Robin: That's... that's... er... enough music for now lads. Looks like there's dirty work afoot. ;)

geez3r
2006-06-07, 09:01 PM
Everyone must reference Python at some point in their life to truly have lived.

You have no idea how many times these little continuation errors have occured in the games I've played in.

Great comic Giant.

mec
2006-06-07, 09:16 PM
On the other hand, if you thought today's disappearing horses were funny, wait until you see what happens when the Giant retcons the Oracle from Male to Female :o :o

And I bet Elan would have something to say about that, too, with hilarious consquences!

mirado_lassik
2006-06-07, 09:28 PM
That makes my day.

charik
2006-06-07, 09:47 PM
There was this one time when our D&D group was just learning to have an actual map representing our positions during combat. Our group wasn't particularly ready for it.

Two points on this story: first, you can freely move through a space occupied by an ally who lets you as long as they are not engaged in melee (although that would've spoiled the fun).

Second, if you haven't already done so, get a copy of OtOoPC and read the Order's first combat, with a group of kobolds: D "On tha plus side, I think tha other kobolds died from laughter." ;D

As for today's comic, I'd put it in my top, oh, 321. I actually enjoyed the last score of updates more.

Gamefreakguy
2006-06-07, 09:53 PM
Is has been the best comic in a very long time... glad to see us get back to the other kind of awesomeness... :D

Test of the Body: Probably just killing a lot of somethings like always... :p
Test of the Mind: Logic... probably Vaarsuvius... or any of them maybe... actually it'll probably be Elan! ;)
Test of the Heart: My prediction (faded, even though it seems pretty obvious to me to think this...): Haley does something amazing for Elan and gets her speech back.

And also a Mounty Python thing!! ;D :)

Woo! Page 11!! :p

TheWanderingLlama
2006-06-07, 10:23 PM
This is just like that (much less funny) "invisible bench" skit I always had to do when I went to summer camp.... Anyone else done it? I probably can't count the number of times I've been forced to perform it.

CelestialStick
2006-06-07, 10:30 PM
Is has been the best comic in a very long time... glad to see us get back to the other kind of awesomeness... :D

Test of the Body: Probably just killing a lot of somethings like always... :p
Test of the Mind: Logic... probably Vaarsuvius... or any of them maybe... actually it'll probably be Elan! ;)
Test of the Heart: My prediction (faded, even though it seems pretty obvious to me to think this...): Haley does something amazing for Elan and gets her speech back.

And also a Mounty Python thing!! ;D :)

Woo! Page 11!! :p

Wow Gamefreak. Your avatar combines two of my favorite things: guns and kitties! Two great tastes that go great together! :D



This is just like that (much less funny) "invisible bench" skit I always had to do when I went to summer camp.... Anyone else done it? I probably can't count the number of times I've been forced to perform it.
Wow man, what a drag. At least that explains the wandering now. ;)

Bluefire
2006-06-07, 11:43 PM
Wow Gamefreak. Your avatar combines two of my favorite things: guns and kitties! Two great tastes that go great together!

I think we got our new gum flavor ... "it's explosively delicious."

great comic btw.

Bilbo27
2006-06-08, 12:04 AM
My GM does that all the time. He forgets something and poof, its gone, or vice versa, it gets added in immediately. Belkar needs to get rid of some pent up anger and fast.

Katonta
2006-06-08, 12:12 AM
This reminded me of a quote in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy ,"...And he promptly disappered in a puff of logic." Great book and movie that one! By the way, great strip Giant!

Melnor
2006-06-08, 12:24 AM
My oh my,
I wasn't going to post, and if I did it would be a "Nice to see my favorite stick figures back on the road" type of thing (not that I didn't enjoy the other storyline, mind you!) but, hahaha, that one was so funny. I was enjoying the dog and the usual banter and all of a sudden I was hit with a great punchline (along the lines of what I was thinking too).
Good comic Giant! (not that my personal opinion really matters, I know :) )

P.S. Yes, I know that I'm in a bracket mood (:P)

Fale
2006-06-08, 01:59 AM
That was a great comic. Anybody else think that Haley's arm looks freakishly large?

Evik
2006-06-08, 04:00 AM
Jeeze Elan....dont look a gift horse in the mouth!!!!
LOL

Chrono_Crow
2006-06-08, 05:54 AM
Jeeze Elan....dont look a gift horse in the mouth!!!!
LOL

You should be smote for that.

SMITE EVIL!

Eutheos
2006-06-08, 06:07 AM
Excellent comic! And 12th page! wOOt!

Kanashimi
2006-06-08, 07:20 AM
Jeeze Elan....dont look a gift horse in the mouth!!!!
LOL

Pun intended?

Antina
2006-06-08, 07:43 AM
??? Hello Mr. Giant!

Vīs ARM (2nd panel from the end) is STILL MISSING!!!

Though the additional arm one panel above it (also mentioned before) has been corrected... ::)

Delgarde
2006-06-08, 08:00 AM
There's always one... someone who realises the GM has forgotten something like this - and points it out.

Got caught that way once - dropping a bow to engage in melee, then using the bow a few rounds later on the other side of the room. I'd completely forgotten I wasn't carrying it anymore, but someone else caught it and spoke up...

Of course, I can hardly criticise - I've been that person once or twice...

Delgarde
2006-06-08, 08:17 AM
You should be smote for that.

SMITE EVIL!

Smite Punster is probably the class ability you're looking for...

Vampire_Boy
2006-06-08, 09:09 AM
I will miss the riding dog. :'(

Farseer_George
2006-06-08, 10:11 AM
That was a bloody good comic

Spit_Dog
2006-06-08, 11:19 AM
I will miss the riding dog.


Awww, Vampire Boy I feel your pain. *Hugs*

Barbarossa
2006-06-08, 11:42 AM
That was a good comic. Any gamer respecting him (or her-)self should go and look embarrased. And then go apologize to your dungeon master.

Forgetting horses. Ugh. Actually, I once had a player who played a noble, and he kept forgetting his servants. Pretty nasty if you burn your own castle down to escape from the baddies...

Zaruthustran
2006-06-08, 01:01 PM
Is this the first time we're seeing the personality of the characters' PLAYERS showing through? As in: is Elan's player actually a smart guy who happens to be very good at consistently roleplaying an imbecil?

The mind boggles.

infiniteviking
2006-06-08, 01:45 PM
Hey, I just noticed -- Vaarsuvius, as befits an elf, is riding with his feet outside the stirrups! He does seem to be holding on to the reins, though -- too bad that doesn't do any good. ;)

kerberos
2006-06-08, 02:27 PM
Smite Punster is probably the class ability you're looking for...
As provided by the Pun Paladin (http://www.galactanet.com/comic/561.htm) prestige class.

humanpylon
2006-06-08, 02:39 PM
quote: Smite Evil

Smite Punster is probably the class ability you're looking for...

I agree! Puns aren't evil...although I guess they might produce a groaning spirit!

saraswati
2006-06-08, 02:43 PM
I tried to quote gamefreakguy's prediction/spoiler thing (see page 12 above) to discuss it, but no matter how I tried to mask it, it was readable in the quote text. I think yellow doesn't work for masking.

Anyhow, I very much like his prediction re the third test. Since Haley can't seem to do anything on her own. Also ,I will add that if his prediction comes true, we will see the return of the inner-Haley brigade. I too, am breathlessly awaiting the return of short-hair Haley. Sigh.

Goofy
2006-06-08, 02:55 PM
Hey, I just noticed -- Vaarsuvius, as befits an elf, is riding with his feet outside the stirrups! He does seem to be holding on to the reins, though -- too bad that doesn't do any good. ;)

Why would holding onto the reins not do any good?

DraxtonSmitz
2006-06-08, 03:27 PM
Durkon still had his horse:

http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=251

Kanashimi
2006-06-08, 03:34 PM
I'm acutally surprised that if Durkon's horse survived the blast that Miko left their horses behind. I know she wouldn't have let them ride, but they could have easily been tethered and led.

Sounds like Shojo owes them some horses ( and a riding weiner dog)

kadh2000
2006-06-08, 05:07 PM
V's missing arm got poofed because he forgot to mention he put it in his sleeve, so on that panel it was under his robe. Then he told the giant that he quickly puts his right arm out to break his fall and poof there it is again for the last panel.

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 05:15 PM
You know, they could always get some coconut shells and clop them together... ::)

Felinoid
2006-06-08, 05:53 PM
??? Hello Mr. Giant!

Vīs ARM (2nd panel from the end) is STILL MISSING!!!

Though the additional arm one panel above it (also mentioned before) has been corrected... ::)

I was going to post an "IT'S NOT MISSING!" rant, but after looking at the comic again, what I have mistaken for a hand in that panel is actually the belt ties for her robe. So instead, I will jump on the "THERE'S AN ARM MISSING!" bandwagon. :P And while I'm at it, there are a number of places in the old comics (and even a couple of newer ones) where the coloring of Roy's head or the background gets a little screwed up.

Otterella
2006-06-08, 06:11 PM
Goofy, when you ride a horse, holding the reins is not what keeps you on it. Holding on with your *knees* is the key, which you can't properly do without your feet in the stirrups, toes pointed out. That's why cowboys get bowlegged. If you hold the reins, but keep your legs lax, you WILL fall off.

Edit: Actually, you *can* hold on with your knees without your feet in the stirrups, otherwise riding bare back would be impossible. It's just *easier* with the stirrups. That's what I meant, of course.

Another Edit: And actually, I think V does have hir feet in the stirrups. Since s/he's not wearing boots, and just has simple stick feet in a simple stick stirrup, it's hard to tell. But the stirrup is centered over the line of the foot in every panel, which seems to me to indicate that the feet are in the stirrups.

CelestialStick
2006-06-08, 06:32 PM
You know, they could always get some coconut shells and clop them together... ::)


But...there are no coconuts in Azure City! ;)

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 06:36 PM
But...there are no coconuts in Azure City! ;)The swallow may fly south with the sun or the house martin
or the plumber may seek warmer climes in winter yet these are not
strangers to our land.

Otterella
2006-06-08, 07:40 PM
Are you saying coconuts are migratory?!

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 07:43 PM
Are you saying coconuts are migratory?!Not at all, they could be carried.

;D I could go on, but I'd probably get a warning...

saraswati
2006-06-08, 07:54 PM
We need a humorous "Where's V's arm - spoiler" thread. I'm off to start one.

Tonttu
2006-06-08, 08:52 PM
Is this the first time we're seeing the personality of the characters' PLAYERS showing through? As in: is Elan's player actually a smart guy who happens to be very good at consistently roleplaying an imbecil?

The mind boggles.
I can just imagine other players giving him while he's snickering at the imagine of popping horses in his head. xD

Durin
2006-06-08, 09:02 PM
mybe since we had to wait for this one we'll get a double length one this time around ;D

CelestialStick
2006-06-08, 09:34 PM
Are you saying coconuts are migratory?!
ROFLMAO! You guys know the lines better than I do! I haven't seen the movie in years, maybe decades. I just bought it though the other week so I should go watch it.

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 09:37 PM
ROFLMAO! You guys know the lines better than I do! I haven't seen the movie in years, maybe decades. I just bought it though the other week so I should go watch it.I cheated -- http://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/mphg/mphg.htm

Google is your friend!

I know a lot of the lines but I like to verify them against a source in case my memory acts up on me. Gettin' old, ya know!

infiniteviking
2006-06-08, 09:38 PM
Why would holding onto the reins not do any good?
Because the horse disappeared anyway. See, the whole point of reins is to keep the horse from going where you don't want it to go. Since Vaarsuvius's expression indicates neither desire of nor expectation for the disappearance of his horse, the action of 'holding onto the reins' clearly didn't accomplish its object.

QED. ;D

Pocal
2006-06-08, 09:48 PM
I miss the daschund. Bring it back Giant! Please?


Great comic.

Otterella
2006-06-08, 09:56 PM
Well, darnitall infiniteviking, you had to go and point out the *obvious* reason why reins would do no good, which I never even thought about while I was giving a long-winded explanation of the mechanics of staying on a horse's back.

Oh goodness me... I'm Vaarsuvius!!

Edit: However, being not only a woman, but a pregnant woman, I have a very clearly defined gender identity, so the similarities end there.

Durin
2006-06-08, 10:00 PM
I don't know if anybody has pointed this out yet but shouldn't Durkon still have his horse? when the Inn blue up and Miko drug the others back in chains Durkon was riding behind them when Roy said "Stupid railroad plot."

CelestialStick
2006-06-08, 10:02 PM
I cheated -- http://www.sacred-texts.com/neu/mphg/mphg.htm

Google is your friend!

I know a lot of the lines but I like to verify them against a source in case my memory acts up on me. Gettin' old, ya know!
LOL. That makes me feel better! I actually thought about looking for the words with Google, but ended up being too lazy. :D



Well, darnitall infiniteviking, you had to go and point out the *obvious* reason why reins would do no good, which I never even thought about while I was giving a long-winded explanation of the mechanics of staying on a horse's back.

Oh goodness me... I'm Vaarsuvius!!

Edit: However, being not only a woman, but a pregnant woman, I have a very clearly defined gender identity, so the similarities end there.



I don't know if anybody has pointed this out yet but shouldn't Durkon still have his horse? when the Inn blue up and Miko drug the others back in chains Durkon was riding behind them when Roy said "Stupid railroad plot."
Yup, someone did mention it. ;)

That and the fact that V is clearly male. :D

mec
2006-06-08, 11:21 PM
Goofy, when you ride a horse, holding the reins is not what keeps you on it. Holding on with your *knees* is the key, which you can't properly do without your feet in the stirrups, toes pointed out. That's why cowboys get bowlegged. If you hold the reins, but keep your legs lax, you WILL fall off.

Edit: Actually, you *can* hold on with your knees without your feet in the stirrups, otherwise riding bare back would be impossible. It's just *easier* with the stirrups. That's what I meant, of course.

I've hardly ever ridden a horse, but I can say that motorcycles are like this, too.

It's difficult to stay on a motorcyle with both feet off the footpegs.

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 11:27 PM
Goofy, when you ride a horse, holding the reins is not what keeps you on it. Holding on with your *knees* is the key, which you can't properly do without your feet in the stirrups, toes pointed out. That's why cowboys get bowlegged. If you hold the reins, but keep your legs lax, you WILL fall off.Humans rode horses for hundreds of years before the stirrup was invented.

TheWanderingLlama
2006-06-08, 11:35 PM
Humans rode horses for hundreds of years before the stirrup was invented.

But the reason Genghis Khan has succesful was because his army had stirrups. Otterella said it was still possible to ride a horse without stirrups, just harder.

CelestialStick
2006-06-08, 11:37 PM
Humans rode horses for hundreds of years before the stirrup was invented.


Make that thousands. :)




But the reason Genghis Khan has succesful was because his army had stirrups. Otterella said it was still possible to ride a horse without stirrups, just harder.

Actually many factors, including the stirrups, contributed to his success. As I recall, the Mongols used light horses with archery, riding to within archery range, firing mass volleys of arrows, and then quickly retreating before the enemy could do anything to counter-attack. The stirrup probably did, however, make the archery more accurate, although when you're shooting volleys of arrows at massed targets accuracy isn't critically important.

The key stirrup played a much more important role after western Europeans adopted it during the Early Middle Ages. Without a stirrup to lock him in place, a knight with a lance is jusing using arm-power to stick you with a spear from horseback. With stirrups, however, he transfers the whole mass of the horse into the tip of the lance, making him a virtually unstoppable engine of death.

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 11:42 PM
But the reason Genghis Khan has succesful was because his army had stirrups. Otterella said it was still possible to ride a horse without stirrups, just harder. What? Stirrups weren't invented until the middle ages. What are you talking about?

Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirrup

Oh, and CelestialStick I was going to put thousands and then reconsidered. Since hundreds go into thousands I thought that it was appropriate.

Edit: I don't believe that Ghengis Khan's horde had stirrups. Reference?

CelestialStick
2006-06-08, 11:43 PM
What? Stirrups weren't invented until the middle ages. What are you talking about?

Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirrup

Oh, and CelestialStick I was going to put thousands and then reconsidered. Since hundreds go into thousands I thought that it was appropriate.

Stirrups were invented in the east before the Middle Ages. It's just that Europeans didn't adopt them from easterners (Huns) until after the Hunnish invasions of the Early Middle Ages.

TinSoldier
2006-06-08, 11:47 PM
While they may have been known in the East for a long time (third century CE), it is still controversial whether even the Huns knew about or used stirrups. I doubt they did.

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 12:00 AM
While they may have been known in the East for a long time (third century CE), it is still controversial whether even the Huns knew about or used stirrups. I doubt they did.

Well your personal doubt aside, the Huns invaded Byzantium in the 5th century, so even if you were right about stirrups having been invented in the east in the third century (which contradicts your earlier claim that they weren't invented until the middle ages and is in any case certainly centuries too late), the Huns would still have had them. Western Europeans eventually adopted them from Asian invaders.

TinSoldier
2006-06-09, 12:13 AM
Well your personal doubt aside, the Huns invaded Byzantium in the 5th century, so even if you were right about stirrups having been invented in the east in the third century (which contradicts your earlier claim that they weren't invented until the middle ages and is in any case certainly centuries too late), the Huns would still have had them. Western Europeans eventually adopted them from Asian invaders.Sorry, I just checked Google really quick and the first website I went to said it was controversial. I'll check some more, maybe.

It wasn't personal doubt, though.

Lessee, check footnote of this page (http://www.reportret.info/gallery/attilathehun1.html), whereas this reference (http://www.ucalgary.ca/applied_history/tutor/oldwrld/armies/stirrups.html) states that the stirrup was brought to Europe by the Huns. This reference (http://www.bartleby.com/65/st/stirrup.html) blows my theory out of the water.

However, Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirrup) says that there is no evidence that the Huns used stirrups.

Almost every other link in my search switches opinions. Hence, controversial. But not being a history/anthropolgy major I'll admit that I don't know for sure. And internet references are by no means definitive.

I think my book on medieval warfare said that the Huns brought the stirrup to Europe, but I don't have it handy.

TheWanderingLlama
2006-06-09, 12:24 AM
...This is what happens when you write post that are probably wrong off the top of your head when you're tired. *backs away slowly*

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 12:30 AM
Sorry, I just checked Google really quick and the first website I went to said it was controversial. I'll check some more, maybe.

It wasn't personal doubt, though.

Lessee, check footnote of this page (http://www.reportret.info/gallery/attilathehun1.html), whereas this reference (http://www.ucalgary.ca/applied_history/tutor/oldwrld/armies/stirrups.html) states that the stirrup was brought to Europe by the Huns. This reference (http://www.bartleby.com/65/st/stirrup.html) blows my theory out of the water.

However, Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirrup) says that there is no evidence that the Huns used stirrups.

Almost every other link in my search switches opinions. Hence, controversial. But not being a history/anthropolgy major I'll admit that I don't know for sure. And internet references are by no means definitive.

I think my book on medieval warfare said that the Huns brought the stirrup to Europe, but I don't have it handy.

I didn't see any reference to stirrups in the first link. The second link mentions that people appear to have ridden horses for 1500 years before inventing the stirrup, although that refers to the places where people first used stirrups; people rode horses without stirrups for longer elsewhere. So I guess we could say hundreds or even thousands of years. :) I was sure that in my MA program in history (many years ago) I'd learned that the Huns had brought stirrups to western Europe, and by 633 Charles Martel, the Frankish kind, had used them while defeating the Muslims at the battle of Poitiers.

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 12:33 AM
I didn't see any reference to stirrups in the first link. The second link mentions that people appear to have ridden horses for 1500 years before inventing the stirrup, although that refers to the places where people first used stirrups; people rode horses without stirrups for longer elsewhere. So I guess we could say hundreds or even thousands of years. :) I was sure that in my MA program in history (many years ago) I'd learned that the Huns had brought stirrups to western Europe, and by 633 Charles Martel, the Frankish kind, had used them while defeating the Muslims at the battle of Poitiers.

Edit: On the Mongols and stirrups, remember that the Mongols invaded Europe some 8 centuries after the Huns, so stirrups has been in wide use on the steppes of Asia for a very long time already.

TinSoldier
2006-06-09, 12:34 AM
Okay, I'm pulling the thread off-topic again.

For the first link you have to scroll down and read the footnote at the bottom of the article.


A student at the Oklahoma Christian University in Oklahoma City (USA) suggested that the Huns were among the first to use the stirrup. In his opinion, the portrait of Attila the Hun should have included a stirrup. The idea, however, that the Huns developed or even knew the stirrup is speculative and controversial. The first solid evidence of stirrup use originates from 4th century China CE. By that time the Huns had long left that region, so they could hardly have adopted the invention from the Chinese. Had they invented the stirrup themselves, the Romans — who either hired or fought them — would certainly have noticed this excellent tool. They did not. There are no indications of common stirrup use in Europe until the 8th century CE. All the more reason to conclude that a stirrup in the portrait of Attila the Hun would be an anachronism.

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 12:39 AM
Okay, I'm pulling the thread off-topic again.

For the first link you have to scroll down and read the footnote at the bottom of the article.


Well you probaly noticed that one of your other links dated the use of Chinese stirrups considerably earlier.

TheWanderingLlama
2006-06-09, 12:42 AM
So how about that missing arm, eh?

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 12:56 AM
So how about that missing arm, eh?
Well you know, the Huns brought the first missing arms to western Europe in the late 5th century... ;)

TheWanderingLlama
2006-06-09, 12:59 AM
Well you know, the Huns brought the first missing arms to western Europe in the late 5th century... ;)
How do you bring something if it's missing? ???

Durin
2006-06-09, 01:20 AM
AHA! god I hope noone already pointed this out. but in episode 237 Roy tells Elan and Durkon to retrieve their animals and equipment before they leave the inn. haha the horses should'na popped at all the party should've had access to there animals due to the info on that episode

TheWanderingLlama
2006-06-09, 01:21 AM
But they didn't have them when Miko dragged them off in chains. Remember that?

Solmage
2006-06-09, 02:57 AM
How do you bring something if it's missing? ???

You bring the condition of 'missing limbs' to the inhabitants of the region by liberal use of chopping tools (aka weapons) .. :)

MrSokkie
2006-06-09, 03:18 AM
I just remember a game where all the characters bought war-horses, but the Dwarf and the Halfling (that's me) had to buy ponies. Of course, the first fight we got in and the ponies bolted. They were just simple beasts of burden, after all. So in the next town, we bought a couple of War-ponies, which, as the DM explained to us, won't run away because they are to dumb to know when they are in danger ;D

The dwarf actually died in the next fight defendig his war-pony; the dwarf didn;t make if resist-poison saving throw. We still remind him of that sometimes and it's been, oh, 8 years ;D

Jannex
2006-06-09, 03:52 AM
Great comic. And really, who hasn't experienced this in a game? Huzzah for continuity wrinkles.

I do have one question, though. Admittedly, I haven't sifted through the previous sixteen pages to see if anyone else asked this, so if someone has, please bear with me. Here it is. Would Vaarsuvius, given his high Intelligence, really have split an infinitive like that?

[/grammar geek]

Vargtass
2006-06-09, 03:59 AM
AHA! god I hope noone already pointed this out. but in episode 237 Roy tells Elan and Durkon to retrieve their animals and equipment before they leave the inn. haha the horses should'na popped at all the party should've had access to there animals due to the info on that episode

AHA! and Durkon has his horse, while Elan was responsible to get the rest... and I rest my case.

Antina
2006-06-09, 04:35 AM
I was going to post an "IT'S NOT MISSING!" rant, but after looking at the comic again, what I have mistaken for a hand in that panel is actually the belt ties for her robe. So instead, I will jump on the "THERE'S AN ARM MISSING!" bandwagon. :P And while I'm at it, there are a number of places in the old comics (and even a couple of newer ones) where the coloring of Roy's head or the background gets a little screwed up.

I didnīt notice the background-colour thing.
You got a good eye for that - WOW.

And I didnīt want to bother THE GIANT or anything.
I thought heīd be happy that somebody noticed BEFORE he gave the stuff away to be printed.

Some authors actually pay people, to find mistakes like that.

Well - actually - we GET paid :) By simply great comix ;)

Ronald_saveloy
2006-06-09, 05:25 AM
Beeing to late to take part in the stirrup debate in this thread, I created a new thread for this toppic.

http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=banter;action=display;num=1149844236

Wahngrok
2006-06-09, 06:24 AM
The new comic made me laugh so hard I just had to sign up because it reminded me of a classic gaming moment of mine.

We were playing Call of Cthulhu and our characters were in the middle of an investigation of a spooky house. Things moved seemingly by itself in there culminating in a bed pushing one of us out of a first-story window. At that point we even suspected the radio of being the source of the furious furniture frenzy because the bed moved just as one of us turned on the radio. (It later turned out to be a telekinetic and telepathic but fortunately paralyzed vampire in the basement, which we destroyed rathe anticlimatic by bashing a hole in the basement wall from the outside and letting him get a nice sunburn).
But right now three of us (including my character) were in the house, covering our ears (because of the wicked radio, remember) when all of a sudden one gets mind controlled and starts attacking the other two with the axe we brought along. My friend and I make it out of the front door and down the street with our unwilling axe-wielding colleague in hot pursuit. Luckily since he was not much of an athlete he was loosing ground when just as that moment the player of the other fleeing character asks the GM: "Who of us actually has got the gun?" (meaning me and her).
Ah, you should have seen the wicked evil grin on the GMs face... our group was just able to afford one and guess who had it. :-/

It could have ended right there but this wouldn't be one of my favourite gaming moments if the GM hadn't rolled a critical failure on his firing-at-poor-old-me-roll. :D

RebelRogue
2006-06-09, 07:10 AM
Reality shifts FTW ;D

Isam
2006-06-09, 07:58 AM
Thanks for the comic, allways happy to see it.

Felinoid
2006-06-09, 08:01 AM
I didnīt notice the background-colour thing.
You got a good eye for that - WOW.
/me bows ;)

First time I noticed it was back in the first hundred strips somewhere, where Roy's head is noticably gray in one panel, rather than his normal healthy brown. Since then it's been unfortunately hard to ignore when these things pop up. :-/ But overall it doesn't really matter, as they're niggling little problems in an otherwise great webcomic.

Goofy
2006-06-09, 08:19 AM
Goofy, when you ride a horse, holding the reins is not what keeps you on it. Holding on with your *knees* is the key, which you can't properly do without your feet in the stirrups, toes pointed out. That's why cowboys get bowlegged. If you hold the reins, but keep your legs lax, you WILL fall off.

I know... I ride. (English/Parelli if anyone asks, and yes, I'm a guy.) Hence why you need neither knees, reins nor stirrups to stay on the horse.

Riding with your knees is what stupid hunt riders who don't know how to ride do. It's all in the hips.

However, I think I meant to either ask why would you need stirrups or reins to help you stay on.

Mal_the_Mad
2006-06-09, 08:39 AM
without trying to start a debate about which is better english or western riding, due to the diferences in the saddles, knees are the prefered method in western, and im unsure about english but why in the heck would you enjoy "posting" in the saddle I understand why the calvary did it, the saddle was just the tree with a thin leather covering, not really confortable to sit on. so i think as long as your confortable with the way you ride then that is a good way to ride.

btw if your toes are pointed out wont the spurs be hitting the horse in a consistant basis?? I always thought you kept your toes forward, heels down.


and cowboys are bowlegged cause they started riding when they were young and horses are fat.

Spit_Dog
2006-06-09, 09:08 AM
Dear Riders/Those with Knowledge of Riding,

Aside from the obvious changes, would riding a weiner dog be substantially different from riding a horse (eg, necessitating a different style)?

Thank you.

Goofy
2006-06-09, 09:41 AM
Dear Riders/Those with Knowledge of Riding,

Aside from the obvious changes, would riding a weiner dog be substantially different from riding a horse (eg, necessitating a different style)?

Thank you.

Yes. Their back structure isn't designed for riding. Not even being ridden by an appropriately sized person.

Goofy
2006-06-09, 09:49 AM
Well, I didn't mean to start a big debate on riding styles.

In western you do not have to use your knees to stay in the saddle. Since there's more padding, however, using your knees is less uncomfortable to the horse than when riding hunt seat. It is easier, when riding a trained horse that won't freak out about it (like most western ponies) to just grip onto the horse with your knees. However, you do not have as great a balance as a skilled rider who rides with their seat.

For example, look at bull riding, or bronco riding. They do not grip with their knees to stay on the bucking bull or horse.

The only style I have an active complaint against is hunt, because the idea of riding hunt seat is that you maximize your own comfort and stamina at the expense of the horse's. Thus, the horse is constantly in a very uncomfortable position when you're riding hunt seat, whether you're good or bad at it.

Yes, you're supposed to keep your feet pointing forward in all riding styles. You end up going into what martial arts refers to as, appropriately enough, horse stance when riding. Legs farther apart than your shoulders, but pointing forward.

Aeek
2006-06-09, 09:58 AM
AHA! and Durkon has his horse, while Elan was responsible to get the rest... and I rest my case.


I'm confident that Elan got the horse puppet !

GeekLordAragorn12
2006-06-09, 11:09 AM
without trying to start a debate about which is better english or western riding, due to the diferences in the saddles, knees are the prefered method in western, and im unsure about english but why in the heck would you enjoy "posting" in the saddle I understand why the calvary did it, the saddle was just the tree with a thin leather covering, not really confortable to sit on. so i think as long as your confortable with the way you ride then that is a good way to ride.

btw if your toes are pointed out wont the spurs be hitting the horse in a consistant basis?? I always thought you kept your toes forward, heels down.


and cowboys are bowlegged cause they started riding when they were young and horses are fat.




Why would you need your knees? I ride english style, and the balance is all in your seat. You need to keep your butt in the middle of the saddle in order to stay balanced. Trying to stay on using your knees would probably end up with you on the ground.

The reason why people post is simple - it's a slower gate of trotting. Sitting trot is I think about 5 or 10 mph faster than posting trot.

Toes aren't supposed to be pointed outwards...they're supposed to be pointed straight, with the heels down. So the spurs(do people really wear spurs in western anymore) wouldn't be a problem.

GeekLordAragorn12
2006-06-09, 11:10 AM
Well, I didn't mean to start a big debate on riding styles.

In western you do not have to use your knees to stay in the saddle. Since there's more padding, however, using your knees is less uncomfortable to the horse than when riding hunt seat. It is easier, when riding a trained horse that won't freak out about it (like most western ponies) to just grip onto the horse with your knees. However, you do not have as great a balance as a skilled rider who rides with their seat.

For example, look at bull riding, or bronco riding. They do not grip with their knees to stay on the bucking bull or horse.

The only style I have an active complaint against is hunt, because the idea of riding hunt seat is that you maximize your own comfort and stamina at the expense of the horse's. Thus, the horse is constantly in a very uncomfortable position when you're riding hunt seat, whether you're good or bad at it.

Yes, you're supposed to keep your feet pointing forward in all riding styles. You end up going into what martial arts refers to as, appropriately enough, horse stance when riding. Legs farther apart than your shoulders, but pointing forward.

I've never ridden western, only English. What's the difference?

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 11:41 AM
You bring the condition of 'missing limbs' to the inhabitants of the region by liberal use of chopping tools (aka weapons) .. :)

Either that or your bring back the limbs that got chopped off in the first place. ;)

Goofy
2006-06-09, 11:43 AM
English is riding. Western is sitting on a moving couch.

Runolfr
2006-06-09, 01:23 PM
While it's a good joke, it occurs to me that there's no reason to assume they left their horses at the inn. After all, Durkon still had his pony back in #251, and he could easily have been leading the remaining mounts on a string.

As for riding: I prefer English, and my wife (who is far more knowledgeable of such subjects than I) tells me that posting is easier on the horse than sitting the trot.