Best use of Improved Pact Weapon Bow features?

[tomato]

I'm trying to make a character focused around the use of a Bow on a warlock using the Improved Pact Weapon bow features for a level 14 character. Currently, my framework is roughly Warlock 3 fighter 11 (arcane archer). I'm not sure if this is the best use however. What do you all think?

[jaappleton]

NOBODY has championed the Warlock Archer more than Mortis Elrond. I surmise he'll be here shortly. :smallbiggrin:

So, here's the thing: You don't actually need to use Improved Pact Weapon to use a bow as a Warlock.

You can make any magical bow / crossbow your Blade Pact weapon. You just can't initially conjure a ranged weapon. But if you find one, you CAN make it your Pact Weapon. So if you start with a +1 Bow... >_>

Additionally, this was discussed heavily in a topic I made not too long ago: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?544943-The-argument-for-the-Warlock-Hexblade-Archer

I'd start Fighter 1 for Con save proficiency to begin with, go Hexblade to attack only with Charisma, and continue from there however you want to. You're starting at lv14, so it doesn't matter too much how you progress it, only how it ends.

If you DON'T want to go Hexblade, I thoroughly recommend picking Archfey for your Patron. Greater Invisibility and Faerie Fire with Sharpshooter.... Oh, so delicious. Or you can go Celestial and be a Paladin with a ranged weapon with Eldritch Smite.

[Easy_Lee]

My girlfriend and I will soon be playing a pair of celestial blade-pact drow warlocks wielding longbows. On paper, the synergy looks incredible. Celestial allows you to bonus action heal without consuming a spell slot, great for longbow users who often don't have a good use for their bonus action, and also grants access to Revivify.

A half-elf hexblade with elven accuracy will do the most damage, but other pacts offer many useful features. Fiend resistance and temporary HP are always useful. Celestial gives you an excellent bonus action to help allies stay alive. Great old one is flavorful and can be useful in more social campaigns. Fey is overall the best at keeping you alive.

My recommendation: think about what you want your character to do and build toward that idea.

[DivisibleByZero]

Maybe it's just me, but I've never seen the appeal of using a ranged weapon when you have the best cantrip in the entire game, which does more damage than any weapon will do because you can make twice as many attacks, and it also does a less resisted damage type.
I just don't see the point.

If I were going to make an "arcane archer" warlock, I'd just refluff Eldritch Blast to look like I was firing a bow made of magical energy.

[BobZan]

I made this build, it's a support Celestial Warlock with Blade Pact.

The Ranged Paladin
V. Human - Feat: Healer or Sharpshooter
Celestial Warlock - Pact of the Blade
8 16 14 10 12 14
ASIs in Dex.

Start with Light Crossbow, get a Longbow on level 3.

You'll have 1+Level d6 bonus action heal to keep your friends alive. With Healer feat you won't need to spend spells healing. After 5th level you'll have some nova damage via Extra Attack and Eldritch Smite.

You're a full caster with bonus action healing as a 'SLA', OoC Healing as a feat and 2 Slots/sr.

[Easy_Lee]

Maybe it's just me, but I've never seen the appeal of using a ranged weapon when you have the best cantrip in the entire game, which does more damage than any weapon will do because you can make twice as many attacks, and it also does a less resisted damage type.
I just don't see the point.

If I were going to make an "arcane archer" warlock, I'd just refluff Eldritch Blast to look like I was firing a bow made of magical energy.

In tier four, eldritch blast might overtake the damage dealt by a pact bow, but only for sustained damage on long days without rest. At most levels and in the general case, Sharpshooter + Darkness + Devil's Sight + Eldritch Smite + Improved Pact Weapon has significantly more damage potential, particularly if you also have Elven Accuracy.

On a good round at level 8, an elvish bowlock can roll 6d20 on two attacks, crit once, and deal 3d8+8(Dex)+20(SS)+10d8(smite crit) damage. That's significant since burst damage is universally useful, magic weapon and force are among the least resisted damage types, and there's no stronger condition than dead.

The downside is that you give up other invocations and pacts in order to build in a particular direction. But on the other hand, most invocations are more situational than the four that a dedicated warlock archer will take.

[rbstr]

The idea is to be an archer foremost, rather than a caster? Others have talked about more warlock-centric builds.
Looking at more fighter-centric builds like your Warlock+Arcane Arche, I think your particular level balance is pretty decent. That third attack is worth it if you want to be more martial-based.
Take buffs/defense/utility stuff as Warlock spells so you don't need to rely on a high charisma score.

Honestly I think you don't want to go CHA-to-hit if you want to be an Arcane Archer mostly (though hexblade is a decent pick for the curse aspect). It's is maybe a bit of a trap since you need INT for the saves on your Arrows. That means you're in a position where you need 14 dex (medium armor), high cha, and high int.
Going dex based reduces that by a point plus puts you in light armor. You need just 13cha for multiclassing. Then you take high dex/int.

BattleMaster fighter would be the better pick for a Hexblade/Charisma-to-hit build. You'd probably want to avoid maneuvers that require saves since those'll be dex-based. But you'd be able to use Rally better than anyone which seems kinda fun!
Samurai might also offer you something if you want to go with Sharpshooter since you'll be able to give yourself advantage a whole ton.

As far as where to go with the Warlock stuff besides the Improved Pact Weapon.
You've got tough choices with your extra invocation. At only level 3 of warlock there's Armor of Shadows for the +1AC or DevilsSight for the darkness synergy.
If you take warlock to 5 you can do ranged smites which could be a good idea.
Every patron has a bit to offer depending on what secondary roles you might want.

[Easy_Lee]

Ranged smites are the major selling point of a warlock archer. A battlemaster fighter or even Arcane Archer should beat the warlock for sustained damage most of the time, but only if the warlock is not able to rest consistently.

I'd say it depends on your goal and the campaign. How often do you expect to be able to rest?

You might also consider hexblade / ranger (Gloomstalker). That gives you more spells, more spell slots (for shield, Hex, etc), and an extra attack the first turn of combat.

[Mikal]

Maybe it's just me, but I've never seen the appeal of using a ranged weapon when you have the best cantrip in the entire game, which does more damage than any weapon will do because you can make twice as many attacks, and it also does a less resisted damage type.
I just don't see the point.

If I were going to make an "arcane archer" warlock, I'd just refluff Eldritch Blast to look like I was firing a bow made of magical energy.

Because you can hit harder via Eldritch Smite and sharpshooter while being more accurate thanks to combining magic bow+magic arrows+bracers of archery+archery fighting style, using say Arcane Archer/Battlemaster/Brute, Rogue, and/or Kensei, up to 3 attacks worth at level 14+ depending on which build you go with, which can also give you more abilities than you get using invocations on the attacks?

[Yuukale]

I'd go

Hexblade 3 / Battlemaster 11 / Assassin 6 - 3 attacks, 3d6/round sneak attack, hex and other goodies such as sharp-shooter.

Turn 1 you get to nova for 6 attacks and a grand total of: 6d10+6d8+12d6+132. If you manage to trigger Assassinate you double those dice and that's almost certainly a guaranteed kill.

at lower levels this also works wonders

[Easy_Lee]

I'd go

Hexblade 3 / Battlemaster 11 / Assassin 6 - 3 attacks, 3d6/round sneak attack, hex and other goodies such as sharp-shooter.

Turn 1 you get to nova for 6 attacks and a grand total of: 6d10+6d8+12d6+132. If you manage to trigger Assassinate you double those dice and that's almost certainly a guaranteed kill.

at lower levels this also works wonders

I assume you would take the fighter levels first. Prior to 12, this is a plain fighter build. I've never seen a 5e game actually go into tier 4 and I understand tier 3 and 4 games to be in the minority compared to tier 1 and 2.

All of that is to say I think characters should be built specifically for the levels at which they will be played.

[DivisibleByZero]

Because you can hit harder via Eldritch Smite and sharpshooter while being more accurate thanks to combining magic bow+magic arrows+bracers of archery+archery fighting style, using say Arcane Archer/Battlemaster/Brute, Rogue, and/or Kensei, up to 3 attacks worth at level 14+ depending on which build you go with, which can also give you more abilities than you get using invocations on the attacks?

Still not buying it.

I can spend one Invocation and one cantrip known to have the best consistent ranged DPR in the game.
-- or --
I can spend a fighting style, a feat, an invocation, try to find a specific magic item that requires attunement, try to find a magic weapon, try to find magic ammunition for that weapon, and have a better nova but less consistent damage.

Nope. Still not buying the point of it.

[Mikal]

Still not buying it.

I can spend one Invocation and one cantrip known to have the best consistent ranged DPR in the game.
-- or --
I can spend a fighting style, a feat, an invocation, try to find a specific magic item that requires attunement, try to find a magic weapon, try to find magic ammunition for that weapon, and have a better nova but less consistent damage.

Nope. Still not buying the point of it.

Well since the point of it is the appeal of an archer over EB, and not "which one is easier to do?", then I guess you're blind, since I've provided a mechanical reason of having more damage and more riders on your attacks, and others have provided both fluff and mechanical reasons.

[Easy_Lee]

Still not buying it.

I can spend one Invocation and one cantrip known to have the best consistent ranged DPR in the game.
-- or --
I can spend a fighting style, a feat, an invocation, try to find a specific magic item that requires attunement, try to find a magic weapon, try to find magic ammunition for that weapon, and have a better nova but less consistent damage.

Nope. Still not buying the point of it.

The combination of Devil's Sight, Sharpshooter, Elven Accuracy, and Eldritch Smite allows for far more damage than Agonizing EB. That makes sense as it's a much higher investment; four invocations, two feats, and a pact, in total, along with requiring an elf. One can add a fighter level at the start for con saves and archery, or three ranger levels for obvious reasons, but it's not necessary by any means.

At the extremes, a Hexblade with Elven Accuracy, Devil's Sight, and Agonizing Blast will not compete with the damage of a similar Hexblade who, instead of agonizing blast, takes Thirsting Blade, Improve Pact Weapon, Eldritch Smite, and picks up Sharpshooter. It's up to the individual player whether the trade is worth it.

[Kane0]

Checklist of things you might want:

- Extra attacks (fighter 5/11, warlock 5 invocation, etc)
- Fighter action surge
- Archery fighting style
- Smites (Warlock 5 invocation) and extra slots for them (MC into full caster or magic items)
- Cha SADness (Hexblade warlock)
- Magic weapon attacks (warlock, AA fighter, Kensai monk, magic weapon/ammo)
- Damage bonuses (hunter's mark, sneak attack, etc)
- Bonus action use (rogue cunning action, Monk Ki powers, Bard inspiration, etc)
- Reaction use (uncanny dodge, defensive spells, etc)
- AA magic shots or BM maneuvers
- Elven accuracy & sharpshooter feats

[Yuukale]

Checklist of things you might want:
- Smites (Warlock 5 invocation) and extra slots for them (MC into full caster or magic items)


Eldritch Smites are restricted to Warlock only slots, no other class helps on this, I'm afraid. Besides, the fighter's third attack at 11 is really tempting if you want a mostly martial class.

[Kane0]

Ah. Well, rod of the pact keeper would still work at least.

[Finlam]

At the extremes, a Hexblade with Elven Accuracy, Devil's Sight, and Agonizing Blast will not compete with the damage of a similar Hexblade who, instead of agonizing blast, takes Thirsting Blade, Improve Pact Weapon, Eldritch Smite, and picks up Sharpshooter. It's up to the individual player whether the trade is worth it.

Doesn't the warlock only have 2 or 3 spell slots? So you cast Darkness and then wait for a crit to smite once or twice if you're in tier 3. Then you hope there's not a second combat before your rest?


It almost seems like you'd be better off taking 2 levels of rogue instead of 1 level of fighter so you can bonus action hide every round to get advantage, Sneak Attack damage, 1 more invocation (from dropping devil's sight) and 1 more smite.

I kind of agree though that I don't much see the point bending over backwards to make mechanics work, when 6 words of fluff would do it too.

[Easy_Lee]

Doesn't the warlock only have 2 or 3 spell slots? So you cast Darkness and then wait for a crit to smite once or twice if you're in tier 3. Then you hope there's not a second combat before your rest?


It almost seems like you'd be better off taking 2 levels of rogue instead of 1 level of fighter so you can bonus action hide every round to get advantage, Sneak Attack damage, 1 more invocation (from dropping devil's sight) and 1 more smite.

I kind of agree though that I don't much see the point bending over backwards to make mechanics work, when 6 words of fluff would do it too.

That assumes you're the only one in the party capable of casting or benefiting from Darkness...or creating advantage, for that matter. Playgrounders always seem to behave as though everyone else in the party is a big dumb fighter.

[Finlam]

That assumes you're the only one in the party capable of casting or benefiting from Darkness...or creating advantage, for that matter. Playgrounders always seem to behave as though everyone else in the party is a big dumb fighter.

I think it's just kind of unusual to have multiple Warlocks with Devil's sight in the party.

There would probably be some serious edge to that party.

[Kane0]

Plus Drow for extra darkness. And edginess.

[Easy_Lee]

I think it's just kind of unusual to have multiple Warlocks with Devil's sight in the party.

There would probably be some serious edge to that party.


Plus Drow for extra darkness. And edginess.

My girlfriend and I will be playing a pair of drow bowlocks in our campaign starting next week, so I may have some bias in regard to this topic.

[Vogie]

Checklist of things you might want:

- Extra attacks (fighter 5/11, warlock 5 invocation, etc)
- Fighter action surge
- Archery fighting style
- Smites (Warlock 5 invocation) and extra slots for them (MC into full caster or magic items)
- Cha SADness (Hexblade warlock)
- Magic weapon attacks (warlock, AA fighter, Kensai monk, magic weapon/ammo)
- Damage bonuses (hunter's mark, sneak attack, etc)
- Bonus action use (rogue cunning action, Monk Ki powers, Bard inspiration, etc)
- Reaction use (uncanny dodge, defensive spells, etc)
- AA magic shots or BM maneuvers
- Elven accuracy & sharpshooter feats

If you don't want to go Hexblade, Archfey Patrons can also use Moon Bow, adding an extra 2d8 per level of spell slot spent (in addition to infinite ammo and advantage vs lycanthropes)

This will also help with your stats, less MAD, just needing the 13 Charisma to multiclass into it.

If you go Archfey Blade Warlock 3/Fighter 11 at 14, you'll have 3 attacks but no Eldritch Smite.

[Submortimer]

Still not buying it.

I can spend one Invocation and one cantrip known to have the best consistent ranged DPR in the game.
-- or --
I can spend a fighting style, a feat, an invocation, try to find a specific magic item that requires attunement, try to find a magic weapon, try to find magic ammunition for that weapon, and have a better nova but less consistent damage.

Nope. Still not buying the point of it.

I mean, you can have both, but there's a significant number benefit to going Archer:

Assuming Vhuman and a basic 27 point buy:
STR 10 DEX 14 CON 14
INT 8 WIS 12 CHA 16

V human Sharpshooter feat
1 Fighter Archery fighting style
1 Fighter/1 Warlock Hexblade
1 Fighter/2 Warlock Agonizing Blast, Devil's Sight
1 Fighter/3 Warlock Blade Pact
1 Fighter/4 Warlock +2 Charisma
1 Fighter/5 Warlock Improved Pact Weapon, swap
AB for Thirsting Blade

With this, you can be hitting for 2d8+2+28 (39) damage a round with a +5 to hit vs. Eldritch Blast doing 2d10+8 (19) with a +7 to hit. That's a decent jump for only a -2 hit to attack.

At level 11, the EB user jumps to 3d10+15 (31.5), but at level 13, the Archer jumps to 2d8+42 (51). Even with Hex, the EB user hits 4d10+20+4d6(56); by contrast, with Hex, the Archer hits 2d8+42+2d6(58).

All on its own, after 6th level, the archer flat out beats the EB on damage numbers at every turn. This becomes even better if you can get a magic bow that is +2 or better or take Crossbow Expert and upgrade to a Heavy crossbow.

In addition, with Half plate, you're sitting with a 17 AC without using any other resources or ASIs.

[MThurston]

It is a big waste to put value in Str for a hex blade. Cha, Wis, and Dex should be your focus.

Cha = Hitting with weapon
Wis = Spell damage and DC
Dex = A.C. and your goal is 16

Class option is Rogue. Attacks while in darkness gives you advantage and sneak attack.

Take Sharpshooter as a Variant Human at first level. War Caster isn't needed for this build. As a bonus action you can hold your bow in one hand to cast. Two hands is needed during the action phase.

You could go a different route and take crossbow expert to use heavy crossbows at 1d10 damage. I'd take sharpshooter later. This feat would allow you to cast EB and fire a hand crossbow as a bonus action until you get improved pact weapon and you could use Cha to attack with it.

Your next feat should be medium armour master or get your dex to 16. Be it a feat to add 1 Dex or just take the +2. The third feat should be the opposite what you did earlier.

Half plate with no disadvantage with 3 dex will get you to 18 AC.

If you feel safe in your Spell Darkness you could just add to Cha until 20.

Take assassin with poison use and you will be ridiculous. You would have to get a DM ruling but you crit on surprise hits. So shooting from Darkness should give you a possible 2 rounds of surprise with advantage. 6d6 sneak with poison damage puts a big hurt on your target.

[MThurston]

With this, you can be hitting for 2d8+2+28 (39) damage a round with a +5 to hit vs. Eldritch Blast doing 2d10+8 (19) with a +7 to hit. That's a decent jump for only a -2 hit to attack.

At level 11, the EB user jumps to 3d10+15 (31.5), but at level 13, the Archer jumps to 2d8+42 (51). Even with Hex, the EB user hits 4d10+20+4d6(56); by contrast, with Hex, the Archer hits 2d8+42+2d6(58).

Ok from what you posted.

Cha of 18 = +4 Mod.

So at 7th level 2 fighter/ 5 warlock you are at +3 Prof, +4 Mod, +1 weapon, +1 fighting style for a + 9 to hit.

Damage with no spells with both attacked hitting is 2d8 +10. If you action surge you can fire twice more. I am not sure how you are getting +2 and +28 for damage.

[RSP]

The combination of Devil's Sight, Sharpshooter, Elven Accuracy, and Eldritch Smite allows for far more damage than Agonizing EB. That makes sense as it's a much higher investment; four invocations, two feats, and a pact, in total, along with requiring an elf. One can add a fighter level at the start for con saves and archery, or three ranger levels for obvious reasons, but it's not necessary by any means.

At the extremes, a Hexblade with Elven Accuracy, Devil's Sight, and Agonizing Blast will not compete with the damage of a similar Hexblade who, instead of agonizing blast, takes Thirsting Blade, Improve Pact Weapon, Eldritch Smite, and picks up Sharpshooter. It's up to the individual player whether the trade is worth it.

So you need to Hexblade 7 for the 4 Invocations, but level 8 for the 2 feats (9 if starting fighter).

+3 Cha mod, +4 Prof, +2 Archery fighting style for +9 to hit
1d10+3 for longbow, +10 for SS.

+4, 1d10+13=~18.5

Vs

Maxed out Cha rather than feats for

+9, 1d10+5=~10.5

So for level 9 and 10 you get a little bit better damage for less consistency. And from 11 up, the lack of a 3rd Attack, to go along with the lower hit, is going to be a big impact.

Yes you can use Darkness to up your hit chance, but so can the EBer. Yes you can use Eldritch Smite, but you only have 2 slots per short rest (the EBer has 3 a level earlier).

Yes you could get bracers of archery but the EBer has the wand of the Pact master.

So it seems a very high investment for a little boost for 1-2 levels. All other levels you’re behind the EBer.

What am I missing?

[rbstr]

It is a big waste to put value in Str for a hex blade. Cha, Wis, and Dex should be your focus.

Cha = Hitting with weapon
Wis = Spell damage and DC
Dex = A.C. and your goal is 16

Wisdom is not the Warlocks casting stat. What are you talking about?



You could go a different route and take crossbow expert to use heavy crossbows at 1d10 damage. I'd take sharpshooter later. This feat would allow you to cast EB and fire a hand crossbow as a bonus action until you get improved pact weapon and you could use Cha to attack with it.


That's not how Crossbow Expert works: "When you use the Attack action and attack with a one-handed weapon, you can use a bonus action to attack
with a loaded hand crossbow you are holding."


You would have to get a DM ruling but you crit on surprise hits. So shooting from Darkness should give you a possible 2 rounds of surprise with advantage. 6d6 sneak with poison damage puts a big hurt on your target.
Surprise rules do not work this way at all. Enemies aren't surprised for multiple rounds ever. So that's a pretty big DM rule to try to count on.

You kinda need to go back and double check the rules you're trying to give advice on, dude. You've been pretty off-the-mark on a lot of stuff today.

[Snowbluff]

Ranged smites are the major selling point of a warlock archer. A battlemaster fighter or even Arcane Archer should beat the warlock for sustained damage most of the time, but only if the warlock is not able to rest consistently.


Having looked at it myself, 5 levels of warlock (Eldritch Smite, Extra Attack) combined with Whispers bard 5-10 (3d6 psychic blades recharging cha charges each SR, maybe pick up Holy Weapon) is a good ranged smiter.

However, I think Improved Pact Weapon is pointless if you can get a magic ranged weapon, like a +1 Handcrossbow which everyone can get in AL.

[Slayn82]

The greatest advantage of a longbow over Eldritch Blast is the range. That 150/600 range is huge. If you can perceive the enemies coming, it's about 3 - 5 rounds of pot shots. That's what makes flying familiars so good in my opinion. On a open field, they should be able to perceive most enemies at the 600 range (in a clear day, visibility is up to 2 miles). Dimension Door range is just 500 feet, an archer still can go for it. You already are firing at disadvantage, knowing the general direction usually is good enough.

But if the DM isn't willing to start encounters at such range, not so good. Unless the enemies are flying, usually.

[Snowbluff]

The greatest advantage of a longbow over Eldritch Blast is the range. That 150/600 range is huge. If you can perceive the enemies coming, it's about 3 - 5 rounds of pot shots. That's what makes flying familiars so good in my opinion. On a open field, they should be able to perceive most enemies at the 600 range (in a clear day, visibility is up to 2 miles). Dimension Door range is just 500 feet, an archer still can go for it. You already are firing at disadvantage, knowing the general direction usually is good enough.

But if the DM isn't willing to start encounters at such range, not so good. Unless the enemies are flying, usually.

Well, if you're spending invocations to use a bow, Eldritch Spear gives 300 foot range.

[Keravath]

One area where a bow might outperform eldritch blast would be for a rogue/warlock multiclass 15/5 or 13/7 ... bladelock with thirsting blade ... darkness+devils sight or greater invisibility (if fae bladelock) for advantage and to enable ranged sneak attack. One of the bow attacks then becomes d8+8d6 which might make it more competitive with eldritch blast (I haven't checked the math ... but sneak attack has the advantage of not being a limited resource like eldritch smite which is only once or twice a short rest ... and sneak attack would also be doubled on crits) ... so I could see someone arguing for a half-elf rogue/warlock with elven accuracy being a case where the bow might be better than eldritch blast (and you get all the other good things that come along with being a rogue).

However, this sort of build might make sharpshooter less desirable.

[MThurston]

Surprise rules do not work this way at all. Enemies aren't surprised for multiple rounds ever. So that's a pretty big DM rule to try to count on.



I mixed up spell use and bonus saves. Wis gets a bonus to your saves not spells attack and DC. Mixed that up in my head somehow.

Surprise
Anytime an opponent is flat footed you get an auto crit on a hit. They are surprised until they reach their init score. Then you roll init and if you go before them they are still surprised.

But this maybe old rules I am mixing into this.

[Snowbluff]

Surprise
Anytime an opponent is flat footed you get an auto crit on a hit. They are surprised until they reach their init score. Then you roll init and if you go before them they are still surprised.

But this maybe old rules I am mixing into this.

I have an assassin player in my games.

ANY combat actions starts with rolling init.

If they are "Surprised" a character spend their turn doing nothing, but is no longer surprised.

[MThurston]

After reading the rule I believe it works at such.

The DM checks passive perception. If noone notices then the Assassin has surprise on everyone until the end of turn 1 and not at the end of their turn.

So turn one would be everyone rolling init. The assassin attacks and gets surprise on any enemy that didn't notice the attack.

Turn 2 starts and no one is surprised.

Not sure how it works at night with a darkness spell up.

The party wouldn't know where the Attack came from and if you dropped the guy on watch, if no one woke up, I would give the Assassin Surprise until someone noticed the attacks.

[Snowbluff]

For further clarification, I am pretty sure surprise ends on the surprised creatures turn. You have to beat them in init as well to get the death blow.

[Vogie]

Surprise
Anytime an opponent is flat footed you get an auto crit on a hit. They are surprised until they reach their init score. Then you roll init and if you go before them they are still surprised.

Yeah, that's not 5e Rules. It looks like Pathfinder...

The thing that gave it away is the word "flat-footed".


Yep, definitely Pathfinder:

The Surprise Round: If some but not all of the combatants are aware of their opponents, a surprise round happens before regular rounds begin. In initiative order (highest to lowest), combatants who started the battle aware of their opponents each take a standard or move action during the surprise round. You can also take free actions during the surprise round. If no one or everyone is surprised, no surprise round occurs.

This is quite different (and more complicated) than 5e's Surprised Condition:

If you're surprised, you can't move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can't take a reaction until that turn ends.

[Kadesh]

Wis = Spell damage and DC

Wat.

Letters

[MThurston]

If you’re surprised, you can’t move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can’t take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can be surprised even if the other members aren’t.

Question
Do they mean player turn or Turn 1 as a whole?

Party of 5 people are asleep with the guy on watch also asleep. The assassin casts darkness and then fires into the group.

An init roll is made. Everyone rolls a 20 and the Assassin rolls a 1.

Are you telling me none of the sleeping characters are surprised?

[rbstr]

If you’re surprised, you can’t move or take an action on your first turn of the combat, and you can’t take a reaction until that turn ends. A member of a group can be surprised even if the other members aren’t.

Question
Do they mean player turn or Turn 1 as a whole?

Party of 5 people are asleep with the guy on watch also asleep. The assassin casts darkness and then fires into the group.

An init roll is made. Everyone rolls a 20 and the Assassin rolls a 1.

Are you telling me none of the sleeping characters are surprised?

Each individual that gets surprised is surprised until their particular turn has passed. So yeah, the assassin surprised them all but because he botched his roll and somehow tipped everyone off or derped around long enough that everyone else went before him so no one is surprised any more by the time he acts.

Determining who's surprised is a DM thing. In general it applies when the creature in question is not expecting, and doesn't get forewarning (like...making a sudden movement to your sword or whatnot).
In your example sleepers probably wouldn't even roll initiative until they were woken, at which point they might be surprised. (attacking one of them would certainly wake them up and force the initiative roll)
The DM has to decide if the little bit of commotion is enough to wake everyone up once an attack is made. Something like casting Silence might keep them asleep.
Maybe they aren't heavy sleepers and they hear the vocal component of the darkness spell or something. This really isn't supposed to super simulationist.

Darkness/being unseen might help you surprise someone...but after that it's just going to give you advantage on attacks against those that can't see you. If you've been attacked or witnessed someone being attacked you aren't going to end up with extra Surprised *the condition* beyond the first round.

[Blood of Gaea]

Why not do a normal Hexblade build, but use a bow? Sharpshooter, Elven Accuracy, 20 Cha. Maybe start with 1 level dip into fighter, but I'd probably pass on that until after I get my 9th level spell for Foresight.

[MThurston]

Why not do a normal Hexblade build, but use a bow? Sharpshooter, Elven Accuracy, 20 Cha. Maybe start with 1 level dip into fighter, but I'd probably pass on that until after I get my 9th level spell for Foresight.

Damage dealing will be your issue. You need you find ways to bump your damage. Rogue Assassin does that. Cast darkness on yourself and fire from distance. Bow use is better than Crossbow unless you take Crossbow expert.

[Vogie]

Damage dealing will be your issue. You need you find ways to bump your damage. Rogue Assassin does that. Cast darkness on yourself and fire from distance. Bow use is better than Crossbow unless you take Crossbow expert.

Or pick up 3 levels of Brute Fighter for 1d4 increase damage per shot, as well as a +2 to hit & action surge.

[Kadesh]

Or pick up 3 levels of Brute Fighter for 1d4 increase damage per shot, as well as a +2 to hit & action surge.
I think everyone turned round and went 'nope, that class is stupidly op compared to every other fighter subclass' and collectively ignored it.

It is UA over a year old, (or coming up for) and forgotten about, having not made it into any published book.

[Vogie]

I think everyone turned round and went 'nope, that class is stupidly op compared to every other fighter subclass' and collectively ignored it.

It is UA over a year old, (or coming up for) and forgotten about, having not made it into any published book.

Fine, then use the more-powerful Hunter Ranger with Colossus Slayer. Of course it hasn't made it into a published book - It came out 8 months ago, which was 3 months after XGtE... it wasn't in Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes because that isn't what the book was for.

And many people are speculating that it'll be part of the Guildmasters' Guide to Ravnica.

[MThurston]

It is UA over a year old, (or coming up for) and forgotten about, having not made it into any published book.

I just found this website and wanted to respond. It's a good question and there are multiple ways to look at it.

Fighter dip would give you +2 to hit with ranged weapons and at 5th level you could fire 4 arrows a turn and action surge for another 2. Very nasty.

You'd get 6d8 + 6d4 + 42 ( 90 average) from longbow. With 4 attacks you look at doing 4d8 + 4d4 + 28 ( 60 average). ( with curse )

Dipping into rogue assassin would also be crazy. Casting Darkness So you have advantage means your crit on 19, 20 is golden and the Surprise hit being a crit.

Cast darkness, bonus action Hex before you fire. Auto crit doing 4d8 + 10, + 6d6 Sneak attack and 2d6 Hex. That's 60 Damage on average for the first round and 35 Average after.

The above is not taking in a poisoned arrow which frankly is even worse. 2 Purple Worm shots would end anyone's surprised character. 16d8 damage adds 88 damage on average and that isn't crit damage so the total is 176 (crit poison) + 60 ( weapon damage) = 236 damage on average from two hits.

[Kadesh]

Fine, then use the more-powerful Hunter Ranger with Colossus Slayer. Of course it hasn't made it into a published book - It came out 8 months ago, which was 3 months after XGtE... it wasn't in Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes because that isn't what the book was for.

And many people are speculating that it'll be part of the Guildmasters' Guide to Ravnica.

1d8 1/Turn is more broken than nigh unresisted Force Damage, at level 11 making more attacks at 1d6, compared to 1d8 potentially resisted weapon damage? And I'm going off what the creator of the game and writer has said. If UA has been made and not released within a year, it's not going to be. We shall see if a Brute Fighter as it stands makes its current iteration appearance within the Ravnica.