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View Full Version : What are some classical weaknesses of various undead?



Greywander
2018-01-18, 07:46 PM
I've been working on what started as a playable lich race/template for D&D 5e, but I realized that what I'd created could actually work as a base for making ghosts, vampires, death knights, and really any type of undead character with just a bit of refluffing. Since then, I've been trying to rework the race with more options so you can customize it to fit the undead concept you like, but I'm running into a bit of a brick wall when it comes to your weaknesses.

It's a fairly well-worn trope that powerful undead (or powerful anyone, really) have some critical weakness that can be exploited to bring them down. For example, a classic is the vampire that loses access to all their supernatural powers when in sunlight, essentially making them just like a mortal, living human. So sort of like a reverse-superman. So I'm looking for some other optional weaknesses players can choose based on what type of undead they want to be, but I'm drawing a blank.

Since I originally envisioned this as a lich race, I built in a weakness specific for that type of lich, but it wouldn't really apply to any other type of undead. It would, however, serve as an example of how easy such a weakness should be to exploit as well as how debilitating that weakness should be. This is an atypical lich that has no phylactery. Instead, they have something I'm calling a lichstone that serves as their power source. Unlike 5e liches, these liches don't need to feed souls to their lichstone, instead it connects directly to the lower planes to channel negative energy into the lich. However, the lich has to carry their lichstone with them (usually inside their body), and thus there's no chance to hide it away. If the lichstone is lost or destroyed, or is inside an anti-magic field or a force cage, then the lich can't benefit from resting and thus can't regain their power. Several of their abilities, notably those that involve regeneration, also become disabled (not all liches will get these abilities, though; you can choose a few from a large selection as you level).

So, the main points of such a weakness are that it disables some key abilities as well as prevents you from healing or restoring yourself (especially regenerating a new body). Accessing this weakness is neither easy nor difficult (defeating the lich nearly guaranties that you'll be able to take its lichstone, but attacking or stealing it without defeating the lich will be difficult). So far, aside from the sunlight example above, the only other weakness I've come up with is a stake through the heart (probably with a silver weapon). Getting out of the sunlight, or removing the stake ends the debilitation, as does creating a new lichstone.

What are some other weaknesses I could use that offer similar levels of debilitation and ease of exploitation? Since this is designed with PCs in mind, these probably shouldn't be so debilitating that it prevents the character from adventuring. I'm toying with the idea of an inability to cross running water, but I'm not sure if that would get too much in the way of adventuring.

CinuzIta
2018-01-19, 11:56 AM
Well, as you already stated out, there’s the weakness to the running water but this could get in they way of a PC (although one might find it to be just an obstacle to overcome, adding something to the role play)! What about if the weakness kicks in if the undead is soaked in holy water?

JeenLeen
2018-01-19, 12:14 PM
I'll run through some weaknesses and how they might work on a PC. My main thought process will be if it would be so annoying as to make the race not fun for that PC and the other players. When that's the case, the weakness should probably be scrapped (or be minor.)

Hmm... thinking on it a bit more. Maybe stuff that is really annoying, like being unable to cross living water, just has a temporary weakness. Thus, it doesn't mean the lich holds up the party by making them reroute to avoid a river (since the weakness will wear off by the time it would matter), but rather that rivers matter tactically in combat. Disadvantage on certain actions while afflicted by the bane, and perhaps for the rest of the battle, seem reasonable for 'minor' weaknesses like running water.

So here goes.
Running (aka, living) water -- if simply cannot cross, prohibitive. But a temporary weakness makes it feasible without rendering the lich useless in combat near water.
Stake through the heart -- NA for liches, but applicable for vampires. I think I've seen 3.5 rules for a 'called shot' to the heart, which if does enough damage causes paralysis.
Holy/blessed weapons -- although it seems awful for a PC race, vulnerability to holy energy type seems reasonable. (I forget the technical 5e term.) Add resistance to Necrotic damage.
Sacred ground -- have the undead feel uncomfortable and with a minor weakness in places consecreated to Good deities, and maybe most Neutrals. Maybe disadvantage on rolls?
Sacred symbols -- as sacred ground, but near holy symbols of good deities
Garlic -- more a vamp thing. Disadvantage or minor damage seems reasonable.
Sunlight -- again, more a vamp thing. Prohibitive if this is too major a weakness for a PC, so I think even disadvantage is too much, unless you allow stuff like heavy clothing to protect them. Maybe extended exposure causes levels of fatigue?
Silver weapons -- vulnerability to silver seems too strong, and adding DR just to let this bypass it seems too powerful, too. Probably best not to try to work into a PC

And there's decapitation or destroyed head, but that generally kills anyone, so not really a weakness particular to undead.

I could see trying to balance some of the above by giving advantage in the present of things linked to negative energy, but that's probably be overpowered since an intelligent player would make it so the boon happens often the bane almost never.

Also, note that in 5e that, generally, healing spells do not harm undead, nor do necrotic spells heal undead. (Although there are exceptions, and I think a handful of positive energy healing spells even heal undead, since they lack the clause that undead are uneffected.) You probably want to give some resistance to turning.


EDIT: two other things that came to mind are salt and grave dirt. I forget how the latter sometimes worked, though.

Greywander
2018-01-19, 08:46 PM
I'll run through some weaknesses and how they might work on a PC. My main thought process will be if it would be so annoying as to make the race not fun for that PC and the other players. When that's the case, the weakness should probably be scrapped (or be minor.)
This is a good rule of thumb.


Disadvantage on certain actions while afflicted by the bane...
I've decided I like this word better than weakness.


Holy/blessed weapons -- although it seems awful for a PC race, vulnerability to holy energy type seems reasonable. (I forget the technical 5e term.) Add resistance to Necrotic damage.
You're thinking of radiant damage. Thing is, radiant damage is reasonably rare and most existing undead in the Monster Manual aren't actually weak to radiant damage (neither do they resist it, though).


Sacred ground -- have the undead feel uncomfortable and with a minor weakness in places consecreated to Good deities, and maybe most Neutrals. Maybe disadvantage on rolls?
Sacred symbols -- as sacred ground, but near holy symbols of good deities
What if you want to play an undead cleric of a good deity? Part of the purpose of this undead race is to provide a way to play a non-evil undead, should the player so choose.


Also, note that in 5e that, generally, healing spells do not harm undead, nor do necrotic spells heal undead. (Although there are exceptions, and I think a handful of positive energy healing spells even heal undead, since they lack the clause that undead are uneffected.) You probably want to give some resistance to turning.
Yup, this is why I've come to see that what I thought was a "slightly overpowered" undead race was actually more on par with existing races than I thought. The difficulty of healing as well as being treated like a monster if you reveal your true self both help to balance out the benefits of undeath.

I've made a number of upgrades available to the undead character as they gain levels and better attune to their undead existence. One of them includes resistance to turning. Another includes resistance, and eventually immunity, to non-silvered weapons. Part of the reason I was looking for different weaknesses/banes was because another ability allows the character to form a new body if theirs is destroyed, much like a lich. I felt that there needed to be a mechanism that would prevent them from being able to reform, as well as imposing other limitations that make them weaker. Not every undead character will choose to get this ability (what makes it so good for a classic lich is that they can hide away their phylactery in a safe place; no such option exists here). For undead characters that don't take this ability, or aren't high enough level to get it yet, they can still die pretty easily.

Here's what I've come up with so far:

Lichstone. I've already talked about this a bit. It's basically the atypical lich's power source, and has to be carried with them. Without it you cannot rest to recover HP/abilities. It's pretty easy to extract it after the lich is defeated, but it's also possible, albeit more difficult, to rip it out of the lich or attack it directly while the lich is still alive and kicking. The lichstone is immune to all damage except radiant. Replacing your lichstone requires a 7th level homebrew spell and 1000 gp, so not easy or cheap.

Sunlight. I briefly considered making the character take damage when in sunlight, but I'm not that cruel. Since sunlight is common, the weakness is also fairly minor. You can't use a narrow list of abilities, regain HP, or benefit from resting (who rests in sunlight?), until you get out of the sun. Reforming your body is a little trickier, since it takes several days to reform, and sunlight blocks this ability.

Stake to the Heart. You can only be staked by silver or magical weapon; mundane weapons don't work. You also can't be staked unless you're unconscious, prone, grappled, or restrained, or if you're below half HP. Getting staked paralyzes you; remove the stake before your body is destroyed and you're golden.

Decapitation. Again, only with silver or magical weapons. Unlike most undead, you can actually survive decapitation, and be restored to unlife if your head is reattached. Getting beheaded by a mundane weapon still allows you to regenerate a new head if you have the proper ability.

Coffin. You have to sleep in your coffin for 6 hours during a long rest in order to gain the benefits, so you need to take it with you or leave it someplace you'll be returning to frequently. It's like a heavier, more inconvenient version of the lichstone, but it's easier to replace if it gets destroyed, as well as easier to hide away if you don't need immediate access to it. The ritual to replace it involves holding a funeral where you are buried in your new coffin, and at dusk you can exhume it. I really like the flavor of this one.

The options above will hopefully give a DM ways to threaten such a player with death, particularly from a determined group of necrophobic paladins and clerics, while still making the regeneration ability useful against random mooks. In addition to the above, each undead character has a secondary weakness, mostly a damage vulnerability. It doesn't block their powers, it just makes them a bit easier to kill.

Brittle. Vulnerability to bludgeoning damage. Skeletons in the Monster Manual have this vulnerability, so it seemed appropriate.
Decrepit. Vulnerability to slashing damage. Not in 5e, but I seem to recall hearing that zombies in past editions were weak to slashing damage.
Shadow. Vulnerability to radiant damage, and sunlight sensitivity (disadvantage on sight-based checks when in direct sunlight). A classic, and meshes nicely with the above sunlight bane.
Kindling. Vulnerability to fire damage. Also a classic.
Hydrophobic. Running water deals acid damage to you. Less restrictive than simply not letting you cross running water, and rare enough that most of the time it won't matter.

Undead players can mix 'n match their weaknesses, as well as the special undead upgrades they want, making them quite customizable. I kind of want to play in a party of undead characters now.

aimlessPolymath
2018-01-20, 01:43 AM
Both demons and vampires traditionally share a weakness to thresholds, or common courtesy- they must be invited in. In general, I think that there are two kinds of vulnerabilities, which can sometimes overlap:

-Physical vulnerabilities, the sort of thing that hunters might carry if they're adequately prepared- stakes, holy water, mirrors, garlic, the various damage vulnerabilities that were listed a post or two ago. These are relatively easy to assign "point" values to, IMO.
-Behavioral vulnerabilities. A vampire can't cross thresholds willingly without permission. They also hate going out in the sunlight, making it a viable kill option, even if you can't carry sunlight around with you. While I think it's easier to create these (a lich who sealed not only his name but his native tongue away, making it impossible for Death to find him, is vulnerable to a whole slew of loanwords in related languages), it seems relatively difficult to assign values to.

Generally, I like to have vulnerabilities be thematically connected to the method of the undead's creation. Salt mummies are vulnerable to water, those who died to drowning might be vulnerable to some kinds of sailor's superstitions (salt, alcohol, cannot cross the path of a seagull, etc.), ghouls (which in my headcannon died of starvation or from cannibalism-related disease) must consume fresh meat if it is offered to them, etc. I would score this vulnerability based on how common it is, and how easily it can be acquired if necessary- rare or difficult-to-create components are worth very low amounts or possibly nothing, commonly available and cheap things (like salt, garlic, a mirror, running water) might be somewhere in the middle.