Dusk-Blade/Shadowlord Telleporting swordsman questions

[Vhagar]

Currently I’m playing a Half-Dragon Dusk-Blade. I know that Dusk-Blades don’t really prestige well but I read somewhere about a way of mixing them with Telflammar Shadowlord to create a teleporting swordsman. (Through the use of Shadow Pounce and Dimension Hop)

I talked to the DM about this and we worked out the logistics. Apparently I would need to dip into rogue and a achieve a whole slew of other things to even qualify. A teleporting swordsman sounds pretty cool but I am starting to wonder if it’s worth all the trouble.

What do you guys think? Do you think the yield will be worth the long road to get to this prestige class? Is there another prestige class you think is more suitable for my character, or should I stick to the straight and narrow and just do dusk blade exclusively.

[Raendyn]

Crinti shadow marauder gets shadow pounce while its prereqs are easier.

Less feats, less ranks, no sneak attack, no LA templates ^ ^

Book is Shining South p.36. should be easy to pass through the DM cuz its also an FR supplement.

I you wanna jump into this at a logical lvl you still need a dip out of Duskblade. Something with hide/move silently as class skill. Although rogue is a prime candidate again it offers more flexibility that Shadowlord prereqs, and it can be anything, ranger comes to mind or swordsage if you are into maneuvers.

[Lapak]

swordsage if you are into maneuvers.My first thought was Swordsage for the tactical-teleport maneuvers line, but I will admit I did not look at how it would blend with advancing Duskblade. Going into Jade Phoenix Mage after would advance spellcasting and maneuvers but not other class features, so there’s still a bit of trade off going on.

[Darrin]

What do you guys think? Do you think the yield will be worth the long road to get to this prestige class? Is there another prestige class you think is more suitable for my character, or should I stick to the straight and narrow and just do dusk blade exclusively.

The trick, as I understand it, is to use a full-round channel of dimension hop, attack one or two opponents, and then make a touch attack against yourself as your last attack. There's been some argument over whether or not you can deliberately "fail" your Armor Class, but it's a touch attack against yourself so, all pedantry aside, I'm not sure it's a really worthwhile argument.

The problem is it takes quite a long time to get this trick off the ground. You need Duskblade 13 and Telflammar Shadowlord 4, and also somehow qualify for the bizarre grab bag of entry requirements for Shadowlord. Hide and Move Silently are not class skills for Duskblades, and getting 2d6 sneak attack is going to take another 1-3 class levels or two feat slots you don't have much room for. If you have access to flaws (UA) or Dragon Magazine, there are a few things that can make this easier: Flexible Mind feat or the Survivalist Fighter variant. Trade the Survivalist bonus fighter feat for 1d6 sneak attack, and then take Dragonfire Strike to bump it up to 2d6. Or take Martial Study/Martial stance from Tome of Battle to pick up Assassin's Stance.

Race: Human
Stub: Duskblade 13/Telflammar Shadowlord 4
Feats: Flexible Mind (Flaw), Blind-Fight (Flaw), Dodge (Human), Mobility (1st), Darkstalker (3rd), Spring Attack (6th), Martial Study (9th), Martial Stance (12th), Elusive Target (15th)

A dip into Survivalist Fighter 1 or Swordsage 1 helps you free up more feat slots.

Crinti Shadow Marauder's prereqs are a little more sane (Mounted Combat and Stealthy), but you have to be Crinti (which isn't entirely clear by the rules) or have the official sanction of the Dambrath nobility. When this came up in an Iron Chef competition, the ruling we came up with was that Crinti could be drow, half-drow, or human (with "drow ancestry", whatever that means), which is a pretty loose interpretation. A stricter reading would probably be, Crinti = half-drow.

Duskblade 13/Crinti Shadow Marauder 5 doesn't kick in until ECL 18, but you don't have to jump through so many hoops to qualify.

[Lapak]

Someone else would have to check my calculations here as I am away from the books, but I believe Duskblade/Swordsage/JPM focused on getting the Shadow X teleport maneuvers would get you move-action teleports at 12 and Swift-Action at 16. It has the advantage of being a straightforward build but loses three caster levels on Duskblade and never gets full-attack Arcane Channeling.

Course, there are non-Duskblade ways of doing ‘teleporting swordsman’ but I think that might be one of the shortest paths to it with a Duskblade-heavy build.

[Vhagar]

Reading through your comments the general consensus seems to be that this may not be with the trouble? Perhaps I need to compromise a little. Is there any way to at least teleport myself with demention hop and still have an action left to inniciate an attack?

Also if anyone has some suggestions on what an interesting prestige class would be to further my character and would work well with duskblade (and half dragon template) I’m open to alternatives!

[Sam K]

Reading through your comments the general consensus seems to be that this may not be with the trouble? Perhaps I need to compromise a little. Is there any way to at least teleport myself with demention hop and still have an action left to inniciate an attack?

Also if anyone has some suggestions on what an interesting prestige class would be to further my character and would work well with duskblade (and half dragon template) I’m open to alternatives!

Dipping swordsage. Even a single level (at the right time) could get you a move-action teleport. Though with how swordsage recovery works, you'll likely only get one use of it per fight.

If you just want the feel of teleporting, perhaps getting access to blink would do it? You'll be porting around all the time, not great for tactical movement though.

[Darrin]

Is there any way to at least teleport myself with demention hop and still have an action left to inniciate an attack?


There are a few different methods to teleport without using a standard action:

Totemist 2 + Blink Shirt soulmeld. This lets you use dimension door as a move action. However, you still have the "can't take any other actions until your next turn" restriction, so you'd need something like Shadow Pounce or Sun School (Complete Warrior) to initiate an attack.
Shadow Stride (move action) or Shadow Blink (swift action) maneuvers. You can probably get Shadow Stride via a Swordsage dip or the Martial Study feat (your Initiator Level needs to be at least 9), but Shadow Blink would require way too many non-Duskblade levels.
Anklet of Translocation (1400 GP, MIC) or Boots of Swift Passage (5000 GP, MIC). Both are 2/day items.
Glyph Seal (1000 GP, MIC). Cast dimension hop into this spell-storing item, and then key the seal to something that you can open or grab as a free action, such as a pocket with ammunition or spell components. Opening a pocket or grabbing an arrow is a free action, which triggers the spell. You can then take a standard or full action as normal.
Use the Hidden Talent feat or an Ardent dip to pick up dimension hop from the Freedom Mantle (Complete Psionic). Swift action 10' teleport for 1 PP. There are a variety of ways to reduce the PP costs of augmenting it, such as Midnight Augmentation or Linked Power/Metapower shenanigans.




Also if anyone has some suggestions on what an interesting prestige class would be to further my character and would work well with duskblade (and half dragon template) I’m open to alternatives!

Well, first there's Abjurant Champion 5 (Complete Mage), which you pretty much qualify for by knowing any abjuration spell, such as resist energy, deflect, or touching dispel. You can toss on a Spellsword 1 dip (Complete Warrior) if you want the -10% ASF for some reason. A dip into Sandshaper (Sandstorm) loses a caster level but adds a bunch of new spells to your list.

Duskblade 13/Nar Demonbinder 7 has a nice symmetry to it, and gives you access to some 5th/6th/7th/8th-level spells. Feat tax is a bit aggravating, though... you'll need Iron Will (possibly via Otyugh Hole from Complete Scoundrel), Spell Focus (Conjuration), and something that gives you a summon spell, such as Arcane Disciple.

Paragnostic Apostle (Complete Champion) is good for "I want some class abilities but I don't want to lose caster levels."

[Deadline]

Is there any way to at least teleport myself with demention hop and still have an action left to inniciate an attack?

In addition to the other methods mentioned, there's also the Sun School tactical feat from Complete Warrior. The Flash of Sunset benefit lets you make a single attack at your highest bonus against a foe you teleport adjacently to (even when using things that normally end your turn, like D-Door).

The only issue with that is Sun School requires flurry of blows, which is really hard to come by without a dip in Monk. That might not be a huge issue though.

Question for the board, is there any way to get the Shadow Pounce ability aside from Telflammar Shadowlord or Crinti Shadow Marauder?

[DEMON]

Question for the board, is there any way to get the Shadow Pounce ability aside from Telflammar Shadowlord or Crinti Shadow Marauder?

Blade of Orien (Dragonmarked) level 10 gives you something very similar to this. It's very easy to qualify for (including through Dragonmark Heir) but does not improve spellcasting at all.