Crusader / Swordsage / Master of the Nine

[Kesnit]

I've always limed ToB, but every time I've built a character from it, the game has ended soon after.

I play in a mostly-Pathfinder game with several friends. (I say mostly Pathfinder because things from 3.5 that weren't brought to Pathfinder are allowed.) I'm currently playing a Brawler. The rest of the party is a Gunslinger/Alchemist, an ice Sorcerer/Cleric/Mystic Theurge, and a Bard. (The Bard - played by my wife - is new, as she just surrendered her fire Sorcerer last night to save an NPC. She has not looked at the bard options, so all I know about the character is that she wants to be support and skill-monkey.)

As I like to have back-up characters handy (because the DM does not pull punches and plot twists happen), I'm putting together my back-up character. Since the rest of the party are all ranged/DPS, I'd like to keep my position as the front-link "tank." (I know tanking does not work well, which is why the word is in quotes. At the moment, I'm focused on crowd-control using combat maneuvers.) I came up with the idea of making a character with the subject classes.

However, this is about as far as I've managed to get. I like ToB, but since I haven't been able to play much with it, I don't really know how to build with it. (The two PCs I've built were pretty simple - a pure Crusader and a SS/Bloodclaw Master.) So I turn to the experts with my questions...

1) Would it be better to focus more on Crusader or Swordsage, given what I want to be able to do? I prefer Swordsage, but I know Crusader is better at the "tank" role.

2) What would be a good breakdown for the two base classes?

The party is LVL 11.

[Darrin]

1) Would it be better to focus more on Crusader or Swordsage, given what I want to be able to do? I prefer Swordsage, but I know Crusader is better at the "tank" role.


If you're going to do any tanking, then Crusader is the way to go. Crusader is going to need a dip (or several) to qualify for Master of Nine, though.



2) What would be a good breakdown for the two base classes?


I'm not sure what you mean by breakdown...?

Human Crusader 8/Warblade 1 can get into Master of Nine, but all your feat slots are full of feat taxes.

Human Unarmed Swordsage can get in with just Swordsage 7, but it's not entirely clear if the Unarmed variant actually gets Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat (ask the DM).

Check this other thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?549429-Warblade-Master-of-the-Nine-Build-Help) for advice on dips to get into Master of Nine.

[Kesnit]

I'm not sure what you mean by breakdown...?

How many levels of Crusader and how many of Swordsage?

[Hellpyre]

Since this is PF, have you taken a look at Path of War, by chance? It takes the basics of the system in ToB and expands it pretty widely.

[Kesnit]

Since this is PF, have you taken a look at Path of War, by chance? It takes the basics of the system in ToB and expands it pretty widely.

None of us have the book, which is why I'm looking at ToB.

[Galacktic]

None of us have the book, which is why I'm looking at ToB.

The Path of War is on the PFSRD, actually!

[Darrin]

How many levels of Crusader and how many of Swordsage?

Ah! Well, if you want a 3rd level Shadow Hand stance, such as Assassin's Stance or Dance of the Spider, then Crusader 6/Swordsage 2 works well. If you want a 3rd level Devoted Spirit stance, such as Thicket of Blades (popular with Lockdown Tanks), then Swordsage 6/Crusader 2. After that, take another level of Crusader and your last prereq feat for Master of Nine. Once you finish Master of Nine, you can tank it out with more Crusader levels or dabble around with the oodles of Swordsage maneuvers.