Having trouble writing plot for urban adventure - Feedback/Critique much appreciated!

[Rutgew]

Hello,

I am a first-time DM for a group of four first-time players. So far, it's been going pretty well, using self-contained adventures and one-shots to progress players to 3rd level (although there is no theme or overarching stoy to the campaign yet). Lately, I made the players arrive in a small city. I planned for a sort of mini-campaign, consisting of multiple adventures in and around the city. My goal was to make the players experience that their actions can have consequences across multiple adventures, and to introduce them to scenarios that blur the lines of morality.

However, I feel like I bit off more than I can chew. After changing the story multiple times, I don't know what to do with it anymore to make it a nice balance between surprising and logical for the players. I would really appreciate some feedback on how to progress the story from fellow players/DMs, to get some fresh views and opinions!

---

This is what the players have experienced so far:
- Torrin is a small merchant city on the crossroads of trade routes, ruled by a city council of nobles headed by the mayor.
- In a few days, there will be a town festival.
- While shopping, the players found out that the town's guard employed all the smithies in town to make weapons and armor.
- The mayor told them that criminality has seen a spike recently, with goblins endangering the surrounding roads and the thieves' guild getting more powerful inside the town.
- The players took care of a cave full of goblins outside of town.
- The next day, they noticed a robbery by a group of Kenku, which they fought in an alley. They managed to keep one alive, which was taken by the guards.
- Next session, the players will probably want to interrogate the Kenku and further investigate the reasons for this rise in criminal activity.

This is what I had planned for the story:
- The thieves guild operate from the sewers and run a black market.
- The rising criminality was enabled by a lack of investments in the town's guard for years on end. The fruitless struggle for funds has turned the general of the town guard into a bitter man. His trust in the city council has been lost and he plans for a military coup.
- In order to execute a coup, he needs funds to hire mercenaries and equipment. He set up a scheme with the leader of the thieves guild: the town's guard would let the thieves guild run their opperations, in exchange for a slice of the cake. This has caused the recent spike in criminal activity.
- The thieves guild suspect that the town's guard is planning something, but don't know what specifically. They want to profit from their arrangement as long as it lasts. Hoewever, if they find out (either before or after the coup) the thieves will want to prevent the town guard from seizing control.
- The coup is to take place during the town festival, at the mayor's party for the nobility.
- Ultimately, I planned for the players to have to decide what power to side with - the town's guard or the thieves guild? Or take them both on? I hope this would be a choice between two bad options that will make the players debate and doubt their alliances.

These are the problems that I am afraid of:
- The story is overly complicated (too many characters, factions and possibilities) and doesnt make that much sense.
- The lack of direction might make players focus on one aspect (for example: taking on the thieves guild), only to be told "that's nice and all, but suddenly the town guard attempt to seize power over the city". I am afraid that the plot twist will come too much out of left field, because I introduced too many factions and potential plot hooks at once.
- The story relies a lot on things that happened in the past. How will I communicate all these background story elements to the players without simply spelling it out for them?

---

If you've made it this far down the post - thank you so much for your attention!
Any suggestions on how to streamline this story, or suggestions for much more interesting directions to take this story in, would be much appreciated!

[Ronnocius]

Hello,

I am a first-time DM for a group of four first-time players. So far, it's been going pretty well, using self-contained adventures and one-shots to progress players to 3rd level (although there is no theme or overarching stoy to the campaign yet). Lately, I made the players arrive in a small city. I planned for a sort of mini-campaign, consisting of multiple adventures in and around the city. My goal was to make the players experience that their actions can have consequences across multiple adventures, and to introduce them to scenarios that blur the lines of morality.

However, I feel like I bit off more than I can chew. After changing the story multiple times, I don't know what to do with it anymore to make it a nice balance between surprising and logical for the players. I would really appreciate some feedback on how to progress the story from fellow players/DMs, to get some fresh views and opinions!

---

This is what the players have experienced so far:
- Torrin is a small merchant city on the crossroads of trade routes, ruled by a city council of nobles headed by the mayor.
- In a few days, there will be a town festival.
- While shopping, the players found out that the town's guard employed all the smithies in town to make weapons and armor.
- The mayor told them that criminality has seen a spike recently, with goblins endangering the surrounding roads and the thieves' guild getting more powerful inside the town.
- The players took care of a cave full of goblins outside of town.
- The next day, they noticed a robbery by a group of Kenku, which they fought in an alley. They managed to keep one alive, which was taken by the guards.
- Next session, the players will probably want to interrogate the Kenku and further investigate the reasons for this rise in criminal activity.

This is what I had planned for the story:
- The thieves guild operate from the sewers and run a black market.
- The rising criminality was enabled by a lack of investments in the town's guard for years on end. The fruitless struggle for funds has turned the general of the town guard into a bitter man. His trust in the city council has been lost and he plans for a military coup.
- In order to execute a coup, he needs funds to hire mercenaries and equipment. He set up a scheme with the leader of the thieves guild: the town's guard would let the thieves guild run their opperations, in exchange for a slice of the cake. This has caused the recent spike in criminal activity.
- The thieves guild suspect that the town's guard is planning something, but don't know what specifically. They want to profit from their arrangement as long as it lasts. Hoewever, if they find out (either before or after the coup) the thieves will want to prevent the town guard from seizing control.
- The coup is to take place during the town festival, at the mayor's party for the nobility.
- Ultimately, I planned for the players to have to decide what power to side with - the town's guard or the thieves guild? Or take them both on? I hope this would be a choice between two bad options that will make the players debate and doubt their alliances.

These are the problems that I am afraid of:
- The story is overly complicated (too many characters, factions and possibilities) and doesnt make that much sense.
- The lack of direction might make players focus on one aspect (for example: taking on the thieves guild), only to be told "that's nice and all, but suddenly the town guard attempt to seize power over the city". I am afraid that the plot twist will come too much out of left field, because I introduced too many factions and potential plot hooks at once.
- The story relies a lot on things that happened in the past. How will I communicate all these background story elements to the players without simply spelling it out for them?

---

If you've made it this far down the post - thank you so much for your attention!
Any suggestions on how to streamline this story, or suggestions for much more interesting directions to take this story in, would be much appreciated!

The story doesn't seem too complicated to me, but I would make it very obvious that there is discontent within the town guard. Show how poor their equipment is, maybe have some of them go on strike until they get more funding, only for the mayor to order them locked up.
In some ways this reminds me of the beginning of Mount & Blade. You could use the story from that game (bandits kidnap local merchant's brother and deliver ransom demand, merchant hires players to interrogate the bandits who are awaiting the ransom for the location of their hideout, where they can go to rescue his brother) and at the hideout have them find some evidence linking the bandits to the town guard. Just as they return to the town the coup would commence. These are just my thoughts, and would need some modification to be more helpful to you.

[Rutgew]

The story doesn't seem too complicated to me, but I would make it very obvious that there is discontent within the town guard. Show how poor their equipment is, maybe have some of them go on strike until they get more funding, only for the mayor to order them locked up.
In some ways this reminds me of the beginning of Mount & Blade. You could use the story from that game (bandits kidnap local merchant's brother and deliver ransom demand, merchant hires players to interrogate the bandits who are awaiting the ransom for the location of their hideout, where they can go to rescue his brother) and at the hideout have them find some evidence linking the bandits to the town guard. Just as they return to the town the coup would commence. These are just my thoughts, and would need some modification to be more helpful to you.

Thanks a bunch for the reply! I really like the suggestion of making the town guard go on a strike. The PCs have already befriended some of the guards and regularly want to hang out with them, so those guys can be a good hook for the players.
I have not played Mount and Blade, but I will look up the story part you mentioned and see what I might be able to use from it! Your summary sounds like it definitelly has some similarities.

[inexorabletruth]

I can respect the depth of your storyline. I like the potential for the conflict, both external and internal. If you're worried that your players wont catch all the nuances, then that's a perfectly reasonable concern... and is the expected side effect of any decent sandbox campaign.

If it feels like your players are getting tunnel vision, have them roll some skill checks. I don't know what system you are playing on, but I play a lot of 3.5 which has a lot of skills. I'll use Sense Motive, Spot, and Gather Information a lot. No result yields no information on these checks. Good rolls give the characters good info and incredible insight into the plot intricacies. Bad rolls give the characters limited insight, or bad intel into the finer points of the plot. Either way, your players will have to work together (or against each other) to suss out the truth. And keeping them rolling checks every time they make a decision will keep them on their toes and questioning themselves, which will cause them to pay closer attention to the plot.

Also, it's a courteous way to gently meta-warn them "I tried to warn you" if they do decide to condone the subplots and context clues. But it's also reasonable and fair. Adventurers are finely honed, supernatural creatures of destiny... but players are usually just normal people. 14 or higher in INT/WIS/ or CHA is usually enough to warp the laws of physics, time and reality, if not destroy them utterly. It stands to reason that the character would be able to understand the subtle intricacies of conspiracy and intrigue that a player might not so easily notice.

[denthor]

Let your players sort it out they will dictate the course of action.

If they choose goblins. If they chose sewers. Then go with it.

If they chose drink in a tavern. Send the rumors in.

I am guessing they look like adventurer type. Have representation from all sides contact them. Role play.

[Anonymouswizard]

Okay notes:
-If you want your PCs to interact with this plot, set up a scene to draw them in. Many players have difficulty when there's apparently nothing to do, either freezing up or performing random actions that will move then away from the plot as often as not. It doesn't have to be explicit, although if they miss the first set of clues then make the next set a boot more obvious, and so on until they bite.
-Once they're hooked let them carry the plot. Sometimes you'll want to pull an 'all roads lead to Rome' and have the same scene happen no matter what, but most of the time have a variety of options to pick from and alter the one that fits the situation best on the fly.
-Provide multiple opportunities to investigate, and multiple ways for the PCs to go. If they want to use the coup to try and take over the town themselves, let them.
-There is always another clue. The classic advice is to prepare three, because you're players will miss the first, misinterpret the second, and destroy the third, then by some bizarre leap of logic work out what you were trying to hint at anyway. But of they still don't get it cone up with a fourth, then a fifth, then a thirteenth.
-If the PCs are investigating but can't move forward for stone reason, whoever they've annoyed the mist hires assassins. The assassins just so happen to have a clue on them.

In all your plot doesn't sound too complex. I suggest picking a name other than 'Thieves' Guild' for the TG's actual name, as they won't be an official guild (unless we're running an Ankh-Morpork style setting). Of, they might still be called that informally, but the name among themselves will likely be something else.

If the city is large enough they might also have a merchant's association or something similar protecting the rights of traders, which will be very annoyed by the goings on. If the PCs refuse to get involved without payment have the MA hire them to guide a shop or the marketplace for a couple of days (and tell the players it's just to get the adventure going).

Think of other groups that might be grumbling, maybe a few taverns or public houses (a.k.a. pubs) are struggling because the increased crime means that their normal clients don't have the money to come anymore. The town's government will also likely be interacting with the guard a lot to try to deal with the rising crime rate. Meanwhile mercenaries get easy but relatively boring jobs protecting merchants and wares. Yes, this could make the adventure more complex, but you could honestly base an entire short campaign around this.

[redwizard007]

This is what the players have experienced so far:
- Torrin is a small merchant city on the crossroads of trade routes, ruled by a city council of nobles headed by the mayor.
- In a few days, there will be a town festival.
- While shopping, the players found out that the town's guard employed all the smithies in town to make weapons and armor.
- The mayor told them that criminality has seen a spike recently, with goblins endangering the surrounding roads and the thieves' guild getting more powerful inside the town.
- The players took care of a cave full of goblins outside of town.
- The next day, they noticed a robbery by a group of Kenku, which they fought in an alley. They managed to keep one alive, which was taken by the guards.
- Next session, the players will probably want to interrogate the Kenku and further investigate the reasons for this rise in criminal activity.

This is what I had planned for the story:
- The thieves guild operate from the sewers and run a black market.
- The rising criminality was enabled by a lack of investments in the town's guard for years on end. The fruitless struggle for funds has turned the general of the town guard into a bitter man. His trust in the city council has been lost and he plans for a military coup.
- In order to execute a coup, he needs funds to hire mercenaries and equipment. He set up a scheme with the leader of the thieves guild: the town's guard would let the thieves guild run their opperations, in exchange for a slice of the cake. This has caused the recent spike in criminal activity.
- The thieves guild suspect that the town's guard is planning something, but don't know what specifically. They want to profit from their arrangement as long as it lasts. Hoewever, if they find out (either before or after the coup) the thieves will want to prevent the town guard from seizing control.
- The coup is to take place during the town festival, at the mayor's party for the nobility.
- Ultimately, I planned for the players to have to decide what power to side with - the town's guard or the thieves guild? Or take them both on? I hope this would be a choice between two bad options that will make the players debate and doubt their alliances.

These are the problems that I am afraid of:
- The story is overly complicated (too many characters, factions and possibilities) and doesnt make that much sense.
- The lack of direction might make players focus on one aspect (for example: taking on the thieves guild), only to be told "that's nice and all, but suddenly the town guard attempt to seize power over the city". I am afraid that the plot twist will come too much out of left field, because I introduced too many factions and potential plot hooks at once.
- The story relies a lot on things that happened in the past. How will I communicate all these background story elements to the players without simply spelling it out for them?

---

If you've made it this far down the post - thank you so much for your attention!
Any suggestions on how to streamline this story, or suggestions for much more interesting directions to take this story in, would be much appreciated!

First, welcome to the brotherhood. We DMs and GMs need to stick together. Us old timers have lots to share with you, and fresh ideas and perspectives from new guys like yourself can help keep us from falling into a creative rut. I look forward to seeing more from you in the forums.

Now, all the advice above was great, and I think you are already doing better than you give yourself credit for. Having said that, you are missing some great opportunities here and I am going to try to help you wring every last drop of flavor out of your current scenario. What I feel is missing is an over arching plot. What you really need is *insert CE race of corrupters here* pulling the strings. Then the plot isn't coming out of left field, it was "craftily hidden or diabolical."

I'm partial to Yuan-ti, githyank , mind flayers, or Drow in that order. There are other options, but at level 3... Let's stick with this list for now.

Why is the mayor not funding the guards properly? Could he (or part of the council) be under the sway of foreign powers? Is their hold a matter of blackmail, an addiction, bribery, business leverage, or threat of violence?

Did the guard captain find out about the corruption, or is he also compromised?

What about the theives guild?

An interesting plot (for new players, most of us are kind of tired of it) could be the council and guards both being manipulated by rival entities, say an Illithid and a githyanki or githzerai, and the theives actually working to oust all the outsiders.

What you need to know to pull something like this off is pretty simple. Who are the powers manipulating events and what do they want. If you know that, then you can make solid choices as to how they react as PCs alter the setting. That is what you fall back on when the players run out of direction. Let a clue slip, and continue on.

Does the illithid want wealth, or just brains to harvest from convicted criminals? The githyanki/githzerai want to kill each other but not as badly as they want the illithid dead. They may also be scouting for a future invasion (like level 10+.) Drow could also be scouting, but they may also be looking for trade in rare goods or slaves. Yuan-ti might be looking for slaves, a market for illicit goods, or simply to corrupt a human society. Beyond that, an individual of any of those races is probably trying to live a soft, comfortable life as long as they are away from their masters. They may have established themselves in a brothel or inn, or as an advisor to someone. There is unlikely to be any loyalty to conspirators, but very likely an attachment to certain comforts, vices, or treasures.

Does this complicate your story? Sure, a little. But it also drives the conflict. If you are smart about things and use only one or two of these guys as lone operatives, it plants the seed of a larger conspiracy. Doing so again down the road can tie otherwise unrelated adventures together in an "oh, no! It's the ____ again," sort of way. Then in a few more levels they can become a more visible threat.

[Anonymouswizard]

A counterpoint top the above poster, bringing in a corrupter makes for a very different story.

OP, the plot you have right now is about human failings. In fact it's good enough that I plan to steal it for my own game. But the side affect of this is that the plot will run into shades of grey a lot. The guards have legitimate grievances, but are significantly overreacting. The mayor has let the guards get to a point where they can't function through negligence and just not being overly focused on the crime that is there. The thieves are thieves, people who have turned their skills to crime because they didn't feel like honest work was giving them enough. In a story like this the church is full of people trying to help people but also has plenty of corruption, the pub landlord is overcharging for ale but doing so to help feed the orphans, nobody is clean but nobody is evil, and in the coup storyline not only do the guards have understandable reasons for what they've done and what they're doing, bit so does the government. Who to support in such a scenario should be a hard choice.

Bringing in a corrupter makes things a lot more clear cut. The people or beings pulling the strings are the evil villains, and once they're dealt with everything will return to a state where everything can be worked out. Sure the manipulators might be morally grey themselves, but they're much less likely. While bringing in an outside source makes plotting easier, you've actually got a really good plot and situation that doesn't need one.

If you want manipulators while still keeping the rich emergent complexity from the scenario, consider using somebody from inside the city who would theoretically benefit. It might have started as a project of since of the thieves that got out of hand, or maybe the alchemists want to weaken the merchants and take some of their political power. Maybe a noble family or somebody similar thinks the commander of the guard will be easier to influence than the current mayor.

Maybe it's better not to deal with this complexity in your first ongoing plot, in which case I suggest you stock to just stock to thieves, guards, and the mayor. Don't bring in any monsters, just let the fact you have two/three organisations generate problems and everybody's inefficiency causing nobody to have the edge when the time for the coup comes.

[Rutgew]

Wow, that's quite some responses! Thank you all for thinking along.
I'm glad to read that most of you seem pretty positive about the base of the story. I honestly couldn't tell anymore after spending so much time trying to make it work.

@ inexorabletruth:
Thanks for the valuable feedback! We play D&D 5E. I am not sure if I get what you mean by making them roll skill checks to figure out plot details. Do you mean that I should put them in situations where those are required (for example, searching the room of the general for clues)? Or do you mean that I should make them roll a skill check out of nowhere and, if they succeed, tell them "your PC thinks there is something odd about the thieves - why would they rob people in broad daylight? It's almost as if they have no fear of getting caught by the town guard".
I read it as the latter (if I misinterpretted your writing, disregard the following). I can see how this method would steer my players back onto the right direction, by putting a question in their character's head that they didn't come up with themselves. However, it also seems metagamey to me, like taking a DM-shortcut instead of laying out enough clues for the party. I'd love to hear more from you in regards to this approach, in order to understand it better! :)

@ denthor:
Thank you for replying. Since I was already planning for the turning point/climax to be at the town festival, I think your "all roads lead to Rome" strategy would definitelly be applicable to the scenario.

@ Anonyouswizard:
Thanks for your elaborate reply!
My players indeed definitelly need clear goals to chase, else they will not know what to do. I think forcing the robbery in bright daylight by Kenku has grabbed their attention, but it's a good reminder to keep some engaging plot hooks in waiting in case they think they reached a dead end.
The thieves guild would indeed not call themselves Thieves Guild. I already have some lore on their organisation written out, but I didn't want to include much of that in the OP as it was already a long read :P
I like your suggestion about how the situation can affect the entire town, from merchants to inns to government. That way, there will always be some way to get the players back to the story - even if they decide to hang around in a bar all day!

@ redwizard007:
Thank you for the warm welcome and your feedback!
I have indeed thought of introducing a more fantastical outside element into the campaign. My own idea was to have the general be replaced by a doppelganger that works for a hobgoblin army. This doppelganger would recruit "elite soldiers" that are actually hobgoblins in disguise (completely covered in armor and clothing, and no speaking allowed as to hide their true identity). And once they have a large enough force, attack the city from within to take it over.
I think such a campaign is mighty interesting and it definitelly adds a little more fantastical spice to the scenario... However, by introducing such a group of evil outsiders, I feel like it would circumvent the morally grey area that I wanted my players to imagine. After all, choosing to ally with a thieves' guild or a corrupt general, would make for a more difficult choice than to ally with thieves or literal monsters. In that sense, I agree with Anonymouswizard.
Nevertheless, thanks for helping me think outside of the box - I'll definitely keep them in mind! And your advice on identifying the powers at hand and how they would react to different outcomes (like a flowchart?) is a good tip in order to simplify the situation for myself, regardless of what scenario I end up going with.

[inexorabletruth]

@ inexorabletruth:
Thanks for the valuable feedback! We play D&D 5E. I am not sure if I get what you mean by making them roll skill checks to figure out plot details. Do you mean that I should put them in situations where those are required (for example, searching the room of the general for clues)? Or do you mean that I should make them roll a skill check out of nowhere and, if they succeed, tell them "your PC thinks there is something odd about the thieves - why would they rob people in broad daylight? It's almost as if they have no fear of getting caught by the town guard".
I read it as the latter (if I misinterpretted your writing, disregard the following). I can see how this method would steer my players back onto the right direction, by putting a question in their character's head that they didn't come up with themselves. However, it also seems metagamey to me, like taking a DM-shortcut instead of laying out enough clues for the party. I'd love to hear more from you in regards to this approach, in order to understand it better! :)

I mean the latter.

I know it feels like metagaming, but strictly speaking, it isn't. And if used judiciously, it can enhance the feeling of immersion. Metagaming, by definition, is using out-of-game resources to affect in-game decisions. In this sense, you are using in-game resources (like a character's knowledge, and also sense of awareness, of their surroundings) to affect in-game decisions.

It stands to reason that a character would know more about their surroundings than the player in control. The character often has above average, even supernatural senses to help them understand their surroundings. Plus, they gain the benefit of 5 natural senses to interact with a world that the player can only hear about or read about. This provides a seamless, in-game element to reflect that heightened level of awareness.