Vow of Peace/Nonviolence

[Hiro Quester]

Has anyone actually successfully played a character with these vows? Can it be played in a way that makes it fun, rather than being a buzzkill?

How does it work in terms of working together with a group of adventurers? How can you prevent or alleviate the annoyance this can cause to other members of the party?

Which kinds of classes can this work well with? It would seem like a fun role-playing challenge form someone like me (who tends to try to optimize to the level of DM needing to ask me to tone it down for balance reasons).

I'm considering something like an illusionist/monk/enlightened fist (who can do non-lethal damage with physical attacks), or a bard diplomancer who specializes in illusion and protection spells.

Edit: a Beguiler would seem to have a spell list well suited to these vows. Hmmm...

[Vaern]

Enchanters and illusionists appear to be easily the best suited to making use of the spell DC increase from Vow of Nonviolence. For an offensive caster, though applying the nonlethal substitution metamagic feat will allow damaging spells to benefit from the bonus as well, just knocking the target unconscious rather than killing them.
While you may not be able to deal actual damage, there's nothing preventing your party from fighting as normal. The only stipulation to them is that they can't finish off a helpless target. If they kill something that's up and fighting, or if they drop it and it bleeds out before it can stabilize, there's nothing wrong with it. If an enemy is defeated without being killed, they must surrender; otherwise, the rest of the party is then free to dispose of them as they see fit.

Vow of Peace might look good with its armor bonuses and the ability to make weapons shatter harmlessly on your skin, but the aura of calm emotions, which the feat does not give you the option of turning off, may end up being absolutely crippling to your entire party. Not being able to deal damage is a relatively easy thing to build around, but a 20-foot radius aura is a massive battlefield obstacle that your party has to dance around. And presumably, as you are constantly within your own aura, you are also affected by your own calm emotions effect, which may make it difficult to cast offensive spells even if they are affected by nonlethal substitution. The aura makes this feat seem potentially more harmful than beneficial to yourself and your group, unless you're in a very low-combat and highly diplomatic campaign.

[daremetoidareyo]

oneiromancy can target dream selves...


Third, you can target your offensive spells at a target's dream self, rather than his physical form. Because this deals mental damage only, it transforms all damage dealt by that spell into nonlethal damage. This effect functions only on creatures that both sleep and dream: Constructs, plants, undead, and elves are immune to this effect. Only spells that target a single creature or specifi c number of creatures benefi t from this effect; you cannot apply it to spells that target an area.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

oneiromancy can target dream selves...Ovinomancy helps you get to sleep, first.

[Troacctid]

Vow of Peace penalizes you for using spells against enemies. Vow of Nonviolence boosts the save DCs of spells you cast against enemies. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Hiro Quester]

I was thinking about the calm emotions as a benefit.

But you are right, Vaern. That is a huge hazard. No barbarian rages or bardic inspiration, or morale bonuses near you is a potential huge problem. Nix the vow of peace then.

[AnimeTheCat]

Vow of Peace penalizes you for using spells against enemies. Vow of Nonviolence boosts the save DCs of spells you cast against enemies. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Are you saying that because of the line that says "you also may not use nondamaging spells to inapacitate or weaken living foes"? Because the very next part says "so that your allies can kill them" if you color spray a mob, take them prisoner, have them swear oaths of surrender and non-interference, if the break the vows you party may deal with them as they see fit.

The calm emotions aura is a supernatural ability, thus it should be activated or deactivated as a standard action. At least, that what I read "this is a mind-affecting, supernatural compulsion" to be. To each their own and if you choose differently I feel like you're unnecessarily making the game harder and making the feat less usable for no reason.

[Troacctid]

You need all your allies to be on board with not using lethal force basically ever. That can be a serious handicap for many builds. Anyone relying on weapon attacks is going to be eating a -4 penalty for your sake. Anyone relying on spells basically can't use any direct damage at all. Your character might be built around those restrictions—but the same won't be true for theirs.

If you want to maximize Vow of Peace in a vacuum, then you don't have much choice but to proceed with the assumption that you may have to avoid casting any spells that would weaken or incapacitate an enemy, because you don't know if your party is going to have someone like a Warmage or whatever.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

You could always just say that the Vow taker just happens to be in the same place and going the same direction as the rest of the party. They aren't allies; they just happen to not want to kill each other. That way, the Vow taker can do his thing, while the actually useful party members won't be tempted to abandon him when he's not looking or murder him in his sleep.