Swords bard magical secrets

[Spacehamster]

If you want to be a more frontline kind of guy, what spells would you take at level 10? Were thinking find greater steed and steel wind strike or banishing smite.

[Snivlem]

I guess I'd go with find greater steed and steel wind strike. There might be more optimal options, but I'd go for these for the flavour alone (and they certainly aren't weak options). FGS

[TheTeaMustFlow]

Guardian of Nature could be a good bet, particularly if you're Strength-based.

Shadow Blade and Holy Weapon are both very good for gishes.

Fireball and Armour of Agathys are both solid, if unspectacular.

There's also the good old tradition of nicking from the Paladin and Ranger lists long before either class can get them - Conjure Volley, Destructive Wave, Swift Quiver and Circle of Power can all be very nice.

[Crgaston]

Don’t forget Shadow of Moil!

[Mikal]

I'd actually say no to Steel Wind Strike. It looks like it should be a frontliner like attack, but it's completely spell attribute based. Shadow of Moil as said above would be better. Gives you a persistent advantage with a retaliatory aura should you get hit.

Shadow Blade is also good, if you don't mind taking a 2nd level spell with Secrets.
You could also consider Armor of Agathys. Retaliatory damage again if hit, plus tem hp for an hour without concentration is nice, especially the damage if you fuel it with higher level slots.

Essentially, go for any spell that provides you nifty abilities or protections in melee that don't rely on your spellcasting stat...

[rbstr]

I'll second Guardian of Nature, particularly if you're strength based. It's quite the spell!
But it isn't bad with Dex either. THP, Advantage, makes you hard to get to. It'd be quite interesting on a lot of more mobile builds.

[Spacehamster]

I'd actually say no to Steel Wind Strike. It looks like it should be a frontliner like attack, but it's completely spell attribute based. Shadow of Moil as said above would be better. Gives you a persistent advantage with a retaliatory aura should you get hit.

Shadow Blade is also good, if you don't mind taking a 2nd level spell with Secrets.
You could also consider Armor of Agathys. Retaliatory damage again if hit, plus tem hp for an hour without concentration is nice, especially the damage if you fuel it with higher level slots.

Essentially, go for any spell that provides you nifty abilities or protections in melee that don't rely on your spellcasting stat...

"spell weapon attack" I think it says in the decription should that not mean you make an attack per target using the attribute your weapon uses?

[Mikal]

It doesn't say spell weapon attack. It says "melee spell attack". The weapon is literally just for show (and material components)

[Spacehamster]

hmmm just thought about this, with find greater steed it says that when riding the mount and casting a spell that targets only you, you get to share it with the mount.
Does that go for banishing smite too? Since you put the smite on you and when you hit with an attack next time the damage and rider procs?

[Spacehamster]

It doesn't say spell weapon attack. It says "melee spell attack". The weapon is literally just for show (and material components)

Ah, kind of a stupid spell for the ranger list then really, which ranger puts their WIS higher than 16? :-/ Really should just key off your offensive attribute for mundane combat.

[Snivlem]

Spiritual guardians is another spell i'd seriously consider, even if your casting stat isnt very strong

[Mikal]

hmmm just thought about this, with find greater steed it says that when riding the mount and casting a spell that targets only you, you get to share it with the mount.
Does that go for banishing smite too? Since you put the smite on you and when you hit with an attack next time the damage and rider procs?

Yes and no, I think. Crawford clarified a range of self means that the target of the spell is you, so that works. However, the spell is concentration, and you can't keep concentration up on multiple spells. Since Greater Steed only says you can also target your mount, but makes no provisions for concentration, you'd have to decide who you'll concentrate on, your spell or the mounts. That's how I'd rule it.


Ah, kind of a stupid spell for the ranger list then really, which ranger puts their WIS higher than 16? :-/ Really should just key off your offensive attribute for mundane combat.

Don't get me started on what they did to that spell, compared to its original incarnation as a 3.5 ToB maneuver.

[Specter]

Can't go wrong with Shadow Blade, unless you have a magic weapon, in which case take Hunter's Mark instead.

I recommend not taking two high-level spells: 5th levels have a big oomph, but you only recover them on a long rest.

[Spacehamster]

Made up my mind to get find greater steed at least, on that note: What shared spells would be best for the steed? Thinking I will
maily use a either a gryphon or the saber toothed tiger. Not decided if I want to fly or not. :)

[Specter]

Made up my mind to get find greater steed at least, on that note: What shared spells would be best for the steed? Thinking I will
maily use a either a gryphon or the saber toothed tiger. Not decided if I want to fly or not. :)

Greater Invisibility, Stoneskin, Heroism, Haste...

[Foxydono]

I'm a big fan of death ward and circle of power, or Otiluke's Resilient Sphere if you want to take the contigency spell later on.

[Chunkosaurus]

I plan on combining Find greater steed and either fire shield or Armor of agathys. Both are very cool. My other thought is Holy weapon. Mostly because I want to fly in on a pegasus or griffon like a badass with a flaming(Guess who has a flametongue rapier?) radiant sword like some figure out of mythology.

Also for your second magical secrets Tenser's transformation also applies to find greater steed, so you and your mount will be badasses.

[Foxydono]

I plan on combining Find greater steed and either fire shield or Armor of agathys. Both are very cool. My other thought is Holy weapon. Mostly because I want to fly in on a pegasus or griffon like a badass with a flaming(Guess who has a flametongue rapier?) radiant sword like some figure out of mythology.

Also for your second magical secrets Tenser's transformation also applies to find greater steed, so you and your mount will be badasses.
Well of you plan on getting a steed, sunbeam is also an excellent choice if you are a lore bard (for lvl 14)! And although it's not undisputed, let a wizard cast flesh to stone on it and then permanently True polymorph it into a young dragon. Just because, well who doesn’t want to ride a dragon?!

[mormon_soldier]

I like haste and fireball for magical secrets.

[Spacehamster]

Find steed and holy weapon it will have to be, get that knight in shining armor feel at the same time as being a full caster. :)

[Chunkosaurus]

Find steed and holy weapon it will have to be, get that knight in shining armor feel at the same time as being a full caster. :)

So then at level 14 magical secrets to be even more badass you take Crown of Stars which will give you a floating crown of stars and also one for your steed(no concentration) that use your bonus action to deal 4d12 radiant, but more importantly you get to ride in looking even more majestic on your steed with a glowing crown and glowing weapon.

[RSP]

If you focus on melee combat, Shadow Blade can be great, so long as maintaining concentration isn't a problem. Upcast and you'll do significant damage, not to mention a pretty good source of Advantage.

If your Greater Stead can hold it, they get one too...

[suplee215]

Might be boring but Haste and Greater Find Steed seems amazing.

[Scyrner]

I love Steel Wind Strike from a purely "that's seems cool" point of view, and so would probably take it. It also seems like it might offer some neat mobility hijinks. That being said, I'd probably only take it if I was playing a fencer-type character.

[RSP]

Can't go wrong with Shadow Blade, unless you have a magic weapon, in which case take Hunter's Mark instead.

Not to nitpick, but I'd suggest Hex rather than Hunter's Mark: Hex is useful with both Spell attacks and Weapon attacks, Hunters Mark is only good for Weapon attacks.

Plus, the non-damage effect is better on Hex.

[Specter]

I love Steel Wind Strike from a purely "that's seems cool" point of view, and so would probably take it. It also seems like it might offer some neat mobility hijinks. That being said, I'd probably only take it if I was playing a fencer-type character.

Steel Wind Strike is up to 30d10 damage (let's say 100avg for missing or less people in the area), along with a Misty Step-like Teleport. I don't see anything wrong with it, and any melee Ranger would be stupid not to get it.

[Mikal]

Steel Wind Strike is up to 30d10 damage (let's say 100avg for missing or less people in the area), along with a Misty Step-like Teleport. I don't see anything wrong with it, and any melee Ranger would be stupid not to get it.

Except for the fact it's a spell Attack and the ranger may not have that stat boosted enough to make it useful.

Or in this case a melee focused sword bard.

[Snivlem]

Except for the fact it's a spell Attack and the ranger may not have that stat boosted enough to make it useful.

Or in this case a melee focused sword bard.

The differenece between a 14 and 20 is a +3 modifier to hit, which should translate roughly (or precisely?) to a 15% dmg decrease. That dosent make the spell useless. It's like rolling 7d6 on a Fireball, the spell would still be good.

[Specter]

The differenece between a 14 and 20 is a +3 modifier to hit, which should translate roughly (or precisely?) to a 15% dmg decrease. That dosent make the spell useless. It's like rolling 7d6 on a Fireball, the spell would still be good.

Yeah. Also, if you don't have 14 WIS as a Ranger at level 17, you're beyind redemption.

[CBAnaesthesia]

I don't see anything wrong with it
Well, not "wrong" per se, but I think it should have been keyed off your melee attack stat instead of spellcasting, since the only Wizards likely to use the spell are Bladesingers and maybe Abjurers who can actually handle being in melee a little bit. Then again I also think it should be a level 4 spell that does a bit less damage so EKs and ATs can use it.

[Chunkosaurus]

Not to nitpick, but I'd suggest Hex rather than Hunter's Mark: Hex is useful with both Spell attacks and Weapon attacks, Hunters Mark is only good for Weapon attacks.

Plus, the non-damage effect is better on Hex.

If you are going to concentrate on a damage enhancer grab holy weapon instead

[RSP]

If you are going to concentrate on a damage enhancer grab holy weapon instead

Don't agree. HW is okay to add 9 Radiant damage, and works with an already Magic Weapon, however, as a 5th level spell, it'll have limited use. Plus it radiates light, which prevents sneaking, which a Bard probably wants to do at some point.

I'd much rather prefer SB, which grants Advantage on attacks in Dim or Darkness, can be used a lot more than HW, as it's a 2nd level spell at its base (if cast as a 5th it does 4d8 psychic damage).

Either one requires Concentration, so that's a push. HW does last longer, but that also prevents the AoE blast. Also, losing Concentration on a 5th level spell is a bit harder to swallow than on your 2nd level spell, and you have to factor that in.

Not a bad spell to tack on some damage but I'd prefer SB as a MS pick due to its scaling and getting a lot more use per day.

Also, HW doesn't duplicate with Find Greater Steed, SB does.

[Specter]

Well, not "wrong" per se, but I think it should have been keyed off your melee attack stat instead of spellcasting, since the only Wizards likely to use the spell are Bladesingers and maybe Abjurers who can actually handle being in melee a little bit. Then again I also think it should be a level 4 spell that does a bit less damage so EKs and ATs can use it.

That would have been better, yes, but then you could apply all sorts of buffs and boosts to it to make it too much. Imagine 6d10 + Hunter's Mark + Elemental Weapon + class features and other spells.