One of my players needs darkness at will

[Shocksrivers]

Hi everyone,

As a DM of a group of currently level six characters, I ran into a little trouble. One of my players would like to have a magic item that creates darkness at will. More or less something like a pendant with darkness on it, but permanent, so she does not have to go back to NPC casters every so often. Now, I was surprised that such an item does not quite exist. We came up with several possibilities:

-wand of darkness, just cast it at the start of every combat
-a necklace with extended darkness that needs to be replenished
-oil of darkness, which you can throw each combat, but that is very expensive
-or making a homebrewed item to do exactly what she needs

What would you all suggest? Bend the rules a little, or is this item too powerful? And if I were to bend the rules, how expensive should it be? Or should I make it the end of a side-quest?

Please let me now if I should post this in homebrew, but it seemed more like a DM problem to me :)

[DeTess]

Has she considered taking a single level in Warlock? One of the invocations gives you the darkness spell which you can cast at will. If the character also has darkvision he suddenly qualifies for a big stack fo feats from Drow of the Underdark that makes the darknes ability even better. A recent optimization competition had a build (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=22810459&postcount=67) that showcased this.

A custom magic item, following the magic item creations guidelines would cost you 18,000 gp (2(spell level)x3(caster level)x2000 (base price) x 1.5 (10 min/level duration)).

[Shocksrivers]

Thank you! Yeah, we were considering warlock, but she already has a little weird build, so she would be getting in xp-penalty territory

[Eldariel]

Thank you! Yeah, we were considering warlock, but she already has a little weird build, so she would be getting in xp-penalty territory

Have you considered just not using XP penalties/Favored Class rules? They rarely contribute anything meaningful to the game and don't really accomplish their intended goal; Human Rogue 10/Wizard 2/Cleric 1/Fighter 2/Ranger 1/Barbarian 1 somehow has no penalties while Human Rogue 10/Fighter 3/Ranger 1 does (or Elf Rogue 3/Ranger 1). The system is so poorly implemented that it's generally better to just do away with it; it restricts character building in weird, illogical ways, while never really hurting any of the truly powerful builds (Wizard, Druid, Cleric typically only take prestige classes which explicitly incur no XP penalties). Instead, you could use the Pathfinder Favored Class bonuses system, where taking a level in your Favored Class grants you either +1 HP or +1 skill point. Carrot, not stick ;)

[sleepyphoenixx]

If the darkness doesn't have to be magical you could just use the Darklight (SoS, 500gp). It basically lets you control the light level in a 80ft radius. It's crazy useful for the price.
It needs to be fueled by power points (1/day), but if you don't have a psionic character or room for Wild/Hidden Talent a weapon (shuriken) with the Manifester enhancement works just as well.

[GrayDeath]

I support using the PF favoured CLass Bonus System and the Warlock level Suggestion.
Simple, elegant, not OP.

[Uncle Pine]

Secrets of Sarlona p140 has the darklight, an item that for a mere 500 gp and 1 power point/24 hours will adjust light in an 80-ft. radius to any of four possible light levels, one of which happens to be total darkness.

[KillingAScarab]

Hi everyone,

As a DM of a group of currently level six characters, I ran into a little trouble. One of my players would like to have a magic item that creates darkness at will. More or less something like a pendant with darkness on it, but permanent, so she does not have to go back to NPC casters every so often. Now, I was surprised that such an item does not quite exist. We came up with several possibilities:

-a necklace with extended darkness that needs to be replenished
I was in a party where the DM had given the other characters necklaces with permanant light spells cast on them, which they simply had wrappings they would use to cover the part which emitted light. You could rule permanancy works for darkness and do the same.

[Bohandas]

Have you considered just not using XP penalties/Favored Class rules? They rarely contribute anything meaningful to the game and don't really accomplish their intended goal; Human Rogue 10/Wizard 2/Cleric 1/Fighter 2/Ranger 1/Barbarian 1 somehow has no penalties while Human Rogue 10/Fighter 3/Ranger 1 does (or Elf Rogue 3/Ranger 1). The system is so poorly implemented that it's generally better to just do away with it

I agree. Drop it. It's useless.

[Shocksrivers]

Thanks for all the advice! I'll suggest becoming a warlock to her, and look over your suggestions for items, see what fits best in the world and the game

[Segev]

A custom item of 2x/day command-activated Extended Darkness is still technically a 2nd level spell, but requires a 5th level caster. The cost would be 7200 gp market price, and each use would last 5 hours.

[Vaern]

The description of magical weapons says that 30% of magic weapons shed light equivalent to a light spell. It may be reasonable to say that an item created by a creature that sees well in darkness and is highly sensitive to light, such as drow or orcs, might be made to similarly emit shadows around it equivalent to the "no light" spell.

[Shocksrivers]

A custom item of 2x/day command-activated Extended Darkness is still technically a 2nd level spell, but requires a 5th level caster. The cost would be 7200 gp market price, and each use would last 5 hours.

Ah, that seems a little more affordable, so that might be a solution!

[DeTess]

A custom item of 2x/day command-activated Extended Darkness is still technically a 2nd level spell, but requires a 5th level caster. The cost would be 7200 gp market price, and each use would last 5 hours.

Not to be a kill-joy, but this is incorrect. Extended Darkness is a third level spell for the purposes of magic item creation. Assuming that the rest of the math is correct, it would cost 10800 GP.

Edit; of course, nothing stops a GM from pricing the item at a lower cost.

[Fizban]

There's also the Dark Lantern from Tome of Magic which gives you a continuous 60' radius of shadowy illumination for 2,000gp. And the DM doesn't need to care about prices.

[Red Fel]

There's also the Shadow Mantle soulmeld (Totemist). When bound to the Shoulders chakra, you can generate a globe of magical darkness around yourself as a swift action, which radiates out 5 feet per point of invested essentia. You also gain Blindsight within that radius.

Of course, this requires you to (1) have essentia, (2) have the ability to shape Soulmelds, and (3) have the ability to bind Soulmelds. Which would require quite a few levels of Totemist, or some feats. But it exists as an option.

[Matrota]

If you go by the DMG custom magic item rules, a continuous darkness effect would cost 18,000 gp, whereas a rod with 50 charges is only 4,500.

[Segev]

Not to be a kill-joy, but this is incorrect. Extended Darkness is a third level spell for the purposes of magic item creation. Assuming that the rest of the math is correct, it would cost 10800 GP.

Edit; of course, nothing stops a GM from pricing the item at a lower cost.

Ah. Funny thing, that's the exact price that a command activated at-will item of darkness would cost. Just need to reactivate it every 30 minutes.

[skunk3]

Totally agreed on cross class/favored class stuff. Penalizing that sort of thing really has no point and we never play with any of those rules in place because it just places limits on characters that limit fun. We also play that if you have multiple classes offering different class skills, once you've 'unlocked' that class skill you can apply as many ranks to it you want for a character of your level, not just that class level.

Warlock is a good suggestion as 4 levels of warlock nets you 3 lesser invocations (which can be extremely handy), a 2d6 eldritch blast that can be used infinitely, dr1/cold iron, detect magic at will, and deceive item, which is super good. It also of course gives you UMD as a class skill, which is huge.

I'm biased though.. warlock is my favorite base class hands down even if the optimizers think it's mehhhh.

[Silva Stormrage]

An Etch Schema of Deeper darkness only costs 3600 GP and can be used 1/day. But since the deeper darkness would last for 5 days that should be enough for your PC's purposes unless they need to spam darkness everywhere multiple times in a combat.

This would require UMD to work though or at least 1 cleric level since it functions essentially like a 1/day scroll.

[Calthropstu]

An at will spell on an item can only affect the holder of the item (or affect the item itself) So a stone with "darkness at will" could theoretically be made... it essentially radiates darkness when turned on. You could then throw it.

The cost for such an item would be 4,000 gp * 2 due it not requiring a slot. So 8,000. He would need to hold onto (or retrieve the stone if thrown) the stone because the darkness is centered on it.

[Nebuul]

You might just put a Continual Darkness spell into your campaign as the natural foil to continual flame Same costs, problem solved. The player just keeps the enchanted object covered and then uncovers it when darkness is desired.

[KillingAScarab]

There's also the Shadow Mantle soulmeld (Totemist). When bound to the Shoulders chakra, you can generate a globe of magical darkness around yourself as a swift action, which radiates out 5 feet per point of invested essentia. You also gain Blindsight within that radius.

Of course, this requires you to (1) have essentia, (2) have the ability to shape Soulmelds, and (3) have the ability to bind Soulmelds. Which would require quite a few levels of Totemist, or some feats. But it exists as an option.9 levels of totemist, by which point you're definitely a totemist. But the nice thing about Magic of Incarnum is the ability to mix it on characters who don't primarily rely on meldshaping. 12th+ level characters with 15 constitution can spend a feat on open lesser chakra: shoulders. Spend a previous feat for shape soulmeld: shadow mantle and another for some [incarnum] feat for a point of essentia. As is often the case with 3.x, it just comes into play rather late. The shadow mantle gets you actual magical darkness, though. Two levels of warlock would get you an invocation to let you see through it for 24 hours, but the at will darkness as the spell means you only get shadowy illumination, without a house rule. A psionic character with a manifester level of at least 10 and access to open chakra, psionic, or a spellcaster with access to 7th level cleric or sor/wiz spells could also allow binding to shoulders for 24 hours at a time, negating the need for one feat.

[Shocksrivers]

There's also the Dark Lantern from Tome of Magic which gives you a continuous 60' radius of shadowy illumination for 2,000gp. And the DM doesn't need to care about prices.

Ah, this is actually precisely what I'm looking for!
Thank you all for the answers!

[Coldsturm]

They could also fill a clear bottle or charm with black sand creating darkness when they take it out. The cost is some clear glass
(1g maybe) and finding black sand.

[Segev]

They could also fill a clear bottle or charm with black sand creating darkness when they take it out. The cost is some clear glass
(1g maybe) and finding black sand.

Where is black sand printed?



Also, that darkness lantern is an amazingly cheap price for what is effectively a continuous darkness item!

[Vaern]

It's in Sandstorm. It doesn't look like a bit of black sand will create an area of darkness, though. It says that magical darkness rises to a height of 20 feet above it, but it does not say anything about creating a radius of darkness around it.
There is also a spell called Black Sand which creates a 20-foot spread of black sand that functions as the naturally occurring substance, stating that magical darkness rises to a height of 20 feet above the surface of the area but making no mention of darkness extending beyond the edges of the 20-foot spread.

[Segev]

It's in Sandstorm. It doesn't look like a bit of black sand will create an area of darkness, though. It says that magical darkness rises to a height of 20 feet above it, but it does not say anything about creating a radius of darkness around it.
There is also a spell called Black Sand which creates a 20-foot spread of black sand that functions as the naturally occurring substance, stating that magical darkness rises to a height of 20 feet above the surface of the area but making no mention of darkness extending beyond the edges of the 20-foot spread.

Ah. I knew about Sandstorm's substance, but only in connection to its brokenness when shoved in the shoes of your zombies and skeletons and necropolitans. I was unaware of its darkness properties.

That said, if you consider the form factor - sand-on-the-ground - it only discussing the darkness being "above" it makes sense. Calculations for radial effects from something on/part of the ground don't make a lot of sense. Arguing that a clump pulled up out of the ground would have a radius of 20 feet for its darkness is not unreasonable. But is, admittedly, house ruling. But then, so is finding black sand, unless you have the spell and are willing to kill something with it to manufacture your own.

[jdizzlean]

Totally agreed on cross class/favored class stuff. Penalizing that sort of thing really has no point and we never play with any of those rules in place because it just places limits on characters that limit fun. We also play that if you have multiple classes offering different class skills, once you've 'unlocked' that class skill you can apply as many ranks to it you want for a character of your level, not just that class level.

Warlock is a good suggestion as 4 levels of warlock nets you 3 lesser invocations (which can be extremely handy), a 2d6 eldritch blast that can be used infinitely, dr1/cold iron, detect magic at will, and deceive item, which is super good. It also of course gives you UMD as a class skill, which is huge.

I'm biased though.. warlock is my favorite base class hands down even if the optimizers think it's mehhhh.

I actually love Warlock for optimizing, assuming you can find an invocation at a low enough cost in levels that you can abuse the hell out of.


I'm surprised no one here has asked just WHY the player needs access to Darkness at will? What's she trying to accomplish w/ it?

[Fizban]

Also, that darkness lantern is an amazingly cheap price for what is effectively a continuous darkness item!
It's not quite Darkness at-will: the Dark Lantern gives you shadowy illumination (regardless of original light level), not magical darkness, so darkvision goes right through it (the shadow mystery its based on is quite explicit), as presumably does low-light vision. It can muck with 1st level or lower light spells, but Continual Flame supersedes it as well.

Does an excellent job of highlighting how darkvision and low-light vision are ridiculously strong on a macro level once you're actually looking at combat in shadowy illumination (as in every night battle ever) though.

As for why darkness at-will, its so they can hide. Unless anyone has ever seen any other reason?

[Nifft]

As for why darkness at-will, its so they can hide. Unless anyone has ever seen any other reason?

I can't see any other reason because it's too dark.

[Uncle Pine]

As for why darkness at-will, its so they can hide. Unless anyone has ever seen any other reason?

Maybe to look sharp under a nice umbrella? :mitd:

[Melestav]

Cast an arcane mark spell with an umbral metamagic gem. Perms darkness. My last char used to good effect.