Odd exceptions

[Lolzyking]

An interesting idea popped into my mind.


how do you feel it would affect balance if Eldritch knight and Arcane trickster caster levels counted as wizard caster levels instead of multiclass caster levels when multiclassed with wizard.

Examples

A) a 10/10 Ek/wizard would be able to prepare wizard spells equal to a 14th level wizard.

B) a 4/5 arcane trickster/wizard would be able to prepare wizard spells as a 7th level wizard.

[Unoriginal]

Armor wizards, armor wizards everywhere.

[Malifice]

An interesting idea popped into my mind.


how do you feel it would affect balance if Eldritch knight and Arcane trickster caster levels counted as wizard caster levels instead of multiclass caster levels when multiclassed with wizard.

Examples

A) a 10/10 Ek/wizard would be able to prepare wizard spells equal to a 14th level wizard.

B) a 4/5 arcane trickster/wizard would be able to prepare wizard spells as a 7th level wizard.

EX and AT casters levels are 1/3 level (round down). Not 1/2 level (round down).

So example A is 13 (not 14). Example 2 is 6th level.

[Anymage]

At first glance, assuming you round the partial caster class down, none of the features you pick up compensate for the fact that those three levels in a 1/3 caster class put you two caster levels behind a straight classed character. That's gonna hurt more than the class features you pick up will help, especially compared to the alternative of Cleric 1/Wizard X.

Best case scenario, you're casting your highest level spells at the level you get the slots (which is still behind a straight caster) instead of one level after that. That isn't too broken, given the opportunity cost.

[Lolzyking]

EX and AT casters levels are 1/3 level (round down). Not 1/2 level (round down).

So example A is 13 (not 14). Example 2 is 6th level.

My suggested change assumes that we go off of Arcane tricksters and eldritch knight's actual caster progression and not the 1/3rd caster rules of multiclassing

Pure "1/3rd" casters gain their casting levels at 3rd 4th 7th 10th 13th 16th and 19th levels

[Lvl 2 Expert]

My suggested change assumes that we go off of Arcane tricksters and eldritch knight's actual caster progression and not the 1/3rd caster rules of multiclassing

Pure "1/3rd" casters gain their casting levels at 3rd 4th 7th 10th 13th 16th and 19th levels

Okay, so your suggestion is you up the power of these classes and then you change them so players can add this upped power to what is already the strongest class in the game. I'm also assuming this would remove the arcane spell failure chance for armored wizards in some manner.

You could do it, but it's almost a gestalt character at that point. For a high powered/high tier game, why not? If you plan to fully optimize it within those rules you just might need to give the druid and the cleric you're playing with a boost as well. Maybe some compatibility with ranger or paladin or barbarian or something?

Or just apply the same multi-class caster rules to every class equally, that works, at least for an all casters game...

[Malifice]

My suggested change assumes that we go off of Arcane tricksters and eldritch knight's actual caster progression and not the 1/3rd caster rules of multiclassing

Pure "1/3rd" casters gain their casting levels at 3rd 4th 7th 10th 13th 16th and 19th levels

I don't understand this post.

What do you mean by casting levels?

[Lolzyking]

I don't understand this post.

What do you mean by casting levels?

these are the level's that fighter and rogue gain their casting subclasses spell slot increases.

Multiclassing rules nerf when fighter and rogue get their spell slots.


edit


a 7th level arcane trickster has three levels worth of spell slots and access to second level spells, if they multiclass a level into wizard at this point they gain no spell slots and lose the ability to cast 2nd level spells.

[Randomthom]

Okay, so your suggestion is you up the power of these classes and then you change them so players can add this upped power to what is already the strongest class in the game. I'm also assuming this would remove the arcane spell failure chance for armored wizards in some manner.

You could do it, but it's almost a gestalt character at that point. For a high powered/high tier game, why not? If you plan to fully optimize it within those rules you just might need to give the druid and the cleric you're playing with a boost as well. Maybe some compatibility with ranger or paladin or barbarian or something?

Or just apply the same multi-class caster rules to every class equally, that works, at least for an all casters game...

There is no more arcane spell failure in 5e, you can either cast spells in armour or you can't depending on if you are proficient or not. This also applies to divine magic.

[Talamare]

Wizards are arguably the strongest in the game; this is a significant buff to Wizards.
EK are arguably one of the best, if not the best Subclass for Fighters; this is a significant buff to EK.

I mean, you won't technically "break" anything. However, you are making the things that are already strong even stronger.

[Lolzyking]

my reasoning for this is the lack of an arcane half caster and that multiclass rules arbitrarily nerf fighter and rogues spell casting progression by shifting it off their classes track and onto their total class level.