Optimum time to dip into Hexblade from Paladin

[xp3ngu1nkn1gh7x]

My group is playing Tomb of Annihilation and they needed a solid tank so I started playing a Protector Aasimar Oath of Vengeance Paladin. We just hit level 3 at the end of our last session and i'm trying to decide when the best time is to start taking levels of Warlock (Hexblade). We rolled stats and with racial bonuses i've got 15 STR, 10 DEX, 17 CON, 14 INT, 13 WIS, and 18 CHA. I'm not sure if I intend to just dip or finish out as a hexblade but I know I will take Paladin as far as 6 for the aura. I also will probably take resilient CON at some point to get CON to 18 and get the proficiency in that save to boost concentration checks. Thanks in advance :smile:

[A Fat Dragon]

Hexblade Warlock will give you a fairly good boost, as your Charisma is currently higher than your strength. It’ll allow you to get a fairly good damage boost out of the blue, so it might be good to multiclass into when you start to feel your damage dropping too low for your own comfort. Personally, I’d stick with Paladin until level 6, and then at level 7, grab Hexblade Warlock.

After that, it all depends on how you feel: If you feel like your party is lacking in damage, it might be smart to put a few more levels in Warlock, or finish it out as Warlock. If your party still needs somebody to be a shield for them, then perhaps sticking with Paladin might be optimal.

[Matrix_Walker]

It's a matter of taste. I'm currently playing a Paladin 2/Hexblade 1. I took Paladin 1, then Hexblade 1, then Paladin 2. I'll likely wait until after getting my aura at Paladin6/character level 7 to take a second level of Hexblade. I managed a 20 CHA to start, so I was anxious to sword and board fighting with CHA, so I wasted no time after starting Paladin for heavy armor.

[Asmotherion]

I Find Sorcerer 6/Hexblade 6/Paladin X to be a nice build overall.

The progression I go for is Sorcerer 1/Warlock 2/Sorcerer 1.
This is the hard part. Especially the Sorcerer levels 'till you get Metamagic. However, everything after that is going to be a smooth progression.

-Next sorcerer Level is Metamagic. Next Warlock Level is Pact Weapon.
-After that, you either upgrade your other choice, or take a feat.
-Optionally, you leave the rest for latter, and start going Paladin.

Combining your Quicken Spell Metamagic, Divine Smite, Eldritch Smite, Hex (and Hexblade's Curse) and Booming Blade, can scale up a lot of Nova Damage. Your Pact Magic can make sure you can repeat that every Short Rest (Catnap as a Sorcerer Spell will give you at least 1 short rest+1 more per session which is the regular+perhaps 1 with Rope Trick if you have a cool wizard in the Party who does that?). Eldritch Blast, Hex and less often Quicken Spell (when you can afford it), can make sure you have a very powerful Ranged Damage option, that is relevant even when you don't use your nova options.

[Innocent_bystan]

Consider your level split at level 5 (because that is a major power boost):

Do you want to attack once with a +8 modifier and a +5 damage boost? (Pal 4/ Hex1)
Or do you want to attack twice with a +6 modifier and a +3 damage boost? (Pal 5)

Are you planning on taking Booming Blade or Greenflame Blade as a cantrip? Because that approach favors the early Hexblade split and, in the case of Booming Blade, adds some stickiness to your tank. Not to mention: the Shield spell is awesome on a tank.

Personally, I'd go for the Hexblade level as soon as possible. That 18 in Charisma makes a difference. At level 4, you are ahead of the power curve. At level 5 it's more or less even. At level 6, you will be kicking yourself for not staying a pure Paladin. Finally at level 7, it's again more or less equal. At level 8, I'd take the second level of Hexblade.

What cantrips, spells and possibly invocations will you choose?

[xp3ngu1nkn1gh7x]

Hexblade Warlock will give you a fairly good boost, as your Charisma is currently higher than your strength. It’ll allow you to get a fairly good damage boost out of the blue, so it might be good to multiclass into when you start to feel your damage dropping too low for your own comfort. Personally, I’d stick with Paladin until level 6, and then at level 7, grab Hexblade Warlock.

After that, it all depends on how you feel: If you feel like your party is lacking in damage, it might be smart to put a few more levels in Warlock, or finish it out as Warlock. If your party still needs somebody to be a shield for them, then perhaps sticking with Paladin might be optimal.

Yea I am the shield for the party. I went sword and board, defensive style, and have shield of faith and protection from evil and good prepped just in case. The Hexblade dip will help boost my damage and I can use booming blade or green flame to help with the delayed extra attack. The shield spell is very tempting as well, especially because ill get spell slots back on short rest. I'm at 19 AC with starting equipment, shield of faith puts me at 21, then shield would kick it up to 26 just in case something really wants to hit me lol. Then eldritch blast would help with damage at range which I have no option for right now.

My biggest problem is both classes have a lot of good things going early. If I got Warlock 2 then I get invocations, but 1 more and I can go Pact of the Blade and get the improved pact weapon from the invocation. Stay with paladin and I get an ASI, then extra attack, then the aura. It's all very tempting lol.

[xp3ngu1nkn1gh7x]

I Find Sorcerer 6/Hexblade 6/Paladin X to be a nice build overall.

The progression I go for is Sorcerer 1/Warlock 2/Sorcerer 1.
This is the hard part. Especially the Sorcerer levels 'till you get Metamagic. However, everything after that is going to be a smooth progression.

-Next sorcerer Level is Metamagic. Next Warlock Level is Pact Weapon.
-After that, you either upgrade your other choice, or take a feat.
-Optionally, you leave the rest for latter, and start going Paladin.

Combining your Quicken Spell Metamagic, Divine Smite, Eldritch Smite, Hex (and Hexblade's Curse) and Booming Blade, can scale up a lot of Nova Damage. Your Pact Magic can make sure you can repeat that every Short Rest (Catnap as a Sorcerer Spell will give you at least 1 short rest+1 more per session which is the regular+perhaps 1 with Rope Trick if you have a cool wizard in the Party who does that?). Eldritch Blast, Hex and less often Quicken Spell (when you can afford it), can make sure you have a very powerful Ranged Damage option, that is relevant even when you don't use your nova options.

Yea I had originally wanted to multiclass into sorcerer but we already have one so I decided to go Warlock instead. I would use the slots for smites mostly but I love casters more than any other class so I know I would step on his toes pretty hard without meaning too. The catnap is an awesome idea, i'll have to talk to our sorcerer about that.

[Sigreid]

My group is playing Tomb of Annihilation and they needed a solid tank so I started playing a Protector Aasimar Oath of Vengeance Paladin. We just hit level 3 at the end of our last session and i'm trying to decide when the best time is to start taking levels of Warlock (Hexblade). We rolled stats and with racial bonuses i've got 15 STR, 10 DEX, 17 CON, 14 INT, 13 WIS, and 18 CHA. I'm not sure if I intend to just dip or finish out as a hexblade but I know I will take Paladin as far as 6 for the aura. I also will probably take resilient CON at some point to get CON to 18 and get the proficiency in that save to boost concentration checks. Thanks in advance :smile:

I'd do Hexblade the next time you level to improve your hit and damage bonuses, then take paladin to 6 for the extra attack and aura, then Hexblade 3 for either a helping familiar and that invocation that gives you maximum health from each hit die spent after a rest or improved pact weapon for a weapon that can be your focus.

Honestly, for what you describe I think the chain pact warlock with the invocation to get the health back.

[xp3ngu1nkn1gh7x]

Consider your level split at level 5 (because that is a major power boost):

Do you want to attack once with a +8 modifier and a +5 damage boost? (Pal 4/ Hex1)
Or do you want to attack twice with a +6 modifier and a +3 damage boost? (Pal 5)

Are you planning on taking Booming Blade or Greenflame Blade as a cantrip? Because that approach favors the early Hexblade split and, in the case of Booming Blade, adds some stickiness to your tank. Not to mention: the Shield spell is awesome on a tank.

Personally, I'd go for the Hexblade level as soon as possible. That 18 in Charisma makes a difference. At level 4, you are ahead of the power curve. At level 5 it's more or less even. At level 6, you will be kicking yourself for not staying a pure Paladin. Finally at level 7, it's again more or less equal. At level 8, I'd take the second level of Hexblade.

What cantrips, spells and possibly invocations will you choose?

Cantrips: Eldritch blast (for some ranged ability), and probably booming blade for the same reason you mentioned
Spells: Shield and (not sure yet lol)
Invocations: at 2nd level probably agonizing blast and Devils sight (when I go pact of the blade i'm taking improved pact weapon)

[OldTrees1]

Well it really depends on what you want out of it.

Hexblade of Ancients
Paladin 2 / Warlock 1 / Paladin +5 / Warlock +2 / Paladin +2 / Warlock +2 / Paladin +4 / Warlock +2
Feats at 5th, 11th, 13th, 17th
1st level spells at 2nd(long) / 3rd(short)
2nd at 6th(long) / 10th(short)
3rd at 12th(long) / 14th(short)
4th at 16th(long) / 20th(short)

Your Hexblade of Vengence would differ from the above for various reasons. One being that while both like Paladin 6, Vengence does not care as much for Paladin 7.

Paladin 2 / Warlock 1 / Paladin +4 / Warlock +3 / Paladin +3 / ...
Feats at 5th, 10th, 12th, ???
1st level spells at 2nd(long) / 3rd(short)
2nd at 6th(long) / 9th(short)
3rd at 12th(long) / ???

[Innocent_bystan]

Cantrips: Eldritch blast (for some ranged ability), and probably booming blade for the same reason you mentioned
Spells: Shield and (not sure yet lol)
Invocations: at 2nd level probably agonizing blast and Devils sight (when I go pact of the blade i'm taking improved pact weapon)

There's that invocation that modifies you EB to bring enemies closer to you (Grasp of Hadar?) that might be a fine addition to you arsenal.

About Improved Pact Weapon: how certain are you that you won't have a magical weapon by then? Paladins get to use their shields as a spell focus, so I'm not sure what benefit you'll have when selecting it.

[Davrix]

My group is playing Tomb of Annihilation and they needed a solid tank so I started playing a Protector Aasimar Oath of Vengeance Paladin. We just hit level 3 at the end of our last session and i'm trying to decide when the best time is to start taking levels of Warlock (Hexblade). We rolled stats and with racial bonuses i've got 15 STR, 10 DEX, 17 CON, 14 INT, 13 WIS, and 18 CHA. I'm not sure if I intend to just dip or finish out as a hexblade but I know I will take Paladin as far as 6 for the aura. I also will probably take resilient CON at some point to get CON to 18 and get the proficiency in that save to boost concentration checks. Thanks in advance :smile:

With that stat-block you should be running Conquest and you wouldn't even need to really dip into hex. Your fear aura and such will greatly help control the battlefield and you can sword and board it up and for extra silliness. Just take the magic init feat grab the druid shillelagh and terrorize with a wooden sword.

But if you truly wish for the hex dip, Paladin 2 Hex 1 then straight paladin, the longer you delay the lv 7 aura from conquest the more time it takes for you to fully come online

[xp3ngu1nkn1gh7x]

There's that invocation that modifies you EB to bring enemies closer to you (Grasp of Hadar?) that might be a fine addition to you arsenal.

About Improved Pact Weapon: how certain are you that you won't have a magical weapon by then? Paladins get to use their shields as a spell focus, so I'm not sure what benefit you'll have when selecting it.

We're running Tomb of Annihilation so i'm not sure (don't want to read ahead and spoil it) so i'm not sure when or if i'll get a magic weapon and I like the idea that my spell casting focus for my Warlock spells is always available. I have thought about Grasp of Hadar and ultimately I may replace something with it to be as sticky as possible but I'm gonna get a feel for how the group handles encounters for a little while longer before committing to the idea.

[SkylarkR6]

Not sure if it helps but I am currently running a padlock. Currently P4/W3. I have warcraster and currently Booming Blade opportunity attack with smite has caused my DM's ulcer. I'm pretty sure I'm going lock 4 next for the ASI then paladin to 7(ancients). The extra attack will be nice when I get it in 1-2 levels but the short rest slots are much fun for shenanigans and extra smiting. If you don't get short rest in your group your mileage will obviously vary.

Remember, my motto though, "Hold Person means never having to say 'natural 20'"

On a side note... My character might be targeted next session for some unknown reasons

[xp3ngu1nkn1gh7x]

Not sure if it helps but I am currently running a padlock. Currently P4/W3. I have warcraster and currently Booming Blade opportunity attack with smite has caused my DM's ulcer. I'm pretty sure I'm going lock 4 next for the ASI then paladin to 7(ancients). The extra attack will be nice when I get it in 1-2 levels but the short rest slots are much fun for shenanigans and extra smiting. If you don't get short rest in your group your mileage will obviously vary.

Remember, my motto though, "Hold Person means never having to say 'natural 20'"

On a side note... My character might be targeted next session for some unknown reasons

Lol that sounds pretty good to me. Yea hold person is the goal. That with some double smites will devastate! I was having trouble deciding between Warcaster and Sentinel. Warcaster for Booming Blade like you have and Sentinel for the stickiness. Warcaster does have a lot of other benefits as well so maybe i'll go with it.

[strangebloke]

I'm taking my first level in hexblade so that I can dump STR and then going straight pally.

Plate armor is the main reason to start in paladin, as far as I can tell. Warlock has better skills and starting money. 4 extra points of point buy is worth losing 1 AC in my book. I might dip back into the class after paladin.

[SkylarkR6]

Lol that sounds pretty good to me. Yea hold person is the goal. That with some double smites will devastate! I was having trouble deciding between Warcaster and Sentinel. Warcaster for Booming Blade like you have and Sentinel for the stickiness. Warcaster does have a lot of other benefits as well so maybe i'll go with it.

I prefer warcaster to sentinal for a couple reasons. Love the advantage on concentration, especially once pally 6 kicks in. Perform somatic components with full hands opens up options "Why yes Mr DM, my holy symbol is on my shield, I have a ruby of war mage on my sword and I have warcaster. I shall cast whatever I want with my sword and board padlock" and of course you can always cast a single target spell with it as a reaction, some that even stop them from moving anyway. Can you guess my favorite?

[SkylarkR6]

I'm taking my first level in hexblade so that I can dump STR and then going straight pally.

Plate armor is the main reason to start in paladin, as far as I can tell. Warlock has better skills and starting money. 4 extra points of point buy is worth losing 1 AC in my book. I might dip back into the class after paladin.

You need 13 strength to multiclass in or out of paladin unless your DM waives the requirement. And with medium armor you need 14 Dex to max AC instead of strength 15