Initiative. Important for non dex class

[Whit]

There are a lot of variables to this but want to make it a simple question. You encounter X monster.
Out of non dex class builds. Let’s just say each with 10 dexterity and you can choose alert feat. Which order of importance per class would you rate to get it first
barbarian, cleric, druid, fighter, paladin

[Easy_Lee]

All of those classes benefit from going sooner except for the cleric or druid IF either is a dedicated healer. Martials want to setup their rage, kill the opponents, or otherwise act before the first creature goes. Damage and control-oriented spellcasters want to hit as many creatures as they can with a big effect before those creatures can spread out or get intermingled with the caster's allies. Buffers want to get their group buffs up immediately.

Only the Healer wants to move after the martials in order to undo the damage done to them. Even then, going first is beneficial since it lets you Ready a spell or get a free turn off to setup. If you're at the top of the initiative order then, after the first turn, you act exactly as if you were at the bottom.

[A Fat Dragon]

Well, Cleric may want to go last, if the cleric is playing more healing orientated, Vs. other builds. Honestly, I’d probably want the Barbarian up first, followed by Fighter, then Paladin, Druid, then Cleric.

But, that’s my preference. Barbarian should always have relatively high initiative, and it is quite Dex-orientated, seeing as how you can’t just slap on some plate armor and call it a day.

Edit: Ninja’d.

[Grod_The_Giant]

Honestly, I almost never place any importance on initiative. Sure, it's nice to go first, but unless you invest a significant amount of resources into it, the difference between your +4 and the monster's +0 is going to be wildly overshadowed by the sheer size of the d20's spread.

[Galactkaktus]

Cleric first since he can give bless to the other dudes before they attack that way. Probably followed by the druid since a well placed control spell can just end fights or he can engage stuff while wildshaping to sponge alot of damage. Then i whould want the rest to act in accordance to their damage potential since killing stuff faster means less attacks against you.

[Honest Tiefling]

Assuming a somewhat...Standard build, I guess Druid > Barbarian/Fighter > Paladin > Cleric? In reality, it's going to be Controller > AoE Damage > Single-Target Damage or Defender > Support. It's really more about role than class. Through yes, clerics can drop a LOT of nice buffs or damage if they are built that way, so this is assuming a support cleric.

I feel like unless you are dropping down AoE Buffs/Control/Damage, you're going to be fine with a mediocre initiative as long as someone else in the party can pick up slack in all but the most optimized of games.

[MeeposFire]

I do not think that this question works very well. Are you going to want to go first if there is a large group of enemies and you have a wizard in your group that has an unfriendly AOE at the ready? Well in that case I probably want to go after the wizard. So yea context really matters.

[bid]

Honestly, I almost never place any importance on initiative. Sure, it's nice to go first, but unless you invest a significant amount of resources into it, the difference between your +4 and the monster's +0 is going to be wildly overshadowed by the sheer size of the d20's spread.
Eh?

While I agree initiative isn't that important, "overshadowed" is profoundly wrong.

Out of the 400 results possible:
+0 = 190 : 20 : 190 ~ 1:1
+4 = 120 : 16 : 264 ~ 1:2

Going from 1/2 to 2/3 is a good difference.

[Easy_Lee]

Another way of looking at it: initiative is important on characters who have something useful to do with high initiative. Assassins are obvious, but fighters, barbarians, and most wizards have good reasons to want to win. Barbarians and fighters, particularly fighters if they action surge, have a good chance of outright killing one creature, meaning the fight just got easier. Barbarians further want to setup their rage so they take half damage from physical attacks. And wizards, if they're clever, should try to catch all of the enemies in a stinking cloud, hypnotic pattern, or similar. Even single target spells like Enemies Abound often work much better when you can get the enemies to stand close to each other instead of close to your allies.

Initiative is a big deal, it's just not a big deal for every character.

[Davrix]

Honestly I let players use Dex Wis or Int for Initiative. But as Grod said in the grand scheme of things it doesn't make a huge difference but in this case it lets my players feel happy

[Pex]

I think initiative is overrated. It's nice to go first. Some class abilities may really need it. If you need it or want it go for it. However, not going first does not make you The Suck. It can be advantageous not going first because you know what the enemy has done or see their plan of attack. That enables you to respond to it or do your own thing knowing they can't stop it or force them to respond to you and not do what they wanted on their next turn. Personally I don't care about initiative in character creation.

[Laserlight]

I do not think that this question works very well. Are you going to want to go first if there is a large group of enemies and you have a wizard in your group that has an unfriendly AOE at the ready? Well in that case I probably want to go after the wizard. So yea context really matters.

I think this is the more important point. "Do I want to go before the monsters?" is a Yes for everyone. "How important is it that I act before Bob and Claire?" is a different question. As a god wizard, I'd rather go first to either AoE the enemy or buff my party while I have them all in range, before they start running in all directions. As a barb, I probably want to act after my casters. As a rogue, I kinda want to go after the barb, so my target has someone adjacent.

[Honest Tiefling]

Honestly I let players use Dex Wis or Int for Initiative. But as Grod said in the grand scheme of things it doesn't make a huge difference but in this case it lets my players feel happy

Hrm. Interesting idea, do you just let the players swap, or do you have some rules regarding it?