Dragonic Sorcerer Optimisation 3.5?

[Asmotherion]

So, we're starting a campain in 3.5. I haven't played in a wile (except from a one-shot, that ended up being a Hellfire Warlock), so I've forgotten how to optimise Spellcasters.

We're probably starting at level 5, but I'd like to be relevant from level 1 if possible, just in case.

I have a fondness for reserve feats (I'll take mini-fireballs as soon as possible, as an alternative to my eldritch blast), but since I am going for a Bronze Dragon Ancestry, I am also considering Strorm Bolt instead of Fiery Burst (or Both, but it's a bit taxing for a Sorcerer, who gets no Bonus metamagic feats). My main concern is the fact I have to wait more levels to get it.

I also like Dimensional Jaunt and Summon Elemental, a lot of utility, as well as Huricane Breath for thematic reasons.

The most direct approach would really be to not take those at all, if I could somehow multiclass Dragon Fire Adept and Sorcerer through Eldritch Theurge, but the special requirements need Eldritch Blast 2d6 (and the special benefits are Eldritch Blast Oriented).

The Main Reason I want to play a sorcerer is to quallify for a special fammiliar (Dragon Wyrmling) and a Dragonpact latter on (RP reasons mostly). If I go into the Spellcaster path, I'm also not willing to derail from it more that 4 levels other than a prestige class (thus, what I can re-take with Practiced Spellcaster)

Other ideas I had was Ultimate Magus for bunus metamagic feats (and the ability to prepare my Fire spells at a higher level) and then Archmage, for Nova Damage.

Finally, the big question is, to Template or not to Template? I am very Charisma Based (as a Sorcerer), or Con based (as a Dragonfire Adept). I want a High Cha and Con, as well as Int, since I might go for Wizard/Ultimate Magus (as well as I want to have Skills). I do like Dex and Wis, and as long as my Str does not make me a "weakling" visual wise, I'm ok (because, I'm supposed to be part-dragon, but not one trained in hand to hand combat)

Stat targeted:
Cha >21 >Con>=Int>=Dex>Wis>=Str


That said, we discussed and won't modify any class requirements for this, so I'm looking for a thematic build to create this.

Any ideas?

[BowStreetRunner]

If I go into the Spellcaster path, I'm also not willing to derail from it more that 4 levels other than a prestige class (thus, what I can re-take with Practiced Spellcaster)
Of course, if you do pick up a prestige class that improves casting, it's almost always better than vanilla sorcerer. A few years back I tried compiling a list of the prestige classes (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?294500-The-Improved-Sorcerer) that did exactly that. I never got around to adding the setting-specific PrCs (Eberron, Forgotten Realms, etc), but it's pretty much complete with all of the non-setting specific books.

[daremetoidareyo]

bronze Dragon heritage is the one that forces people to move away from you, right?

you want caltrops, and the draconic claw feat...

[BowStreetRunner]

bronze Dragon heritage is the one that forces people to move away from you, right?

Draconic Heritage (Bronze) gets you dragonblood subtype; +1 (per draconic feat) on saves vs sleep, paralysis, and Electricity spells & abilities; Survival as a sorcerer class skill.
Bronze Dragon Lineage gets you a swift action mind-affecting enchantment (compulsion) effect to spend an arcane slot which will force opponents within 30' to make a will save or start their next turn moving 5 ft away from you.
If you acquire enough draconic feats to pick up Draconic Legacy then bronze will add Control water (4th level), speak with animals, and water breathing to your list of spells known.

[Asmotherion]

Thank you all for your replies.

Here is the update: So, we are starting at level 6 after all.

Race Options: Silverbrow Human OR Spellscale OR High Elf

So far, I am going for Wizard3/Sorcerer1/Ultimate Magus 2

I think I want to end up with an Ultimate Magus Build, Buffer and Utility mostly who Deals Damage with Ranged Touch Atacks and the Occasional Save of Suck/Die AoE so:

Cha>=Dex>=Int>Con
Rest are dumb stats. Won't be quite wise or strong, but I won't drop lower than 12 either.

The campain is planed to go 'till level 20, and as I go out of Ultimate Magus, I intend to Grab Abjurant Champion. If I don't go High Elf, I'll quallify for it with my Human Feat (Weapon Proficiency), or I'll have to dedicate a Feat to it in the long run.

Other feats I want are:

Practiced Spellcaster (Still haven't Selected wich class to apply it to, since I don't know which one I want as my main spellcasting class)

One Reserve Feat that Provides me with an All-Purpose Magic Attack (Haven't Decided which one yet; I know one thing for sure though, spellcasters should never be reduced to throwing arrows, even when short of spell slots.
I am considering Acidic Splatter, touch Attacks being my thing, but my Range is very limited at my current level; Fiery Burst seems the best choice, but I don't like save-or-suck very much. My 3rd option; Hurricane Breath seems like a nice control effect to give my Fighter buddy attacks of opportunity from a distance).

Heighten Spell: The only thing that makes me not Hate Save or Suck spells in this eddition, but rather not being very enthusiastic about them is this metamagic Feat. It's also the main edge a Sorcerer has on a Wizard (Spontaneusly Heightening his lower Spell Slots to whatever level, thus needing only 1 effective tool-spell of each type, rather than a bunch of spells that do the exact same thing, but apply to different situations).


Latter on:
Summon Elemental Reserve Feat: Huge Versality, Substitutes completely a lot of spells. Bonus for giving me RP oportunity of Binder/Warlock light Eddition (Together with making a Dragonpact at latter Levels). On the other hand, it might get a Ban, due to it's pure Versality. So, moving on.

Empower Spell: Because the campain will go on, and I want to profit from my caster level on the long run.

Energy Substitution+Energy Admixture: As I said, I love (Ranged) Touch Attacks. They deny you your AC, and speciffically the Orb of X line of spells (if I remember correctly, and did my research right through my google-fu), denies the target it's Spell Resistance, which will be crucial in our campain (DM told me he does not mind a small amount of metagame in our character builds), since we'll be dealing with Drow Elves, Vampires, Liches, and other things with SR. I don't want to be the guy who got "A ton of Amazing Spells" only to cast the like a Magicarp (...but nothing happened). It also fits well thematically with my character, since I play a Dragonic Origin, and focusing on Elemental Energies as part of my research as an Ultimate Magus (a Wizard experimenting on his Sorcerous Dragonic Origin) fits well.

A form I want to exploit for combat via the Alter Self spell is the Blackscale Lizardfolk (+7 Natural Armor -1 due to size), and on top, I look a lot like a Dragon... Kinda like a Cheap Dragon Form Buff. Together with Mage Armor and Shield, I should have an Ok AC, around 26-28, perhaps 30 if I manage Cat's Grace. I think I can survive delivering touch attacks for level 6 most of the time; I'm a caster after all, I am not expected to have a ton of AC.

Anything else I could look for? Something here that does not work quite as intended? It should be noted that Dragon Magazin Material and Unearthed Arcana are unavalable to me for the build, as well as setting specific material (I think). We are playing in Forgotten Realms, and anything specifically for it should be fine though.

[Tytalus]

So far, I am going for Wizard3/Sorcerer1/Ultimate Magus 2


You need 5 class levels before entering ultimate magus to meet its skill requirements.

I suggest you take a look at one of the various ultimate magus handbooks to get the most out of it.

[Zaq]

Of the directly damaging reserve feats, only Acidic Splatter, Fiery Burst, and Winter's Blast are available with 2nd level spells. Since you're interrupting your casting progression, you might not have 3rd level spells available by the time you get your 6th level feat, depending on how exactly you divide your levels. If that's the case, Fiery Burst is likely to be the most useful of those three options simply because it's the only one that will allow you to not be within 15 ft of your target.

[Asmotherion]

You need 5 class levels before entering ultimate magus to meet its skill requirements.

I suggest you take a look at one of the various ultimate magus handbooks to get the most out of it.
I knew I was missing something... thanks for the catch. So I guess either Wiz3/Sor2/Ult1 or Wiz4/Sor1/Ult1. Any suggestions on which progression is more optimal?

I've taken a look on the suggested builds online, but found nothing about a Sorcerer/Wizard build, since most of them focus on Wizard/Beguiler. I want to play a Wizard/Sorcerer for a specific character concept, focusing more into his Sorcerer side (and dragonic side) on early levels.


Of the directly damaging reserve feats, only Acidic Splatter, Fiery Burst, and Winter's Blast are available with 2nd level spells. Since you're interrupting your casting progression, you might not have 3rd level spells available by the time you get your 6th level feat, depending on how exactly you divide your levels. If that's the case, Fiery Burst is likely to be the most useful of those three options simply because it's the only one that will allow you to not be within 15 ft of your target.

I really like Acidic Splatter, since it's a Ranged Touch Attack, and ignores Armor, Shield and Natural Armor. I figured at higher levels I'll probably be passing most of my time invisible during combat, to deny Dex as well, making it almost an auto hit.

That said, it's not very wise to be that close when I'm a d4 HD. Perhaps I'll retrain it latter if my DM lets me?

For now, I have access to lesser Orb spells for that (I'll probably take 1 for now).

[Grim Reader]

So, we're starting a campain in 3.5. I haven't played in a wile (except from a one-shot, that ended up being a Hellfire Warlock), so I've forgotten how to optimise Spellcasters.

The Main Reason I want to play a sorcerer is to quallify for a special fammiliar (Dragon Wyrmling) and a Dragonpact latter on (RP reasons mostly). If I go into the Spellcaster path, I'm also not willing to derail from it more that 4 levels other than a prestige class (thus, what I can re-take with Practiced Spellcaster)

The first rule of spellcaster optimization is "Thou shalt not lose caster levels" Its also the second rule, and not coincidentally, the third. Now caster level is an expression that does a lot of different jobs in D&D. What is referred to here is the spells per day and getting spells of higher levels progression of caster level. That is the progression that Practiced Spellcaster does nada for. It only boosts the caster level that affects things like duration, damage dice etc.


I knew I was missing something... thanks for the catch. So I guess either Wiz3/Sor2/Ult1 or Wiz4/Sor1/Ult1. Any suggestions on which progression is more optimal?

Thou shalt not lose caster levels. So an Ultimate Magus wants as many of the single-advancement levels as possible to land on the wizard side, and as much wizard as possible. That means Wiz 4/Sorc 1 /UM 1. Practiced spellcaster on the Sorc side, because that keeps the caster level UM assigns spellcasting advancement by higher on the Sorc side. Reserve feats do give you a competence bonust to spells with some descriptors, so ask you DM if that affects the UMs "Highest caster level" set. If so, you might manage to lose only one level of Wizard casting through the whole progression.

You can actually enter UM as a Wiz 5 with the spontaneous divination variant, but that is primarily useful for things like Sublime Chord etc stuff.

[Kurald Galain]

See if your DM allows Pathfinder books. Their Draconic sorcerer gets +1 per die on all damage spells of your favorite element. Makes blasting that much more viable.