Thri-kreen Race.

[Ivor_The_Mad]

Thri-kreen

Thri-kreen Traits
Ability Score Increase Your Dexterity increases by two and your Constitution increases by 1.
Age Thri-kreen mature around 6 and rarely live past 30.
Alignment Thri-Kreen tend toward Chaotic Neutral. "Thri-kreen tend wander the deserts and savannas of the world, avoiding all other races."
Size Your size is Medium.
Speed Your base walking speed is 35ft.
Bite Your pincers act as a natural weapon and can be used as unarmed strikes. (1d6 + Str) piercing damage
Sleepless "Thri-kreen don't require sleep and can rest while remaining alert and performing light tasks. Their inability to sleep is thought to be the reason why thri-kreen have such short lifespans."
Standing Leap "The Thri-kreen's long jump is up to 30 feet and its high jump is up to 15 feet, with or without a running start."
Chameleon Carapace "The thri-kreen can change the color of its carapace to match the color and texture of its surroundings. As a result, it has advantage on Dexterity (Stealth) checks made to hide."
Natural Armor You have hard chitinous plates that provide protection. Your AC = 13+Dex
Languages"Thri-kreen employ a language without words. To show emotion and reaction, a thri-kreen clacks its mandibles and waves its antennae, giving other thri-kreen a sense of what it is thinking and feeling. Other creatures find this manner of communication difficult to interpret and impossible to duplicate. When forced to interact with creatures of other intelligent species, thri-kreen employ alternative methods of communication, such as drawing pictures in sand or making pictures out of twigs or blades of grass."
You can communicate in Thri-kreen, and common.
Four Armed You have two sets of arms allowing you to hold twice as many items. Your arms count as two separate sets.

Isolationists and Wanderers. "Thri-kreen consider all other living creatures as potential nourishment, and they love the taste of elf flesh in particular. If a creature might be useful for something other than food, the thri-kreen aren't likely to attack it on sight. Thri-kreen kill to survive, never for sport.
Other information can be found here: http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Thri-kreen

Thanks for reading. Did I miss something or should I change something?

Citation: WotC

[Kuulvheysoon]

Well, you missed one of their most distinctive traits, and the hardest to balance- they have 4 arms.

[Ivor_The_Mad]

Well, you missed one of their most distinctive traits, and the hardest to balance- they have 4 arms.
Hmm... yes I do seem to have overlooked that. Any ideas?

[danpit2991]

Hmm... yes I do seem to have overlooked that. Any ideas?

multi attack

[Erys]

I would change their Standing Leap to somewhat mirror the Tabaxi Sprint ability; where the Thri-kreen can jump per the spell but after doing so they have to spend an action 're-centering themselves'.

I would give them a Racial Feat: Multi-attack, to cover their four arms.

Past that, looks good to me. $$

[Arenabait]

Perhaps have it so that the secondary arms can always count as a free hand for things like Casting, holding objects, object interactions, drinking a potion, holding stuff, etc. But they can't be used to wield two handed or versatile weapons.

An important point: This would *not* change how TWF works. Still has to be two light weapons (at least without the feat), and they'd still get only one extra attack from a bonus action.

[Davrix]

How I want this race back heh BUG MEN

Seems this might be a little overturned atm. So here are my suggestions. You are free to take or disregard any of my changes, though I feel this brings them more in balance with other races while offering some pretty good bonuses.


Thri-kreen

Thri-kreen Traits
Ability Score Increase Your Dexterity increases by two and your Constitution increases by 1.
Age Thri-kreen mature around 6 and rarely live past 30.
Alignment Thri-Kreen tend toward Chaotic Neutral. "Thri-kreen tend wander the deserts and savannas of the world, avoiding all other races."
Size Your size is Medium.
Speed Your base walking speed is 30ft (they have a lot going for them in this build, increase movement just seems like overkill in features)
Bite - Your pincers act as a natural weapon and can be used as unarmed strikes. (1d6 + Str) "piercing damage, and the target must succeed on a Constitution saving throw (DC = 8+Prof+Con) or be poisoned until the start of your next turn. If the saving throw fails by 5 or more, the target becomes paralyzed for the duration of the poison. (I would suggest a feat to increase its duration and add damage based on Con mod)
Stasis - Thri-kreen can enter into a state of awareness that gains all the benefits of sleep, though they are aware of any sudden changes to the environment around them as if they were awake. This is most commonly used when guarding the hatchery
Multiple limbs - You have a second pair of arms, they are not as strong or dexterousness as your upper arms but they allow you to hold small items such a potion or dagger. You can take one additional free item interaction per turn than normal or you may use a potion as a bonus action if held in this way. . You cannot use these limbs to make a weapon attack or cast spells.
Standing Leap - You count as having a running start when you take the jump action.
Chameleon Carapace - The thri-kreen can change the color of its carapace to match the color and texture of its surroundings. As a result, it has advantage on Dexterity (Stealth) checks when taking the hide action or remaining motionless on there turn.
Natural Armor - You have hard chitinous plates that provide protection. Your AC = 13+Dex
Hive Mind - Thri-kreen do not communicate like other races. They instead use a mixture of clicks and clacks, with a mixture of antennae motions and pheromones in the air to allow an emphatic connection between there own kind. Thri-Kreen can understand common however but cannot speak it. instead relying on pictures and gestures to communicate their intentions. This can sometimes lead to frustrating interactions between other races.

Isolationists and Wanderers. "Thri-kreen consider all other living creatures as potential nourishment, and they love the taste of elf flesh in particular. If a creature might be useful for something other than food, the thri-kreen aren't likely to attack it on sight. Thri-kreen kill to survive, never for sport.

[the_brazenburn]

Whoa, no crap. You really thought about this.

As for the four armed feature, you could just say that they can be used to hold light weapons, and can make an extra attack with TWF.

I do love the thri-kreen, though.

[Ivor_The_Mad]

A lot of good points. I like the idea of making the feats. As for the arms: They let you hold 2 extra items and you can attack twice. Speed is now 35 ft.

Thri-Kreen Feats

Paralyzing Venom: When you make a bite attack the target must succeed on a Constitution saving throw or be poisoned for 5 minutes. If the saving throw fails by 5 or more, the target is also paralyzed while poisoned in this way. The poisoned target can repeat the saving throw on each of its turns, ending the effect on itself on a success."

Four Armed Fighter: (+ TWF) You treat your other 2 arms as you would others you can use them to hold weapons and attack. You also get 2 bonus interactions with items on your turn. You can now use two two handed weapons

[Ivor_The_Mad]

At some point ill work on subclasses.
Subclasses:
Mantis
Ant
...
...
...

also the arms, if you have TWF, can use two two handed weapons.

[Willie the Duck]

multi attack


I would give them a Racial Feat: Multi-attack, to cover their four arms.

Multi-attack (the general principle, not the MM ability) is what has made Thri-kreen one of the more problematic races in most editions they've shown up in. I would make very clear what the parameters were for this.

Alternately, make it very clear that with their stereo-articulated eyes (https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2002-04-12), it fails to give them additional attacks, so much as simply additional hands to hold things (such that they don't have to switch out weapons and the like).



Four Armed Fighter: (+ TWF) You treat your other 2 arms as you would others you can use them to hold weapons and attack. You also get 2 bonus interactions with items on your turn. You can now use two two handed weapons

Again, spell out exactly what that means. Having seen what happened with homebrew Thri-kreens in the past, someone will interpret that as meaning their 11th level Thri-kreen fighter can make 3 attacks each with two greatswords as their normal action, and then TWF with their claws as a bonus action, or the like.

[Davrix]

A lot of good points. I like the idea of making the feats. As for the arms: They let you hold 2 extra items and you can attack twice. Speed is now 35 ft.

Thri-Kreen Feats

Paralyzing Venom: When you make a bite attack the target must succeed on a Constitution saving throw or be poisoned for 5 minutes. If the saving throw fails by 5 or more, the target is also paralyzed while poisoned in this way. The poisoned target can repeat the saving throw on each of its turns, ending the effect on itself on a success."

Four Armed Fighter: (+ TWF) You treat your other 2 arms as you would others you can use them to hold weapons and attack. You also get 2 bonus interactions with items on your turn. You can now use two two handed weapons

For the venom that is to good of a trait for any racial. It would be much better and more useful to a player it is a one round effect also it needs to have the rule, once used it cannot be sued again until a short or long rest. Much like the lizard-man one is from volo's when they bite and heal from it.

So to make it akin to the lizard man (which you should for balance reasons)

Bite - The Thri-Keen can use its mandibles to make an unarmed Bite attack at 1D4+str)
Venom - As an attack action, the Thri-keen can make a bite attack and inject poison into the wound if it hits. The target becomes poisoned until the end of its next turn. Once used this attack cannot be used again until a short or long rest is finished.

(this way there is no save now, a target is poisoned for one round. This is a very fitting racial. Having it longer or more potent should be baked into a feat like thus.)

Feat - Deadly Bite
- Your bite attack is now 1D6+str and counts as magical for overcoming resistance
- Venom now lasts for one minute when applied. The creature must now make a saving throw at the end of each of it turns. (Sv DC 8+Prof+Con) If it succeeds the poison ends. If it fails the save by 5 or more the target becomes paralyzed on top of being poisoned until it makes a successful save and both conditions end.

Four arm fighter -No

Do not let them use weapons or any kind of attack with these. They have never been balanced around it and you come into contact with to many problems with duel weapon feats and such. Avoid this all together and stick to the suggestion of what i wrote above. It should be utility and not a offensive bonus or this will become un-balanced right quick and they already have some really good racial. You could literally leave this off and the race would still be really good compared to others. Also seriously two-two hander weapons? Are you just looking for something broken and OP or do you want a functional balanced race?

Multiple limbs - You have a second pair of arms, they are not as strong or dexterousness as your upper arms but they allow you to hold up to, two small items such a potion or dagger. You now have two free item interactions per turn and can use a potion as a bonus action. You cannot use these arms to make attacks or cast spells.

The bonus potion action is a great feature and well wroth a racial sense its normally a full action. If you allow any sort of weapon use with them, your going to get so many people trying to cheese things. You are welcome to disregard my input on this but just know that it will be a very broken feature at that point and make them essential the best martial race choice. Now if you wish to still have this feature I would suggest a Feat at least to allow this in some way but not in the base race.

Example

Feat - Flurry of Limbs
You have trained your lower limbs to be stronger and more durable than your kin
- You have advantage of any grapple check if nothing is held in your lower arms and have one of your main arms free.
- you may use your lower limbs to hold one light weapon. As a bonus action you can make an additional attack and add your ability score to the damage roll. These arms are seperate from any ablities or feats that augment normal humanoid attacks and thus cannot be affected by them.
- You can take a bonus action to make two unarmed non-magical claw attacks at 1D4+str.

[Blackbando]

Shouldn't this be in Homebrew Design?

Just a thought.

[Ivor_The_Mad]

Multi-attack (the general principle, not the MM ability) is what has made Thri-kreen one of the more problematic races in most editions they've shown up in. I would make very clear what the parameters were for this.

Alternately, make it very clear that with their stereo-articulated eyes (https://www.schlockmercenary.com/2002-04-12), it fails to give them additional attacks, so much as simply additional hands to hold things (such that they don't have to switch out weapons and the like).



Again, spell out exactly what that means. Having seen what happened with homebrew Thri-kreens in the past, someone will interpret that as meaning their 11th level Thri-kreen fighter can make 3 attacks each with two greatswords as their normal action, and then TWF with their claws as a bonus action, or the like.

Sooo... how would you word it?

[Ivor_The_Mad]

Shouldn't this be in Homebrew Design?

Just a thought.

... maybe...

[Davrix]

Sooo... how would you word it?
The simple solution is you don’t let them so they can’t abuse it and you work it into the feat like I posted. As I said having this as a base feature would make the race to good or you need to take other things out so it doesn’t get as much because it’s alrwady over budget when it comes to features and it’s stats.

[Willie the Duck]

Sooo... how would you word it?

Mind you, I'm reticent to give the T-k any additional attacks, so you might not like what I'd say. I would word it something along the lines of "the Thri-kreen may hold onto twice as many objects as a two-armed/handed individual, being that four one-handed objects, two two-handed objects, or a two-handed object plus two one-handed objects. If more than one of these objects is a weapon and the Thri-kreen has multiple attacks based on their class abilities (or chooses to use two-weapon fighting, otherwise following the same rules as any other player), they may alternate which weapon they use for each attack (or, if they have a free hand, they may make a claw attack with one of their attacks, and as always a monk may make an unarmed attack even if all of their hands are occupied). Likewise, during other creatures' turns, a Thri-kreen threatens Opportunity Attacks so long as they have a hand free (for claw attacks) or if any of the weapons held are melee weapons (and at a greater distance if wielding a weapon with reach, following the standard rules for such weapons)."

[Davrix]

Mind you, I'm reticent to give the T-k any additional attacks, so you might not like what I'd say. I would word it something along the lines of "the Thri-kreen may hold onto twice as many objects as a two-armed/handed individual, being that four one-handed objects, two two-handed objects, or a two-handed object plus two one-handed objects. If more than one of these objects is a weapon and the Thri-kreen has multiple attacks based on their class abilities (or chooses to use two-weapon fighting, otherwise following the same rules as any other player), they may alternate which weapon they use for each attack (or, if they have a free hand, they may make a claw attack with one of their attacks, and as always a monk may make an unarmed attack even if all of their hands are occupied). Likewise, during other creatures' turns, a Thri-kreen threatens Opportunity Attacks so long as they have a hand free (for claw attacks) or if any of the weapons held are melee weapons (and at a greater distance if wielding a weapon with reach, following the standard rules for such weapons)."

I just feel like giving them ANY sort of weapon option in the base race = to powerful and players at a table would argue over how to abuse it as they have always done from the past renditions of it. Letting them have a bonus action for a potion is a very nice perk and you can bake in weapon use into a feat. That way its much simpler for a DM to either tweak the feat as needed to allow what they wish or outright ban it so it doesn't become a issue. Your just asking for to many problems by putting it int he base race.

[Willie the Duck]

I just feel like giving them ANY sort of weapon option in the base race = to powerful and players at a table would argue over how to abuse it as they have always done from the past renditions of it. Letting them have a bonus action for a potion is a very nice perk and you can bake in weapon use into a feat. That way its much simpler for a DM to either tweak the feat as needed to allow what they wish or outright ban it so it doesn't become a issue. Your just asking for to many problems by putting it int he base race.

I'm not giving them a weapon option. All races already have the option of attacking with a different weapon with each attack (if they have multiple attacks)-- most are just limited to choosing between the two one-handed weapons they could potentially be carrying at once.

EDIT: Oh, I see, you had the only to 'hold small items such a potion or dagger' and get extra object interactions instead. Yeah, I can see how that might be another option also with limited abuse potential.

[Davrix]

I'm not giving them a weapon option. All races already have the option of attacking with a different weapon with each attack (if they have multiple attacks)-- most are just limited to choosing between the two one-handed weapons they could potentially be carrying at once.

EDIT: Oh, I see, you had the only to 'hold small items such a potion or dagger' and get extra object interactions instead. Yeah, I can see how that might be another option also with limited abuse potential.

I understand your logic and its not a bad option but I'm hesitant to allow any sort of text that lets you hold extra weapons in them aside from at most a dagger because players will try to abuse it in some way. So its just better to not give that option and then bake it into a feat which will be much easier to balance or change as needed for a GM using this race.

[Ivor_The_Mad]

I see now why WotC had trouble with this before... This is *&#!@$% confusing.

[Davrix]

I see now why WotC had trouble with this before... This is *&#!@$% confusing.

It's not confusing its just some players will abuse things given half the chance. The solution is simple, its just one I don't think you liked. You want them to have the second set of arms to wield weapons. My option does not allow for that outside of the feat. You are more then welcome to just let them hold a weapon in them, just realize this will be abused and many will simply look at your home-brew and go Broken and either take the option out or nerf it.

Allow me to break down though why my option is probably the best choice here.


Multiple limbs - You have a second pair of arms, they are not as strong or dexterousness as your upper arms but they allow you to hold up to, two small items such a potion or dagger. You now have two free item interactions per turn and can use a potion as a bonus action. You cannot use these arms to make attacks or cast spells.

Feat - Flurry of Limbs
You have trained your lower limbs to be stronger and more durable than your kin
- You have advantage of any grapple check if nothing is held in your lower arms and have one of your main arms free.
- you may use your lower limbs to hold one light weapon. As a bonus action you can make an additional attack and add your ability score to the damage roll. These arms are separate from any abilities or feats that augment normal humanoid attacks and thus cannot be affected by them.
- You can take a bonus action to make two unarmed non-magical claw attacks at 1D4+str.


These will have to be re-worded still as i can already see some flaws in the wording of the text but for the moment that is a separate problem and one easily solved by looking at the PH and seeing how they word certain things.

Multiple Limbs - The goal here is to allow for an extra item interaction per turn (you normally get one free) & having the option to use a potion as a bonus action instead of a full action. (this is amazing for low level parties and still good even on the high end where many racial perks fall off) This cuts off any abuse of wielding a weapon by a player in the base race and sense the other perks you have listed are extremely good as well you cant give them an extra set of weapon arms or the ability to cast because you will negate many feats in the book. most notably war-caster and duel wielder along with two-weapon fighting style.

Feat - Flurry of Limbs - Here is where you can best put options to give them a weapon in the extra limbs. You keep to the style of race you wish while allowing for competition from other feats rather then outright deleting them. Now granted what I have here might be a little to good. It barrows from grappler and the duel weapon fighting style. So this needs some tweaking now that i think about it. They key I think right now is putting the line about these arms being separate from other feats that augment fighting such as duelist or duel wielder is key. Your going to have to make this distinction because it simply doesn't work well with the action economy of 5th and you need to give the DM some control. Personally I feel like you could leave this feat out all together and be fine with the Race perks I have suggested and you would have a mostly balanced and playable race to use in any 5th game that I don't think many Dm's would take issue with. The moment you try to add in weapons to the 2nd arms however your going to run into problems.

[LVOD]

Minor suggestion: add the caveat to their “camo” ability that they can’t be wearing armor or significant clothing.

This guys is pretty strong already, and a nerf like this would make sense. It doesn’t really slow him down unless he gets some magic armor/robes, but that would be the trade off

[Davrix]

Ok so I decided to put a little more effort into this as I think I'm going to introduce them into a game I'm going to run in a few months. This is still a rough draft but this would be something I would be much more comfortable in allowing at a table that feels much more in tune with Volo's and PH designs.

Thri-Kreen Traits
Ability Score Increase - Your Dexterity increases by two and your Constitution increases by 1.
Age - Thri-Kreen mature around 6 and rarely live past 30.
Alignment - Thri-Kreen are mostly chaotic neutral. They view themselves as as the epitome of evolution. The hive offering both superior strength and intelligence over all other races. Because of this, Thri-Kreen consider all other living creatures as potential nourishment, although If a creature might prove useful for something other than food, they aren't likely to attack it on sight. Thri-Kreen kill to survive, never for sport.
Size - Thri-keen are on the smaller side of medium, usually averaging around 4 to 5 feet. the bulk of their bodies being made up by armored chitin from their carapaces.
Speed - Your base walking speed is 30ft. With a burrow speed of 10ft in soft loose earth or sand.
Bite - You can use your mandible to make an unarmed Bite attack at 1D4+str)
Venom - As an Bonus action, the Thri-keen can make a bite attack and inject poison into the wound if it hits. The target becomes poisoned until the end of its next turn. Once used this attack cannot be used again until a short or long rest is finished.
Stasis - Thri-Kreen can enter into a state of awareness that gains all the benefits of sleep, though they are aware of any sudden changes to the environment around them as if they were awake and on guard. This is most commonly used when watching the hatchery
Desert Hunter - Thri-keen are born to the sand covered hives in the desert of (Insert land)and live most of their lives near or in them protecting the hive. Because of this, harsh desert living is second nature to them. Gain proficiency in the survival skill and difficult sandy terrain counts as normal for you.
Natural Armor - You have hard chitinous plates that provide protection. Your AC = 13+Dex as long as your not wearing armor.
Multiple limbs - You have a second pair of arms, they are not as strong or as dexterousness as your upper arms but they allow you to hold small items like a potion. As such you are able to interact with things more efficiently than normal bipeds. You are allowed a second free item interaction on your turn and as a bonus action you may use a potion instead of using an action providing you are holding the potion.
Hive Mind - Thri-Kreen do not communicate like other races. They instead use various clicking sounds and pheromones to allow an empathic form of communication between their own kind. Thri-Kreen can understand common. However they cannot speak it. Instead relying on pictures and gestures to communicate their intentions. This can sometimes lead to frustrating interactions between other races they deem worthy of their time.

Thri-Keen Feats

Deadly Bite

Increase your Str or Con by +1
Your bite attack is now 1D6+Str and counts as magical for overcoming resistance
Venom now lasts for one minute when applied. The creature must now make a saving throw at the end of each of it turns. (Sv DC 8+Prof+Con) If it succeeds the poison ends. If it fails the effect continues, if the creature fails the save by 5 or more the target also becomes paralyzed until it makes a successful save and both conditions end.


Augmentation
Your body was augmented in order to better protect the hive. You gain the following additional abilities.
You count as having a running start when you take the jump action.
You have advantage on all grapple checks provided you meet the conditions of grapple with your upper arms and both of your lower arms are free to use for the grapple check.
You can change the color of your carapace to match the color and texture of its surroundings, as long as your not wearing armor. As a result, you have advantage on Dexterity (Stealth) checks when taking the hide action and creatures have disadvantage on perception checks when trying to detect you providing you didn't move on your last turn.


Flurry of Limbs (Highly experimental)
You have trained your lower limbs to be stronger and more durable than your kin
Increases Str or Dex +1
You may use your second set of arms to wield one weapon providing it has the light or finesse property. You gain +1 ac if you are holding a weapon this way but you loose the bonuses of your multiple limbs ability . You may forgo the AC bonus on your turn and take a second attack action with this weapon.

[Eric Diaz]

My favorite solution for Thri-kreen's extra arms is saying they can do whatever they want with the extra arms... but no extra actions! A two-handed weapon with a shield and a crossbow? Sword and board AND torch AND knife? Sure, why not!

Grapple with two hands then stab twice? Sounds awesome!

I don't see how this would break the game. Their AC would be improved by shield + two-handed weapon, but they wouldn't be able to wear armor (despite having some natural armor).

[Davrix]

My favorite solution for Thri-kreen's extra arms is saying they can do whatever they want with the extra arms... but no extra actions! A two-handed weapon with a shield and a crossbow? Sword and board AND torch AND knife? Sure, why not!

Grapple with two hands then stab twice? Sounds awesome!

I don't see how this would break the game. Their AC would be improved by shield + two-handed weapon, but they wouldn't be able to wear armor (despite having some natural armor).

because that literally makes them better then any other race in the game. For the very reason you just listed as one of the top abuse points. Being able to grapple and still swing a two hander? or having a sword and board and being able to grapple? Yea ummm NO

[Eric Diaz]

because that literally makes them better then any other race in the game. For the very reason you just listed as one of the top abuse points. Being able to grapple and stills wing a two hander? or having a sword and board and being able to grapple? Yea up NO

I don't see that as too much worse than using a 1d8 weapon... is about 2 extra damage, and at the cost of having lower AC and being unable to wear armor (it also depends if you're giving away magical armor etc). Grappling with 2 hands is no better than grappling with 1 IIRC (and the action economy remains unchanged), you can use a shield to shove anyway, etc. Of course, we would need some balance, but I think it could be made less powerful than, say, a variant human.

EDIT: alternatively, to really nerf this stuff give disadvantage to the two lower arms if attacking, grappling, etc. Maybe could be abused for spell components, I dunno.

[Davrix]

I don't see that as too much worse than using a 1d8 weapon... is about 2 extra damage, and at the cost of having lower AC and being unable to wear armor (it also depends if you're giving away magical armor etc). Grappling with 2 hands is no better than grappling with 1 IIRC (and the action economy remains unchanged), you can use a shield to shove anyway, etc. Of course, we would need some balance, but I think it could be made less powerful than, say, a variant human.


Variant human is the thing that breaks the power curve but honestly its a variant rule not the base rule but people seem to treat it s the standard option. Which its not.

What you want offers to much room for abuse, power builders and just makes interacting with other weapon feats... iffy at best and instead of trying to balance around all that you just avoid it and call it a day. They still have a ton of nice abilities in this set up and you wont lack for special things about your race choice.