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View Full Version : What is the Polymorph any Object spell level limit?



ayvango
2018-02-19, 07:20 PM
Its wording miss part that limits target HD as well as form HD. From given examples I could conclude that you could choose form with more HD than original creature. What about level limit? Is it 15 HD as for normal polymorph?

BowStreetRunner
2018-02-19, 07:35 PM
The wording of polymorph any object (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/polymorphAnyObject.htm) begins "This spell functions like polymorph (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/polymorph.htm), except..." which means you use the rules for polymorph except where stated in the description of polymorph any object.

Of course, polymorph beings "This spell functions like alter self (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/alterSelf.htm), except..." so getting the full rules you have to read through the entire chain of spells.

Jack_Simth
2018-02-20, 06:49 AM
Its wording miss part that limits target HD as well as form HD. From given examples I could conclude that you could choose form with more HD than original creature. What about level limit? Is it 15 HD as for normal polymorph?

Short answer is: The spell is a mess, ask your DM. If you are the DM, pick an answer that works for you and run with it.

Objects don't have HD, but you can use very explicitly use PaO to turn an object into a creature. PaO inherits from Polymorph, which has three HD limits (target's HD, caster level, 15) and will only turn a critter into another critter if the change does not exceed any of them. This is not explicitly overwritten, yet objects have no HD and can explicitly be turned into creatures that do. So at least part of the HD limit is clearly intended to be overwritten, but it's not clear which part(s). You can gauge intent by looking at the example list (for instance, "Shrew to Manticore" would suggest that target's HD is irrelevant), but that's not exactly what I'd call a hard science - you'll get disagreement on what any given entry actually implies, whether it's a text-trumps-table bad example, and so on.

So: The spell is a mess, ask your DM. If you are the DM, pick an answer that works for you and run with it.

Anthrowhale
2018-02-20, 07:14 AM
The conservative choice is that only the target HD limit is overridden. The caster level limit is however rarely relevant.

Jack_Simth
2018-02-20, 08:24 AM
The conservative choice is that only the target HD limit is overridden. The caster level limit is however rarely relevant.
What, you've never wanted to turn someone into a Great Wyrm Gold Dragon (41 HD)? Yes, if you keep the 15 HD limit from Polymorph (unclear RAW, so your mileage may vary), then the caster level limit is unlikely to come up (at Sor/Wiz 8, the default caster level for it off of a scroll is going to be 15), but it's worth mentioning as there's ways around that minimum expected caster level (take, for instance, an Rogue/Fighter that goes into Ur-Priest, then takes Contemplative for the Trickery domain; could have an 8th level spell slot and cast Polymorph Any Object from it at caster level 8).