Plugging homerule holes - My varient death rules and which things I need to change

[Albions_Angel]

Hi all,

I am taking some time to unify and tidy all my homerules that I roll out for every game I run in on of my worlds.

One of them has lots of knock on effects and I dont know all of them. So first up, I need to lay out my homerule. This wont be changing. It works for me and my games. It may actually be from a book, but I havnt seen it anywhere. I inherited it from my first group.


This replaces the standard death mechanics of 3.5e D&D.

When a character is dropped to 0HP or less, they are staggered. They can make a single move action every round without penalty. Actions beyond a single move (a second move, a standard action, swift action, etc) causes the character to bleed a single point of damage for each additional action taken.

When a character's HP becomes equal to the negative of their CON modifier, they fall unconscious and are Dying. Once each round thereafter, on their turn, they have a 10% chance to stabilize. Failure to do so results in the loss of another point of damage. Any healing, or a DC10 Heal check can stabilize the character.

When a character's HP becomes equal to the negative of their CON score, they die.


This works well in the types of games I run because the characters are encouraged to tag some healing on a staggered ally in combat to keep them up, or on an unconscious and dying ally if combat is taking a long time. It also encourages people to take risks, but also allows them to play on after "fatal" damage.

The downside is, it has knock on effects to some feats and abilities, and maybe even spells.

I have already modified Diehard, which was easy enough. Its basically the same as it normally is, but it simply applies to when a creature is dying by my rules, rather than between -1 and -9 HP.

What other rules do I need to modify. Theres a Frenzy Barbarian class ability right? Any more?

[Khedrac]

What happens with a Con of 6? Is the character consious at 1hp?

Presumably creatures without a Con score (undead and constructs) are still destroyed at 0hp?

And the big question - the spell delay death - presumably this will have no effect on when a character goes unconsious, just whether or not they die?

[Nifft]

I used a variant similar to yours, but as noted you probably want to account for low Con as well as high Con.

This variant saw extensive play-testing from level 3 to level 18.


You die at negative (Con score + 2x level).

You are staggered from 0 to negative (Con bonus + level), or at 0 if (Con bonus + level) < 1.

Originally we had death at (Con score + level) instead of 2x level, but that didn't work well with how fast damage scaled at high levels.

Note that there is no -10 in this -- it's just Con score, which is centered around 10.

[Fizban]

Aside from Delay Death there's another spell or two that can keep you conscious (Ferocity i think?), a soulmeld, probably some class features, and gaining Ferocity or a similar ability from shapeshifting. The Frenzy you're thinking of is the Frenzied Berserker's Deathless Frenzy.

Thing is, pretty much no printed 1st party material expects the ability to keep fighting past 0 to be worth more than an effective 10 hit points (except the Frenzied Berserker, such a great idea that one). Which means its quite easy and really just better to make a blanket ruling that nothing can allow a character to keep fighting past whatever your desired negative threshold is (in this case -con hp). Same thing with effects that let you ignore non-lethal, or any other combo really: hear about bad combo, blanket ruling that combo does not work, is much more effective than playing whack-a-rules-lawyer.

[BowStreetRunner]

When a character is dropped to 0HP or less, they are staggered. They can make a single move action every round without penalty. Actions beyond a single move (a second move, a standard action, swift action, etc) causes the character to bleed a single point of damage for each additional action taken.
Since you changed the rules for the Staggered condition, you will need to update the Nonlethal Damage rules or else they have the potential to become lethal too, since nonlethal damage can render you Staggered.

[Albions_Angel]

Thanks. Most of this is tightening up my language. These rules were tested extensively at all low to mid levels and worked well.

The low con thing never came up, but is easily sorted with the rider "or when your HP reaches 0, whichever value is lower".

Things without a con score are destroyed at 0 HP as normal. Honestly, thats true of any NPC unless the party specifically says we want to take them alive but also use lethal damage. We never had someone play something without a con score, so if that comes up I will talk to the player and come up with a system. For PCs, I imagine assuming a con score of 10 would make sense.

Non-lethal damage is also dealt with by adding "as if" before staggered in my rules. Its not a true "staggered" condition, but one that soft-limits you to a single move action. In all other ways, Non-lethal is the same as it is anyway.

What book is delay death from again? I need to take a look and see if its intended use is to keep you on your feet. If it is, then it will, yes, affect when you go unconscious.

[Pleh]

So what happens if a healer "removes staggered condition" with a spell, magic item, or class feature?

Does it last the rest of the round, fizzle, or just remove the condition?

[Albions_Angel]

Removes staggered. Does what it says on the tin. They are stabilized and no longer bleeding out if they do more than a single move. Of course, even a 1 damage hit staggers them again, and might even knock them out.

[Goaty14]

IIRC, you can take a swift action instead of taking a move action (thus in a round you could do Standard/Swift/Swift instead of Standard/Move/Swift), which looks pretty weird that the character can take a move action normally but not a swift action.


a soulmeld, .

Rageclaws.