The Prison Breakout

[Voltage89]

I need a little help with the start of my next campaign. My players all have made very in depth backstories and all have rather interesting items that they have acquired throughout their past travels. In the town that they are all near, there is a man who is attempting to becoming a Lich. He constantly captures people and turns them into undead or takes them to feed a rather large monster he has been building up. The players will be part of the feed group. They will be taken to an undead prison and will be able to escape rather easily. My problem is there gear. Logically, they would be stripped of everything they are wearing and there gold and interesting items would be taken by the leader. However, I feel like that is a rather ****ty thing for a dungeon master to do. The players spent so much time with the backstories, and then there items are taken. I need ideas for how they could keep there items while still being inprisoned. I had an idea of just placing there stuff in a chest, but that just seems way to generic. Help if you have any ideas! Thanks!

[Armored Walrus]

I think you may need to rethink the starting area if they've put that much effort into their equipment and trinkets already. I agree that putting it all in a chest is cheesy and videogamey. Maybe you start the session with them having been taken, but not yet processed into the prison? So they'll still have most of their possessions and still be armored, but their weapons have been confiscated. If they watch and wait, there's a chance to recover them and escape.

I feel like if you were going to start them with no equipment or gold, they should have known that at character creation.

The only other way I can think of to do this is "The lich is pretty powerful, and didn't consider you enough of a threat to bother disarming you and confiscating your goods, but some emergency called it away suddenly, leaving only his underlings watching you now."

[Dualswinger]

Don't be afraid to take things from your players as long as you intent to give them back. (The "I'm not stealing, just borrowing" defence.)

If a player has a reason to be actually attached to their loot, then taking it away is usually a lovely hook for side questing. Perhaps while they are being taken to the "feed site" they are led through an area where a minion is sorting through items that have been taken from the poor victims, and they spot their own gear among the spoils. If your would be lich requires funding, perhaps the "sale" of these magic items is what's giving him the financial backing to perform his ritual, in which case, the players tracking down their items could be a fun side quest. Or perhaps if they are appropriate, he gives them to his minions, creating fun "sub-bosses" with a great spike in accomplishment when they reclaim their item. You have your REASON to take their items, so just work on a believable way to give them back.

Hope this helps

[Tiadoppler]

Were they captured from an inn? Maybe all their gear was left in their rooms.

Maybe the undead capturing them weren't smart enough to recognize certain specific non-weapon items as being special. If a very literal skeleton is ordered to "Remove their weapons and gold, and imprison them" they don't have any initiative to take other valuable possessions.

Otherwise, interesting trinkets might have attracted the attention of the jailer, who has kept them separate while he examines them. On a desk, in an arcane lab, or something.

[Hobbo Jim]

You could have someone assist them in breaking out, and perhaps they know where they can get their stuff? Perhaps for a price :smallwink: Alternatively, maybe their guards are now wearing/using their stuff so they have to defeat some of the guards to get it back, or maybe half of it is being worn by a couple guards they find and half is still in a storage room or a chest.

It really depends on context. If the wannabe lich is quite powerful, as above maybe he doesn't consider them a threat. If he's not super powerful, but solo, then a storage room isn't that far fetched. Maybe not in the exact same location as the prison, but maybe they find the location of his house where he does stash all of his capturee's stuff - he can't hold all of it on his own person. The things I suggested just above mostly are relevant if the guy is relatively powerful, but more importantly has a following to help him do some of the grunt work.

[Unoriginal]

I need a little help with the start of my next campaign. My players all have made very in depth backstories and all have rather interesting items that they have acquired throughout their past travels. In the town that they are all near, there is a man who is attempting to becoming a Lich. He constantly captures people and turns them into undead or takes them to feed a rather large monster he has been building up. The players will be part of the feed group. They will be taken to an undead prison and will be able to escape rather easily. My problem is there gear. Logically, they would be stripped of everything they are wearing and there gold and interesting items would be taken by the leader. However, I feel like that is a rather ****ty thing for a dungeon master to do. The players spent so much time with the backstories, and then there items are taken. I need ideas for how they could keep there items while still being inprisoned. I had an idea of just placing there stuff in a chest, but that just seems way to generic. Help if you have any ideas! Thanks!

Nothing wrong with putting it all the valuables in a pile of loot and the weapons/armors be given to the prison's goons.

Or you could start by having the prison's Boss (or just the big guy in charge of the prisoners) examine the PCs, take their stuff, and make them tell what it is (or else) to make sure the Undead don't miss anything (it'd be rather stupid if they destroyed some magic items by accident, for example).

How will the PCs be able to escape the prison easily, though?

[smcmike]

Were they captured from an inn? Maybe all their gear was left in their rooms.

Maybe the undead capturing them weren't smart enough to recognize certain specific non-weapon items as being special. If a very literal skeleton is ordered to "Remove their weapons and gold, and imprison them" they don't have any initiative to take other valuable possessions.

Otherwise, interesting trinkets might have attracted the attention of the jailer, who has kept them separate while he examines them. On a desk, in an arcane lab, or something.

This is all good advice, and how I would handle it. I know that PCs have a tendency to carry everything they own everywhere they go, but since this is a cutscene to start a campaign, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with having them captured without their gear. The wannabe lich just wants bodies - taking their stuff too actually causes a problem - what’s he gonna do with a suit of armor from a missing person? Sell it and give himself away?

In terms of items that they really do keep with them all the time, this lich doesn’t have any reason to think they are special or important. Again, he’s just collecting bodies.

[Biggstick]

Don't be afraid to take things from your players as long as you intent to give them back. (The "I'm not stealing, just borrowing" defence.)

If a player has a reason to be actually attached to their loot, then taking it away is usually a lovely hook for side questing. Perhaps while they are being taken to the "feed site" they are led through an area where a minion is sorting through items that have been taken from the poor victims, and they spot their own gear among the spoils. If your would be lich requires funding, perhaps the "sale" of these magic items is what's giving him the financial backing to perform his ritual, in which case, the players tracking down their items could be a fun side quest. Or perhaps if they are appropriate, he gives them to his minions, creating fun "sub-bosses" with a great spike in accomplishment when they reclaim their item. You have your REASON to take their items, so just work on a believable way to give them back.

Hope this helps

I think it's SUPER lame when a DM takes everything gear-wsie from the Players, especially if the Players don't know about it before-hand. Both as a DM and as a Player I think it's lame. However, the bolded bit is the best suggestion put forth imo. it has almost a movie-sort of feel to it. OP can take inspiration from something like Guardians of the Galaxy in which the guards going through the Guardians' stuff while they're being processed into prison, and are doing it visibly in front of the PC's. It makes it clear where the PC's stuff is at, and gives them a very clear first goal after escaping their bonds.

I wouldn't have guards using their items though, unless it was the guard(s) initially seen going through the items. Players might feel a need to try and kill every guard in an attempt to re-gain their stuff, when in reality the Players should just be trying to escape with their stuff. Overall though, allowing Players to see their stuff clearly gives them a very clear goal on where to get their stuff back and how to progress forward.

[Voltage89]

I actually really like the idea of there just being a large pile of basically useless items that have been collected from the victims. And of course, there items would be on top as they were to be the next victims. As for there armor, I will most likely leave them with that.

[MadBear]

As an alternative, seems like a great opportunity for a side quest. While the lich is probably too powerful to care about some random peasants trinkets, I bet some of his non-dead minions would love to collect and sell these to make profit on the side. Just throw in a couple of hooks about how Benjin has taken the loaded wagon out back filled with the last round of peoples stuff and is heading in out to a local thieves guild to sell it all.

If they're quick and paying attention, they can ambush him and get their stuff back (and more). Otherwise, if they just kill everyone, give them the opportunity to track this cart. In that case, maybe they get there too late and he's sold their stuff to the guild. Now they have to decide, do they pay the thieves guild to get their stuff back, do they kill these guys and take their stuff, or do they raid the place at night.

All of this becomes a great way to get them XP and progress as PC's while the overpowering lich progresses with his own schemes.

[Voltage89]

I also wouldn't mind your input on something else. I had an idea for what he will be feeding them too, but I would love to know what you guys think would be a cool idea. I personally don't really want it to be something that they can actually defeat. I would rather it be a foe they will be forced to fight whenever they come back to the prison to free the other people.

[Unoriginal]

I also wouldn't mind your input on something else. I had an idea for what he will be feeding them too, but I would love to know what you guys think would be a cool idea. I personally don't really want it to be something that they can actually defeat. I would rather it be a foe they will be forced to fight whenever they come back to the prison to free the other people.

Is the monster directly related to the guy's attempt to become a Lich?

Because if it's not: a gigantic Gibbering Mouther.

[Voltage89]

Is the monster directly related to the guy's attempt to become a Lich?

Because if it's not: a gigantic Gibbering Mouther.
The monster was not going to be directly related at all. His end goal was to take over the local town. In doing so, he has several of these small prisons around the mountains. He basically is feeding something and it continues to grow and will help him destroy the town in the end.

[Unoriginal]

The monster was not going to be directly related at all. His end goal was to take over the local town. In doing so, he has several of these small prisons around the mountains. He basically is feeding something and it continues to grow and will help him destroy the town in the end.

Then I repeat: gigantic Gibbering Mouthers. Maybe with a mind-control item stabbed into them.

Mouthers are just easy to make bigger and demand 0 magical ressources, compared to, say, a golem army.

[Voltage89]

Then I repeat: gigantic Gibbering Mouthers. Maybe with a mind-control item stabbed into them.

Mouthers are just easy to make bigger and demand 0 magical ressources, compared to, say, a golem army.
I am looking into them right now, and they seem to be the perfect fit. A monster that cares about nothing but devouring its prey! Thanks!

[Unoriginal]

I am looking into them right now, and they seem to be the perfect fit. A monster that cares about nothing but devouring its prey! Thanks!

And that grows with each victims, and are a more horrifying fate than just oozes. Plus they have weird stuff like blinding spit. Don't hesitate to change them a bit/add stuff to make them weirder.

You're welcome!

[AHF]

I think it's SUPER lame when a DM takes everything gear-wsie from the Players, especially if the Players don't know about it before-hand. Both as a DM and as a Player I think it's lame. However, the bolded bit is the best suggestion put forth imo. it has almost a movie-sort of feel to it. OP can take inspiration from something like Guardians of the Galaxy in which the guards going through the Guardians' stuff while they're being processed into prison, and are doing it visibly in front of the PC's. It makes it clear where the PC's stuff is at, and gives them a very clear first goal after escaping their bonds.

I wouldn't have guards using their items though, unless it was the guard(s) initially seen going through the items. Players might feel a need to try and kill every guard in an attempt to re-gain their stuff, when in reality the Players should just be trying to escape with their stuff. Overall though, allowing Players to see their stuff clearly gives them a very clear goal on where to get their stuff back and how to progress forward.

This totally made me think "Peter Quill and his Walkman." You can set it up so getting their stuff back is very satisfying as well.

[Vogie]

Even though YOU know they're going to be eaten, since the front is a prison, a very prison-y thing to do is have all of the characters dump all their stuff in a box when they are initially processed. That gives the PCs a location where all their stuff is, so it's just a part of the escape attempt.

[willdaBEAST]

Even though YOU know they're going to be eaten, since the front is a prison, a very prison-y thing to do is have all of the characters dump all their stuff in a box when they are initially processed. That gives the PCs a location where all their stuff is, so it's just a part of the escape attempt.

I like this idea, it'll simultaneously give the prisoners hope, "oh they'll return our things and probably treat us fairly!" That can help the bottom fall out later when they figure out what is actually happening to prisoners.

Can anyone elaborate why taking away the PCs' belongings is so unpopular with players? I'm not disagreeing, I'm curious what kind of reactions people have seen. Also, I think there's a big difference between running a campaign for a while, capturing the PCs and taking their stuff, versus starting the campaign with them captured and they have to recover their stuff. If anything having an emotional connection to X item through time spent in character creation will help, "we can't leave this prison until I retrieve family heirloom X".

Do other DMs flat out avoid prison scenarios, or do you allow the PCs to retain all their belongings when captured?

[Tiadoppler]

Can anyone elaborate why taking away the PCs' belongings is so unpopular with players? I'm not disagreeing, I'm curious what kind of reactions people have seen. Also, I think there's a big difference between running a campaign for a while, capturing the PCs and taking their stuff, versus starting the campaign with them captured and they have to recover their stuff. If anything having an emotional connection to X item through time spent in character creation will help, "we can't leave this prison until I retrieve family heirloom X".

Do other DMs flat out avoid prison scenarios, or do you allow the PCs to retain all their belongings when captured?


In 4e, there was a huge extent to which Magical Items were a part of a character's power and level progression. The game was balanced around the idea that a level X player would have a +N weapon, a +N armor, a +N amulet, etc. Taking away magical items was essentially the same as XP/Level draining mechanics. You are no longer a real level 12 Fighter, now you're basically a level 8. Stealing items was telling the player to erase huge swathes of his/her character sheet.

If a character does any sort of optimization (especially people who focus on specific feats that only work with certain weapons), removing their access to their preferred equipment type reduces their power a lot more than it would for a more balanced class that focuses on general utility. It punishes "minmaxers" more than "roleplayers", and "minmaxers" are much more likely to take offense at having their power level decreased anyway.

If a significant amount of a character's wealth is tied up in adventuring gear, having it all stolen can upset the player. "The DM giveth and the DM taketh away" should be used sparingly because the goal of the game is to have fun and entertain people. Some players only want good things to happen to them: if significant ups and downs in terms of a character's success and wealth are going to happen in the game, I'd mention that in Session 0. "By the way, sometimes bad things will happen to your characters, and a big part of the plot will be about how you are able to come back from failures and setbacks."

Occasionally, there'll be a family heirloom stolen, or a favorite artifact, or whatever. That's upsetting to the character, but provides a great quest hook for the player. I use this very sparingly so that it is interesting and special, and not just "okay, who gets pickpocketed today?"

[MadBear]

I've personally found that players that trust the DM are ok with their stuff being stolen if:

1. It's possible to get it back
2. It doesn't happen all the time

It's alot like a powerful NPC friend swooping in to help the party out in dire straights. If it happened once during a campaign, it might be memorable. If it happens every time theirs danger, it sucks.

[Biggstick]

I like this idea, it'll simultaneously give the prisoners hope, "oh they'll return our things and probably treat us fairly!" That can help the bottom fall out later when they figure out what is actually happening to prisoners.

Can anyone elaborate why taking away the PCs' belongings is so unpopular with players? I'm not disagreeing, I'm curious what kind of reactions people have seen. Also, I think there's a big difference between running a campaign for a while, capturing the PCs and taking their stuff, versus starting the campaign with them captured and they have to recover their stuff. If anything having an emotional connection to X item through time spent in character creation will help, "we can't leave this prison until I retrieve family heirloom X".

Do other DMs flat out avoid prison scenarios, or do you allow the PCs to retain all their belongings when captured?

Both as a Player and as a DM I think it's lame. Even more so if you have Players who put a ton of work into building their characters and writing out their story.

One of the biggest reasons for this is DM's typically don't tell their Players they're going to start the campaign in a prison-like scenario in which they don't have any of their things. And that shows one of two things by the DM: poor communication skills, or "Gotcha" DM'ing. The reason is that DM's need to open up conversations with the Players to find out the type of game they're interested in, as well as talk about what kind of game they're interested in running. When a DM fails to include that the Players will be starting out in a prison with none of their stuff, that's a double whammy to the Player. Not only does the Player have a story that they've written for said character that potentially has nothing to do with getting caught up and taken to prison, anything item-wise that they might have gained through backstory has been taken from them as well. Basically they could have written a story along the lines of...

"Parents died when I was young. I was raised by wolves, both the physical manifestation of them and people who act like them. Nothing in this world matters to me except gold."

and they'd be in the same spot as someone who wrote a backstory that incorporates all the elements I've asked for them to include in a backstory as well as worked in story elements from the world.

The thing is, all of this is fine, as long as the DM informs the Players that they're going to be starting out in a prison without any of their stuff. I have played in both types of games before, a certain module which has you starting out with nothing in a prison, and a homebrew campaign in which we started out with nothing in a prison. I've never followed up on the module personally, but according to the DM, it specifically states that the DM isn't to inform Players that they'll be starting with nothing and they're in prison. To me that's garbage. On the other hand, the DM that started us out in prison in his homebrew campaign told us from the start that we'd be in said situation. While there was a little grumbling initially, it allowed the Players to really get behind the story beginnings. They included within their backstory a better conclusion that might indicate how/why one ends up in a situation to be taken into prison. This is cooperative story-telling, and is a good thing imo.

The point I'm trying to make is that when you have Player buy-in, your game is going to be more enjoyable.

Starting the Players off in a situation in which they lose everything (and they didn't know it was going to happen) is going to annoy and/or turn potential Players away from the game. You'll have folks who don't have fun because of it for the first few sessions, and that's not a feeling I want my Players to experience. I want them to have a freaking blast, from Session 0 all the way through the campaign conclusion. I can do this, both as a DM and as a Player, as long as there are open lines of communication between everyone in the group. There will be sessions in which they're trudging through sewers, fighting off all manner of creature, dealing with poison and disease, and just generally hating what they're going through, but they chose the route and had an idea of what they might be facing. Choosing something has consequences, and sometimes they're good, and sometimes they're bad. But giving Players the choice is what's important, or at the very least, informing them of what's to come and what to expect.