Building the Internet using 3.5e Mechanics

[BlackOnyx]

Just an interesting little thought experiment: how would one go about creating something akin to an internet infrastructure using existing 3.5e mechanics (spells, magic items, creatures/constructs etc.)?


Essentially, I'm looking for a few basic elements:


- Several central (or numerous interconnected) repositories of information
- Able to be contacted at a distance by numerous "users"
- Able to provide users with information based on keyword based queries
- Able to receive & store new information from said users
- Magically/mechanically automated (as much as possible)


How would you do it? I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

[Uncle Pine]

I believe the standard Tippyverse approach would begin by setting up a network of mind raped formian queens with ranks in Autohypnosis 50 miles apart from each other.

[Lisselys]

First of all, you'd want some very low magic, as this is something which would require a pretty large scale depending on the setting and the costs can get pretty high.
My first assumption would be unseen servants central servers, obliged to comply to messages sent by casters. This can be done, therefore, with very few resources.
The data would be all hard data, which would require a lot of paper, but again, there are spells for that and you don't need to create that much stuff in order for this to work.
Also, the number of unseen servants would be proportional to the number of mages working/accessing the wizardnet.
Think about it this way: In order to get access to the Wizardnet, you'd have to craft/cast/pay a fee to have your own unseen servant permanenc'ed in that context. This way you have a direct link to the server, the database, and the whole system.

How would they respond to my messages, you ask?
Easy: Codes. Nothing stops an unseen servant to read a message using taps or a similar code, and as a mage you generally are pretty well versed in this kind of stuff.
Alternatively, an appropriate level spell (Similar to message, but where your answer is written on paper and with a better mileage) can do wonders. I don't know if a similar spell exists, but something like a level 1-2 spell is I guess ok, if you take into account the limitation of only being able to use it to access the wizardweb (Or Wizardnet? Can't decide)

Lastly, the cost of all this is directly increased by the number of relays you use.
One big server, with strong enough magic to connect to everyone is costly. A single book (Which is connected to the server) wouldn't be as expensive as you'd think, but still there are a lot of problems.

A system where you have different and multiple servers would still require some fee in order to mantain it, but it would be much more efficient (Think about it: IF some bad guy wanted to manipulate the data, they'd have to attack all the servers, which is pretty hard)

[remetagross]

I believe the standard Tippyverse approach would begin by setting up a network of mind raped formian queens with ranks in Autohypnosis 50 miles apart from each other.

Indeed. Such Formians Queens would then relay the thought to the central server where a last Formian Queen crafts traps of Unseen Servant. The fee a wizard pays to access the web is equal to the price of such a trap.

When the wizard wants to access the wizardnet, he thinks about it. His thought is picked up by the closest Formian Queen relay through telepathy, which then conveys the order to the central Formian Queen. That last one then orders the Unseen Servant owned by the wizard to perform the required task.

[Uncle Pine]

Indeed. Such Formians Queens would then relay the thought to the central server where a last Formian Queen crafts traps of Unseen Servant. The fee a wizard pays to access the web is equal to the price of such a trap.

When the wizard wants to access the wizardnet, he thinks about it. His thought is picked up by the closest Formian Queen relay through telepathy, which then conveys the order to the central Formian Queen. That last one then orders the Unseen Servant owned by the wizard to perform the required task.

I'm sorry, but what role do the unseen servants serve in the big picture when speaking (or speaking through a telepatic link) is a free action and therefore your 10 feet long, 4 feet high, 3,500 pounds server hubs have memorized through Autohypnosis virtually every information available in the world in written format, and can therefore already relay it to any user tapping into the network?

As far as image storage goes, Dragon Magazine #327 has memory crystals for the low price of 200 gp each.

[remetagross]

Hey dude, ease down. I didn't know Autohypnosis could do that. A problem, though, is that Mindrape is [evil] and as such another means of dominating the Formian Queens should be preferable, or else Paladins will start to track down the Internet builders.

[The Glyphstone]

Hey dude, ease down. I didn't know Autohypnosis could do that. A problem, though, is that Mindrape is [evil] and as such another means of dominating the Formian Queens should be preferable, or else Paladins will start to track down the Internet builders.

Paladins can be tracking down 17+ level arcane full casters all they like, but there's not a whole lot they can do when they find them.

[Uncle Pine]

Hey dude, ease down. I didn't know Autohypnosis could do that. A problem, though, is that Mindrape is [evil] and as such another means of dominating the Formian Queens should be preferable, or else Paladins will start to track down the Internet builders.
I was calm, sorry if I sounded off in any way.
Back to the task, the mindrape dilemma can be solved by using simulacrum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/simulacrum.htm) of formian queens instead of mindraped ones. This would also prevent any trouble from people flinging break enchantment spells at the server hubs to undo the mindrapes. Simulacrum is also 2 whole levels lower than mindrape, so the whole Internet web would be easier to setup.

[Nifft]

You just need sufficiently large Widen factor to get a 20-ft.-radius spread to cover a roughly 131,477,280-ft.-circumference sphere.

Then everyone will be stuck at home thanks to the Word Wide web.

[remetagross]

You just need sufficiently large Widen factor to get a 20-ft.-radius spread to cover a roughly 131,477,280-ft.-circumference sphere.

Then everyone will be stuck at home thanks to the Word Wide web.

:smallbiggrin:


I was calm, sorry if I sounded off in any way.
Back to the task, the mindrape dilemma can be solved by using simulacrum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/simulacrum.htm) of formian queens instead of mindraped ones. This would also prevent any trouble from people flinging break enchantment spells at the server hubs to undo the mindrapes. Simulacrum is also 2 whole levels lower than mindrape, so the whole Internet web would be easier to setup.

That does seem to solve that issue. In that case, I think the only matter that remains to be settled is how to upload an image to the mind of a connected wizard. How do those memory crystals work exactly? Do they have to be held by the Formian Queens or by the Wizards?

[Psyren]

Do you all want ants Abysm? Because this is how you get ants Abysm.

[Uncle Pine]

That does seem to solve that issue. In that case, I think the only matter that remains to be settled is how to upload an image to the mind of a connected wizard. How do those memory crystals work exactly? Do they have to be held by the Formian Queens or by the Wizards?

As far as I can tell, they're just 200 gp cameras made of magical gemstone which can only take one photo: you put the memory crystal on your eye and after you blink whatever you were looking at is permanently recorded on the crystal. I imagine important photos or pictures could be physically stored somewhere and that formian queens could memorize what's in them so that they can tell to wizards the content of the images, but I have no clue as to how you could deliver them via telepathic bond. Maybe some chain of eyes shenanigans?

[atemu1234]

I was calm, sorry if I sounded off in any way.
Back to the task, the mindrape dilemma can be solved by using simulacrum (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/simulacrum.htm) of formian queens instead of mindraped ones. This would also prevent any trouble from people flinging break enchantment spells at the server hubs to undo the mindrapes. Simulacrum is also 2 whole levels lower than mindrape, so the whole Internet web would be easier to setup.

Mind Rape is instantaneous; it can't be dispelled.
Though Simulacrum is easier, I guess.

[Silva Stormrage]

Mind Rape is instantaneous; it can't be dispelled.
Though Simulacrum is easier, I guess.

Mind rape specifically notes that break enchantment removes personality changes.

[BlackOnyx]

First of all, you'd want some very low magic, as this is something which would require a pretty large scale depending on the setting and the costs can get pretty high.
My first assumption would be unseen servants central servers, obliged to comply to messages sent by casters.


A good call on the accessibility front. As a first level spell (for bards, wizards, and cloistered clerics), it's perfect.


That being said, I wonder if there's a good way to get past the range issue; 25' + 5'/CL isn't very far in the context of a massive library.

I suppose you could just condense the layout, building small walkways only large enough for servants to move through.



Also, the number of unseen servants would be proportional to the number of mages working/accessing the wizardnet.
Think about it this way: In order to get access to the Wizardnet, you'd have to craft/cast/pay a fee to have your own unseen servant permanenc'ed in that context. This way you have a direct link to the server, the database, and the whole system.


I really like this idea. Every caster gets their own terminal that only they themselves have a connection to.


Perhaps participating libraries could rent access to magic items of unseen servant with a continuous duration? That way, even non casters could partake with a successful UMD check.



...but I have no clue as to how you could deliver them via telepathic bond. Maybe some chain of eyes shenanigans?


I actually like this idea in combination with the unseen servant suggestion. Maybe not chain of eyes specifically, but clairvoyance.


In essence, each wizardnet member purchases/rents a small terminal at a participating library. Said terminal is a small table with two continuous magic enchantments: an unseen servant and a clairvoyance sensor positioned above it.


Requests are sent to the unseen servant (are they mentally controlled? if not, speaking stones would probably work), which can bring the requested reading material to the terminal and page through it while the viewer watches.


It'd certainly be a bit clunky (and expensive at the outset, no doubt), but it could make for a good alternative to lower level casters and/or noncasters without access to teleport.

[Tvtyrant]

What about just using the commoner cannon? Effigy Jermlaines inside a pipe network, they use binary based on high fives or low fives.

[Bullet06320]

for a screen or monitor, you could use programmed illusion based magic item to receive the information

there's a 2nd edition item, not sure if there's a 3rd edition item similar, but painter in a box, from complete ninjas handbook, to get screen shots and use as a printer

[Uncle Pine]

Can we use dream (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/dream.htm) traps to provide our Internet users with a primitive and extremely inefficient image search? The spell does say "The messenger then enters a trance, appears in the intended recipient’s dream", so I wonder if by having the messenger (a clerk or unseen servant) hold a memory crystal with the required image at the time the dream trap is activated it would be possible to show the image to the recipient as part of the dream.

[PrediDERP]

Instead of hive mind formian queens, what about something akin to the Mage of the Arcane Order's Spellpool? One (or many) large magical databases where information could be stored, not just spells. Then subscribers could pay a monthly fee to purchase a sending stone (think modern day cell phone or other mobile device) to contact a MotAO or unseen servant which would then give them the information they need.