ASI 18 or 20 or Feats

[Whit]

Using standard pre roll. Your best beginning stats are 17/15 How important is it to have 20 over 18. Abs is 20 better than a feat

[Blood of Gaea]

Using standard pre roll. Your best beginning stats are 17/15 How important is it to have 20 over 18. Abs is 20 better than a feat
It depends on the build, a Fighter using a glaive or great sword will get more out of Great Weapon Master or Polearm Master than they would 18-20 Str, for example. Meanwhile, most full spellcasters will almost always want to get their casting stat to 20 first thing.

[strangebloke]

Depends on the class and the level.

You never *need* a 20. The math never dictates that you must get one. The exception here is monks, who really do want 20 DEX, if only for purposes of AC.

Sometimes, to get a specific niche build to work, you do *need* a feat. (EG: Warcaster.) Other times a feat is just a huge shot in the arm to a character concept, (Sharpshooter/Elven Accuracy to archers) and at other times it just adds a lot of flexibility to a build that needs it (Magic initiate and Prodigy for fighters)

[Citan]

Hi!
I guess I won't be in the majority but I'm usually fine with having only one stat at 20, and sometimes even not even the primary at 20, if I had something in mind that required several feats.

For example, if I was to create a support character based on a Bard, I'd probably still go to 20 CHA because it influences resources (Bardic Inspiration) in addition to spell DC...
But based on a Divine Soul Sorcerer? CHA just affects your spell DC so honestly I'd prefer capping at 18 but instead pick both Inspiring Leader and whatever else I'd feel useful for my party (possibly Healer and Ritual Caster).

In the same mindset, while I'd often max a Monk's WIS and DEX, I would be perfectly fine with capping either or both stats at 18 (or 20/16) in order to get some nice build working that requires 2 feats. ;)

>>> For me, maxing 20 is either because that stat influences too many things to be passed or because I just don't have any idea for a feat to replace it with.

Overall my experience is that most of the time (I mean, the times when successing or not REALLY counts) either I miss with a large margin or I succeed with a large margin, so that 1-2 point wouldnt have made any difference. ^^

[MxKit]

IMO, 20 is usually not better than a feat.

If my highest stats after racial modifiers were 17/15, I'd do one of two things at lv4:


Raise them to 18/16, because raising two stats that are important to you to the next level always tends to be a good choice.
Take a half-feat that raises one of them by +1, and at 8th either take another half-feat that raises the other, or go +1/+1 with another uneven stat/another stat I want to take a half-feat for. (Example: On my Wood Elf Rogue I might want Elven Accuracy and Observant. If I have Dex 17, Con 15, and Wis 14, I'd probably take Elven Accuracy at lv4 for Dex +1, then at lv8 take Con +1 Wis +1, then at lv10 take Observant for Wis +1. However, if I had Dex 17, Wis 15, Con 14, I'd take Elven Accuracy at lv4 for Dex +1, then at lv8 take Observant for Wis +1, then maybe take +2 Con, if I really want to raise it, at lv10.)

If my highest stats before racial modifiers were 17/15, that changes things a little, since my stats would shake out pretty differently and I might even wind up with 17/16/16 as my three highest stats depending on build. (For example, for a Monk, I might decide I want to put my 17 into Dex and my 15 into Wis, but also a 14 into Con; that'd be a great excuse to play a Hill Dwarf Monk! Then I could either take a +1 Dex half-feat, or raise Dex and some other stat by +1, at a later level. Athlete is not bad to have as a non-Drunken Master, especially if you have decent Strength, and with those stats it could be reasonable to bump up your Strength a bit later.)

[Zene]

Personally, I love feats. Stat increases are boring. Even if I didn't love the flavor, for most of my builds they are *so good* that it's hard to convince myself that I should do +2 to a stat instead.

The exception, for me, are Bards and Paladins, which get so much from their Cha; and fighters, that get so much from their primary attack stat.

I do know a lot of people, though, that swear by ASIs. Not only in their primary and secondary stat, but also sometimes in Con before even considering feats. It seems crazy to me. But I'd love to do some kind of mathematical analysis to see if it's really a better choice. 5% increase to hit, or land a save, or make a skill check, or +1 AC, just doesn't seem that big to me. But maybe it is, and I'm just ignorant of the math.

[Potato_Priest]

I’ll pretty much always take feats almost exclusively one I get my primary stat and constitution to 16, and if anything I usually feel stronger than the rest of the party. (Though I am usually better at both strategy and optimization than most table mates). I think you ought to be fine.

[Daithi]

I also like going with variant human just so I can start with a feat if I'm playing some classes.

For example, if I'm planning on being an Assassin then I want the Alert feat as soon as possible. If an assassin doesn't win initiative then he losses the auto-crit assassinate ability, so getting that +5 to initiative is vital. Plus, when you get to strike first, your opponent may never get to strike at all. On the other hand, getting DEX up to 20 is really important too --- AC and damage bonuses come into play round after round after round. So, I prefer just starting with the feat as a variant human.

[Whit]

Now apply what you said to Crawford’s most people don’t use feats from the post above.

My belief is the perception for the character to be the best at an ability or 2 name a stat and that player says I have 20x so I’m super strong smart agile etc.

The feats add an extra special to the character so my view is while not everyone uses a feat , I would disagree with Crawford and say that most people do use at least 1 feat of course depending on their level.

And at what level is best for a feat. Your first asi or second,

[MxKit]

Now apply what you said to Crawford’s most people don’t use feats from the post above.

My belief is the perception for the character to be the best at an ability or 2 name a stat and that player says I have 20x so I’m super strong smart agile etc.

The feats add an extra special to the character so my view is while not everyone uses a feat , I would disagree with Crawford and say that most people do use at least 1 feat of course depending on their level.

Doing an informal poll on a board full of experienced players who are geared towards optimizing, mathematically figuring out bonuses, and (I say this with all love; I do it too) overthinking things, then deciding the eight initial responses you get mean something wrt how things break down among the millions of 5e players, though... That seems like folly.

Also, despite what I said above, a good number of my characters don't have feats, because I also do like raising stats. Even if it's suboptimal, sometimes I like to raise non-primary stats, or bring my 8's up to 10's to get rid of my negative modifiers. I imagine this is even more true of newer players and those who don't know or care about optimizing, which probably makes up most of the playerbase at this point. That's not even to mention tables that don't use feats at all.


And at what level is best for a feat. Your first asi or second,

That's really going to depend on your build. As someone else said, getting Alert ASAP is major for an Assassin, and Fighters benefit from getting a weapon-related feat early. Monks really don't need feats at all, though, especially not Drunken Masters, and spellcasters who are going to stay at range and especially who get proficiency in Con saves can delay grabbing feats for a long while, or even forgo them entirely. Likewise, if you're wanting to be a tank, turning into a wall to keep people from hurting your allies, you're going to want Sentinel to make that come online early, but if you're just trying to be a pew-pew eldritch blasting Tomelock, you don't particularly need feats and could benefit from Charisma, Dexterity, and Constitution being high, and even Wisdom isn't bad for you to have.