Attacking low flying enemies with melee

[Merudo]

Suppose an enemy is flying at low height (~10 feet high).

Can I hit them with my melee weapon? How far up can I attack?

What if I'm Small/Large/Huge? Does my size have any bearing on my upward attacks?

[MaxWilson]

Suppose an enemy is flying at low height (~10 feet high).

Can I hit them with my melee weapon? How far up can I attack?

What if I'm Small/Large/Huge? Does my size have any bearing on my upward attacks?

For a human being, maximum reach is typically about 1.5x height. Add the length of your weapon to that.

In short, yes, you can probably hit something 10' up with a sword, but not with your fists unless you jump, which you certainly can.

[Tiadoppler]

It's a DM ruling afaik, not a written rule.

Generally, I'd say that most Medium creatures with swords/clubs/axes can only hit flying enemies that are "one square" or 5' off the ground, roughly at head level. If someone is trying to "jump up and attack", they might ready an action to attack when they're within range of the target and use their move action to jump up. How high can you jump?

Large creatures are generally "2 squares" tall, so they can hit things at head level for them (10' off the ground).

If someone has a reach weapon, they can reach farther.



In short, yes, you can probably hit something 10' up with a sword, but not with your fists unless you jump, which you certainly can.

I disagree. Oh, I agree that you could hit a 10' high object, but a flying creature that's occupying the space between 10' and 15' doesn't necessarily take up the entire space, and is mobile within that area. That being said, I do tend to run things a bit more granularly, using squares instead of feet for distances. If you're doing theater of the mind, knowing if an enemy is flying at 9' or 13' might make a big difference.



Edit: Fixed typo.

[JackPhoenix]

A small or medium creature occupies 5' cube. Melee weapons without Reach quality have 5' reach, that includes vertically. Medium creature can attack flying creature moving anywhere between 0-10' off the ground.

[MaxWilson]

I disagree. Oh, I agree that you could hit a 10' high object, but a flying creature that's occupying the space between 10' and 15' doesn't necessarily take up the entire space, and is mobile within that area.

This sounds like merely a disagreement between us over what the OP meant when they said the hypothetical enemy was flying ~10' up. As such, the OP is in the best position to make the final ruling on their own situation, since they have the most data.

[mephnick]

It's all just 5ft squares man. They're either in your reach or not. No different than on the ground.

[Tiadoppler]

This sounds like merely a disagreement between us over what the OP meant when they said the hypothetical enemy was flying ~10' up. As such, the OP is in the best position to make the final ruling on their own situation, since they have the most data.

Agreed. It's a pain to describe altitude in D&D.

Generally I'll have flying enemies stay at least 20'-30' off the ground if they're meant to be stay airborne and attack from range, or I'll just have them land if they're attacking in melee. It saves me a lot of effort. If they're swooping down to attack with 5' melee and flying back up, they're entering 5' melee range of a ground based combatant. If they're swooping down with a 10' reach weapon, they're in 10' reach range of a ground based combatant. Frankly, tracking readied attacks is obnoxious, and I'll only do that sort of thing for the first turn or two.

[Errata]

Generally, I'd say that most Medium creatures with swords/clubs/axes can only hit flying enemies that are "one square" or 5' off the ground, roughly at head level. If someone is trying to "jump up and attack", they might ready an action to attack when they're within range of the target and use their move action to jump up. How high can you jump?

They don't need to ready an action. Jumping is a form of movement, and there are rules for it. You can attack in the middle of your move in 5e. Readying an action is for delaying until someone elses turn, not something on your own turn.

By RAW, you may need a running jump to get a good vertical distance. If you have a strength based melee build with a running start, it should be easy to jump up 5 feet without a check. Otherwise you might need some other boost to your jumping or pass an athletics check. Assuming you have a way to jump up 5 feet, then attacking shouldn't be a problem.

If they're not 10 feet above you on your turn, but you expect them to fly overhead, that's a situation where ready an action might apply. Unfortunately by RAW you can only move OR take an action as a readied action, and you need your move to jump in range. And you can't even get an OA, because the readied action used up your reaction.

[Merudo]

How high can you jump?


3 + your Strength modifier for running jump (half for standing jump).

For a medium creature with 20 strength and 5 feet reach, the maximum high they can attack is 5 (height) +5 (reach) +8 (jump) = 18 feet.

Being large or having a reach weapon would increase that to 23 feet, both would be 28 feet.

However, the GM might allow the character to make a Strength (Athletics) check to jump higher.

[Tiadoppler]

They don't need to ready an action. Jumping is a form of movement, and there are rules for it. You can attack in the middle of your move in 5e. Readying an action is for delaying until someone elses turn, not something on your own turn.

Hmm, if you jump up a certain distance, don't you fall before you can take an action? I know you can take a reaction (that's why I specified readying an action) during a fall (see Feather Fall), but if you run over a pit trap or the edge of a cliff, surely you can't use a full action before you drop down.



3 + your Strength modifier for running jump (half for standing jump).

Meant as a rhetorical question, but thank you!



How about a Medium PC wielding a lance from atop a Large mount. The Large mount takes a running jump up to go up 10'. How high can the tip of the lance held by the PC sitting on the Large mount reach?

[Merudo]

Readying an action takes up your reaction

[Tiadoppler]

Readying an action takes up your reaction

Can you take a normal Action while in mid-air during a jump?

[Errata]

Hmm, if you jump up a certain distance, don't you fall before you can take an action?

Movement is movement. Jumping counts toward your normal movement rate. You can take an action in the middle of your movement, and continue with the rest of your movement. This is the general rule, and there is no specific rule about jump atomicity that would override it. You can attack an airborn target mid-jump, if you can jump high enough, and it doesn't require a readied action/reaction to do so. There are a number of jumping related modifiers in the game, and this exact use case is one of the key reasons why people would value them.

The only thing special about a jump as a form of movement is that continuing the remainder of your movement after you take an action is not optional (unless you have the ability to hover/fly).


How about a Medium PC wielding a lance from atop a Large mount. The Large mount takes a running jump up to go up 10'. How high can the tip of the lance held by the PC sitting on the Large mount reach?

You have to fudge the PC's position a little based on the general shape of the creature. But if it's a typical horse type, longer than it is tall, I'd estimate that the PC starts approximately 5' off the ground. A taller mount than that wouldn't always be a good thing since it might be harder to hit things on the ground with a non-reach weapon. So the jump puts it 15' off the ground. It could normally attack something flying 20' above the ground in that situation, but with the lance's reach it could hit something flying 25' above the ground.

You could potentially jump off the mount at that point for an extra 5', to hit something 30' off the ground, though I'd rule it requires a pretty good animal handling AND athletics check to do so.

With really long jump distances you need to keep in mind that since it's movement, your movement rate could become the limiting factor rather than your theoretical maximum jump distance. You can't jump further than you can move. It's a grey area how that applies to falling back down to the ground after a really high jump if you use all your movement to go up.

[Tiadoppler]

Movement is movement. Jumping counts toward your normal movement rate. You can take an action in the middle of your movement, and continue with the rest of your movement.


Huh, okay. That makes sense. I suppose you could take a running jump off the edge of a 1000' cliff, use an Action to melee attack a dragon in mid-air, then use your Bonus Action to Misty Step back to solid ground, if your actions happen during your jump, and before you fall.

[PhoenixPhyre]

I once bent the rules a bit to let someone attack a flying thing.

They were defending this shield bubble (magical forcefield) that had already been shown to bounce things back that hit it. They were fighting a young dragon, and it was hovering about 20 feet off the ground, out of reach of the dwarven fighter. So he said "Can I springboard off the bubble and smack the dragon?"

I decided that he needed to make a Hard Athletics check to get up. He rolled a natural 20 (plus a bunch). So he parkoured off the bubble, and went to attack the dragon (level 5, so 2 attacks). One hit, one crit. Killed the dragon (it was mostly dead). He then managed to pull off a very good Acrobatics check to land safely on its corpse. It was quite epic.

[Errata]

Huh, okay. That makes sense. I suppose you could take a running jump off the edge of a 1000' cliff, use an Action to melee attack a dragon in mid-air, then use your Bonus Action to Misty Step back to solid ground, if your actions happen during your jump, and before you fall.

That seems fine. Misty Step is useful.