Thought experiment: How would you get a huge adamantine door out of a dungeon?

[DonEsteban]

I'm building a dungeon. There's an adamantine door, which is easily the most valuable item in the dungeon. It doesn't fit through the tunnels and it's fairly deep underground. Let's say its 20' x 20' x .5' and weighs about 100'000 lbs. if that sounds right to you. (It's probably not massive adamantine, that would be ridiculous.) You have only access to 3rd level spells.

What is the quickest way to get it out? What if you had 5th level spells? Creative solutions are invited, but they should be within the rules.

Edit: Corrected weight.

Edit 2: Assuming 10' x 10' tunnels (with a few obstacles), abilities of 5th level characters are admissible and the door is a magic item although solutions ignoring this last fact are still invited.

[Grod_The_Giant]

If it's a hundred pounds, the issue isn't weight-- it's size.

Potentially stupid answer from glancing through the spell list: Meld Into Stone requires a rock "large enough to fully contain your body," and will merge "yourself and all the equipment you carry." Arguably, this works even if the equipment is too big to fit in the stone. So, have someone pick up one edge of the door (a hundred pounds isn't that much) and step into a boulder about the size of a person. Put said bolder on a Tenser's Floating Disk or some other means of carrying a heavy object and drag it out of the dungeon and its enclosed spaces. Boom.

[Unoriginal]

I'm building a dungeon. There's an adamantine door, which is easily the most valuable item in the dungeon. It doesn't fit through the tunnels and it's fairly deep underground. Let's say its 20' x 20' x .5' and weighs about 100.000 lbs. if that sounds right to you. (It's probably not massive adamantine, that would be ridiculous.) You have only access to 3rd level spells.

What is the quickest way to get it out? What if you had 5th level spells? Creative solutions are invited, but they should be within the rules.

If it doesn't fit the tunnels, it means it was built in separate pieces and then assembled there. Find how they put it together and target those areas 'til it re-separates.

Also, why is the door more valuable than the thing it protects?

Note that an adamentium door isn't *that* though, if you just spend a few hours on it.

[Ninja_Prawn]

I think the OP means 100 thousand pounds. The . symbol is used as a thousand separator in pretty much every language except English.

Honestly, I'm struggling here. There aren't any teleport spells that work on objects, true polymorph won't work because adamantine is magical, you can't reconstitute it after it's been disintegrated... Maybe stone shape on the walls around it to disconnect it from the doorframe (assuming it's stone) and then a series of arcane gates to get it from A to B - then you only need enough force to shift it 5 feet. Thunderwave doesn't have a weight limit...

[rbstr]

In american-style numbers he's saying "100,000lbs" I bet. (edit: beat me to it!)

If a big ass door was only 100lbs it wouldn't have to be very light metal or hollow or something. A solid iron manhole cover is ~100lbs.

[Grod_The_Giant]

I think the OP means 100 thousand pounds. The . symbol is used as a thousand separator in pretty much every language except English.

Honestly, I'm struggling here. There aren't any teleport spells that work on objects, true polymorph won't work because adamantine is magical, you can't reconstitute it after it's been disintegrated...
Oh. In that case, never mind. A hundred pounds doesn't seem like enough, but a hundred thousand seems like too much... in either case, yeah, I think Unoriginal is right-- you're going to need to break it. Though that's somewhat up to the DM as to how that works, since the DMG rules on large objects in particular are pretty vague.

[Lombra]

If the door is not larger than twice the tunnel's dimensions then the second level reduce spell would solve this.

Edit: it would become a 10'×10'×0.25' , weighing 12'500lbs.

Edit2: to actually bring it out, it can become complicated looking only at in-game mechanics: lifting limit is 30×Strength Score, block and tackle allow you to lift 4 times more than the normal amount you coud, so it becomes 120×Strength Score, still not enaugh for a single man to carry, as you would need 105 strength. If there were a goliath, then he would need only 53 to lift it, so three goliath characters with at least 18 strength each could manage it... if I did my math right.

Edit3: or enlarge 3 party members, a single sorcerer with three moderately strong buddies could do this... block and tackle could actually be put in series to gain cumulative benefits IRL, but let's not do that.

[nickl_2000]

A casting of reduce/enlarge would help out get through the caves and would reduce the weight to 12,500 pounds. Cast enlarge on the strongest PC to make their push/pull weight much higher.

Then you can cast shape water repeatedly to create ice underneath it to make it slide under the ice. The reduction of friction may be enough to pull it through using donkeys with ropes that aren't on the ice and PCs.

[JellyPooga]

Reduce the door.
Enlarge the carrier.
Gaseous Form the carrier.

Once the Enlarge/Reduce expires, it doesn't matter; the door is already gaseous and that puppy has an hour duration. Float your way out the dungeon to where a cart awaits.

[Unoriginal]

I don't think even Tiamat could move a door so heavy, though.

[DonEsteban]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, allright. 100 thousand pounds. Iron is about 8g/cm^3 so that seemed all right.

I'm not sure I would consider a character dragging the door or using block and tackle as "carrying" though. There won't be goliaths but I'm beginning to see how Polymorph might work. You're getting close, though. I might have to make it larger. There is actually a good reason it is there, because it's protecting something dangerous.

[nickl_2000]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, allright. 100 thousand pounds. Iron is about 8g/cm^3 so that seemed all right.

I'm not sure I would consider a character dragging the door or using block and tackle as "carrying" though. There won't be goliaths but I'm beginning to see how Polymorph might work. You're getting close, though. I might have to make it larger. There is actually a good reason it is there, because it's protecting something dangerous.

Getting around it is really quite easy. Cast mold earth on 5 feet of earth under our to excavate the rock underneath it and move the earth elsewhere. Then go under it

[Laserlight]

I don't think even Tiamat could move a door so heavy, though.

Assuming the tunnels are fairly flat (or can be made so) all the way up to the entrance, you get a batch or rollers / cylinders. Let the door slide along on the rollers. When the door goes off the last one, pick the last one up, run to the front and drop it back in the rotation.

Going up stairs or inclines, across low weight limit bridges, etc, takes us back to the drawing board.

In that case my answer is "Hire a gnome or dwarf engineer"

[Lombra]

I don't think even Tiamat could move a door so heavy, though.

She could if she could grow one size larger (the tiamat from Tyranny of Dragons).

30×30 is base carrying capacity, times 8 for gargantuan size is 7'200lbs of lifting.

Edit: if the door were reduced.

[Lombra]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, allright. 100 thousand pounds. Iron is about 8g/cm^3 so that seemed all right.

I'm not sure I would consider a character dragging the door or using block and tackle as "carrying" though. There won't be goliaths but I'm beginning to see how Polymorph might work. You're getting close, though. I might have to make it larger. There is actually a good reason it is there, because it's protecting something dangerous.

Is your objective to make it impossible or you want to leave the players a chance at taking it? If the case is the former you can simply say "it doesn't move. Period.", of the case is the latter, I think you should think about clever ways to get it out, not simple ways to keep it in.

[MrWesson22]

With 5th level spells, polymorph someone into a giant ape (23 str, size category huge, so 4x carrying capacity of medium creature). This puts their push, pull, drag at 2760lbs. Enlarge have 2 more casters cast enlarge and enhance ability strength on him. Each one of these doubles carrying capacity, so now he can push, pull, or drag 11,040lbs.

Adamantine weighs the same as iron in D&D, so 480lbs/cu ft. This means the door weighs 96,000lbs. Reducing it drops the weight to 12,000. Tensers floating disc can carry 500lbs. Use 2 of them in conjunction with the door and there you go.

[ImproperJustice]

Inwas going to suggest a combination of mold earth, reduce, levitate, and Tenser’s disk, but it looks like we have been beaten to it.

[Naanomi]

Use Fabricate to turn it into stacks of 5ft ingot piles?

[DonEsteban]

Getting around it is really quite easy. Cast mold earth on 5 feet of earth under our to excavate the rock underneath it and move the earth elsewhere. Then go under it
I'm aware of that. It is not so much about keeping someone out, but of keeping something (inaminate) in.


Assuming the tunnels are fairly flat (or can be made so) all the way up to the entrance, you get a batch or rollers / cylinders. Let the door slide along on the rollers. When the door goes off the last one, pick the last one up, run to the front and drop it back in the rotation.

Going up stairs or inclines, across low weight limit bridges, etc, takes us back to the drawing board.

In that case my answer is "Hire a gnome or dwarf engineer"
It's too large to fit through the tunnels. That's the main mode of protection. So it would at least require a fair amount of digging or stoneshaping and that would take a lot of TIME. I'm fine with that, I especially asked for a quick solution.



Is your objective to make it impossible or you want to leave the players a chance at taking it? If the case is the former you can simply say "it doesn't move. Period.", of the case is the latter, I think you should think about clever ways to get it out, not simple ways to keep it in.
Good question. I want to rule out all the obvious ways that an intelligent person would have thought of. I want to make it hard.



Adamantine weighs the same as iron in D&D, so 480lbs/cu ft. This means the door weighs 96,000lbs. Reducing it drops the weight to 12,000. Tensers floating disc can carry 500lbs. Use 2 of them in conjunction with the door and there you go.
Wait, arent' you still off by a factor of 12 here??


Use Fabricate to turn it into stacks of 5ft ingot piles?
That's a good one. I honestly don't know if it works, though. What is considered a raw material and what about the "high degree of craftsmanship" clause here? I remember having read a heated debate about this subject somewhere before ... Also, adamantine items are listed under "magic items" I'm not sure if they should truly considered magical in this edition, though. :smallconfused:

[Ninja_Of_Orthan]

I'm building a dungeon. There's an adamantine door, which is easily the most valuable item in the dungeon. It doesn't fit through the tunnels and it's fairly deep underground. Let's say its 20' x 20' x .5' and weighs about 100'000 lbs. if that sounds right to you. (It's probably not massive adamantine, that would be ridiculous.) You have only access to 3rd level spells.

What is the quickest way to get it out? What if you had 5th level spells? Creative solutions are invited, but they should be within the rules.

Edit: Corrected weight.

are you playing modern/in the future?

[DonEsteban]

Standard D&D 5 setting, why?

[Ninja_Of_Orthan]

Standard D&D 5 setting, why?

if you were playing futuristic you could use laser cutters to allow the door to be removed and then possibly using a shrink ray to get it out of the dungeon (possibly using robots) (all these ideas come from the futuristic setting in dm guide)

[Ninja_Of_Orthan]

scratch that idea, just use the spell ENLARGE REDUCE

[Ovarwa]

Hi,

Getting it out slowly can be done through purely mundane means. 100,000lbs is only 50 tons, and far heavier and more fragile objects were moved around in antiquity. They did not have dwarves, and sometimes not even iron. Dealing with size might be more of an issue than weight.

But they also did not have polymorph or summon earth elemental, which might be useful. (If you have a few elementals carry the thing, can they phase through ceilings bearing the thing after it has been reduced?)

If the thing is adamantine and reduced, a Repelling Blast will push it. No weight limit there I can recall. :) Stairs become a problem though.

Of course, as mentioned, the door can be cut into pieces. Fabricate isn't the only way; some damage-dealing cantrips might do the job fine. If it needs to be restored, Mending works for that.

Just some thoughts.

Anyway,

Ken

[Dudewithknives]

Melt it, form into bars, carry out.

[History_buff]

18 8th level Goliath barbarians with 20 str and both bear totems and enlarge cast on all of them and reduce casted on the door could drag it out with brute force.

[Callin]

Funny possible way that would take FOREVER.

Forge Cleric to do Artisans Blessing turning a small amount into something 100gp or less. Do so over and over again each time taking 2 hours. Once for the Ritual and Once to get it back with a Short Rest. Do so for the next year and you might have it all out by then.

[jnayls]

Heat Metal to get the door nice and hot,
Wall of Water to quickly quench and create stress fractures throughout the door,
and then Shatter combined with a Conjure Barrage of light hammers.
Make the DC a 20 Smith’s Tools Arcana check after all of that to reduce the door to a pile of rubble that can be moved out piece by piece.

My 2¢

[sambojin]

A lvl6 Firbolg (or Goliath) Moon druid, wildshaped into a Giant Constrictor Snake, with Enlarge cast on them can carry 4560lbs in its mouth without being encumbered. 9120lbs Max lift, if racial double lift carries over to wildshape.

So two of them on a Reduced door could do it, assuming a gigantic (one step higher than huge) creature could fit down the passages.

15lbsx19(Str)x2(racial)2x(large)x2(huge)x2(Enlarge )=4560lbs basic carry, if I've got the math right. Not bad for a lvl6 character that dumped the strength stat :)

[Tubben]

You only said spell level, but not char level.

One Wizard with Enlarge/Reduce to get the weight to 12.000 pound and the size to half.
2 Mood druids who cast enhance ability (bull strength) on themself and then transform into an Mammoth (CR6, STR 24).

STR 24 = Lifting of 720 x 4 (Huge) x 2 (Enhance Ability) = 5760 per Druid.
= 11520
The Wizard has a Strength of 17. Would need only 16, but i guess he's not naked.

[ThePolarBear]

Adamantine in this edition is not magical per se, the magic items are just magic items that are made form adamantine.

Which, btw, gives us a nice fun way to deal with the door.

Assuming the guidelines from DMG, a Huge item becomes a Large one, so that Huge door would become a Large discrete object. Absolutely resilient, most likely MORE than what is given as a guideline, let's say double the hps. Let's give it a very nice and probably undeserved 20DT. Assume it's not immune or resistant to Thunder Damage....

Just Shatter it after Reducing it, guarantee success by using a Tempest Cleric. Bring the newly manageable sized pieces out. If not small enough, Shatter again.

[History_buff]

A lvl6 Firbolg (or Goliath) Moon druid, wildshaped into a Giant Constrictor Snake, with Enlarge cast on them can carry 4560lbs in its mouth without being encumbered. 9120lbs Max lift, if racial double lift carries over to wildshape.

So two of them on a Reduced door could do it, assuming a gigantic (one step higher than huge) creature could fit down the passages.

15lbsx19(Str)x2(racial)2x(large)x2(huge)x2(Enlarge )=4560lbs basic carry, if I've got the math right. Not bad for a lvl6 character that dumped the strength stat :)

Racial traits (physical traits anyway) do not carry over to wildshape.

[sambojin]

Actually, they can, if it's feasible that the shape could have that trait. And there are animals with stronger builds than others, so I'm going to assume it can.

For an end game option, if a druid could wear a belt of storm giant strength as a Giant Constrictor Snake (no reason to not be able to wrap it around him), he could do it himself. Since the reduce spell would probably rip the door off its hinges, he could take possession of the door, hold it, and *merge it into him* as well when wildshaping, making the carrying part all the easier. OK, it takes a legendary item, but still, stealth removalist is good removalist.

What happens when the reduce spell runs out? Hilarity, that's what.

[Sigreid]

Get lots of rope/picks etc. Wizard casts Animate Dead on a lot of skeletons or zombies and makes them widen the tunnels and pull it out. Not doing the math on the weight, but I"m talking wizard and cleric burning all of their slots that can do it to create a veritable army of slaves to pull it.

Might even be better to have a cartographer identify the exact point above the door and dig down. You could then set up a couple of those giant hamster wheel cranes that they used in ancient times to lift it out.

[Coidzor]

I'm building a dungeon. There's an adamantine door, which is easily the most valuable item in the dungeon. It doesn't fit through the tunnels and it's fairly deep underground. Let's say its 20' x 20' x .5' and weighs about 100'000 lbs. if that sounds right to you. (It's probably not massive adamantine, that would be ridiculous.) You have only access to 3rd level spells.

What is the quickest way to get it out? What if you had 5th level spells? Creative solutions are invited, but they should be within the rules.

Edit: Corrected weight.

If it was solid Iron, then 98,200 pounds would be the weight for 200 cubic feet of it. Thinking Adamantine is about ~1.8% denser than Iron is probably OK, though it sounds like it's supposed to weigh the same as Iron after all.

The sword Shatterspike from the Sunless Citadel is probably the best item in 5E for breaking apart an Adamantine door.

A 20 STR character with a Block and Tackle can lift 2400 pounds, so 42 such individuals could lift it, provided they could get all of their block and tackle set up, or 84 plain old STR 10 people. 334 STR 10 Commoners could drag it.

The sheer amount of weight would have to be distributed across 76 Elephants to carry it. It would take about 47 wagons with teams of 4 Draft Horses each to transport all of that weight, or 24 if you double their listed capacity for pulling.

It's 50 tons, so it could be carried on any large sailing vessel, so long as it could actually physically be transported onto it.


That's a good one. I honestly don't know if it works, though. What is considered a raw material and what about the "high degree of craftsmanship" clause here?

Smith's Tools proficiency isn't that hard to have on a Wizard, though it would delay implementing the plan for a while if the didn't already have proficiency.

Forge Domain Clerics will automatically have that proficiency and they get Fabricate as one of their Domain spells.


Also, adamantine items are listed under "magic items" I'm not sure if they should truly considered magical in this edition, though. :smallconfused:

What items other than the armor are listed under magic items?


I think the OP means 100 thousand pounds. The . symbol is used as a thousand separator in pretty much every language except English.

Honestly, I'm struggling here. There aren't any teleport spells that work on objects, true polymorph won't work because adamantine is magical, you can't reconstitute it after it's been disintegrated... Maybe stone shape on the walls around it to disconnect it from the doorframe (assuming it's stone) and then a series of arcane gates to get it from A to B - then you only need enough force to shift it 5 feet. Thunderwave doesn't have a weight limit...

Is Adamantine itself inherently magical? I don't recall anything about Adamantine weapons being magical or counting as magical, just that Adamantine Armor is listed as a magic item.

Nonmagical Adamantine weapons are called out for bypassing the damage immunities or resistances of Gargoyles and some varieties of Golem, IIRC.

[JungleChicken]

Well, it's fastened to a wall, I presume to be softer so just hire some stone smiths and then some orphans to drag that thing out...a LOT of orphans.

You may have to make some orphans

[Blood of Gaea]

Use shatter spells to break it into pieces, then use animate object to make one Huge(15ft by 15ft) piece at a time fly out on its own.

[sambojin]

Mystic's Nomad Teleportation discipline probably has a bit you could use in it as well. Just gate it out once you can move it.

[Moxxmix]

Is this restricted to only having a single person trying to do this, or any number of people? Or at least a party? Can they hire people?

How far do they have to move it? You said a 20'x20' door wouldn't fit through the corridors, but I assume the 10'x10' form (reduced) would?

100,000 pounds would be the density of iron, which is vaguely assumed to match adamantine.

Enlarge/Reduce could reduce its size/weight to 10'x10'x3". It also reduces the weight to 12,500 pounds.


A 6th level Goliath totem barbarian who took the 6th level Bear improvement, and got Bull's Strength from Enhance Ability would then move 2160 lbs normally, or 4320 lbs at 5' per round with 18 Str. Upgrade it to 4320/8640 if adding Enlarge. (Requires another sorcerer per barbarian.) 6 normal, or 3 enlarged barbarians could then move it at normal speed.

Alternatively, Conjure Animals to get a team of 8 CR ¼ draft horses, each with 18 Str. Each conjured team can move 4320 lbs, so 3 teams of draft horses could move it at normal speed. I'm going to guess enlarging the draft horses (which would require 8 sorcerers per team) is not feasible while remaining inside the corridor size.


Enlarge/Reduce doesn't last as long as Enhance Ability or Conjure Animals, however. Put a 6th level sorcerer with Extended metamagic on it, and you can get 14 minutes per day. Given that both the draft horses and the barbarians would have 40' of movement, that allows for 1 mile of movement per day. That can be doubled by adding haste by adding Haste. You'd need another sorcerer per barbarian for that.

So, options of:

3 barbarians, 3 casters (Enhance Ability), 3 sorcerers (enlarge barbarians), 3 sorcerers (haste barbarians), 1 sorcerer (reduce door) = 2 miles of movement per day

(Double the numbers if you can't get goliath barbarians.)

or

3 druids (Conjure Animal - 8x draft horse), 1 sorcerer (reduce door) = 1 mile of movement per day (24 horses)

or

2 druids (Conjure Animal - 8x draft horse), 12 casters (Enhance Ability), 1 sorcerer (reduce door) = 1 mile of movement per day (12 horses)

or

3 druids (Conjure Animal - 4x brown bear), 12 casters (Enhance Ability), 1 sorcerer (reduce door) = 1 mile of movement per day (12 bears)


With 24 horses, you only need 4 casters, but I'm disinclined to think you can fit 24 horses in the pull setup. With 12 horses or brown bears you need 15-16 casters, and it's somewhat more reasonable, but still not great. If you get the barbarians, you need 13 casters (or 25 without goliaths), and can get twice the distance.

This doesn't count Dashing to double the distance, as I'm not sure whether that would start affecting exhaustion. On the other hand, if you're only working for 14 minutes per day, might as well push it, as you can rest before the next attempt. So the barbarian team could get up to 4 miles per day. Cut it in half if you can't get sorcerers with Extended Spell metamagic.

Presumably, even if you can't make it all the way to the surface, you can get it far enough to leave the door in a room that has the space to hold it when the Reduce wears off.


With 5th level spells, make a Teleportation Circle, then do the same Reduce + barbarians/teams of animals to drag it the required 10 feet (can use the lower capacity setups and just dash for the round) before the end of the next round (when the teleportation portal disappears).

[Blood of Gaea]

Is this restricted to only having a single person trying to do this, or any number of people? Or at least a party? Can they hire people?

How far do they have to move it? You said a 20'x20' door wouldn't fit through the corridors, but I assume the 10'x10' form (reduced) would?
If you had two people to use, have one person cast Enlarge/Reduce on the door to get it down from 20x20 to 10x10, then have another cast Animate Object, then have the door fly out.

Two people use a 2nd and 5th level spell collectively between them, and the task is done.

Of course, you'll need to burn significant resources depending on how far it needs to be moved, but the goal is only to get it out of the dungeon.

[Beelzebubba]

Backing the use of Shatter to break it into smaller pieces and stuffing them into a Portable Hole.

Or, burying it, and coming back later with a group of Dwarf smiths and give them a 30% cut to chop it into manageable pieces.

[bc56]

Do Transmute Stone (rock to mud) on the walls, then Mold Earth to move the dirt out of the way until you have a large enough shaft above the thing. Then use a system of blocks and tackles tied to an enlarged beast of burden to lift the thing out of the shaft. Next, now that it's in the open, figure out how in the world you're going to cut it into transportable pieces, probably by melting it down.

[Easy_Lee]

Easy. A barbarian with an adamantine maul, while raging, has advantage on strength checks and automatically scores critical hits against objects. No matter the door's hit points, he can break it into smaller pieces with his maul and haul them out with a block and tackle.

Anyone with the cantrip Mending can put them back together later. Mending cannot restore magic to objects but it can repair magical materials.

Never underestimate a Dwarven barbarian paired with a Dwarven cleric.

[bc56]

Easy. A barbarian with an adamantine maul, while raging, has advantage on strength checks and automatically scores critical hits against objects. No matter the door's hit points, he can break it into smaller pieces with his maul and haul them out with a block and tackle.

Anyone with the cantrip Mending can put them back together later. Mending cannot restore magic to objects but it can repair magical materials.

Never underestimate a Dwarven barbarian paired with a Dwarven cleric.

Mending cannot repair a break greater than 1 cubic foot in volume.

[Tetrasodium]

this excellent video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOoCuDnmtyM&t=3s) shows the very simple mechanical stuff that could be powered with mage hand or similar one guy used to make the coral castle (http://coralcastle.com) as long as the hallways were large enough to fit the tripods, pretty much any weight door could have been moved in even though no magic can lift that much weight.

[Temperjoke]

If you're worried about walls being tampered with to move the (intact) door through the halls of the dungeon, you could put an architectural design trap in with some beams holding the roof in place, and if the beams are cut or damaged, it drops the roof. This could even relate to the danger being kept inside, if the roof rubble would help block access to the door.

[8wGremlin]

If a druid could carry it, and wild shape it would be subsumed into their form.
So you need to reduce the weight of it so that the druid could carry it.

As other have said Wizard/Sorcerer reduces it to be 1/8th its original weight. 2nd level spell (so doable at level 3)

as long as the druid can claim it to be his equipment/carried stuff he can wild shape with it.

A Druid can wild shape into any form and all it's equipment will be merged in to its new form. (doable at level 2)
Druid then has an hour to walk out of the dungeon.

[sir_argo]

I cast Enlarge/Reduce to make the door 10x10x.25. It now counts as merely "Large". I cast Animate Object on the door and have it walk itself out of the dungeon. The only real limitation here is concentration... it would take two casters.

[Easy_Lee]

Mending cannot repair a break greater than 1 cubic foot in volume.

Not at one time, it can't. What you do is break the thing into small enough pieces that those pieces can be mended together as the individual breaks between them are no greater than one cubic foot in size. It's a simple matter of geometry, nothing two Dwarves can't figure out given a few hours.

The question is this: why did the designers think this was a limitation in the first place?

[DonEsteban]

Thanks for all your replies. To subsume:

Carrying: The corridors are only large enough for Large creatures, so the minimum STR needed to carry this monster is 100000 / 8 (reduce door) / 2 (large) / 2 (enhance ability) / 15 (carrying capacity) = 208. Even if a huge, enlarged creature would require a STR of 50. So any "equipment" shenanigans are out, it appears.

So we're back at dragging it through corridors that are too narrow (reduce is only 1 minute). And there are obstacles on the way. So this would require a lot of manpower for widening passages or extensive use of stone shape. Or you could dig a hole. However you do it, it would take a lot of time.

Fabricate would be a good way, but I'll have to make it a magic item (for story reasons) anyway, so this won't work.

This leaves destructive methods, which would reduce the value of the thing dramatically:

Melting it is certainly possible, but building that forge would take a lot of time. Days at least.

Destroying it: The rules from DMG are pretty darn stupid if applied to our situation. I will have to make something up. Back in 3.5 the door would have hardness 20 and let's say 400 hp per foot. At least 16000 hp for 20' + 20'. At 10 hp per minute that would take more than a day to cut it into 4 pieces. Which would still be hard to carry outside. That sounds about right.

Honorable mention to jnayls, whose ideas would certainly speed up the process.

Thanks also to Moxxmix. They would not have so many spell-casters, but they might hire some.

Destroying it and using fabricate and animate object appears to be the quickest solution for 5th level spells.

Nice trap idea, Temperjoke, I will consider it!

Thanks for playing!

BTW: Does the adamantine door in Tomb of Horrors have 5e stats? I don't have that book ...

[Kibry]

I can't think of a way with 3rd level spells, however I can think of one with 4th level spells.

Use Conjure Woodland Beings to summon 8 pixies. Have them polymorph the party into Huge sized moles(Or something else with a burrowing speed) and dig your way in from the outside. The leftover polymorphs can be used to polymorph party members again into something that can drag the door. (If the digging takes less than an hour. Solution below can also be use immediately)

Or, the pixies can poly after the digging is done(let's say an hour for the sake of this example, initial polymorph is over. Cast Conjure Woodland Beings spell again). Something with a high strength. We'll say you have 4 lvl8+ party members. Polymorph is concentration. Have 2(Or 3 or 4 depending on the size of the hole you've dug) pixies polymorph your party members into T-Rexes and have them grab the door. Have the others cast Fly on them. All the T-Rexes have to do is hold onto the door. Flying speed of 60 ft for 10 minutes should amount to a total of 1000 ft.

^This could also be done if you pre-break up the door(before Conjure Woodland Beings)

If we're talking about actually getting it somewhere, I would say same solution. Except carrying it over land between long rests. Though, that doesn't account for monster encounters or difficult terrain) (You could use the T-Rex forms to break it up into pieces)

edit: Alternatively, While in Huge Mole form, you could carve out platforms into the rock. The second time you use Conjure Woodland Beings you could summon 8 Blink Dogs and have them teleport the door up.

[tieren]

I'm wondering if there is a simpler extra planar solution, would it weigh less if you coated it with oil of etherealness and tried moving it in that plane?

Can we summon something to move it through some other plane for us and get it back once outside?

Can we get it directly to the plane of earth or fire and use the denizens there to break it up or transport it?

edit:
by 5th level spells you have contact other plane, magic circle, planar binding, etc...

[Beelzebubba]

This leaves destructive methods, which would reduce the value of the thing dramatically

Why? Are people after the door for cultural or historical reasons?

Otherwise that metal will be repurposed into other stuff as soon as possible. Small chunks to re-forge is ideal in that case.

[Vorpalchicken]

Need a third level caster and a seventh level. Possibly it will take multiple castings..

First casts enlarge/reduce. Second casts otiluke's resilient sphere. The 8 strength mage rolls the weightless door out of the dungeon.*

[Shulk]

Use my character's engineering skills to remove the hinges of the door, or even remove the foundations AROUND the door, shove the door in a bag of holding, and bugger off. easy.

[nickl_2000]

Use my character's engineering skills to remove the hinges of the door, or even remove the foundations AROUND the door, shove the door in a bag of holding, and bugger off. easy.


The bag can hold up to 500 pounds, not exceeding a volume of 64 cubic feet

100,000 lbs door is way over 500 pound limit. 20x20x.5 = 200 cubic feet is way over 64 cubic foot limit

[Shulk]

100,000 lbs door is way over 500 pound limit. 20x20x.5 = 200 cubic feet is way over 64 cubic foot limit

Then in that case, I'd re-engineer the dungeon with ramps for trolleys, carraiges, caravans, and get a land vehicle or monster which could lift it in there.

[Easy_Lee]

Just occurred to me that two castings of the spell Gate would do the trick. Gate opens a portal that is exactly large enough for the door to fit.

[DonEsteban]

I'd allow the Pixies trick only if I'm in a very good mood. Why is beyond the scope of this thread.


> This leaves destructive methods, which would reduce the value of the thing dramatically [...]

Why? Are people after the door for cultural or historical reasons?
Well, it's a magic item. Broken up it's just a pile of metal, probably not even massive adamantine, and I could not find a reliable source on the actual value of raw adamantine, so anything is possible here. Probably pretty much still ...


Need a third level caster and a seventh level. Possibly it will take multiple castings..

First casts enlarge/reduce. Second casts otiluke's resilient sphere. The 8 strength mage rolls the weightless door out of the dungeon.*
Hmm, is this as intended? It says the sphere is weightless, but nothing about the contents. Anyway it's just 1 minute. Probably valid, though ...

[Vorpalchicken]

The lore of adamantine seems to suggest that it would be too difficult for mid-low level characters to break apart. If it were that easy, then it wouldn't be valuable

[sir_argo]

Well, it's a magic item

I disagree with this. Leather armor listed under "Magic Items" is magical, but leather itself isn't inherently magical. Adamantine armor may be magical, but adamantine isn't inherently magical. The OP never said the door is magical. If he had, many of the options discussed here would not work.

I think the OP (who is the DM of the campaign in question) needs to answer the question as to whether the door is magical or not.

[Easy_Lee]

I disagree with this. Leather armor listed under "Magic Items" is magical, but leather itself isn't inherently magical. Adamantine armor may be magical, but adamantine isn't inherently magical. The OP never said the door is magical. If he had, many of the options discussed here would not work.

I think the OP (who is the DM of the campaign in question) needs to answer the question as to whether the door is magical or not.

That's why I said to break it with an adamantine maul and reassemble it with Mending. The fact that Mending can't repair breaks over a certain size is easily gotten around by breaking the door into small enough pieces.

[DonEsteban]

OP here :smallwink:
I think I will make it magical. I want to add an enchantment or two for reasons beyond the scope of this questions anyway. I do think it would be destructible, albeit very hard to do, because I don't like the concept of an "unbreakable" item. All items that are not artifacts should be destructible, I think.

[Easy_Lee]

OP here :smallwink:
I think I will make it magical. I want to add an enchantment or two for reasons beyond the scope of this questions anyway. I do think it would be destructible, albeit very hard to do, because I don't like the concept of an "unbreakable" item. All items that are not artifacts should be destructible, I think.

Then either the ninth level spell Gate or Reduce and a sufficiently strong group (perhaps composed of hired help or plenty of purchased donkeys) will likely be the only ways to get the door out of the dungeon in once piece. But who knows what being might actually want such a door.

[ruy343]

I think that I could do it with a level-1 party with level-1-party resources (assuming that three of the level-1- adventurers were first-level wizards and that they were smart enough to equip themselves with a draft horse). However, this method assumes a number of things:


There is a corridor in the dungeon large enough to extricate the door relatively easily while laid on its face (i.e. - there's a 20-foot-wide corridor, preferably heading straight towards the entrance, though that's not necessary)
The door can actually be removed from the rock face where it was placed (duh).
The entire dungeon is a flat surface, or the dungeon slants upward toward the door's location (bringing it uphill would be tough, though theoretically possible - need more horses/ropes, but stairs might require a bit more spellcasting - you'll see why in a moment).



The "Grease" spell coats a 10-foot-square surface of the ground with a slippery grease that causes enemies to slip and fall (theoretically by reducing the coefficient of friction in that area). The Grease lasts for one minute, and is NOT a concentration spell (I'm AFB, but I can't find a single source that says it Is a concentration spell, thus, a single wizard may cast it many times simultaneously) If the door was laid on its face, 4 castings of the grease spell would be all that was necessary to stand the entire thing on a reduced-friction surface, which would allow it to be slid with greater ease. Add another two castings of the spell in the path where you wish to slide it, and your door should be much easier to move.

This does require that your DM agrees that the grease spell should reduce the coefficient of friction by an appreciable amount. In theory, if it makes the area frictionless, all you'd have to do it give it a little shove and it'll go until you run out of frictionless area. However, I assume you'd at least need a horse or two to move it, given that friction probably isn't entirely negated (a dexterity saving throw allows a character to remain standing and fight from within the area, for example... though it may be that overcoming the surprise is all that is necessary here and once you believe you're safe, the spell's effect ends on you... magic in 5e is complicated like that...).

This would be made easier if your DM is nice to you in the following ways:

The door parts down the middle into two 10'x20' doors, which makes it easier overall (and is how I imagine the door would be anyways)
Your DM allows you to make the underside of the door itself slick (it's not technically "the ground", but come on - why can't I make the underside of this stationary, non-creature-bound object slick?)
Your DM allows you to upcast Grease and lets you affect a larger area with it per casting (a 3rd-level casting would affect a 20'x20' area in that case, assuming an additional 5' area per spell level). This would allow you to spend higher-level slots in a way that saves you time, but again, this isn't necessary for success.



However, aside from the argument about how much the "Grease" spell reduced the coefficient of friction, this method does NOT require your DM to be nice to you. You can make your work significantly easier if you grease the ground its on. Maybe combining this with the "reduce" strategy (assuming the door isn't warded against that) and a horse, and you can extract the door easy-peasy.

NOTE: "easy-peasy" assumes that the DM is willing to narrate your 3-day-long door-extraction adventure in a quick montage lasting no longer than 10 minutes... some DMs do not do this because they are jerks (or don't like to be outsmarted).

ALSO NOTE: if the aforementioned wizards were all level 2 transmuters, they could transmute the door temporarily into wood, which would be much lighter. If they had the time/means/drive to do so, they could flood the dungeon and float the door out as a raft. Not for the faint of heart.

EDIT: I said 3 first-level wizards because they'd be able to cast grease 6 times per day, allowing them to move the door 10 feet per day. It woulds till take them forever, but a level one party could do it.

[Coidzor]

Destroying it: The rules from DMG are pretty darn stupid if applied to our situation. I will have to make something up. Back in 3.5 the door would have hardness 20 and let's say 400 hp per foot. At least 16000 hp for 20' + 20'. At 10 hp per minute that would take more than a day to cut it into 4 pieces. Which would still be hard to carry outside. That sounds about right.

Point of order, that would be per foot of thickness. The 20' x 20' aspect of the dimensions are height and width and the 0.5' aspect is the thickness. It's also 40 hp per inch of thickness (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/exploration.htm#tableSubstanceHardnessAndHitPoints ), so half a foot of adamantine would be 40 * 6 = 240 hp. So you would have 4 different 5x5 sections of door, each with 20 Hardness and 240 hp.


BTW: Does the adamantine door in Tomb of Horrors have 5e stats? I don't have that book ...

I'd be surprised if they didn't preserve the 3.5 change that the door only had a thin layer of adamantine plating after adventurers kept just stealing the door and buggering off and the demons got lazy.


ALSO NOTE: if the aforementioned wizards were all level 2 transmuters, they could transmute the door temporarily into wood, which would be much lighter. If they had the time/means/drive to do so, they could flood the dungeon and float the door out as a raft. Not for the faint of heart.

As I recall, that ability requires the material to already be wood, stone, copper, iron, or silver and only can change it into another of that list of things. So you could turn adamantine ore into wood and cart it out, but not adamantine itself.

If it could work, then it'd take almost 34 hours of ritual to do it.

[MrWesson22]

Wait, arent' you still off by a factor of 12 here??

No because the polymorphed enlarged giant ape could do 11000lbs. But he might be too big to fit down the hallways. And my method required 3 concentration spells between polymorph and 2 enlarge/reduces, so it probably isn't the best method.

[DonEsteban]

Ah, you meant your Gargantuan Gorilla plus Tenser's Disks! I'd allow it just for the sight of it, but the beast would never fit through my corridors ...

[tieren]

Assume the party can dislodge the door from its hinges and there is enough room to lie it down.

Conjure elemental fire snake, just being in contact with it will cause fire damage. Have the fire snake lie across the door to melt it into more manageable pieces.

Some mold earth castings might even let you channel the molten adamantine coming off for ingots or other manageable pieces.

[Throne12]

Hire A dwarf Excavation team. They will have a hole up to the surface Big enough to pull it out. Then hire a group of giants.(hill giants are stupied so you can get them cheap.)

[Sigreid]

Build a raft and flood the tunnel enough to float it out. Easier if you have a decanter of endless water.

Similar to how they believe Romans and Egyptians moved massive stones miles.