Damage options for lore bard.

[Bobikus]

Making a character for a campaign starting at level 3. 4 man party consisting of a bear totem barbarian, thief rogue, wizard, and myself. Considering playing a lore bard as the 4th slot since they seem to have a nice mix of battlefield control while being able to take some healing options (the rogue and barb players like to rush into combat and get hurt often.) Knowing that our DM likes to get a little surprise encounter heavy, usually in situations where enemies love to enter combat mid-fight and rush the casters, what are some good options to maintain a bit of personal tankiness/damage. Preferably fighting at range so less of the party is trying to crowd around melee range (or else I'd probably just consider valor).

[jnayls]

Phantasmal Force and Dissonant Whispers are fantastic controls on the field. Lockdown and forced movement. With the wizard doing some control your cutting words can minimize damage incoming and Shatter, while not the most blasty of spells is a viable option as a limited AOE.

Tasha’s and Hold person also work, plus paralyzed means auto crits on hits and prone means advantage for the rogue and barbarian.

I guess the real question is what kind of wizard is in the party, one of you can focus more on control and the other on blastiness.

And your wizard, if they hit with a booming blade pairs really well with your Dissonant Whispers.

[ShikomeKidoMi]

You're a Lore Bard. If the party needs more direct damage, your spell options are 'all of them'. You can grab Fireball at level 6, if you really need it.

The Bard spell list leans towards control, though. Spells like Hypnotic Pattern and Hold Person give the party a huge advantage over monsters with low Wisdom saves. Blind is a non-concentration spell that decimates the abilities of a monster with a poor Fortitude save. Even Faerie Fire has it's uses, since it negates invisibility and gives your party advantage on attack against a monster that fails a Dexterity Save.

[CBAnaesthesia]

Not a whole lot, but Dissonant Whispers is great as has been said. For damage, Spiritual Weapon is a good level 6 choice.

[Bobikus]

Good suggestions, thanks.

Other decision I'm trying to still make is for race, since Human Variant is allowed. Magic Initiate for some more cantrips (including maybe eldritch blast or booming blade) is tempting, but not sure if that's worth all of what Half-Elf can give in terms of extra stats, darkvision, etc. (Fey ancestry sounds like a nice bonus too when I expect to be up against spell casters frequently, the DM loves amoral wizard antagonists).

[CBAnaesthesia]

Good suggestions, thanks.

Other decision I'm trying to still make is for race, since Human Variant is allowed. Magic Initiate for some more cantrips (including maybe eldritch blast or booming blade) is tempting, but not sure if that's worth all of what Half-Elf can give in terms of extra stats, darkvision, etc. (Fey ancestry sounds like a nice bonus too when I expect to be up against spell casters frequently, the DM loves amoral wizard antagonists).

Yeah, Magic Initiate for BB and EB (you can take both with the Warlock version of the feat) is good. I wouldn't take Hex as your level 1 spell for a Bard though since you have a lot of other excellent concentration options.

Overall I think Half-Elf is better though (and if you're looking at feats, I would say it's tough to beat Inspiring Leader. It won't add to your damage but it's such a great feat for any high-Charisma character).

[Bobikus]

Yeah Half-Elf gives so much that it's hard to really pass up as much as I'd love to have the extra early feat. I'm just really used to having a damage cantrip sort of thing to use on turns I don't want to spend a resource, and would prefer to have something that's spell attack roll vs just saving throw stuff, and bard cantrip list isn't suited to that.

[sithlordnergal]

Does your DM allow you to multiclass? If so, then you should take a single level of Sorcerer and using the Draconic Subclass. You'll have a base 13 ac, access to Firebolt and Chill Touch, and then you can take either Magic Missile or Chromatic Orb for some decent attack spells.

[Toadkiller]

A player in a game I’m running did variant human with magic initiate. It has worked out well. She got some damage cantrips and (I think) Shield. Basically a level 1 magical secrets.

[8wGremlin]

Suggestion #27

1st level Hexbade Warlock, get EB, Hex, medium armour, shield use with 14 dex you get 18ac with breastplate and shield (this will help you survive the rush)

2nd level become bard 1
3rd level bard 2
4th level bard 3

all the way up to bard 6 and take some decent spells.
at 8th level take Warlock 2
9th Warlock 3

[Biggstick]

With the group you've described, of Barbarian, Rogue, and Wizard, I'd recommend you consider Cleric. Specifically, I'd consider Light Cleric.

All the typical Cleric goodness (armor/shields/Guidance/Bless/restorative magic/versatile spell list), plus spells like Faerie Fire and Fireball to boot. With Warding Flare, you'll be able to rock 18-19 AC, and give enemies disadvantage when they try to attack you with those mid-round surprises.

A typical Bard just seems like it'd be too squishy for this 4 person group. If you're worried about being a face for the party, you can easily play a Half Elf Light Cleric with 12-14 Charisma, proficiency in Persuasion, and use Guidance/Enhance Ability to act as a face.



Of course, you can just ignore all that and stick with the Lore Bard. A Lore Bard isn't going to really be bringing damage. I'm not exactly sure of what your Wizard ally is going to bring to the party during combat, but as a Lore Bard I'd consider Faerie Fire, Phantasmal Force, and Hypnotic Pattern to be a solid mixing of crowd control that allows you to contribute in a way Players typically expect a Lore Bard to contribute. If your party needs more aoe damage, you can grab Shatter from your level 2 spells, or Fireball from your Bardic Secrets. You should discuss with your Wizard what type of spells they plan on taking so the two of you can work together to coordinate spells/concentration.

[Bobikus]

Divine Soul Sorcerer as a 1 level dip sounds a little tempting. Can get the cantrips and magic missile and also Bless. Our DM isn't a big fan of allowing multiclassing though unless I can really justify it RP-wise, and no one else is multiclassing.

[Bobikus]

Cleric as a class has never just looked that exciting to me. Tempest looks more neat thematically though than light as far as offensive spell clerics go though, so I never looked at light much.

[Aaron Underhand]

I've played a bard with a surprise heavy DM and you are very squishy, as well as lacking in at-will damage.

To be honest the damage issue isn't much at low levels, and your spells will compensate at high level - I'd worry more about defence

Multiclassing gives you some great options, 1 level of cleric is recommended for medium armour Shields and both guidance and bless, with sacred flame giving you a damage options. Since Xanathars, Hexblade is also a source of Medium armour, and gives you eldritch blast, but doesn't synergise well with spells, Dragon Sorcerer gives a little. I actually took 1 level of Wizard, and relied on Shield for defence. This was a role play decision, as should any multiclass be. If multiclass is off the table then I would highly recommend VHuman for the feat.



Moderately armoured for medium armour and Shield
Alert to avoid surprise


I actually took healer - because the party was 6 and needed it - without a cleric I would highly advise that from one of the party, preferably not you, as you have healing word to get people up again - Healers ability to take someone from unconscious to 1 hit point is key, and a rogue thief can do it as a bonus action

[Quoz]

Lore bard at 6 with magic secrets can get one of the nastiest meat grinder combos out there. Take Find Steed from the paladin list and Spirit Guardians from cleric.

Spirit Guardians is a party friendly concentration AoE. 15 foot radius centred on you, and any creature that starts or enters has half speed and takes 3d8 radiant, save for half. It can last a whopping 10 minutes.

Find Steed gives you a mount that is intelligent, resilient, and copies any spell you cast on yourself. So now any opponent in the area has double the damage from spirit guardians.

With the long spell duration you can precast and have all your regular actions available. In a dungeon grind you could probably even chain it between multiple encounters.

Of course, this does make you a priority target for everything you fight, so getting your AC up and taking the dodge action isn't a bad idea.

[Foxhound438]

(and if you're looking at feats, I would say it's tough to beat Inspiring Leader. It won't add to your damage but it's such a great feat for any high-Charisma character).

Super second this, you can be a Vuman with stats: 8/14/16/8/10/16. Here specifically you get a full +6 temp HP, which makes you as tanky as a character with a +5 con. Maybe opt to have 16 dex if you want more AC.

For damage, probably don't worry too much about it. A barbarian and a rogue should do plenty of damage, anything you throw in is complementary at that point. At L3 you probably can get away with an early shatter and then use a crossbow on later rounds. If something jumps in post start and wants to fight you, you might prefer to go for some kind of crowd control or escape option instead (see tasha's hideous laughter or expeditious retreat).

[Zene]

Does your DM allow you to multiclass? If so, then you should take a single level of Sorcerer and using the Draconic Subclass. You'll have a base 13 ac, access to Firebolt and Chill Touch, and then you can take either Magic Missile or Chromatic Orb for some decent attack spells.


Divine Soul Sorcerer as a 1 level dip sounds a little tempting. Can get the cantrips and magic missile and also Bless. Our DM isn't a big fan of allowing multiclassing though unless I can really justify it RP-wise, and no one else is multiclassing.

If you can get it allowed, DS is a fantastic dip. Damage Cantrips and Bless (as mentioned), plus Guidance (amazing for all characters but even better for lore bards, as it synergizes so well with being a skill monkey). And personally I’d skip Magic Missile to go for Shield and Absorb Elements —they’re a massive survivability boost, and those damage cantrips should serve you well enough until you get to Animate Objects.

[KnotaGuru]

I'd second cleric for this group. I love lore bards, but they are squishy and you have a wizard who could focus on control, which is where bards excel. The current group doesn't benefit from short rests either, aside from the wizard's arcane recovery 1/day. Lore bards need short rests to regain Bardic Inspiration and if you took the feat inspiring leader.

If you want to play a support class that can dish out damage, cleric is actually really good. Any cleric will have access to bless, healing word, spiritual weapon, and spirit guardians. Tempest has nice bust potential. Light gets access to fire spells and warding flare can be very helpful. Arcane gets access to a couple wizard cantrips and if you pick up magic initiate for shillelagh you can deal some reliable at-will melee damage while only having to focus on wisdom boosts. Clerics are much more durable that bards as well, having proficiency in medium armor & shields.

[Crgaston]

Re: multiclassing, Lore bards are one of the easier classes to have a good RP reason to take warlock... in your research you discovered a ritual which allowed you to access/summon blah blah blah. It’s in a Lore bard’s nature to seek out more knowledge, especially magical knowledge.

Hex Blade as mentioned above is ideal, and for this party in particular the Celestial pact would be quite useful as well. And of course Fey dovetails with Bard perfectly. A warlock dip transforms the Lore Bard into a serious jack of all trades, adding the best Attack roll cantrip that can be enhanced with riders. For invocations you could take Mask of Many Faces for at-will Disguise Self and Repelling Blast for keeping those surprise attackers at bay or knocking them away from allies.

For a 1 level dip Dragon or Divine Sorcerer is probably supreme, though. Free AC for dragon or free spell known for divine, 4 cantrips and expanded combat spells with no loss in slot progression, and if you start as a sorc you get Con saves.

RP wise, nobody “decides” to become a sorcerer. It just happens. So maybe you freaked out when you started getting magic powers and went to the Bards to see if they could help you understand/control your abilities.

So, TL;DR, your best options for boosting survivability/damage on a Lore Bard are dipping, and the RP justification is easy and fun to do with a Bard.

[MarkVIIIMarc]

Go for the V.Human and grab a feat or High Elf.

High Elf if I recall gets any Wizard Cantrip as a bonus. None of them are quite Eldritch Blast but Wizards have some neat damaging Cantrips, ranged and touch and I like damaging Cantrips for that ONE time you don't have your weapons.

Thunderwave is a favorite damaging Bard spell of mine. Wanna do damage and get out of melee? Wanna do SOME damage 100% of the time? Wanna hit a line of enemies in a hallway? Thunderwave.