Mountain Rage

[tedcahill2]

Just want to make sure I'm understanding Mountain Rage for Goliath Barbarbian's correctly.

It's a straight buff with no downsides right?

How the hell did that even get printed?

[Venger]

Just want to make sure I'm understanding Mountain Rage for Goliath Barbarbian's correctly.

It's a straight buff with no downsides right?

How the hell did that even get printed?

mountain rage replaces your regular barbarian rage

many acfs are straight buffs without taking anything away from you.

goliath, being unfairly saddled with LA +1, is a weak race, so it's hardly unbalanced for them to get big sometimes

[heavyfuel]

Just want to make sure I'm understanding Mountain Rage for Goliath Barbarbian's correctly.

It's a straight buff with no downsides right?

How the hell did that even get printed?


While "Mountain Rage" is a straight buff compared to the core "Rage", getting the substitution level impedes you from getting other ACFs, such as the very good "Whirling Frenzy".

More importantly, the substituion level removes the "Fast Movement" class feature, which means you can't trade it for "Pounce" with "Lion Totem Barbarian", which is like 90% of the reasons to get a level in Barbarian anyway (from a pure mechanical standpoint)

[Venger]

While "Mountain Rage" is a straight buff compared to the core "Rage", getting the substitution level impedes you from getting other ACFs, such as the very good "Whirling Frenzy".

More importantly, the substituion level removes the "Fast Movement" class feature, which means you can't trade it for "Pounce" with "Lion Totem Barbarian", which is like 90% of the reasons to get a level in Barbarian anyway (from a pure mechanical standpoint)

yes, there's also the inability to get spirit lion totem barbarian which is really 100% of the reason for barbarian to exist

[DEMON]

More importantly, the substituion level removes the "Fast Movement" class feature, which means you can't trade it for "Pounce" with "Lion Totem Barbarian", which is like 90% of the reasons to get a level in Barbarian anyway (from a pure mechanical standpoint)

The Mountain Rage ability doesn't really mention replacing/removing Fast Movement, so more likely than not, it's just an omission from the table (same as illiteracy).

[heavyfuel]

The Mountain Rage ability doesn't really mention replacing/removing Fast Movement, so more likely than not, it's just an omission from the table (same as illiteracy).

Not sure I agree with you.

"Mountain Rage" is a straight up buff to "Rage", so removing "Fast Movement" was probably intentional.

As for "illiteracy", aren't Goliaths these very social creatures? Maybe they teach even their barbarians on how to read.

[Jowgen]

You do keep Fast Movement. Sample NPC Akala Fishstringer Kulie-Kamana from page 76 has it as well as Mountain Rage, being a straight barbarian. EDIT: side-note, the substitution table also doesn't mention Illiteracy either, which the sample character also has.

[Dimers]

Not a straight buff, no. Actually being Large size does have down sides: more difficult or impossible movement in tight spaces, worse hiding, lower AC -- and while the additional Strength cancels out your attack penalty for melee, it won't for typical ranged attacks.

It's just that stereotypical D&D barbarians from mountaintops will rarely care about those things.

[heavyfuel]

You do keep Fast Movement. Sample NPC Akala Fishstringer Kulie-Kamana from page 76 has it as well as Mountain Rage, being a straight barbarian. EDIT: side-note, the substitution table also doesn't mention Illiteracy either, which the sample character also has.

Nice catch.

While RAW doesn't say so, it seems the intentions are pretty clear.

Still, "Mountain Rage" is so chock-full of disadvantages (can't be Human for bonus feats Barbs desperately need, can't grab "Whirling Frenzy", lose 1d12+Con HP and 1 BAB on a melee character cuz of LA) I'd have no problems allowing it

[DEMON]

Not a straight buff, no. Actually being Large size does have down sides: more difficult or impossible movement in tight spaces, worse hiding, lower AC -- and while the additional Strength cancels out your attack penalty for melee, it won't for typical ranged attacks.

It's just that stereotypical D&D barbarians from mountaintops will rarely care about those things.

This sir from Boston basically summed up what I was about to say. While definitely not a bad thing, the size increase is not that big of a deal for Goliaths that it would be for some other races.

The large size is mostly good for reach, since Goliaths already have powerful build and the +2 STR is at least somewhat mitigated by the attack penalty from size increase. And let's not forget the rather harsh LA +1 from being a Goliath...

[Vizzerdrix]

I want to say that Ive seen a build that gets Mountain Rage onto a tibbit. Im not sure where though.

[Venger]

I want to say that Ive seen a build that gets Mountain Rage onto a tibbit. Im not sure where though.

maybe iron chef or one of the similar competitions. must've used stoneblessed.

[Fouredged Sword]

maybe iron chef or one of the similar competitions. must've used stoneblessed.


I want to say that Ive seen a build that gets Mountain Rage onto a tibbit. Im not sure where though.

Bigmclargehuge I think it was called. It was a build that attempts to count a 3 or 4 sizes at once.

[Venger]

Bigmclargehuge I think it was called. It was a build that attempts to count a 3 or 4 sizes at once.

yeah here you go (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?132294-Tiny-Von-BigMcLargeHuge) he was a kobold, not a tibbit. name from space mutiny (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFHlJ2voJHY)