Melee rogue issues.

[Dudewithknives]

I am currently level 2 playing a melee focused rogue who is a noble fencer type.

I plan to stay melee as much as I can, and don't want to play the hide and snipe type.

I was planning to go swashbuckler because of how easy it is for them to get melee range sneak attacks off.

Any other way to get highly reliable way around that might make me consider another subclass?

My stats are good enough to play any of them.

[Xihirli]

Swashbuckler was made for you. Seems like a good choice.

[Easy_Lee]

No other rogue subclass will have as easy a time with SA except perhaps the Arcane Trickster (familiar help action). Find Familiar Help can get a bit gamey for some DMs so I think swash is your best bet.

[djreynolds]

No other rogue subclass will have as easy a time with SA except perhaps the Arcane Trickster (familiar help action). Find Familiar Help can get a bit gamey for some DMs so I think swash is your best bet.

You should check out Mr. Lee's Iron Scoundrel. Shield master is a very good feat

[Blood of Gaea]

Theives can often use their fast hands abilities to get advantage for a sneak attack, but that will vary depending on your DM. That said, Swashbuckler is pretty ideal for a charismatic fencer, so definitely go with that.

[Dudewithknives]

Theives can often use their fast hands abilities to get advantage for a sneak attack, but that will vary depending on your DM. That said, Swashbuckler is pretty ideal for a charismatic fencer, so definitely go with that.

Inventive uses of fast hands I am sure I could get away with, within reason. Ball bearing under the feet of a storm giant aren't going to do anything but if reasonable I can pull it off. His combats are rather brutal so I would have to recast find familiar a lot.

I will look at thief,

[Grod_The_Giant]

Inquisitive is also reasonably reliable; not many monsters have a good Cha, and even fewer have skill proficiencies at all, much less Deception. Swashbuckler is probably better for you, though, particularly for that fluff.

[ToastyTobasco]

What all items can you use with Fast hands?

Could you slap manacles on an enemy, or use a net, throw a bottle of oil?

[Blood of Gaea]

What all items can you use with Fast hands?

Could you slap manacles on an enemy, or use a net, throw a bottle of oil?
Anything that takes an action, but isn't a direct attack. Throwing a bottle of oil on the ground should be fine, throwing some sand might be alright, but tossing a net is definitely an outright attack.

[Easy_Lee]

You should check out Mr. Lee's Iron Scoundrel. Shield master is a very good feat

Thanks. I assumed the OP didn't want to multiclass, else I would have recommended this or Barbarian as easy sources of advantage.


Inventive uses of fast hands I am sure I could get away with, within reason. Ball bearing under the feet of a storm giant aren't going to do anything but if reasonable I can pull it off. His combats are rather brutal so I would have to recast find familiar a lot.

I will look at thief,

Thief is good at a lot of things but, by itself, the best means it has of generating advantage is Hide. Hiding in melee can be difficult.

You can get quite creative with thief, though. Sneak up on someone and use manacles twice (action + bonus action) to bind both of their hands. That's a fun trick, if your DM allows it (presumably an opposed sleight of hand check or possibly athletics, either of which you could build for if allowed). But Thief is more of a trickster rogue than a, well, swashbuckler.

[Dudewithknives]

Thanks. I assumed the OP didn't want to multiclass, else I would have recommended this or Barbarian as easy sources of advantage.



Thief is good at a lot of things but, by itself, the best means it has of generating advantage is Hide. Hiding in melee can be difficult.

You can get quite creative with thief, though. Sneak up on someone and use manacles twice (action + bonus action) to bind both of their hands. That's a fun trick, if your DM allows it (presumably an opposed sleight of hand check or possibly athletics, either of which you could build for if allowed). But Thief is more of a trickster rogue than a, well, swashbuckler.

Yeah, we can't multiclass. However he did ok a feat for me that lets me use a rapier to make a 1d4 bonus attack as long as my other hand is empty and gives me 1 ac

[Easy_Lee]

What all items can you use with Fast hands?

Could you slap manacles on an enemy, or use a net, throw a bottle of oil?


Anything that takes an action, but isn't a direct attack. Throwing a bottle of oil on the ground should be fine, throwing some sand might be alright, but tossing a net is definitely an outright attack.

Fast Hands specifically allows the Use an Object action. That action applies any time an object requires your action to use it unless something more specific would apply (specific beats general). For example, putting poison on a weapon - Use an Object - Fast Hands. Donning or doffing a shield - arguably Use an Object, ask your DM. Putting manacles on an incapacitated enemy - check. Putting manacles on an enemy who's actively resisting - ask your DM, but that probably gets into grappling. If it does get into grappling, you can still build for it (expertise athletics, 14-16 strength will do). But your DM might not appreciate it and it's not a surefire way of winning just any fight.

Whatever you do, be reasonable. Your DM is a player, too, and he isn't perfect.

[poolio]

What all items can you use with Fast hands?

Could you slap manacles on an enemy, or use a net, throw a bottle of oil?

Things that interact with an enemy directly are usually considered attacks, I've seen a lot of dm's rule that using a potion is fine, but i personally would take into consideration what the "thief" background might be, like for example, the soldier background, a thief in an army may have been a scout or a field medic, and in the latter case i would be completely okay with healing potions as well as using a healers kit, which should take several minutes if you think about it, i mean you have to clean/disinfect the would, possibly need stitches, and then wrap it, i don't think you just slap the injured character with a box full of medical supplies and a big red cross on and they start feeling better, but that's just my opinion on it, your dm's views my very.

[Spyderson]

I like having the mobile feat as a rogue. It overlaps awkwardly with swashbuckler, but that extra 10ft movement really helps you get in and then back out of a melee opponents threat range. Coupled with a bonus action dash from cunning action to move an additional 40ft(assuming your base is 30). I've had success with this as an inquisitive rogue giving myself advantage on targets for sneak attacks. Might fit in with the noble fencer type of identifying opponents weak points and exploiting them.

[Dudewithknives]

I like having the mobile feat as a rogue. It overlaps awkwardly with swashbuckler, but that extra 10ft movement really helps you get in and then back out of a melee opponents threat range. Coupled with a bonus action dash from cunning action to move an additional 40ft(assuming your base is 30). I've had success with this as an inquisitive rogue giving myself advantage on targets for sneak attacks. Might fit in with the noble fencer type of identifying opponents weak points and exploiting them.

Mobile is such a great feat, it is top of the line for a rogue.

I was thinking:

1. Swashbuckler and take sentinel or mage slayer at 4, the other at 8, then might take skilled 10.

2. Inquisitive and take mobile at 4, whatever feats past that.

3. Thief and take mobile at 4, maybe inspiring leader, or medic later.

[WickerNipple]

Mobile is such a great feat, it is top of the line for a rogue.

I was thinking:

1. Swashbuckler and take sentinel or mage slayer at 4, the other at 8, then might take skilled 10.

2. Inquisitive and take mobile at 4, whatever feats past that.

3. Thief and take mobile at 4, maybe inspiring leader, or medic later.

I think you're probably going to want some Dex increases before all of that.

[Dudewithknives]

I think you're probably going to want some Dex increases before all of that.

We rolled stats:

Str 13
Dex 20
Con 15
Int 14
Wis 15
Cha 18

Started with a feat that is essentially pam with a rapier. I can make a 1d4 bonus attack and have 1 bonus ac as long as my offhand is empty.