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Skuli
2018-03-12, 10:30 AM
Ok, so I'm playing ranger 18, with Warblade manouver progression instead of spells and some other, minor tweaks.
TWF, 2x shortswords, Tiger Claw and Shadow Hand manouvers.
Now, I have fairly optimized character, and in my group, I'm pretty sure I'm Tier 2. Right now in my party, there is a Sorcerer and a Swordsage, though they are not optimized. Sorc plays "fluff", and Swordsage do not know how to play it, I mostly end doing his build including manouvers to keep him remotely at pace.
Our DM recently gave us Deck of Many Cards, that got me instant 4 lvl ups. I'm pretty mad at him actually :P He has some plans dealing with this problem (I'm 3 lvl's above other party members now), although not that good ones (he pushes me towards Weapons of Legacy, exchanging them for 50k of exp. I'm trying to get at least item familiars), due to the fact that he stripped me of all magic items from that same deck of many cards. Any idea about dealing with exp problem will also be appreciated :)
But my problem is mostly, what feats to pick. I have 3 feat slots free, and as for now, my feat selection looks like this:
Able Learner
Weapon Finesse
Landlord
Knowledge Devotion
Shadow Blade
Leadership
Blind-Fight
Quick-Draw (exchanging it, got it with bonus feat)

with 2 flaws:
frail (-1 HP/lvl)
and the one that gives -3 to will saves, forgot the name

Stances:
Hunter's Sense
Assasin's Stance
Island of Blades
Leaping Dragon Stance

Manouvers:
Cloak of Deception
Shadow Blink
Raging Mongoose
Pouncing Charge
Swooping Dragon Strike
Girallon Windmill Flesh Rip
One with the shadow
Five-Shadow Creeping Ice Enervation Strike
White Raven Tactics
shadow stride
Shadow Noose
Wolf Climbs the Mountain
_____________________________________________
Now, was wondering about picking the following feats
Weapon Focus (shortsword)
Combat Expertise
Sense Weakness
But I'm not that confident with them. I would like to go for some utility rather than straight combat. Or at least better ones than that, don't really have an idea where to go now, don't like to overmunchkinize it.
My skill list is built mostly around knowledge - I have 18 ranks in nature, dungeoneering, religion (knowledge dev) and arcane (FE arcane spellcasters), and 13 ranks in planes (cross-class, able learner).
Besides that, survival, jump (Tiger Claw), spot, listen, handle animals, hide, move silently are high. I have 10 skill points per lvl (6 ranger+3 INT+1 human)

I'm already getting nifty dmg comparing other party members, I'm at frontline mostly, cause we play in 3 ppl, and have highest AC. DEX is 24.

Do You have any suggestions? I would love to get something to get knowledge (plans) as class-skill. Not going for any class change, and playstyle is pretty self-explanatory I think ;)

FelineArchmage
2018-03-12, 11:24 AM
Just out of curiosity - why Landlord? Do you guys have a base of operations?

Anyway, I'm always partial to the Leadership feat, but that's probably because we have a train of cohorts in all our campaigns. Pft.

Conversely, I know you said you'd rather go straight utility, but what about Travel Devotion? It will allow you to move and do a full round attack in combat.

Skuli
2018-03-12, 12:05 PM
Just out of curiosity - why Landlord? Do you guys have a base of operations?
Anyway, I'm always partial to the Leadership feat, but that's probably because we have a train of cohorts in all our campaigns. Pft.
Yep, we're playing Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil and I've taken over the moothouse, my cohort is staying there and basically I've turned it to Perpetuum mobile, bunch of crafters working on cash for fort renovation and cohort-pyramid scheme :P They don't go with us, but they are a plot hook and take care of the fort while we're gone. Basically I've got Landlord for the reason above - in comparison to my party I'm too powerful and tried to tone a bit down with some fluff.


Conversely, I know you said you'd rather go straight utility, but what about Travel Devotion? It will allow you to move and do a full round attack in combat.

I get that from manouvers. Pouncing Charge allows charge with a full-attack, and if monsters don't get towards me I still have some standard action manouvers like Swooping Dragon Strike. I though about Travel Dev, but don't have any turn attempts so basically it's a one fight thing without nightstick shenanigans or multiclass. ToB is full of goodies ;)

Goaty14
2018-03-12, 02:24 PM
2 cents (in this case, 2 feats):

Open Minded: Grab 5 skill points, not strings attached. Probably one of the weaker feats, but probably better than WF. Also allows you to get synergy bonuses if you choose the right skill.

Jack of All Trades (Master of Nu'Un (https://dragon-quest.org/wiki/Master_of_Nu%27un#Trivia)) Can use untrained skills as if trained in them, really helps out to identify monsters.

Darrin
2018-03-12, 02:25 PM
Weapon Focus (shortsword)
Combat Expertise
Sense Weakness


My go-to feats for TWF are usually Combat Reflexes + Double Hit (Miniatures Handbook), which gives you two attacks on an AoO. After that... Robilar's Gambit is kinda low-hanging fruit.



Do You have any suggestions? I would love to get something to get knowledge (plans) as class-skill. Not going for any class change, and playstyle is pretty self-explanatory I think ;)

You can get Knowledge (Planes) as a class skill from Keeper of Forbidden Lore (Fiendish Codex I), or from Flexible Mind (Dragon #326).



I get that from manouvers. Pouncing Charge allows charge with a full-attack, and if monsters don't get towards me I still have some standard action manouvers like Swooping Dragon Strike. I though about Travel Dev, but don't have any turn attempts so basically it's a one fight thing without nightstick shenanigans or multiclass. ToB is full of goodies ;)

Travel Devotion can be taken more than once, so taking it three times would give you 30 rounds of move + full attack, presumably for three combats per day. Pouncing Charge works for one round, and then you've got to recover it. However, since you're using the Warblade recovery method, the swift action to use Travel Devotion competes with the swift action to recover your maneuvers.

Skuli
2018-03-12, 03:10 PM
2 cents (in this case, 2 feats):

Open Minded: Grab 5 skill points, not strings attached. Probably one of the weaker feats, but probably better than WF. Also allows you to get synergy bonuses if you choose the right skill.

The "Spend these skill points as normal" ruins this though. Knowledge skills pretty much maxed out, got all synergy bonuses from bluff already, 5 in tumble and balance, only skills that I'm lacking right now (that I would eventually want ) is sleight hand and sense motive, later one I won't be that good anyway since it's WIS. If it were uncapped by max ranks, that would be another story, maybe.
It's hard to come up with something worth it, remember, I'm 18 lvl and 10 skill points per lvl. So even decent options are appreciated.


Jack of All Trades (Master of Nu'Un (https://dragon-quest.org/wiki/Master_of_Nu%27un#Trivia)) Can use untrained skills as if trained in them, really helps out to identify monsters.
Only knowledge that I'm missing is knowledge (local) for monstrous humanoids, and they didn't show up even once till now. So this feat won't help that much. Also I have the "collector of stories" skill trick, so it helps a lot ;)


My go-to feats for TWF are usually Combat Reflexes + Double Hit (Miniatures Handbook), which gives you two attacks on an AoO. After that... Robilar's Gambit is kinda low-hanging fruit.
Don't get that much of AoE, in my game they don't come up often. DM is using 5-foot steps or defensive retreat option usually. And as I'm the party, let's say, tank, most of the enemy's focus is on me, so I'm not the one benefiting from AoE.
"Jack be quick" is nice, but I'd have to build more around mobility in combat, spiked chain would help my reach preferably.


You can get Knowledge (Planes) as a class skill from Keeper of Forbidden Lore (Fiendish Codex I), or from Flexible Mind (Dragon #326).
That's actually nice catch, thanks! Just don't know how I can fit it with my character, Ranger of Mielikki... but that's a problem that I can solve one way or another I think ;)


Travel Devotion can be taken more than once, so taking it three times would give you 30 rounds of move + full attack, presumably for three combats per day. Pouncing Charge works for one round, and then you've got to recover it. However, since you're using the Warblade recovery method, the swift action to use Travel Devotion competes with the swift action to recover your maneuvers.
I'm aware of pros and cons of travel dev, and with clever use of manouvers, tactics and getting all the attention, I've never had to worry that much about getting a full attack after the first round, and even then,
Swooping Dragon Strike and my 37 jump means 11k6+10 dmg and stun if it manages to survive that, which is generally a better option than free move. Or I just use shadow blink (swift teleport 40 ft) and give hell once again ;)
It would be good with "Jack be quick", but on the other hand, I'm not a barbarian, I usually try to avoid being hit if I can.
And Pouncing Charge+Shadow blink is available all day long, just once per encounter/recovery, but that still are 2 tactical moves giving me full attack. So as generally it's a good choice, with access to Tiger Claw and Shadow Hand, not that much.

EDIT: added manouvers to the first post.

Darrin
2018-03-12, 03:34 PM
That's actually nice catch, thanks! Just don't know how I can fit it with my character, Ranger of Mielikki... but that's a problem that I can solve one way or another I think ;)


It was something that surprised me as well, but was listed under the Knowledge skills in the Alternative ways to get new Class skills (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?451088-Alternative-ways-to-get-new-Class-skills) thread.

The fluff on the Abyssal Heritor feats says something about one of your ancestors maybe got a little bit naughty with something demonic, and this part of your bloodline could manifest unexpectedly due to stress. Drawing from a Deck of Many Things can be very stressful. Taking a single Abyssal Heritor feat has no adverse effect. Taking two of them changes your alignment to Chaotic. I don't believe you mentioned your alignment, but a chaotic ranger generally isn't a problem for Meilikki.

What are your favored enemies? Have you considered Nemesis or Improved Favored Enemy? If you have Assassin's Stance, then Craven or Staggering Strike might be worth a look.

Skuli
2018-03-12, 04:13 PM
It was something that surprised me as well, but was listed under the Knowledge skills in the Alternative ways to get new Class skills (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?451088-Alternative-ways-to-get-new-Class-skills) thread.
Nice thread, thanks! Will be helpful in the future, bookmark :)


The fluff on the Abyssal Heritor feats says something about one of your ancestors maybe got a little bit naughty with something demonic, and this part of your bloodline could manifest unexpectedly due to stress. Drawing from a Deck of Many Things can be very stressful. Taking a single Abyssal Heritor feat has no adverse effect. Taking two of them changes your alignment to Chaotic. I don't believe you mentioned your alignment, but a chaotic ranger generally isn't a problem for Meilikki.
Well, it's not that big of a deal considering my alignment, as it's True Neutral. But it may collide with my character's history - royal child of a guy, that wiped demon-cult court from a country, to be elected king, and then slaughtered by the same cultist uprising with all of his family. My character ended up saved by a teleport from a court mage ( now he has teleport phobia, Mr. T plane-like :P ) and raised by a group of mercenaries. But as I said, this isn't that big of a problem, I think I can squeeze some kind of "know Your enemy" explanation for this one and pointing to my DM alternatives like skewer foe with my full BAB progression and Raging Mongoose, ending with 11 attacks, 6 of them with full BAB ^^


What are your favored enemies? Have you considered Nemesis or Improved Favored Enemy? If you have Assassin's Stance, then Craven or Staggering Strike might be worth a look.
Yeah, Improved Favoured Enemy crossed my mind, but wanted to get into Sense Weakness and had to pay feat tax. But that's a good feat that I'll go into I think instead of above selection.
As for Nemesis, I do have blind-fight and Hunter Sense for pinpointing target and d6 is not that big of a dmg, besides that, my DM is stingy in throwing me any of my FE (I do too much dmg as it is ^^ )
My Favoured Enemy selection is:
Arcane Spellcasters +2
Magic Beasts +4
Aberrations +4
Outsiders (Evil) +4
So I was wondering about extra Favoured Enemy (Undead) also. Those 2 combined with one of those 2 feats for knowledge (planes) could be a good fit I think. Only thing is that my DM is stingy with my FE (cause I'm doing too much dmg compared to other party members, and that +4 on all of my attacks... well, yeah), and I worry that he'll just alter types and this won't come up much.

As for Craven and Staggering Strike, I spend most of my time in Island of Blades. Assasin's Stance is only for that moments when all of my party screams "oh ****, kill him now!", because with my number of attacks and Cloak of Deception, it adds roughtly 14d6 on my 7 attacks, that beside sneak attack deal 14d6+57 dmg or more if I get second swift action from other sources to boost myself with Raging Mongoose, giving me aditional 4 attacks ;) And I'm a party player, I wan't others to actually do stuff :P

Do You guys have any other suggestions?