wind spells vs undead

[rediridesence]

So im playing in a 3.5 game and the question came up last session if undead, being immune to fortitude saves (for the most part) are subject to spells like gust of wind or eye of the hurricane.

I know that spells that affect objects still affect undead, but do wind spells that push creatures back X amount of feet on a failed save count towards this? Or are undead immune to spells like the ones mentioned above?

[Kish]

Will a gust of wind strong enough to blow away a person blow away a corpse the same weight?

Even if one doesn't take the attitude "stupid RAW is just that: stupid," this is RAW for Gust of Wind:


In addition to the effects noted, a gust of wind can do anything that a sudden blast of wind would be expected to do.

So yes, it affects objects, including undead, as a nonmagical 50 mph blast of wind would, despite the fact that most of the spell's text is about its effect on creatures. A DM cannot be replaced by a computer yet.

[heavyfuel]

So im playing in a 3.5 game and the question came up last session if undead, being immune to fortitude saves (for the most part) are subject to spells like gust of wind or eye of the hurricane.

I know that spells that affect objects still affect undead, but do wind spells that push creatures back X amount of feet on a failed save count towards this? Or are undead immune to spells like the ones mentioned above?

By a strict RAW (Rules As Written) reading, spells that push creatures back on a failed Fort save would not affect undead. However, seems the RAI (Rules As Intended) is that corporeal undead would feel these effects, as would objects. No reason wind shouldn't push objects back.

Also, we have the Simple RAW Q&A (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?527767-Simple-RAW-Thread-for-3-5-33-Doesn-t-everything-popular-die-when-33) on this forum. It's very effective tool for getting quick answers for simple questions (though the answers will be about the RAW, not the RAI)

[Doctor Awkward]

Undead are immune to any effect that requires a Fortitude save unless is also affects objects or is harmless.


The force of the gust automatically extinguishes candles, torches, and similar unprotected flames. It causes protected flames, such as those of lanterns, to dance wildly and has a 50% chance to extinguish those lights.

In addition to the effects noted, a gust of wind can do anything that a sudden blast of wind would be expected to do. It can create a stinging spray of sand or dust, fan a large fire, overturn delicate awnings or hangings, heel over a small boat, and blow gases or vapors to the edge of its range.

Wind affects objects.

Undead are subject to the effects of high winds.

[Seharvepernfan]

Gust of wind having a fort save is retarded. 250lb dwarf with fort +2 gets blown away, but the 30lb halfling with fort +6 doesn't? Okay.

[DrMotives]

Gust of wind having a fort save is retarded. 250lb dwarf with fort +2 gets blown away, but the 30lb halfling with fort +6 doesn't? Okay.

So, maybe an opposed strength check? Dwarven stability bonus would apply. A bonus for 4 or more legs makes sense. I'm betting that abilty checks just come up less than saves, so they didn't think of them when writing the spell.

[Nifft]

Gust of wind having a fort save is retarded. 250lb dwarf with fort +2 gets blown away, but the 30lb halfling with fort +6 doesn't? Okay. That 250 lb butterball is blown over, not away. He rolls away softly.

With a +6 Fort save, your 30 lb Halfling is apparently 15 lbs of wiry muscle, and the other 15 lbs are pure determination.


So, maybe an opposed strength check? Dwarven stability bonus would apply. A bonus for 4 or more legs makes sense. I'm betting that abilty checks just come up less than saves, so they didn't think of them when writing the spell. Yeah that's quite sensible.

You might also apply the creature's size bonus to the strength check, throw in an extra penalty for having wings or other natural flight (e.g. being a Beholder), or an extra bonus for having 4+ legs, etc.

[Seharvepernfan]

So, maybe an opposed strength check? Dwarven stability bonus would apply. A bonus for 4 or more legs makes sense. I'm betting that abilty checks just come up less than saves, so they didn't think of them when writing the spell.

A halfling could have 20 str; doesn't make him any bigger. The DMG lists "bulk" as one of the things fortitude is supposed to represent, so I get why they picked it. Frankly there just isn't any way to resist wind (without grabbing on to something) other than just being heavy enough to not be moved by it. It doesn't matter how strong you are unless you can grab the ground with your feet.

[Nifft]

A halfling could have 20 str; doesn't make him any bigger. The DMG lists "bulk" as one of the things fortitude is supposed to represent, so I get why they picked it. Frankly there just isn't any way to resist wind (without grabbing on to something) other than just being heavy enough to not be moved by it. It doesn't matter how strong you are unless you can grab the ground with your feet.

Or grab the wall with your sword.

Or "grab" / correct your balance with your muscles.

In other words, it makes no less sense than anything else in D&D.

[KillianHawkeye]

It doesn't matter how strong you are unless you can grab the ground with your feet.

This is a fairly common thing to see in movies or on television, so I wouldn't be surprised if it found its way into D&D.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

The party centaur resists by holding a horse stance.