Eberron Cosmology and Duality of Planes

[InterstellarPro]

So, the Eberron cosmology seems to be filled with dual planes (pairs of opposing planes). I am interested in exploring this possible relationship, even though I have not seen anything in the literature about it.

Here are the planes and what I see as their dual (or opposite) plane. The first several are obvious:
Fernia and Risia (fire and ice)
Mabar and Irian (night and day)
Daanvi and Kythri (order and chaos)
Material and Dolurrh (life and death)
Lamannia and Thelanis (divine vs arcane aspects of nature, or the nature we see vs spiritual aspects of nature/the stories we tell about it)
Shavarath and Syrania (conflict vs peace, ground vs sky)

This leaves only Xoriat and Dal Quor, only I have trouble seeing how I can describe them as opposites. They seem too similar to be considered opposites. Any idea for how I might complete my dual plane theory (and add it to my game as a sect of the Chamber that studies the effects of planar dualities)?

[TallerSpine]

Psion vs wilder?

[CozJa]

So, the Eberron cosmology seems to be filled with dual planes (pairs of opposing planes). I am interested in exploring this possible relationship, even though I have not seen anything in the literature about it.

Here are the planes and what I see as their dual (or opposite) plane. The first several are obvious:
Fernia and Risia (fire and ice)
Mabar and Irian (night and day)
Daanvi and Kythri (order and chaos)
Material and Dolurrh (life and death)
Lamannia and Thelanis (divine vs arcane aspects of nature, or the nature we see vs spiritual aspects of nature/the stories we tell about it)
Shavarath and Syrania (conflict vs peace, ground vs sky)

This leaves only Xoriat and Dal Quor, only I have trouble seeing how I can describe them as opposites. They seem too similar to be considered opposites. Any idea for how I might complete my dual plane theory (and add it to my game as a sect of the Chamber that studies the effects of planar dualities)?

Honestly, I'm not too much convinced about Material and Dolurrh: generally speaking, Eberron is the point where all planes coalesce into reality, therefore putting it into the dualism may be a bit of a stretch. On the other hand, it is true that Dolurrh has a tenuous veil separating it from Eberron, therefore it could work.

I'm convinced by:
Fernia and Risia (fire and ice)
Mabar and Irian (night and day)
Daanvi and Kythri (order and chaos)
Shavarath and Syrania (conflict vs peace, ground vs sky)

It's not easy to place them all, therefore I have some different suggestion.
You could try:
Lamannia and Xoriat (the aspect of everything natural vs the aspect of everything alien and unknown, both can be unsettling and perilous.)
Thelanis vs Dal Quor (the realm of stories and the realm of dreams: do stories come from our dreams, or our dreams are generated by our collective legends? Or both?)

Clearly, if you want to go for a sect of the Chamber looking at it this way, you may try to put it all together as being a representation of the eternal struggle between Khyber and Siberys. I can even see different theories in the sect: if Dolurrh represent death and Eberron life, why the planes do not mirror each other? If Eberron is the place where all planes meet and Dolurrh is death, like Khyber, maybe there is a secret place born from Siberys? What if Dolurrh represents Siberys death and is indeed the place where everything must end to bring about the Prophecy?
Another interesting thing to ask is: looking in their observatories, what the dragons really see in the sky?
Mh, I like your idea, plenty of possibilities here...


Psion vs wilder?
Something similar could work too: if Lamannia vs Thelanis is seen as Divine vs Arcane (remember that canonically, Divine magic and druidic magic are two different things, but maybe those dragons do not believe it) then Dal Quor and Xoriat could be the manipulation of the mind vs the manipulation of the flesh.

It could even be that your sect of dualist dragons has different ways of perceiving that dualism!

[InterstellarPro]

It's not easy to place them all, therefore I have some different suggestion.
You could try:
Lamannia and Xoriat (the aspect of everything natural vs the aspect of everything alien and unknown, both can be unsettling and perilous.)
Thelanis vs Dal Quor (the realm of stories and the realm of dreams: do stories come from our dreams, or our dreams are generated by our collective legends? Or both?)


I like the idea of Thelanis vs Dal Quor a lot! I was thinking about trying to figure out a link between the Age of Dreams and Age of Nightmares in Dal Quor with power struggles between the Seelie and Unseelie courts in Thelanis.

[Dragolord]

You might get somewhere putting Eberron against Xoriat, as reality against insanity, and Dal Quor against Dolurrh, as dreams against forgetfulness and the loss of hope.

[CozJa]

You might get somewhere putting Eberron against Xoriat, as reality against insanity, and Dal Quor against Dolurrh, as dreams against forgetfulness and the loss of hope.

That's another good idea: the aspect of forgetfulness of Dolurrh is often overlooked


I like the idea of Thelanis vs Dal Quor a lot! I was thinking about trying to figure out a link between the Age of Dreams and Age of Nightmares in Dal Quor with power struggles between the Seelie and Unseelie courts in Thelanis.

Interesting! This could be tied to manifest zones of the two planes interacting with each other? Maybe the two planes are 'manifest' into every living creature when it thinks about a story and when it dreams... in that way, the flow of stories in Thelanis for a mortal could mirror the flow of his dreams and nightmares (do not forget that, in the end, what we see manifest of Thelanis can depend on the eyes of the seer). It may even be that the archfey of Thelanis are in fact different aspects of the most powerful Quori, and that's why the turning of the age is such a big deal: it will echo even on Thelanis. Another interesting plot point would be if the two planes are somewhat mirrored into each other, but in the other way around: like when you tell a fairy tale with happy ending to a baby who had a nightmare, the Seelie Fey will be stronger, as long as the power of the Nighmare is stronger, but if the Kalashtar will bring forth the turning of the age, the Unseelie Court will become more powerful in the hearts of mortals... and in Thelanis.

[InterstellarPro]

That's another good idea: the aspect of forgetfulness of Dolurrh is often overlooked



Interesting! This could be tied to manifest zones of the two planes interacting with each other? Maybe the two planes are 'manifest' into every living creature when it thinks about a story and when it dreams... in that way, the flow of stories in Thelanis for a mortal could mirror the flow of his dreams and nightmares (do not forget that, in the end, what we see manifest of Thelanis can depend on the eyes of the seer). It may even be that the archfey of Thelanis are in fact different aspects of the most powerful Quori, and that's why the turning of the age is such a big deal: it will echo even on Thelanis. Another interesting plot point would be if the two planes are somewhat mirrored into each other, but in the other way around: like when you tell a fairy tale with happy ending to a baby who had a nightmare, the Seelie Fey will be stronger, as long as the power of the Nighmare is stronger, but if the Kalashtar will bring forth the turning of the age, the Unseelie Court will become more powerful in the hearts of mortals... and in Thelanis.

That is an awesome interpretation of my idea. It still needs more thought, but I like it a lot. Thank you for your help!

[CozJa]

You're welcome! Let us know what you'll come up with!

[InterstellarPro]

You're welcome! Let us know what you'll come up with!

I am a fan of Mongoose Publishing's Fey Magic. The idea of the Reverie has always appealed to me. These Dreams of the Fey being intrinsically tied to Dal Quor feels like more than just mortals dreaming and telling stories. Did mortals tell stories and create the fey? Or did the tales already exist, and mortals discovered them? Perhaps Thelanis is the potential for every story that could ever be told. Perhaps Dal Quor is the potential for every dream that could ever be dreamed. The two are linked by more than just telling different stories changes the dreams we have (although that is true). It is more than just dreams influence the stories we tell (although that is true, as well). There is something greater linking the planes. Almost like they are two aspects of the same plane.

Keith Baker (http://keith-baker.com/dragonmarks-thelanis-and-the-fey/) has similar ideas about this connection, although he chose one specific feyspire to represent the connection while I think it is a much stronger and more intrinsic connection.