I just don't get inspiration in D&D 5

[Roderack]

I've been playing and running RPGs since the original D&D pamphlets were published. I ran an original AD&D campaign for years. Then I moved on to other systems and haven't been around D&D for a very long time. Friends are wanting a D&D 5th edition game so I've been reading through the Dungeon Master's Guide and Player's Handbook.

Maybe I've been away for D&D too long or maybe I'm just stupid, but I can't figure out how inspiration is intended to be implemented in the game. Could someone provide a brief description and an example? Clearly it's intended as a reward recognizing various qualities of play, but I do not understand how a player who's been granted inspiration would actually use it in game play.

Thanks in advance.

[Solusek]

I only play in one D&D group currently, so can't speak to what a broader range of people do, but we have never used it. I don't think we ever even talked about it. It's just an awkward mechanic that I feel would do more harm than good were DMs to actually use it as written.

[Unoriginal]

I've been playing and running RPGs since the original D&D pamphlets were published. I ran an original AD&D campaign for years. Then I moved on to other systems and haven't been around D&D for a very long time. Friends are wanting a D&D 5th edition game so I've been reading through the Dungeon Master's Guide and Player's Handbook.

Maybe I've been away for D&D too long or maybe I'm just stupid, but I can't figure out how inspiration is intended to be implemented in the game. Could someone provide a brief description and an example? Clearly it's intended as a reward recognizing various qualities of play, but I do not understand how a player who's been granted inspiration would actually use it in game play.

Thanks in advance.

One of the PCs in my campaign has a passion for music. I've awarded an inspiration when he spent time befriending a bard in a very nice RP moment.

Basicaly, Inspiration is just to reward cool moments, RP, and ideas. if you spend one, you have advantage.

[Desteplo]

My players were fighting half a chess board and the king was barking orders
-our battle master fighter player started to roll play his maneuvers (rally and commanders strike in particular)

Awarded inspiration

He liked the way the wizard described his grease spell and thought that was the most important turn of the fight

Gave his inspiration to the wizard

[Tanarii]

ut I do not understand how a player who's been granted inspiration would actually use it in game play.
By saying "I spend my inspiration", and getting advantage on the roll he's making.

Can't remember if the official rule is you have to declare it after or before you see the roll though.

[FelineArchmage]

Everyone has already described examples on when to give inspiration so I'm gonna skip that.

In terms of implementing it, they can use their inspiration to gain advantage on any roll, which is usually very useful in 5e. Advantage allows you to roll 2 d20s and take the higher of the two numbers. It's this edition's way to make it more likely for your player to succeed on whatever they're doing.

[Toadkiller]

Our house rule (which came from someplace) is that any player can give inspiration to another once per session for a notable role playing moment or clever idea. Anyone who has inspiration can re-roll a bad roll once. At the end of each session all unused inspiration goes away.

Functionally, it mainly gives us a way to celebrate fun role play and ideas. The “giver” tosses a cheap bead necklace (from Mardi Gras) to the recipient who wears it until tossing it back into the pot when it is used. Maybe half the time or so it changes the result of the roll, though we haven’t tracked it. Overall, minimal mechanical impact (chance to change 5 rolls a session max) but it adds some fun for our group anyhow.

[Tiadoppler]

With regards to ease of use/remembering that this mechanic exists in 5e, I use physical tokens (a pile of golden coin props) that I hand to players, and they keep it until they decide to use the Inspiration. If I don't do this, nobody (including myself) remembers to grant/use Inspiration at all. It's obnoxiously forgettable for a 'core' roleplay-encouraging mechanic.

[Tanarii]

With regards to ease of use/remembering that this mechanic exists in 5e, I use physical tokens (a pile of golden coin props) that I hand to players, and they keep it until they decide to use the Inspiration. If I don't do this, nobody (including myself) remembers to grant/use Inspiration at all. It's obnoxiously forgettable for a 'core' roleplay-encouraging mechanic.
Players have the same problem with Bardic Inspiration. They had the same problem with 4e Action Points. They have this problem with a poker chip right in front of them to remind them they have something to spend.

I don't get it. These are not insignificant bonuses, but players cannot for the life of their PC, often quite literally, remember them. :smallconfused:

[Tiadoppler]

Players have the same problem with Bardic Inspiration. They had the same problem with 4e Action Points. They have this problem with a poker chip right in front of them to remind them they have something to spend.

I don't get it. These are not insignificant bonuses, but players cannot for the life of their PC, often quite literally, remember them. :smallconfused:

Yeah, it's frustrating, but I can't blame the player for not remembering Inspiration (Bardic and otherwise) if it's not something that the player earns reliably/gets regularly. It's something that the DM/another player gives them, so it's not something they necessarily think about when they consider their character's options. It doesn't originate on their character sheet, so it's hard to keep track of.

I didn't have the same problems with Action Points in 4e: the players got them at the same time, at a regularly rate, so they remembered that they existed and were able to remind each other "don't forget, we've all got Action Points this encounter".

[Tanarii]

Yeah, it's frustrating, but I can't blame the player for not remembering Inspiration (Bardic and otherwise) if it's not something that the player earns reliably/gets regularly. It's something that the DM/another player gives them, so it's not something they necessarily think about when they consider their character's options. It doesn't originate on their character sheet, so it's hard to keep track of.

I didn't have the same problems with Action Points in 4e: the players got them at the same time, at a regularly rate, so they remembered that they existed and were able to remind each other "don't forget, we've all got Action Points this encounter".
Bards hand out Bardic Inspiration like candy.

I hand out chips for (Personality-related) Inspiration early during each session, and regularly during the session to those that have used it, far more than the once a session the DMG recommends, and I make a big deal out of it each time. And some players still don't spend it, even when they get opportunities almost immediately after. I've asked players before if they're hoarding it for the perfect moment or something and they still say "no, I just forgot". Sometimes other players will remind them (which is something that requires a corresponding in-game vocalization IMC) and they'll be all surprised and be like "oh yeah, I can use my inspiration on that." Other times the entire table will forget they can do that, and I can see the chip in plain view right at the top of the character sheet.

And it definitely happened with disturbing frequency to me as a 4e DM as well.

Maybe it's because I don't count it as my job to remind players that they have abilities they can use? :smallyuk:

It's not all players or anything. It's just enough that it's clear to me there's clearly something common to our psychology going on.

[Tiadoppler]

It's just enough that it's clear to me there's clearly something common to our psychology going on.

It's called "Humans and many other D&D playing sapients are bad at remembering things."

A big reason that 5e switched from +2/+1/-5 style modifiers to Adv/Disadv in the first place was... people were having trouble remembering all the situational modifiers. Humans are bad at quickly doing a checklist and determining all the different situational effects that are involved in an attack or damage roll, and having a circumstance checklist (Am I Flanking? Is he Prone? Am I wielding in 1h or 2h? Am I flying? Am I charging? Is he vulnerable to my damage type(s)? Does he have any active spells? Do I have any active spells? Can he cast Shield?) slows down the game a lot.

Then you tack on a "sometimes I can get a bonus whenever I feel like it, but not always" for additional confusion...

[Asmotherion]

It's really optional. It's a way for your DM to say "well done", and you can use it up latter for advantage on a roll of any kind, to make a failure into a success.

I like using it as a DM, as you make your Players aware that what they are doing is meaningful or wasting time. I also use the "Unfocused" that works the opposit way, and I get to roll it, when I feel a player is wasting time (for non-rp reasons).

Other DMs give Xp bonuses or Penalties; I personally am against this, as I feel the whole party should be the same level at all times; This is why I use a variant rule that calculates Party XP, which they can use to level up during Dawntime.

I firmly believe that the story I provide my players is it's own reward or penalty, and the most appropriate reward is enhancing their chances of success.

[DarkKnightJin]

For the Bardic version:
I place a physical die equal to the BI die I can add to a roll on the space for Inspiration on my character sheet. As something of a reminder to myself that O have it.

For the DM-appointed version:
Wouldn't this version be a bit like the "Fate Point" thing from other systems? Maybe it helps as a free 'charge' of the Lucky feat?

[mephnick]

Mearls basically admitted that they weren't sure whether it was a good idea or how to make it work more naturally but left it in anyway, hence why it isn't tied to any other mechanics. So do whatever you want with it.

[Mortis_Elrod]

I find that often times i will award inspiration without knowing it. As an example let say someone had a clever way to use a skill from a cool/RP/makes alot of narrative sense standpoint. Adv on that role.

This isn't inspiration in total, since inspiration is used when the player determines, but it similar and i do it constantly because i like rewarding out of the box ideas and solutions.

[DarkKnightJin]

I find that often times i will award inspiration without knowing it. As an example let say someone had a clever way to use a skill from a cool/RP/makes alot of narrative sense standpoint. Adv on that role.

This isn't inspiration in total, since inspiration is used when the player determines, but it similar and i do it constantly because i like rewarding out of the box ideas and solutions.

That particular thing isn't directly rewarding with Inspiration as it is trying to improve the narrative.
Your player(s) have a good idea to try and make something happen? Give them Advantage on the roll. If you feel they made ot next to impossible to fail at what they're trying to do? Lower the DC, or maybe even cut out the roll entirely if the DC was low enough before.

But, I'll admit that doing something like that, is probably more natural and worked into the narrative than just giving Inspiration to be used at any point during the session would be.
I feel it also encourages the players to try and get creative about tackling certain non-combat encounters, and by extension, RP a bit more.

You could even award Advantage on a single attack roll while in combat if they keep up the RP and make creative use of the environment. Or give the enemy Disadvantage on their Saving Throw, if you think it'd make for a better story.

[The1exile]

I’ve never had too much of a problem with inspiration - but I came from playing a lot of 7th sea, where drama dice (that you add to your roll to change the outcome, sometimes dramatically so).

Some changes I do recommend to the default is to allow players to have more than one point at a time. That way the players can spend more time doing the cool stuff that earns them inspiration, and are also less likely to begrudge using it on a roll that turns out to be easy. Also, at the end of an act, make clear that inspiration resets, to avoid potion hoarding syndrome. Finally, if your party talks about sharing inspiration - our barbarian is good for saying “that sounds like a nasty roll, I’ll lend you a point of inspiration if you like” - they’ll start to use it more often.

[DarkKnightJin]

I’ve never had too much of a problem with inspiration - but I came from playing a lot of 7th sea, where drama dice (that you add to your roll to change the outcome, sometimes dramatically so).

Some changes I do recommend to the default is to allow players to have more than one point at a time. That way the players can spend more time doing the cool stuff that earns them inspiration, and are also less likely to begrudge using it on a roll that turns out to be easy. Also, at the end of an act, make clear that inspiration resets, to avoid potion hoarding syndrome. Finally, if your party talks about sharing inspiration - our barbarian is good for saying “that sounds like a nasty roll, I’ll lend you a point of inspiration if you like” - they’ll start to use it more often.

I think players can share their Inspiration (non-Bardic) with other players, even by RAW. So that shouldn't be a problem. Allowing to 'store' some Inspiration might work too.

[Chugger]

A lot of people say you give inspiration to reward people for role playing in a damaging or self-depricating way. I.e. you as a player know x about monster y, so you deliberately have your character - who doesn't know anything about monster y, go up and stick his head in it's mouth. Now he can roll with advantage to see if it gets bitten off completely or just in half. It's like a reward - a pat on the head - for when a player actually tries not to meta game. Except that's not really it at all.

In reality - in practice - inspiration is given by DMs who fear that chars are gonna get really badly hurt - like as they walk into a mind flayer's cave - it's given to characters so later, after the DM perma-kills and eats their brains - he can say "well I did try - I gave you that inspiration hoping you'd save vs having your mind destroyed - but sadly you rolled a 1 and a 3 - and your mind was utterly obliterated. Sorry."

I'm totally lying and misrepresenting and being sardonic ... yet all the above I have witnessed and is true. Well, I did add a little hyperbole - a bit.

I think inspiration has a quantum physics quality to it and can't be well understood. Those who claim to understand it are either lying or unaware of their own limitations. I mean seriously, what is going on with entangled particles, anyway - spooky action at a distance and all that? Oh, inspiration - yeah - just buy a bag of cool tokens - fake piece o eight - fake old coins - stale graham crackers that no sensible person would actually eat - old pieces of chewing gum you've pried off the underside of park benches and bus seats - peanut shells - anything. Occasionally give them to the players - for completely irrational and inconsistent reasons - don't even try to have it make sense. Just do it, and they'll try to force sense upon your chaos - and salad will come out of it. And we'll all have a sensible and nutritionally balanced lunch. That, my friend, is how inspiration works.

[bc56]

Honestly, Inspiration is a mess. I don't use it, and I don't try to use it. It's too hard to define how one should award it without being biased toward specific players.

[Unoriginal]

I don't get why people call it complicated/a mess/half-baked/etc.


It's literally just "DM can give Inspiration to players when the players do something nice. Players can use Inspiration before a roll to get advantage".

[The1exile]

I think players can share their Inspiration (non-Bardic) with other players, even by RAW. So that shouldn't be a problem. Allowing to 'store' some Inspiration might work too.

You’re right, they can by default. I more meant to highlight the discussion that goes with it, that helps to let that rule actually get used.

[Roderack]

Thanks very much for the feedback. I understand it now.
Very much appreciated.

[Sigreid]

Players have the same problem with Bardic Inspiration. They had the same problem with 4e Action Points. They have this problem with a poker chip right in front of them to remind them they have something to spend.

I don't get it. These are not insignificant bonuses, but players cannot for the life of their PC, often quite literally, remember them. :smallconfused:

No doubt there are other players like me that don't forget but suffer from "I might need it more later" paralysis and fail to use it when they should.

[Knaight]

I don't get why people call it complicated/a mess/half-baked/etc.


It's literally just "DM can give Inspiration to players when the players do something nice. Players can use Inspiration before a roll to get advantage".

It demands a qualitative GM judgement call, and also has mechanical impact. For a lot of GMs this isn't even worth remarking on, but this forum has a lot of die hard 3.x players, and if 3.x (or at least the culture that emerged with the game) was built on anything it was built on not doing that.

[Tanarii]

No doubt there are other players like me that don't forget but suffer from "I might need it more later" paralysis and fail to use it when they should.I see a lot of LR spellcasters with this problem too. Or the opposite. ;)

[Beelzebubba]

Personally, I think of it this way: it's fate smiling on you, but you have to earn it by being true to yourself.

So, in our game, you get it refreshed when you are put in a risky/dangerous situation and act according to your character's chosen Bonds, Flaws, or Ideals when a more expedient, 'optimal', 'play the game to win' choice can be made.

So, if you say you hate bullying, and are put in a position where you will risk losing something else pretty important by interceding in and stopping some bullying, then you get it back. \

--

If you already have it, and you do the same, then we do other things, but that's in optional / house rule territory.

[Asmotherion]

Honestly, Inspiration is a mess. I don't use it, and I don't try to use it. It's too hard to define how one should award it without being biased toward specific players.

Not really. That's kinda the DMs job.

A) Not being Biased towards his Players and
B) Being in a possition to judge when an action contributes to the story's development (for better or for worse), does neither, but was nevertheless something cool added to the story, or eats out playing time for no particular reason (knowingly).

A DM can sometimes act as a referee, and it's not a bad thing whatsoever. It can help progress the story at a faster pace.

[Fire Tarrasque]

Here's the exact rules on inspiration, without house or optional rules thrown in:
The DM can AT ANY TIME, for ANY ACT, award a player inspiration. The player can then role a D20 and add it on to their first D20 role. That's it. It's not even really needed.
Bardic Inspiration, though, is unrelated. It's a class feature.

[Anonymouswizard]

It's just an awkward mechanic that I feel would do more harm than good were DMs to actually use it as written.

Inspiration is a very bad attempt at getting roleplaying and some plot mechanics into the core of 5e. It falls completely flat because people who don't like narrative/roleplaying mechanics are just going to ignore it, and those who like them are much more likely to own systems that have more developed versions (of which Fate is one of the lightest in narrative mechanics).

Specifically, Personality Traits and Inspiration read like the writers saw Fate's Aspects and Fate Points but didn't get them. In Fate you begin with a store of Fate Points (minimum one, most likely less than five) which you can spend to call bonuses or plot developments from the Aspects that describe the characters and scene (which don't have to be yours, they just have to benefit you). At the same time you can regain a Fate Point if an Aspect would logically cause you problems, but rejecting this complication costs you a Fate Point, with the process being called a Compel. Unlike Inspiration characters are meant to gain and lose several Fate Points a scene, with the story experiencing highs and lows depending on the FP stock. It also points out that a Compel can apply retroactively, if you acted in line with your aspects and it logically goes poorly, and recommends that players actively ask for Compels when they need Fate Points. Or Compelling other PCs or NPCs by spending a Fate Point.

5e would probably have been better off either giving players a limited pool of Inspiration per session, or just getting rid of it all together. It's so tacked on that it just gets lost in the jumble of other rules.


I don't get it. These are not insignificant bonuses, but players cannot for the life of their PC, often quite literally, remember them. :smallconfused:

I've found that such metagame currencies work much better if you're seen to be using them as well. I've seen characters fail to spend any Fate Points in Dark Heresy (when I played in Deathwatch I was the only player to end sessions with no FP), but when I ran Fate it took a couple of scenes of seeing me spend FP to invoke Aspects or bring in plot details and players got how it worked. Took them much longer to learn to call for Compels, but that's because it's hard to get into that mindset.

[Sigreid]

If you want people to be excited about inspiration I think it could be good to instead of advantage on a roll have it allow a character to regain one long or short rest resource. Would be pretty epic at every level.

[Theodoxus]

Last night I was playing in an AL game, and the whole team were murderhobos. We were walking down a road, and I smelled a cookfire. The Dragonborn ranger also smelled it, and took off into the woods to track it down, without saying a word to the group. The rest of the party starts following his lead, until I was the only one remaining on the road.

The party makes quick work of the "bandits" - I use scare quotes because no one in the party actually asked the campers what they were doing. The dragonborn had overheard "Lucky we stole this boar from the king's fields!" - and since he has Humans as a favored enemy, proceeded to wreck the camp - causing the rest of the party to engage without even knowing why (and hence why I call them murderhobos).

So, I sit down at the edge of the wood, waiting for their return, when lo and behold, a lone bandit comes walking out, pulling up his trousers after relieving himself. He sees me, and decides I'm easy prey, so he goes for the attack. Rolls a 1 and a 2 - and the DM decides he's not quite tied his belt correctly, dropping his pants and showing his dangly bits for me to examine - being sitting and all.

I proceed to ask if he's propositioning himself to me - for which the DM granted me inspiration, as she had intended to goad me into a fight, and I refused to stoop to murdering the poor lad. I then rolled to persuade him to allow me to help him with his dangly bits, as I had decided right then my character was bisexual. I used the inspiration immediately, rolling an 8 and a 20! (for a total of 25, yay charismatic knight!) and the poor bandit mortified and confused, confessed he didn't want to be a bandit any longer and was willing to become my squire (I took the Noble Knight background, but didn't have any retainers, so this worked out well). The DM gave me another inspiration after the conclusion of my "battle" and ended up using that one in a fight against spiders.

Of course, I, being human (and my squire, dubbed Bob as well) received nothing but scorn from the Dragonborn the rest of the evening. But it was totally worth it. I nearly killed the DM, who couldn't really catch her breath from all the ensuing laughter...

[JakOfAllTirades]

Last night I was playing in an AL game, and the whole team were murderhobos. We were walking down a road, and I smelled a cookfire. The Dragonborn ranger also smelled it, and took off into the woods to track it down, without saying a word to the group. The rest of the party starts following his lead, until I was the only one remaining on the road.

The party makes quick work of the "bandits" - I use scare quotes because no one in the party actually asked the campers what they were doing. The dragonborn had overheard "Lucky we stole this boar from the king's fields!" - and since he has Humans as a favored enemy, proceeded to wreck the camp - causing the rest of the party to engage without even knowing why (and hence why I call them murderhobos).

So, I sit down at the edge of the wood, waiting for their return, when lo and behold, a lone bandit comes walking out, pulling up his trousers after relieving himself. He sees me, and decides I'm easy prey, so he goes for the attack. Rolls a 1 and a 2 - and the DM decides he's not quite tied his belt correctly, dropping his pants and showing his dangly bits for me to examine - being sitting and all.

I proceed to ask if he's propositioning himself to me - for which the DM granted me inspiration, as she had intended to goad me into a fight, and I refused to stoop to murdering the poor lad. I then rolled to persuade him to allow me to help him with his dangly bits, as I had decided right then my character was bisexual. I used the inspiration immediately, rolling an 8 and a 20! (for a total of 25, yay charismatic knight!) and the poor bandit mortified and confused, confessed he didn't want to be a bandit any longer and was willing to become my squire (I took the Noble Knight background, but didn't have any retainers, so this worked out well). The DM gave me another inspiration after the conclusion of my "battle" and ended up using that one in a fight against spiders.

Of course, I, being human (and my squire, dubbed Bob as well) received nothing but scorn from the Dragonborn the rest of the evening. But it was totally worth it. I nearly killed the DM, who couldn't really catch her breath from all the ensuing laughter...

And that, boys and girls, is why DM's show bias towards a player - because everyone else at the table is lame.

Well played, Sir!

[Finback]

Does anyone else do it for terrible, terrible puns? I devastated the table and made someone so cross they had to leave the table.
Y'see, the bard was able to turn into a giant ape for the combat. He was a regular chimp off the old block. *player gets a twitchy eye* He chose to h-orang-ue the foes with his wit. *she moves to leave the table*
It was all a matter of gibbon-take anyway.

And that's how I, the DM in the game, got inspiration from my players.

That being said, wordplay is never a losing battle. A pun is its own reword.

[Unoriginal]

Does anyone else do it for terrible, terrible puns? I devastated the table and made someone so cross they had to leave the table.
Y'see, the bard was able to turn into a giant ape for the combat. He was a regular chimp off the old block. *player gets a twitchy eye* He chose to h-orang-ue the foes with his wit. *she moves to leave the table*
It was all a matter of gibbon-take anyway.

So, she was so tired of you monkeying around she had to leave to avoid going banana?

I admit, some players can't handle the puns, when the chimps are down. A DM must have all the skill and charisma of a kong man to make them come back.

Yet, I'm sorry to say, but there is a missing link in your story, if you want it stand up to the test. I'll even say a monkey element is lacking.

I don't want to intrude in your primate business, but are you sure the player wasn't pissed by other things before that? It's pretty rare to see a RPG player going ape for only a couple of puns. Unless, to paraphrase Pratchet's work, she was a complete Ook-ie.

What can I say, the ape didn't fall far from the tree.

[Tanarii]

Does anyone else do it for terrible, terrible puns?
Players that make puns lose their inspiration.

Actually, that should be a real rule. :smallamused:

[PhoenixPhyre]

Players that make puns lose their inspiration.

Actually, that should be a real rule. :smallamused:

I don't like that rule. My current character's style is entirely based around wordplay and puns. Bad jokes are the only ones I'm capable of.

[Tanarii]

I don't like that rule. My current character's style is entirely based around wordplay and puns. Bad jokes are the only ones I'm capable of.
Switch to "your mom" jokes. It's less puerile and actually funny. :smalltongue:

[Unoriginal]

Switch to "your mom" jokes. It's less puerile and actually funny. :smalltongue:

Do you really want people to do "your mom" over and over, all session?

[PhoenixPhyre]

Switch to "your mom" jokes. It's less puerile and actually funny. :smalltongue:

Puns are the pinnacle of humor. Only the weak-minded don't appreciate their awesome awfulness. :smallwink:

[lt_murgen]

If you want people to be excited about inspiration I think it could be good to instead of advantage on a roll have it allow a character to regain one long or short rest resource. Would be pretty epic at every level.

In AL, I had one DM who awarded Inspiration to everyone at the start of the game. Not everyone used it, but everyone who did saved it for a dramatically appropriate moment.

If I ever DM a normal campaign again, I am going to treat Inspiration exactly like Fate points in the old WEG Star Wars. Use it on a normal thing- you lose it. Use it at a dramtically appropriate moment - you regain it at the end of the adventure. Use it at a moment when the whole adventure is hanging upon the roll- get it back, plus another one, at the end.

Example:
Using it to shoot a stupid green bounty hunter before he shoots you - you lose it.
Use it during a chase to loop a rope and grapple around a pipe on the first try - you get it back at the end.
Use it to make the one-in-a million shot to destroy the ultimate symbol of evil - You get it back, +1.

[GlenSmash!]

The best way of using Inspiration I've seen was a DM who had his player's put their Personality Traits, Ideals, Bonds, and Flaws on cards that they would physically lift up to show the DM when they we're being referenced.

For example, an Outlander Barbarian would charge into battle without thinking and show the card that says "There is no room for caution in a life lived to the fullest." The DM would award Inspiration for using his background, the player would spend it pretty much immediately and try to earn it again.

It cultivated a game where the players were trying to tailor their decisions to the background traits they had chosen (including some custom ones) to gain Inspiration and spend it for mechanical gain as much as possible.

It was a weirdly effective way of tying roleplaying to rollplaying :smalleek:

[mephnick]

The best way of using Inspiration I've seen was a DM who had his player's put their Personality Traits, Ideals, Bonds, and Flaws on cards that they would physically lift up to show the DM when they we're being referenced.

For example, an Outlander Barbarian would charge into battle without thinking and show the card that says "There is no room for caution in a life lived to the fullest." The DM would award Inspiration for using his background, the player would spend it pretty much immediately and try to earn it again.

It cultivated a game where the players were trying to tailor their decisions to the background traits they had chosen (including some custom ones) to gain Inspiration and spend it for mechanical gain as much as possible.

It was a weirdly effective way of tying roleplaying to rollplaying :smalleek:

My only problem with this (I did it this way) was that some traits are monumentally easier to call upon than others, so it became an actual mechanical decision which trait to choose..the opposite of the desired effect of backgrounds. The soldier that chose "I am stong and like breaking things" can gain advantage a hell of a lot easier than the artisan who that chose "I want to know how things work and what makes people tick." So you now have this struggle of "Do I take the trait that I actually want, or the one that offers me the most opportunities for a mechanical advantage?" Or the DM has to figure out when and where to balance giving out advantage himself..which means you might as well just grant it whenever like the default rule.

[Asmotherion]

If you want people to be excited about inspiration I think it could be good to instead of advantage on a roll have it allow a character to regain one long or short rest resource. Would be pretty epic at every level.

This can happen. I also allow them to be used for stuff like "Dramatic entry" (Player who is away from some scene, is allowed to metagame for this instance, and "happens" to end up there in a dramatic fashion of their choosing, 1d6 rounds after they use the dice). Other special effects can be discused and I work with the player to design something on the spot. It's basically my way to say "I trust you to change the outcome of the story significantly with this, in an interesting way".

[GlenSmash!]

My only problem with this (I did it this way) was that some traits are monumentally easier to call upon than others, so it became an actual mechanical decision which trait to choose..the opposite of the desired effect of backgrounds. The soldier that chose "I am stong and like breaking things" can gain advantage a hell of a lot easier than the artisan who that chose "I want to know how things work and what makes people tick." So you now have this struggle of "Do I take the trait that I actually want, or the one that offers me the most opportunities for a mechanical advantage?" Or the DM has to figure out when and where to balance giving out advantage himself..which means you might as well just grant it whenever like the default rule.

This is an excellent point.

My players will always pick which ever Trait seems most interesting to them but I don't have any power-gamers in the group.

[Theodoxus]

Puns are the pinnacle of humor. Only the weak-minded don't appreciate their awesome awfulness. :smallwink:

I'm having my players roll new characters for an interlude between Tomb of Annihilation and Tomb of Horrors (because I'm evil). They're currently deciding to all run different domain clerics. I casually mentioned that it might be taking place on the coast. One player got excited "ohh, we can be pirates!" I replied:

"Pirates of the Cleric Being"



My only problem with this (I did it this way) was that some traits are monumentally easier to call upon than others, so it became an actual mechanical decision which trait to choose..the opposite of the desired effect of backgrounds. The soldier that chose "I am stong and like breaking things" can gain advantage a hell of a lot easier than the artisan who that chose "I want to know how things work and what makes people tick." So you now have this struggle of "Do I take the trait that I actually want, or the one that offers me the most opportunities for a mechanical advantage?" Or the DM has to figure out when and where to balance giving out advantage himself..which means you might as well just grant it whenever like the default rule.

One way to avoid this, as long as it's expressed up front and agreed to - is to only allow a player to regain inspiration once everyone has gotten one. This would encourage group thinking outside the box. "Bob the artisan hasn't gotten Inspy get. Hmm... Hey Bob, check out this weird trap, can you figure out how it works?"

They might also peer over the characters background traits and figure out which ones might be easier to demonstrate.

[Finback]

I'll even say a monkey element is lacking.



I think this has gone beyond the original Scopes of the thread.



/mikedrop

[Kurt Kurageous]

For the Bardic version:
I place a physical die equal to the BI die I can add to a roll on the space for Inspiration on my character sheet. As something of a reminder to myself that O have it.


I physically place special junky old D20s in front of my players. It works.

[sophontteks]

Thats exactly it.
The backgrounds often put limits on a characters metagaming where they can't do the best action because its not what their character would do. Not all players are going to play like that, but those who do get a pretty solid reward for doing so. Those other players, envious of the actual roleplayer receiving a real mechanical advantage for his/her troubles, might take the hint and occasionally think about how their character would react.

It works great. My players love it. It helps them dig themselves out of the mess their characters get into just being themselves, allowing the characters to actually be themselves.

Just read the flaws and bonds of a players background and reward them when they stick to it.

[Tanarii]

The backgrounds often put limits on a characters metagaming where they can't do the best action because its not what their character would do.
Not doing something "because it's not what my character would do" is exactly metagaming, especially if you use the weird version RPGs use for the word.

Metagaming doesn't necessarily mean bad.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Not doing something "because it's not what my character would do" is exactly metagaming, especially if you use the weird version RPGs use for the word.

Metagaming doesn't necessarily mean bad.

Wait, what?

That's not the definition of metagaming I'm familiar with.

I've always used
Metagaming = using the knowledge that you're in a game to influence the character's course of action.

[Tanarii]

Wait, what?

That's not the definition of metagaming I'm familiar with.

I've always used
Metagaming = using the knowledge that you're in a game to influence the character's course of action.
And he's talking about using a game defined term (Personality, Ideal, Bond or Flaw) to change what he's doing, resulting in a mechanical bonus (Inspiration). That's your very definition of metagaming.

But even if you're not using a game defined thing and getting a mechanical bonus, you're still using the knowledge you're in a game, and your own made up game object that's not you ("my character") and changing what you would do based on it. Saying "my character wouldn't do that" is also by your definition metagaming. (Which is the typically weird RPG version of the word.)

Metagaming isn't even a problem until you make it one, and usually things people are trying to do to avoid it actually make it one.

[sophontteks]

I don't know what your talking about Tanarii, quite honestly.

If you are not roleplaying your character, you are metagaming. Inspiration is a great way to encourage roleplay and reward roleplay without in any way harming players who just aren't as into roleplay. The whole 5e schtick is that it is encouraging new players to get into the roleplaying experience through positive enforcement.

I can provide examples.
My party druid, who is attached to her grandpappys pelt, sees an enemy NPC wearing it, obviously as a means to goad her into action irrationally. She could decide to ignore the obvious ploy, but she doesn't. She plays out how her character would react, swearing and going berserk, forcing the party to restrain her. It was a good time and she got a point of inspiration for her excellent roleplaying.

Given how its written this is how inspiration is intended to be used and it works great in my opinion. I don't want my players to feel punished for roleplaying, I want them to enjoy it, and this mechanic really helps make it more enjoyable.

[Unoriginal]

Metagaming is the act of "gaming" what is beyond the game.

Getting inspiration because you are RPing your character isn't metagaming.

RPing your character because it can get you an inspiration as reward is arguably metagaming.


Reading the boss's stats in advance, concluding your PC needs an advantage to be efficient, and starting RPing because you think it'll give you an inspiration is definitively metagaming.

[Tanarii]

Given how its written this is how inspiration is intended to be used and it works great in my opinion. I don't want my players to feel punished for roleplaying, I want them to enjoy it, and this mechanic really helps make it more enjoyable.
I agree with all that.

With the caveat that you appear to be using "roleplaying" to mean making decisions in character, which IMO is a subset of all possible roleplaying. But that's my personal slightly bigger tent usage of the word. Your version is probably by far and large the second most common usage of the word, after "talking to NPCs".


I don't know what your talking about Tanarii, quite honestly.
This is pretty normal. The way I look at things is kinda weird sometimes. Just ignore my babbling on metagaming. If PheonixPhyre and Unoriginal aren't agreeing with me, it's probably nonsense. :smallbiggrin:

[sophontteks]

Best response ever award goes to Tanarii :smallbiggrin:

I understand that inspiration is a "your milage may very" kind of thing. I'm a green DM playing with all new players and its been an indespensible tool for me to help nudge them into the RP experience. They are trying to roleplay and a free dir is a real meaningful reward for their efforts.

Actually one of them is maybe too good. That Druid I mentioned is very in character. I come from the frame of mind "What could I expect the players to do." only to see the druid act entirely unlike how a player would. I had to work on the story a good bit to account for this and help bring her into the fold. She's hardcore.