What spell is your "Go To" spell and which "Never" works for you?

[MarkVIIIMarc]

I'm curious how many of the same spells will end up on both sides.

For me Phantasmal Force used to never work. Then it finally did and people are complaining its OP! So I'm not sure how to rank it.

My go to has to be "healing word". That darned Bonus Action Rise from the dead spell has done more good for our party over the sessions.

Bestow Curse I tossed last level. Having to go touch a bad guy just didn't seem right to my low strength Lore Bard.

[Laserlight]

for my wizard, the default is Fireball if I have a good mass target, otherwise Bless. I am notoriously unable to hit with Firebolt--from L6 to L10, I doubt if I've scored a hit with it more than 5 times.

[Ogre Mage]

Go to

Wizard/Sorcerer: shield, greater invisibility.
Cleric: bless.
Warlock: eldritch blast.

Never works: spiritual weapon. The enemy either dies or moves away or I miss and most of the time I never get any more than one or two hits in! I've never seen the spell be as useful as people claim it is.

[Cespenar]

Bless and Healing Word worked so much for me that they should have gotten a raise. Really, up to level 2 or 3, even. Haha, pun. :smalltongue:

On the other hand, Silence never really worked in my tables, despite the on-paper awesomeness. I guess we never ran into mages in really confined spaces, and DMs often just made mages get out of the area and cast their spells anyway.

[Avonar]

Currently, Shadow Blade is a good go to. A nice constant damage spell.

My never is Enemies Abound. I LOVE the idea of the spell but it has never, ever worked.

[Asmotherion]

My go-to is Eldritch Blast. Actually no. Hexed, Agonising Eldritch Blast (Which, is now known at my table as the "Double Damned Eldritch Blast"). It feels more or less like a weapon attack and a spell at the same time. And it's awesome. If I want it to "make a difference in power level", I augment it further by quicken spell, or other mechanics.

Alter Self gives huge utility in and out of combat as well. I love it for spying purposes.

Shield, when I need an AC boost. I keep my AC high enough to make Shield a panic button of virtual unvulnerability.

Counterspell and Dispell Magic for a complete pack of taking the upper hand in a Spellcasting Duel.

Finally, Bilnk and Mirror Image come in handy when I want to buff my defances even further.

The rest of my picks are usually thematic picks, such as Dragon's Breath, or Shadow Blade, depending on the character I build.

The "Never Works" trope is Disguise self, and depends on the DM. If a DM wants it to work, or interprets it as I do, it works just fine. If every single creature that sees you, rolls to inspect you, it obviously will fail. In my case, it has yet to prove useful, because the one time I had a DM who interprets it as I do, I already had access to Alter Self. So yeah.

I generally pick Spells and Cantrips that either optimise my chance of Success and/or Versality. So, if I try to pull something with Prestidigitation for example, and it backfires, I won't complain; It was something out of the Box I was experimenting with, not a part of the effect. On the other hand, if I see something and have no Idea about it's stats, I prefear to use my spell slots on things that will affect it (like Hex, obviously undead things excluded), rather than a Save or Suck thing that might do minimal damage for a single turn.

[Dr. Cliché]

Go to spells:
Druid: Primal Savagery*, Produce Flame, Healing Spirit, Healing Word, Conjure Animals
Warlock: Eldritch Blast, Hex
Sorcerer: Frostbite, Booming Blade*, Slow
Bard: Vicious Mockery, Animate Objects
Arcane Trickster: Booming Blade/GFB, Shadow Blade
Paladin: Bless, Shield of Faith, Aura of Vitality

*If I have the Mobile feat.


Spells which never work:
Ice Knife: Either no other enemies are in range of the 5ft AoE, or else at least one ally is in range. Usually the latter.
Slow: It's my go-to spell because it happens to be the only crowd-control spell that sorcerer has. However, so far it's been pretty lacklustre.
Heat Metal: Every time I pick this spell, it seems that I either fight no enemies using metal armour, or ones that aren't worth blowing the spell on.#
Darkness: Even when I'm using a Shadow Sorcerer or a Warlock with Devil's Sight, I find it incredibly difficult to use this without screwing my allies in the process.
Vampiric Touch: It's a spell I want to like, because I love the flavour and healing, but the damage is just so piddling.
Enervation: Barely more damage then Vampiric Touch, ends immediately if the enemy makes their first save and is 2 levels higher.
Insect Plague: The fact that it can't move really limits its usefulness.
All the 'Smite' spells: Maybe they're good for non-paladins, but they seem outright worse than a Paladin's normal Smite ability.

[ImproperJustice]

Go to:
Dispel Magic and Counterspell: deny enemy mages or clear obstacles. Always super useful.

Mage Hand: Once I have this, I use it for everything I can.
Sanctuary: Total Lifesaver

Never Work:
Disguise Self: the situation to use this NEVER comes up. When it does, it seems like there are better options.

[nickl_2000]

For my Moon Druid I have cast Detect Magic, Goodberry, and Guidance more than anything else.

As for Never works, conjure animals hasn't been all the great for me yet. Despite the 1 hour duration, I've had them dispelled within 1 round both times I've cast it. Although at least my raptor swarm hit to kill concentration during that 1 round and required the enemy use a third level spell slot to get rid of.

[MrStabby]

I find the smite spells interesting. They run the whole range between awesome and totally sucky.

My current favourite is wrathful smite. Wisdom save followed by wisdom checks can be pretty tough for a lot of bruisers to overcome. If they fail then you have pretty much controlled much of their movement and given them disadvantage all for a level 1 spell and a bonus action. Taking an enemy out of combat for two to three rounds for no actions (well maybe half an action if you count hitting them) is a great deal. Ensnaring strike is similar but I find a little weaker just because those enemies that can't do anything at range are those that tend to have high strength.

[DwarfDM]

Bugby's Hand, From large creature control (grapeling a dragon and pinning it to the ground) to defence and utility.

It's a larger and more usefull mage hand.

A wizard is always prepared.

Spells that never work: Counterspell, The enemy always counterspells my counterspell.

[MintyNinja]

Go to:

Sorcerer: Subtled Suggestion
Druid: Flaming Sphere
Cleric: Bless

Never Hits:

Cleric: Inflict Wounds
GM: Command

[BoxANT]

Arcane go to:
Cantrip: Shape Water (surprisingly useful)
1st: Shield
2nd: Misty Step
3rd: Counterspell
4th: Polymorph
5th: Animate Objects

Honorable Mention: Clairvoyance + Dimension Door

Divine go to:
Cantrip: Guidance
1st: Healing Word
2nd: Spiritual Weapon
3rd: Spirit Guardians
4th: Banishment
5th: Raise Dead

Honorable Mention: Bless


Never work?
Illusion spells, just don't like the DM dependency.

[EvilAnagram]

Tasha is my lady, and I love her dearly.

[Vorpalchicken]

Blink is my go to. It also is my "never works"

Well it works if I am unconscious, sitting on two failed death saves.

[ruy343]

My go-to spell is always Grease when playing a wizard. I just always find so many fun things to do with it...

I play to rarely these days that I don't have anything else to add to the conversation.

[bc56]

Primal Savagery!
Also shocking grasp!

[Miz_Liz]

My favorites tend to be concentration spells with bonus action movement. I nearly always play support, so being able to cast spiritual weapon/call lighting/ moonbeam/fireball, then use my standard for various other things is nice.

Also Healing word. Healing word is the best thing ever. My two piddly little healing words (level one bard dip) kept my party's fighter alive last session.

[Willie the Duck]

Never works: spiritual weapon. The enemy either dies or moves away or I miss and most of the time I never get any more than one or two hits in! I've never seen the spell be as useful as people claim it is.


Heat Metal: Every time I pick this spell, it seems that I either fight no enemies using metal armour, or ones that aren't worth blowing the spell on.#

These I find to be the case. Spirit Guardians too, tends to either get cast when it really isn't necessary, or held in reserve for the boss fight that doesn't come. Say what you will about fireball, but I've never met anyone who has the spell who ever didn't use it and use it often.

[KorvinStarmast]

Re: What spell is your "Go To" spell and which "Never" works for you?
For my first character (KorvinStarmast) it was Sacred Flame. Almost every time I cast it, the enemy seemed to make a save, so zero damage. I renamed it Profane Flame for the profanities it got me to utter when yet another monster saved versus that spell.

The Go To spell that never let me down: Healing Word. Teammate back in the fight, or able to get up and run like hell, just that quickly.

[Arkhios]

As much as I like Bless, for some reason I still prefer casting Divine Favor instead. I'd much rather have Bless cast on me by someone else.

PS. I play a Paladin with Dual Wielder, so the spells for both categories, for me, are a bit "simple" and perhaps even boring.

[Dys Dogeater]

I can't even really completely justify the why except that we usually play at low levels and I prefer to punch above my weightclass over extended skirmishes. I use Hex wayyyyyy too much.

[Sariel Vailo]

spell that i keep putting on my god forsaken lists that never works when i use it sleep

go to bard vicious mockery cure wounds
paladin any smite
wizard ice magics
sorcerer ice magics
haven't been a cleric

[Slayn82]

These I find to be the case. Spirit Guardians too, tends to either get cast when it really isn't necessary, or held in reserve for the boss fight that doesn't come. Say what you will about fireball, but I've never met anyone who has the spell who ever didn't use it and use it often.

Agreed. And I will add more. Lightning Bolt is totally overshadowed by Fireball. Even in previous editions, it's only role was to be a backup spell, to fight fire immune enemies or to hit one or two targets in a melee. In 5th, it's range was seriously nerfed, while both his and Fireball was boosted to deal 8d6 damage at lvl 5. So, overall, Fireball became even more the spell to go.

[NecessaryWeevil]

My wizard was in theory an illusionist, but after several nerfs to illusions (especially Phantasmal Force, which seemed to operate by different rules when cast by opponents), I came to love Wall of Force.

Currently playing a Celestial Warlock / Divine Soul Sorceror. Sanctuary --> Bless ---> Healing Word is emerging as a standard tactic.

[Kane0]

Beyond cantrips, my go-to spells are Bless and Thunderwave until I graduate to Fireball.
Hold Person is the one that never sticks for me, but for some reason I just can't give it up.

[Samayu]

Suggestion has always been one of my favorites, but I haven't had any luck with it lately. Maybe because I'm now high enough level that I have better things to do. Same for Hypnotic Pattern.

Last week we were fighting cloud giants, so none of my WIS-save spells would work, and they kept saving versus my fireballs!

[Sicarius Victis]

My go-to spells depend on my character type:
Gish: Hex, Shield, BB/GFB, whatever Smite seems most appropriate
Pure Mage: Suggestion, Phantasmal Force, Bigby's Hand

Sadly, though, I only rarely play spellcasters in the first place, so I don't often get the chance to use them.

Favourite spell altogether: Illusory Dragon. Enough said.

[Chugger]

Not go-to but I often pick minor illusion or silent illusion. And almost all DMs I work with never let them amount to anything.

The action economy is such that illusions almost never work or are worthwhile in combat - but even if I were to say create the silent illusion of a tiger wearing a necklace (hm it must be a druid maybe) that stalks in the shadows as if going to make a flank attack - my jerk DMs meta-game it and have all their badguys "know" it's an illusion, and I've wasted a round and a slot. So screw illusions. And screw DMs who meta too much.

[Dudewithknives]

Go to is either Dissonant Whispers or Green Flame Blade depending on class.

Never works is easy: Hold Person. 3.5, pathfinder, 5e, I can never pull it off.

[Wisefool]

Go to:
Goodberry- I get 1/day w/ MI feat and use it everyday to give the party a backup to revive KO'd players or a little healing at day's end.
Guidance/Light- super utility cantrips

Never:
Healing Word- between only having 2 spell slots from my dip and Goodberry being a HW substitute, I prefer to reserve healing for Cure Wounds
Frostbite- it never hit once so when I took my cleric dip, Sacred Flame took over its role. I love Frostbite's rider, but the CON save proved too big a hurdle.
Faerie Fire- another spell I love the idea, but it doesn't play well in my group. Our DM is loose w/ adv from flanking, so FF is more likely to help enemies than allies.

[Afrodactyl]

For my warlock in the last homebrew campaign we did, Arms of Hadar put in some serious work. Was devastating for killing off mooks and softening the BBEG when the time came. Granted, it was a lower level game, but still.

As for the spell that never worked? Fireball. Regardless of what I'm using, I can never roll a decent damage number, and the targets always makes their saves.

[KillingTime]

Go-to
Healing word - bonus action "get up!". Yes please!
Also I love dissonant whispers. Decent damage and a great rider.

Never works
Well - not so much never works, as never quite as useful as I think it should be:
Minor Illusion
I get creative with this spell a lot, but either enemies pass their Int checks, or the DM thinks of a perfectly reasonable reason that the NPCs are not as affected by it as I hoped they would be.
Still fun, but never as awesome as I imagine it's going to be while I'm casting the spell.

[Vorpal Crowbar]

go to:
cantrips: Shape Water, Mold Earth, Toll the Dead
1st: Find Familiar
2nd Suggestion
3rd: Animate Dead
4th: Summon Greater Demon

All of the above are extremely versatile in uses (except toll the dead)

Never Works for me: Darkness, Fog Cloud

VC

[Aaron Underhand]

Go-to spell: magic missile. It's on my bard /wizard, and on my arcana cleric. When they're resistant, in cover, high ac, close to death, and you absolutely need to hit, also if you have a charmed teammate to rouse...

My never spell is Heroism. Knew it for three levels, never cast it....

[Ellisthion]

Go-to: Prestidigitation. I also tend to use Sending a lot.

Never works: Feather Fall. I spend a lot of time with it prepared "just in case" but have almost never cast it, and I don't think I've ever cast it in a legitimate non-stupid situation.

[Baad007]

Go to: Spiritual Weapon, Spiritual Guardians
Never Works: Command, Guiding Bolt

[jaappleton]

I find the smite spells interesting. They run the whole range between awesome and totally sucky.

My current favourite is wrathful smite. Wisdom save followed by wisdom checks can be pretty tough for a lot of bruisers to overcome. If they fail then you have pretty much controlled much of their movement and given them disadvantage all for a level 1 spell and a bonus action. Taking an enemy out of combat for two to three rounds for no actions (well maybe half an action if you count hitting them) is a great deal. Ensnaring strike is similar but I find a little weaker just because those enemies that can't do anything at range are those that tend to have high strength.

I do believe you’re wrong about Wrathful Smite. It’s even better than you think;

It forces a Wisdom CHECK. Meaning no enemy gets to add their proficiency if they have it in Wisdom saves, and as a check, they perform it with Disadvantage due to the effect imposed by Wrathful Smite itself.

[nakajima]

If I had choose one, my "Go To" -spell would have to be Witch Bolt. I really like the fact that once you hit, you can just automatically deal 1d12 damage to the enemy on your turn as long as you concentrate on it. That way you can still feel useful without risking blowing one of your spell slots on a failed attack roll. Of course, as I am currently playing a relatively low level wizard, I do tend to blast my enemies with Magic Missile quite often.

Somewhat paradoxically, the spell that never works for me is also Witch Bolt. I fail my attack roll so often it almost feels like Beshaba herself is meddling with my rolls. :smallannoyed:

[Vingelot]

Go to: Minor Illusion. Fireball also produces nice results.

Useful in theory, but never works (well enough to be worth preparing): Sleep

[white lancer]

Go to: Tasha's Hideous Laughter and Suggestion. Thus far, I don't think anyone has saved from them for me, and they've been brutally effective (strangely, they always seem to save from Dissonant Whispers...which is a trade-off I'll accept!).

Never works: I upcast Sleep in my last session against a group of enemies that included one wounded, rolled reasonably well, and still failed to get anything to work. Oh well, I guess it's probably worse when we have a large group and the enemies are bound to have more HP. Other than that, Silence has been worthless so far (haven't had the occasions where it's useful come up), and Blindness/Deafness hasn't ever seemed worth casting (because based off our enemies, it never seems better to target CON over WIS saves).

[Magic Myrmidon]

My go-to typically depends on the character, but I've always been fond of haste and polymorph.

As for spells that never work for me, Fog Cloud. I always manage to hinder out party more than the enemy.

[odigity]

If I had choose one, my "Go To" -spell would have to be Witch Bolt. I really like the fact that once you hit, you can just automatically deal 1d12 damage to the enemy on your turn as long as you concentrate on it. That way you can still feel useful without risking blowing one of your spell slots on a failed attack roll. Of course, as I am currently playing a relatively low level wizard, I do tend to blast my enemies with Magic Missile quite often.

Somewhat paradoxically, the spell that never works for me is also Witch Bolt. I fail my attack roll so often it almost feels like Beshaba herself is meddling with my rolls. :smallannoyed:

Witch Bolt is universally agreed to be one of the worst attack spells in 5e.

[EvilAnagram]

Witch Bolt is universally agreed to be one of the worst attack spells in 5e.

If he has fun getting 3d12 out of a first-level spell, more power to him. No reason to dump on his fun.

[Clone]

My personal Go-to spells are Alter Self, Scorching Ray, Shatter and Blur.
While I haven't played much mid tier D&D, only DMed, Wall of Fire and Conjuring spells are potent and work wonders.

Through all the games I've played and DMed Scorching Ray, Shatter, Healing Word and Phantasmal Force are the most popular.
There isn't a single spellcaster I've played with who hasn't picked at least one of these.
Both myself and another DM I rotate with for different campaigns operate under a similar mindset. The "why would they try see through your illusion if they have no reason to be suspicious" mindset, so illusion spells are strong if used creatively enough.
They often become a group act, performing various actions to grant bonuses or to make the illusions more believable. Always so fun.

Crown of Madness and the lower level Wall spells, such as Sand and Water, are generally underwhelming I find.
Bane is another, but I haven't seen it used much so I can't comment too much.

[PhoenixPhyre]

Never works: sacred flame. I've missed *mushrooms* with it. Immobile mushrooms. Stupid dice...

[Tanarii]

Illusions for both. Not just in 5e either. Or even just D&D. It's common for DMs to have no idea how to handle illusions, so they either allow anything or shut everything down.

[History_buff]

Go-To spells

-Shield for obvious reasons
-absorb elements also obvious reasons
-dissonant whispers
-hold person (managed to have it stick for 3 rounds on a cleric boss type with a dc 15 definitely avoided death because of that I have good luck with it)
-invisibility
-dimension door (great for noping out or getting where you need to be in a hurry)
-Healing word (get up we got fighting to do)


Never works the way you’d hoped
-Spirit guardians ( Great spell but issues keeping concentration just rolled terribly)
-Geas (took it once turns out putting it on a sufficiently strong evil npc just hurt him bad and then he got it purged from him by his boss... fake surrendering coward *grumble grumble”
-blink (half the time getting hit could be all the time)

[nakajima]

Witch Bolt is universally agreed to be one of the worst attack spells in 5e.

I am very well aware of that. However, I honestly couldn't care less about which spells are actually good and which are not, or about optimization. That's not why I play D&D. I do realize that that is exactly what some people enjoy the most about the game and that's perfectly fine. It just isn't what I personally enjoy. The reason why I use Witch Bolt is because I find the idea of zapping my enemies with magical electricity to be fun and for the fact that I don't need to roll on my following turns as long as I concentrate.

[Arkhios]

I am very well aware of that. However, I honestly couldn't care less about which spells are actually good and which are not, or about optimization. That's not why I play D&D. I do realize that that is exactly what some people enjoy the most about the game and that's perfectly fine. It just isn't what I personally enjoy. The reason why I use Witch Bolt is because I find the idea of zapping my enemies with magical electricity to be fun and for the fact that I don't need to roll on my following turns as long as I concentrate.

That is strictly speaking not the entirety of it. You also need to expend your Action every turn to deal the damage, even though you don't have to make an attack roll. Unless you get an Extra Action elsewhere, you only have one on every single turn. That's a rather steep price, even if you weren't interested in optimal play.

That said, if you're fine with that, good for you :)

[mephnick]

Go To:

Hypnotic Pattern - it ends combats
Black Tentacles - I've had this shut down so many enemies it's ridiculous


Never works:

Hold Person - Maybe my DMs fudge it because they don't like losing their big enemy, but I've never had it land in an important situation. I stopped prepping it.
Guiding Bolt - I just never hit with it.
Augury - Even as a DM I don't understand how to use this spell. How the **** should I know if something is going to work or not? My groups defy the odds constantly.

[Willie the Duck]

Augury - Even as a DM I don't understand how to use this spell. How the **** should I know if something is going to work or not? My groups defy the odds constantly.

Then the spell should indicate if the odds are with them or against them, and nothing more or less.

[mephnick]

Then the spell should indicate if the odds are with them or against them, and nothing more or less.

Sure, that's generally how I run it. But it seems like a pretty useless spell none the less.

"This will succeed unless it doesn't." Thanks!

[Spore]

Darkness never works for me. I have seen its praises sung among many a class guides in most guides because it makes enemies "blind". However often the enemy has darkvision while my most crucial allies do not. And somehow I have never precast Darkvision on them if there happens to be a combat where Darkness would work great.

In the past editions I was always about that Summon Monster x including Fiendish T-Rexes, Lantern Archons (long range touch attack ignore damage reduction is nice) or even casting summons such as a Ghaele.

In 5th edition, I haven't played many casters yet but Light is always a cornerstone for anyone with no hands to hold a torch and unable to see in dark dungeons. Detect Magic spam is gone but the spell is still a vital part of many situations. As is Protection from Evil (and Good for some reason). Another spell that is advised against often but works most of the time is Hold Person.

[Willie the Duck]

Sure, that's generally how I run it. But it seems like a pretty useless spell none the less.

"This will succeed unless it doesn't." Thanks!

I guess. It's an end-run around things you don't know (and often don't even know you don't know). That's always either going to be the most powerful thing possible, or completely useless.

[odigity]

I am very well aware of that. However, I honestly couldn't care less about which spells are actually good and which are not, or about optimization. That's not why I play D&D. I do realize that that is exactly what some people enjoy the most about the game and that's perfectly fine. It just isn't what I personally enjoy. The reason why I use Witch Bolt is because I find the idea of zapping my enemies with magical electricity to be fun and for the fact that I don't need to roll on my following turns as long as I concentrate.

You may not personally care about optimization, but unless your character is suicidal, your character *does*, as does the rest of your party, who presumably also want to survive. Your character lives in the world of D&D physics, and unless the entire party is mentally handicapped, they'll eventually notice your character's tactical decisions are obviously suboptimal, and therefore putting the entire party in danger.

Trying to put me down to feel good about yourself by saying "I'm a roleplayer, I don't care about optimization" is as gross an oversimplification as those who do nothing but min/max with no regard for theme or flavor.

Also, reiterating the fact that you're free to do whatever you want is redundant, and just a manipulative way of shutting down conversation. This is a discussion forum. The whole point is to exchange words on a topic. I offered you what I thought was valuable information in case you didn't already have it, because that's the point of posting your thoughts in public, rather than keeping them in your head.

It's not like I threatened to physically come over and force you to play the way I think you should. Your personal freedom is a silent given.

[Telwar]

For my wu jen mystic:

Go-to:
Psychic Crush - AOE stun? Int save? Yes, please. The first big fight I was in, this saved our asses.
Wind Form and Cloak of Air - This is my psionic mastery combo; disadvantage on all attacks and flight for 10 minutes and shares concentration is very handy.

Never:
Radiant Beam - No target has ever failed its save. This is annoying. I'm probably going to retrain out the discipline soon.

[EvilAnagram]

Darkness never works for me. I have seen its praises sung among many a class guides in most guides because it makes enemies "blind". However often the enemy has darkvision while my most crucial allies do not. And somehow I have never precast Darkvision on them if there happens to be a combat where Darkness would work great.
Darkvision cannot pierce magical darkness as per the Darkness spell.

[History_buff]

Darkness never works for me. I have seen its praises sung among many a class guides in most guides because it makes enemies "blind". However often the enemy has darkvision while my most crucial allies do not. And somehow I have never precast Darkvision on them if there happens to be a combat where Darkness would work great.




Darkvision doesn’t let you see through the darkness spell.

The darkness spell is not your everyday ordinary darkness. It’s advanced darkness. It’s magical.

[nakajima]

You may not personally care about optimization, but unless your character is suicidal, your character *does*, as does the rest of your party, who presumably also want to survive. Your character lives in the world of D&D physics, and unless the entire party is mentally handicapped, they'll eventually notice your character's tactical decisions are obviously suboptimal, and therefore putting the entire party in danger.

Trying to put me down to feel good about yourself by saying "I'm a roleplayer, I don't care about optimization" is as gross an oversimplification as those who do nothing but min/max with no regard for theme or flavor.

Also, reiterating the fact that you're free to do whatever you want is redundant, and just a manipulative way of shutting down conversation. This is a discussion forum. The whole point is to exchange words on a topic. I offered you what I thought was valuable information in case you didn't already have it, because that's the point of posting your thoughts in public, rather than keeping them in your head.

It's not like I threatened to physically come over and force you to play the way I think you should. Your personal freedom is a silent given.

I apologize if I offended you in anyway. It wasn't my intention to put you down or anything of the sort. I also did not try to shut down the conversation. I appreciate you pointing out something that is, as you said, valuable information. My response was, at least in my opinion, appropriate as I was merely trying to explain the reasoning behind my sub-optimal decisions.

However, I would like to point out that in my post, I never tried to justify my poor choices by saying "I'm a roleplayer". I just make choices based on what I find the most fun. Also, your first point is quite nonsensical. My character wouldn't think about the most optimal approach to killing his enemies, as most real people wouldn't. If he is able to shoot lightning from his fingertips, why wouldn't he see that as a more than valid option in a fight?

Anyway, I don't want to argue about something so insignificant. I genuinely wish you have a nice weekend and a pleasant Easter in case you take part in such celebrations.


...You also need to expend your Action every turn to deal the damage, even though you don't have to make an attack roll. Unless you get an Extra Action elsewhere, you only have one on every single turn. That's a rather steep price, even if you weren't interested in optimal play.

Oh, right, sorry. I am aware of that, both how the spell works and the fact that it is quite expensive, but I just completely forgot to mention it. Thank you for bringing it up.

[Tanarii]

Augury - Even as a DM I don't understand how to use this spell. How the **** should I know if something is going to work or not? My groups defy the odds constantly.Augury is one of the best low level spells in the game.

It's invaluable for determine when it would stupid to enter an open green demon face, open a chest, walk down an apparently trap free hallway to grab the gold idol at the end of it, or if your plan to quickly swap the idol for a bag of sand will work. And what will happen if you push the big red button marked DO NOT PUSH and this means you stupid! in smaller print*.

It's also very useful for determining when a combat will be significantly beyond Deadly, especially in a combat as war game.

It might even, depending on how generous the DM interprets the action within 30 minutes rule, warn you when you're going to make a choice that will eventually result in you having to do considerably more than an adventuring day's worth of encounters.


*personally, I'd expect most players to elect to push this button. I'm not sure that a Woe Augury would really make a difference. :smallamused:

[EvilAnagram]

I apologize if I offended you in anyway. It wasn't my intention to put you down or anything of the sort. I also did not try to shut down the conversation. I appreciate you pointing out something that is, as you said, valuable information. My response was, at least in my opinion, appropriate as I was merely trying to explain the reasoning behind my sub-optimal decisions.

However, I would like to point out that in my post, I never tried to justify my poor choices by saying "I'm a roleplayer". I just make choices based on what I find the most fun. Also, your first point is quite nonsensical. My character wouldn't think about the most optimal approach to killing his enemies, as most real people wouldn't. If he is able to shoot lightning from his fingertips, why wouldn't he see that as a more than valid option in a fight?

Anyway, I don't want to argue about something so insignificant. I genuinely wish you have a nice weekend and a pleasant Easter in case you take part in such celebrations.



Oh, right, sorry. I am aware of that, both how the spell works and the fact that it is quite expensive, but I just completely forgot to mention it. Thank you for bringing it up.

Are you saying that you make choices based on the things you like instead of doing whatever people on the internet say to do? Madness!

[Quoxis]

Spells that never work: Counterspell, The enemy always counterspells my counterspell.

How? That only works if you’re up against two spellcasters at the same time or the opponent only uses cantrips as far as i understand the rules, because on the same turn you can only use one leveled spell (even if one of them is cast as a bonus action or reaction). And counterspelling a cantrip doesn’t really seem to be worth the effort.

[Tanarii]

How? That only works if you’re up against two spellcasters at the same time or the opponent only uses cantrips as far as i understand the rules, because on the same turn you can only use one leveled spell (even if one of them is cast as a bonus action or reaction). And counterspelling a cantrip doesn’t really seem to be worth the effort.
Because there is no restriction on using two leveled spells on your turn.

Only that if you use a bonus action spell, you cannot cast a leveled spell with your action or reaction on your turn.
(Edit: it is actually worded if you can a bonus action spell, "you can’t cast another spell during the same turn, except for a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action.")

So unless the enemy cast a bonus action spell and you're countering it, no problem. They are free to use their reaction to counterspell.

[Quoxis]

Because there is no restriction on using two leveled spells on your turn.

Only that if you use a bonus action spell, you cannot cast a leveled spell with your action or reaction on your turn.
(Edit: it is actually worded if you can a bonus action spell, "you can’t cast another spell during the same turn, except for a cantrip with a casting time of 1 action.")

So unless the enemy cast a bonus action spell and you're countering it, no problem. They are free to use their reaction to counterspell.

I thought the rule you quoted applies to reaction spells as well, but after rereading the spells section i stand corrected. Counterspell just lost a whole lot of usefulness (against other casters that have it on their list, that is).

[EvilAnagram]

I thought the rule you quoted applies to reaction spells as well, but after rereading the spells section i stand corrected. Counterspell just lost a whole lot of usefulness (against other casters that have it on their list, that is).

There were two Counterspelling casters in my party for one campaign. The final battle was a mess of reactions.

[Quoxis]

There were two Counterspelling casters in my party for one campaign. The final battle was a mess of reactions.

I imagine counter counter counter counter counters, like those russian doll in a doll in a doll things.

[Spore]

There were two Counterspelling casters in my party for one campaign. The final battle was a mess of reactions.

Villain: I cast Magic Jar, possessing your fighter and ending your lives once and for all!
Fighter: Fool! you have activated my trap bard! By using his reaction and paying a third level spell slot I cancel out the effect of your spell.
*Bard jumps up from face down position for dramatic effect*
Villain: Aha! Now I have you just where I want you. Your counterspell activates my cabalist leader and second in command. Cast counterspell, too, devoted minion!
*Cabalist Leader flicks his cape away, revealing his divine focus*
Fighter: But have you considered my other faithful friend, the black magician!
Wizard: Do you always have to announce my skin color? People see I am drow. No need to point it out every 6 seconds.

[EvilAnagram]

Villain: I cast Magic Jar, possessing your fighter and ending your lives once and for all!
Fighter: Fool! you have activated my trap bard! By using his reaction and paying a third level spell slot I cancel out the effect of your spell.
*Bard jumps up from face down position for dramatic effect*
Villain: Aha! Now I have you just where I want you. Your counterspell activates my cabalist leader and second in command. Cast counterspell, too, devoted minion!
*Cabalist Leader flicks his cape away, revealing his divine focus*
Fighter: But have you considered my other faithful friend, the black magician!
Wizard: Do you always have to announce my skin color? People see I am drow. No need to point it out every 6 seconds.


Gods damn. This is exactly what happened.

[Quoxis]

Villain: I cast Magic Jar, possessing your fighter and ending your lives once and for all!
Fighter: Fool! you have activated my trap bard! By using his reaction and paying a third level spell slot I cancel out the effect of your spell.
*Bard jumps up from face down position for dramatic effect*
Villain: Aha! Now I have you just where I want you. Your counterspell activates my cabalist leader and second in command. Cast counterspell, too, devoted minion!
*Cabalist Leader flicks his cape away, revealing his divine focus*
Fighter: But have you considered my other faithful friend, the black magician!
Wizard: Do you always have to announce my skin color? People see I am drow. No need to point it out every 6 seconds.


Hats off for the Yu-Gi-Oh! references, haven’t had a laugh like that in a while.

[Beelzebubba]

Sure, that's generally how I run it. But it seems like a pretty useless spell none the less.

"This will succeed unless it doesn't." Thanks!

I think it means more if you're in a sandbox or other campaign style where the DCs of the encounters can vary a lot more than the vanilla D&D 5e seems to aim towards.

[Beelzebubba]

Go to:
Entangle, Guidance, Misty Step.

Never works:
Flaming Sphere (it's hard to force AoOs if you don't have many party members in the front line), Hold Person ("They made their save"), Fog Cloud (it's still too situational).

[Potato_Priest]

Go to: Prestidigitation
My characters seem to have an uncanny magnetic attraction to latrines, so being able to clean onesself magically is a real life saver.

Go to: Zone of Truth
I've never met a DM who didn't love their dishonest NPCs, but this combined with a handy little thing called torture makes getting the truth out of them finally a possibility.

Go to: Thorn Whip
Before I played a druid I always thought this spell was lame, but it really dominates in a lot of environments where there's some vertical aspect to the battlefield. I particularly enjoy whipping archers off castle walls from below.

Never works: Dispel Magic.
For some reason, I always roll really poorly with this spell. Combine that with the fact that all the PlotTM brand magics are apparently 9th level (or just straight up immune to dispelling), and this ends up being pretty useless.

[Tanarii]

Never works:
Flaming Sphere (it's hard to force AoOs if you don't have many party members in the front line)This one is a never works for many of my Wizards. At least, the way they want it to work. They just don't seem to "get" that it doesn't burn creatures that go through the adjacent squares. That anyone can walk past it as long as they don't stop next to it. ie end their turn next to it.

It often primarily ends up being a 2d6 bonus action. That's still good use of the spell of course, but they are often salty about it anyway.

[Beelzebubba]

This one is a never works for many of my Wizards. At least, the way they want it to work. They just don't seem to "get" that it doesn't burn creatures that go through the adjacent squares. That anyone can walk past it as long as they don't stop next to it. ie end their turn next to it.

It often primarily ends up being a 2d6 bonus action. That's still good use of the spell of course, but they are often salty about it anyway.

Yeah, I'm a bit salty about it too. Ideally, it should be 2d6 that bonus action... +2d6 if they don't move, OR forcing them to move triggering an AoO for someone else in the party. If our table ran 5-6 players per game I think it would work more often, since you can then actually have two players in front and come in from behind with the sphere to make a triangle. The only thing that would otherwise work is to toss it behind a monster caught in a door or other chokepoint.

I'm usually way better off doing an Entangle / Faerie Fire and an Ice Knife instead.

[th3g0dc0mp13x]

This one is a never works for many of my Wizards. At least, the way they want it to work. They just don't seem to "get" that it doesn't burn creatures that go through the adjacent squares. That anyone can walk past it as long as they don't stop next to it. ie end their turn next to it.

It often primarily ends up being a 2d6 bonus action. That's still good use of the spell of course, but they are often salty about it anyway.

I've been using it as primarily as a minor controller, i.e. you can't stand there back up and let the fighter get an AoO. Or strafe the fighter and let the Bear get an AoO.

I haven't been playing very long but my go to spells have been entangle, spike growth and flaming sphere.

My never works is Faerie Fire. And to a lesser extent flaming sphere. As a blind* human my DM has made me roll to see if I pushed the thing near them and then they get the saving throw.

*=Lack of darkvision

[Tanarii]

And to a lesser extent flaming sphere. As a blind* human my DM has made me roll to see if I pushed the thing near them and then they get the saving throw.

*=Lack of darkvision
How ... why ... flaming sphere creates light! :smallconfused:

[th3g0dc0mp13x]

How ... why ... flaming sphere creates light! :smallconfused:

I was mildly frustrated with that as well, Essentially I went from blind to bright ball of fire in front of me and then shoved it at them. Basically I was blinded or just off put by the amount of difference in light levels.

This is the first campaign where she is DMing so there have been a lot of odd calls that have screwed me over but I'm still having fun.

[Kenny Snoggins]

Augury is one of the best low level spells in the game.



I'm looking forward to using it. I picked it up in my book of magic secrets but haven't gotten the chance to use it yet.

Go To
(I have a hexblade 3 / lorebard 6 PC)

Darkness-- Great with Devil's Sight. I have Elvish Accuracy, so once you put the Hexblade's curse on someone, in darkness your crit chance becomes something like 27.5% per proc. It's like 90% of greater invisibility's utility in a second level spell, of which I have 2 slots that I get back every short rest. It's better than greater invsibility in some ways, since if you have a shadow sorcereror of a few other builds, they can also benefit from it and you all hang out in the darkness bubble, crit fishing and nuking people. Since I have find familiar from Book of Secrets, I can cast Darkness on a coin, give it to my Bat Familiar, and have the bat fly up above my head and reduce the effective radius of the darkness at ground level, if we are in tight quarters and it would gimp the party too badly. Generally doesn't come up but nice to have. I have a mantle of spell protection as well, so the interaction between darkness and the mantle makes my PC pretty difficult to deal with for enemy casters. Regular attack roles have disadvantage due to darkness, and saving throw spells have disadvantage due to the mantle.

Thorn Whip-- I love this spell for it's ability to make people take falling/environmental damage. It pairs great with Spirit Guardians to bring a guy into the range of spirit guardians and make the cantrip 2D6 + 3d8 (at my current level). I have a couple instant-kills with it from pulling a guy off a tall place and splatting them. If you have a flying mount or a fly speed, then picking up and dropping a guy is another way to boost the damage a little. I got this as one of my Book of Secrets cantrips.

Toll the Dead / Eldritch blasts are my go-too damage dealers. Which to use depends on it I have advantage or not.

Spirit Guardians is ace. Being a Hexblade/Lore Bard I have enough resilience to hang close to but behind the martials without immediately getting wasted if somebody leaks through. The slowing effect can lead to a lot of baddies piling up in tight formation in front of the martials, and then subsequently getting vaporized by the sorcereror. It also makes penetrating into the backline difficult. Flavor wise I like thinking about the bard whistling, then all these little terrifying spirits popping up and out of his pockets and the folds of his cape or the sound box of the lute, etc.

Spiritual Weapon-- I love this spell, although I'm usually torn between boosting it with Hex and boosting it with Darkness. Generally it seems that Hex does more damage. Boosted with Hex it does... OK damage, especially for a bonus action. Getting essentially 3 attacks (two eldritch blasts and one spiritual weapon) out of a full caster feels nice, it feels like I'm actually contributing something. (along with moving my death bubbles around and spending reactions to reduce incoming damage)

Not So Great

Vicious Mockery-- I keep this on the list because hey, I'm a bard, but this spell sucks. It targets Wisdom, which usually isn't a dump stat for monsters, does virtually no damage, then only debuffs one attack. If it also had a social use, maybe, or if it targeted Charisma and had some other effect. I don't know. Super lame spell.

Hypnotic Pattern-- I've used this a few times, and it's OK, but I feel like it sort of takes the fun out of the engagement, or it just eats a single attack from each guy in range (as they use the other attack to wake up people, admittedly maybe causing damage). Just telling the DM to put all his toys down and let the fighters and barbarians and paladins brutalize them seems kinda lame.

I'm looking forward to find greater steed :) Hex giving disadvantage on strength or dex checks, then grabbing a guy (with my expertise athletics) while the griffon dashes straight up (so like... 80 feet?) then drop the bad guy on another bad guy. "Bard! From the Top Rope with the Griffon Powered Brain Basher!"