Healing Spirit + Life Cleric

[nickl_2000]

Has there been any official ruling for the use of Healing Spirit with a Life Cleric's Disciple of Life ability? Will it give each heal 1d6+4?

[Aett_Thorn]

It should work fine. Since Life Cleric's ability just says when you "use a spell" and not "cast a spell".

[Naanomi]

I let it work, hasn’t been super broken yet

[JackOfAllBuilds]

It worked with concentration heals like Aura of Vitality on life Cleric/lore Bards

[Belier]

This work with goodberries so good with it

[MaxWilson]

This work with goodberries so good with it

It doesn't work with Goodberry. Goodberry is a spell with instantaneous duration which creates berries. When you cast Goodberry, you're not healing people with a spell any more than Animate Dead constitutes killing people with a spell.

(Yes, I'm aware of Crawford's opinion on this, but he's clearly wrong unless/until the printed rules for Disciple of Life are changed in a PHB rewrite.)

[Belier]

It doesn't work with Goodberry. Goodberry is a spell with instantaneous duration which creates berries. When you cast Goodberry, you're not healing people with a spell any more than Animate Dead constitutes killing people with a spell.

(Yes, I'm aware of Crawford's opinion on this, but he's clearly wrong unless/until the printed rules for Disciple of Life are changed in a PHB rewrite.)

Lol wich is why I say crawford is very picky on raw versus intents in my rant last day

[furby076]

It doesn't work with Goodberry. Goodberry is a spell with instantaneous duration which creates berries. When you cast Goodberry, you're not healing people with a spell any more than Animate Dead constitutes killing people with a spell.

(Yes, I'm aware of Crawford's opinion on this, but he's clearly wrong unless/until the printed rules for Disciple of Life are changed in a PHB rewrite.)

pretty sure Crawfords words are considered accepted rules. Does he make mistakes, sure everyone does...and so does the PHB. If you are using PHB to override Crawfords later adjustments, then you are using a lot of messed up things.

i dont always agree with Crawford, but his words are official, our words are homebrew

[MaxWilson]

pretty sure Crawfords words are considered accepted rules.

By whom?


Does he make mistakes, sure everyone does...and so does the PHB. If you are using PHB to override Crawfords later adjustments, then you are using a lot of messed up things.

i dont always agree with Crawford, but his words are official, our words are homebrew

When players show up to play D&D (5E) with their PHB, there's value in adhering to the rules of the game they expected to be playing. That means following the PHB unless you have a good reason not to.

There's no such value in following the words that JeremyCrawford once tweeted on his Twitter account.

[MrStabby]

pretty sure Crawfords words are considered accepted rules. Does he make mistakes, sure everyone does...and so does the PHB. If you are using PHB to override Crawfords later adjustments, then you are using a lot of messed up things.

i dont always agree with Crawford, but his words are official, our words are homebrew

Nope. Actual rules are "accepted rules". Handbook and errata. If he has the option to include stuff in an erratum and declines to do so, that is pretty indicative. Else he is just a guy on the internet. Sure he has played a lot of D&D and may have a good idea on what rulings are fun and his advice on what rulings to make may be be useful to a lot of tables, but certainly would not say there is any consensus that they are "accepted rules".

[Asmotherion]

It doesn't work with Goodberry. Goodberry is a spell with instantaneous duration which creates berries. When you cast Goodberry, you're not healing people with a spell any more than Animate Dead constitutes killing people with a spell.

(Yes, I'm aware of Crawford's opinion on this, but he's clearly wrong unless/until the printed rules for Disciple of Life are changed in a PHB rewrite.)

So, you're going to argue against something that has builds made around it, one of the creators saying it works as it does, just because you what, don't like it's unclearity in RAW I presume?

The most logical rule is, depends on the DM and Table. RAI suggests it Works and RAW is clearly unclear on the matter. If someone wants to go for something like Goodberies and Life Cleric, best ask how your DM interprets it First. Simple as that.

And it's not like it's Crazy Broken either. Just good enough to provide some interesting healing, equivalent to a stash of minor Healing potions (each requiring Actions to Consume, thus preferably out of combat).

[nickl_2000]

My DM houseruled this one. Said 40 HP healing for 1 first level spell was to much. His agreement was that it would give you 3 extra goodberries. So when you cast it you get 13 goodberries instead of 10. Seems like a decent compromise in my opinion if you think 4 HP per goodberry is to much.

[Belier]

My DM houseruled this one. Said 40 HP healing for 1 first level spell was to much. His agreement was that it would give you 3 extra goodberries. So when you cast it you get 13 goodberries instead of 10. Seems like a decent compromise in my opinion if you think 4 HP per goodberry is to much.

The thing is it's not suppose to make extra objects appears.

When a pc eat a berry, you really did use a level 1 spell to heal them, making it 4 hp. If you make it with a level 2 cast it even let the spell gain efficiency scaling as now jt is able to heal for 1 + 2 + 2 per berry and so on with higher level of casting. That is funny for a spell that is not supposed to be scaling. And since the duration is 24 hours, a player presenting to the campaing after a downtime could say, before I went to rest I casted all my slots on good berries and show on with a houndred berries at the start of the campaing.

[nickl_2000]

The thing is it's not suppose to make extra objects appears.

When a pc eat a berry, you really did use a level 1 spell to heal them, making it 4 hp. If you make it with a level 2 cast it even let the spell gain efficiency scaling as now jt is able to heal for 1 + 2 + 2 per berry and so on with higher level of casting. That is funny for a spell that is not supposed to be scaling. And since the duration is 24 hours, a player presenting to the campaing after a downtime could say, before I went to rest I casted all my slots on good berries and show on with a houndred berries at the start of the campaing.

I know that it isn't RAW, it's a DM houserule since he felt that 4 HP per berry was to much. Just his compromise to give some benefit from the subclass ability while still being reasonable in his mind.

[Belier]

I know that it isn't RAW, it's a DM houserule since he felt that 4 HP per berry was to much. Just his compromise to give some benefit from the subclass ability while still being reasonable in his mind.

Your dm still has to remember that a berry cost an action to consume.
4 hp healing for an action in combat is not what I call op.

I know in between combat it sounds absurd but it wont save people that much in combat. He can even rule it you cannot force feed an uncouncious creature because you should never put something in the mouth of an uncouncious person.

It also means that somebody did multiclass having one quick advantage for delaying other usefull stuff.

He can throw more encounters if the PC really liked fighting.

Over all it is not that broken.
He can adjust, throwing more things at people.

[Belier]

Dm's calling things op just are dm's that usually ain't adjusting to what the pc's are doing. Needs to be creative.

[Belier]

Now imagine this, and you aint needing to multiclass.

Human variant healer feat. For a measly 5 gold you can buy 10 charge, and when somebody goes uncouncious yiu can raise it any time you have a charge for an action to 1 hp without force feeding wich wouldnt work.

1 time per rest you can heal somebody for 1d6 + 4 +level
You can carry easily 40 charges on you. No spell slots required.

If your dm would allow this feat at level 1 he needs not to nerf a multiclasser than enable goodberry life cleric at level 2 for the cost of slowing progression and consuming spells slots.

This feat is often looked like an underwhelming feat and people calls goodberries life cleric op. It's not reasonable to assume so.

[MaxWilson]

So, you're going to argue against something that has builds made around it, one of the creators saying it works as it does, just because you what, don't like it's unclearity in RAW I presume?

The most logical rule is, depends on the DM and Table. RAI suggests it Works and RAW is clearly unclear on the matter. If someone wants to go for something like Goodberies and Life Cleric, best ask how your DM interprets it First. Simple as that.

And it's not like it's Crazy Broken either. Just good enough to provide some interesting healing, equivalent to a stash of minor Healing potions (each requiring Actions to Consume, thus preferably out of combat).

It's not crazy broken, but using Grim Harvest on Animate Dead is crazy broken, and they both rely on the same logic.

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When a pc eat a berry, you really did use a level 1 spell to heal them, making it 4 hp. If you make it with a level 2 cast it even let the spell gain efficiency scaling as now jt is able to heal for 1 + 2 + 2 per berry and so on with higher level of casting. That is funny for a spell that is not supposed to be scaling. And since the duration is 24 hours, a player presenting to the campaing after a downtime could say, before I went to rest I casted all my slots on good berries and show on with a houndred berries at the start of the campaing.

No, you didn't. The spell is already over at that point. It has only instantaneous duration.

[utopus]

It should work fine. Since Life Cleric's ability just says when you "use a spell" and not "cast a spell".

I agree with this, in that it should have a similar ruling to life cleric + goodberry

@maxwilson planning to make changes to your ridiculously good healer guide?

[MaxWilson]

I agree with this, in that it should have a similar ruling to life cleric + goodberry

@maxwilson planning to make changes to your ridiculously good healer guide?

Hahaha, I feel like that thread is obsolete now actually. ANYONE can make a ludicrously good healer now with minimal effort. Even a bog-standard Moon Druid has more healing than the party is likely to actually need in practice, even if the DM "fixes" Healing Spirit to work only once per round. By level 10 you've got 40 Goodberries and 220d6 (722) of Healing Spirit per long rest. That's not as much as the 2000+ HP a dedicated healer could be doing with Aura of Vitality, but that was always ludicrous overkill that I've never seen any party need. In practice, 300 HP of healing is plenty at level 10.