Some AT/BS MC Help

[YungXs]

Hey everyone,

I've been a lurker on this forum for a long time and I was wondering if I could get some help. So right now I'm a PC in my friends home-brew world. I was running a wild-magic sorcerer I was particularly not enjoying due to the mechanics but he was my first character and I could not really get into a feel for what direction I want his character to go into. So i plan on retiring him.

We're currently at LVL 6. So I'm going to be playing a 10 year old changeling. I plan on having him being a child who was essentially saved from the towns child fighting ring. I want to play him as essentially a "wizard" who is really an arcane trickster/bladesinger( my DM let me be a blade singer, I'll have to appear as an elf most of the time for lore purposes). Could I get some ideas? I want him to be kind of that conniving child. I rolled some solid stats , 18,11,15,11,14,13.

I was thinking about doing something along the lines of a 3AT/3BS. This would give me a lot of skills as well as access to a good amount of spells as well. I know that since I'm at 3/3 I'll be missing out on an ASI and some feats. I've been reading this sub-reddit for a while and I was hoping I could get some ideas from everyone!

Cantrips


Mage Hand
Fire Bolt
Minor Illusion
Thunder Clap
Green flame blade
friends



1st lvl


shield
charm person
magic missle
tasha hideous laughter



2nd


darkvision
hold person
shatter
suggestion





Just to give you guys some ideas of the spells i'd want to take

[the secret fire]

I'd probably go Rogue 1/Wizard (BS) 5 in your situation. Rogue at 1st level for the extra skills, then to BS 6 (extra attack) at 7th level before switching back to Rogue. Arcane Trickster doesn't really combine well with Wizard levels. It's not worth it to take the subclass just for a few more spell slots. If you want a multiclass Wizard/Rogue, you should really look at taking a different Rogue subclass.

[Sinon]

I would actually go the other way, maxing my wizard levels at 2 and then going 4 in rogue.

For me, this multiclass is about adding the Bladesinger’s defense bonus to the rogue, though. Not about adding skills to a wizard (which is a legitimate perspective as well.)

Wizard 2/AT 4 you’re getting 2d6 sneak attack, cunning action, and that ASI.

You’ve got six cantrips.
Friends, Minor Illusion, and Mage Hand are good.

Greenflame Blade is ok.
I would consider maybe Booming Blade, though. The damage is less frequently resisted, and the point is to control, not damage - discourage the opponent from following you when you disengage and move out of melee reach.

Unless you’re thinking “skilled wizard” over “magicy rogue” I’d drop those damage cantrips. You get your SA on weapons – use weapons.

Maybe (maybe) a cantrip that requires a save, for when you might not have advantage or are facing a tough AC, or one with a rider of some kind, rather than straight damage.

Your spell selections are ok. My version doesn’t get second-level yet (an admitted downside), but if you do get three levels of wizard, I’d take Misty Step. When you need to get out of a trick spot like being restrained, it really pays off. (And remember that you can cast rituals - having their versatility never hurts.)

And, while I know that this sometimes runs contrary to a character theme, you really want Find Familiar – That little creature is a resource that just keeps on giving inside combat and out, but for someone who relies on getting SA, an ally that can swoop in next to an opponent, trigger your SA requirements, and swoop out with impunity (like an owl) is hard to pass up.

[Specter]

I would actually go the other way, maxing my wizard levels at 2 and then going 4 in rogue.

For me, this multiclass is about adding the Bladesinger’s defense bonus to the rogue, though. Not about adding skills to a wizard (which is a legitimate perspective as well.)

Wizard 2/AT 4 you’re getting 2d6 sneak attack, cunning action, and that ASI.

You’ve got six cantrips.
Friends, Minor Illusion, and Mage Hand are good.

Greenflame Blade is ok.
I would consider maybe Booming Blade, though. The damage is less frequently resisted, and the point is to control, not damage - discourage the opponent from following you when you disengage and move out of melee reach.

Unless you’re thinking “skilled wizard” over “magicy rogue” I’d drop those damage cantrips. You get your SA on weapons – use weapons.

Maybe (maybe) a cantrip that requires a save, for when you might not have advantage or are facing a tough AC, or one with a rider of some kind, rather than straight damage.

Your spell selections are ok. My version doesn’t get second-level yet (an admitted downside), but if you do get three levels of wizard, I’d take Misty Step. When you need to get out of a trick spot like being restrained, it really pays off. (And remember that you can cast rituals - having their versatility never hurts.)

And, while I know that this sometimes runs contrary to a character theme, you really want Find Familiar – That little creature is a resource that just keeps on giving inside combat and out, but for someone who relies on getting SA, an ally that can swoop in next to an opponent, trigger your SA requirements, and swoop out with impunity (like an owl) is hard to pass up.

This.

As a final build, AT10/BS10 is a good way to go: You get everything that's essential to both Wizard and Rogue by then, and still end up with 5th-level spells and 7th-level slots, more than a pure AT would have.

[YungXs]

I would actually go the other way, maxing my wizard levels at 2 and then going 4 in rogue.

For me, this multiclass is about adding the Bladesinger’s defense bonus to the rogue, though. Not about adding skills to a wizard (which is a legitimate perspective as well.)

Wizard 2/AT 4 you’re getting 2d6 sneak attack, cunning action, and that ASI.

You’ve got six cantrips.
Friends, Minor Illusion, and Mage Hand are good.

Greenflame Blade is ok.
I would consider maybe Booming Blade, though. The damage is less frequently resisted, and the point is to control, not damage - discourage the opponent from following you when you disengage and move out of melee reach.

Unless you’re thinking “skilled wizard” over “magicy rogue” I’d drop those damage cantrips. You get your SA on weapons – use weapons.

Maybe (maybe) a cantrip that requires a save, for when you might not have advantage or are facing a tough AC, or one with a rider of some kind, rather than straight damage.

Your spell selections are ok. My version doesn’t get second-level yet (an admitted downside), but if you do get three levels of wizard, I’d take Misty Step. When you need to get out of a trick spot like being restrained, it really pays off. (And remember that you can cast rituals - having their versatility never hurts.)

And, while I know that this sometimes runs contrary to a character theme, you really want Find Familiar – That little creature is a resource that just keeps on giving inside combat and out, but for someone who relies on getting SA, an ally that can swoop in next to an opponent, trigger your SA requirements, and swoop out with impunity (like an owl) is hard to pass up.

Thank you for this. As well as everyone else who had replied back. I'll probably end up following this and going with what Specter had said and go with the 10AT/10BS build. I'll focus more on the roguey aspects of this guy at first. I'm having my DM introduce my new character as a "wizard" and then really going from there. I'm going to enjoy all of the shenanigans I get with being a skill monkey with some spells!

Though since I'd be going more melee/bow what should I do as my stats?

Highest Dex , then Con - Char - Wisdom - Int and then str? does that sound about right - my DM is letting me change out char+1/dex+1 for +2 dex and I lose the proficiency in deception.

[Sinon]

My priorities would be :

Dex (Attack, defense, initiative, skills)
Int (The DC for your spells like Hold Person and Charm, plus the Bladesinger bonus)
Con (hit points and your ability to maintain concentration)

Wis and Cha are sort of tied. Normally, Wis is a crucial save and Perception, but as a Changeling, you’re probably going to be using Deception a lot.

Strength you dump.

[YungXs]

My priorities would be :

Dex (Attack, defense, initiative, skills)
Int (The DC for your spells like Hold Person and Charm, plus the Bladesinger bonus)
Con (hit points and your ability to maintain concentration)

Wis and Cha are sort of tied. Normally, Wis is a crucial save and Perception, but as a Changeling, you’re probably going to be using Deception a lot.

Strength you dump.

Forgot to reply to this! Thanks for the Stats Shinon. So my DM is pretty cool and letting me change some stuff around and giving up stuff so I can switch things around. So with ASI and the change to my stat bonuses my DM is giving me. I have a


1 Str
20 Dex
13 Con
16 Int
11 Wis
15 Charisma


We're at lvl 7 right now so I'm a 5AT/2BS , one more away from another level of expertise. This is gonna be so great. Any other recommendations you would make? I'm actually not going to take dark vision though.. I'm playing my character as a half-elf (changeling ) who is afraid of the dark and won't go in without a light and one who won't do two watches because he needs his nap time.