Is this feat to powerfull? (Iaijutsu Master)(Homebrew)

[Vox Silentii]

https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Iaijutsu_Master_(5e_Feat)

When combined with, let's say the Alert feat, and giving that the player has 20 in dex.

That would mean that hitting would be +10 and +10 to dmg throughout this round (not counting the bonus that prof gives to initiative)Then with a bonus action sheath the sword so this thing can be used again.

Note that this was done with 6sec math. So i am possibly forgetting something.

[Unoriginal]

Yes, it is overpowered. Or at least not smoothly fitting inside the 5e rules. Maybe both.

[Vox Silentii]

Any way that you think of that might nerf it a bit?
Also i calculated wrong.
Initiative would be 10
So its +15 to attack and dmg
Maybe a good nerf would be "just the first strike"

[rbstr]

It's completely busted. It basically gives a large amount of bonus damage with a huge accuracy bonus to every attack on your turn every turn.

If I were to try to rework the spirit of the thing to something more in-line:
Add 1/2 your proficiency bonus to your initiative rolls. That can stay, it's fine.
During the first round of combat you have advantage on melee attacks and add your proficiency bonus to melee attack damage rolls.

I think that might not good enough since it pretty situational but it's also too strong to apply more than one round of combat.
But it actually works best on a Samurai with Rapid Strike, which is fun to me.

[Unoriginal]

Any way that you think of that might nerf it a bit?
Also i calculated wrong.
Initiative would be 10
So its +15 to attack and dmg
Maybe a good nerf would be "just the first strike"

There is too many benefits for one feat, for starter.

[mgshamster]

Any way that you think of that might nerf it a bit?
Also i calculated wrong.
Initiative would be 10
So its +15 to attack and dmg
Maybe a good nerf would be "just the first strike"

Remove the bonus to initiative.

Change the "sheath as bonus action" section to "Draw and Stow one weapon of choice as part of an attack." No need to make it a bonus action, and it's equivalent to Dual Weapons feat's ability to draw or stow two weapons at once.

Change the bonus to attack and damage section to, "When you draw your weapon and attack on the same turn, the first hit against a surprised creature is treated as a critical hit." Having it always work every round against all enemies that go after you plus extra hit and damage is way too strong. But only on the first round of combat may be a bit too weak for a feat - so maybe add "+1 to strength or Dex" as part of it.

[strangebloke]

Lets break this down.

Most people would say that GWM is too strong, right? Or at least that it's the upper edge of what a combat feat should be allowed to do.

GWM is -5/+10, and a bonus attack once in a while. It doesn't really combo with anything except sort of with PWM.

Iajutsu Focus is +6-7/+6-7, a +1-2 to initiative, but requires a bonus action to use each round. It also lets you use a reaction attack with a sheathed weapon. If comboed with alert, this changes to +11-12 to both attack and damage.

Let's assume for the moment that attack and damage are roughly equal in value. In reality, scaling bonuses to attack are way more important than scaling bonuses to damage, but whatever. GWM 'adds' +5 to each attack and Iajutsu focus 'adds' +12->+24 value to each attack at the cost of a bonus action.

This feat is r i d i c u l o u s.

vHuman Hexblade 8. Iajutsu, GWM, alert.

Wins initiative, unsheathes greatsword, attacks twice with greatsword with +10(+3+3+(3+1+5)-5) to attack for 2d6+25(+3+3+(3+1+5)+10) damage for a total of 64 damage that round.

[Vox Silentii]

Lets break this down.

Most people would say that GWM is too strong, right? Or at least that it's the upper edge of what a combat feat should be allowed to do.

GWM is -5/+10, and a bonus attack once in a while. It doesn't really combo with anything except sort of with PWM.

Iajutsu Focus is +6-7/+6-7, a +1-2 to initiative, but requires a bonus action to use each round. It also lets you use a reaction attack with a sheathed weapon. If comboed with alert, this changes to +11-12 to both attack and damage.

Let's assume for the moment that attack and damage are roughly equal in value. In reality, scaling bonuses to attack are way more important than scaling bonuses to damage, but whatever. GWM 'adds' +5 to each attack and Iajutsu focus 'adds' +12->+24 value to each attack at the cost of a bonus action.

This feat is r i d i c u l o u s.

vHuman Hexblade 8. Iajutsu, GWM, alert.

Wins initiative, unsheathes greatsword, attacks twice with greatsword with +10(+3+3+(3+1+5)-5) to attack for 2d6+25(+3+3+(3+1+5)+10) damage for a total of 64 damage that round.

Yeah, but it states that you have to use a one handed weapon. But its still very broken.
I am looking for a way to make it viable. Nerf it but still keep the essence of it

[strangebloke]

Yeah, but it states that you have to use a one handed weapon. But its still very broken.
I am looking for a way to make it viable. Nerf it but still keep the essence of it

ah, missed that.

I would just say, draw or sheathe as part of a weapon attack, add (1/2)initiative to damage on the first round of combat, then give it +1 dex. The lower build cost means that it gets picked more, and you can still do the draw-attack-sheathe again business. Combos nicely with Alert still.

Maybe quibble with the damage offered on the first turn a bit, but I think it's fine.

I mean, the whole idea is the two samurai who rush each other, make one attack, and then the one dies, right?

A (5e) samurai charges in, uses fighting spirit and action surge and gets off 5 attacks, with +10 damage to each attack, sheathes his blades on the last two attacks, and ponders Bushido for a moment while the enemy behind him falls apart, having taken absurd damage. Refluff the many strikes as one if you wish.

[Vox Silentii]

Okay since the feat is a little to much we can change things about it. Maybe more in the style of

Katana Expertise

You can use Longswords as if they had the finesse property but only when they are fluffed as katanas.

You can draw you weapon during your first attack, if you do so you can double your prof modifier on hitting and damage on the first attack that turn. While drawing the weapon this way it is treated as equipped with one hand (1d8)

As a Bonus Action or After your last attack that turn you can choose to sheath your weapon.
While sheathed it is treated as an improvised weapon.


Does pretty much the same thing only not nearly as op.

[JackPhoenix]

*sees dandwiki link*

I didn't even had to click on the link to know it's either overpowered, stupid, or both. Why did I do it anyway only to confirm my suspicion?

[mephnick]

*sees dandwiki link*

I didn't even had to click on the link to know it's either overpowered, stupid, or both. Why did I do it anyway only to confirm my suspicion?

Because dndwiki is amazing. I saw a Barbarian totem path someone linked that at level 6 gave you proficiency in 2 saves of your choice and a bonus action attack every turn.

[Kaliayev]

Rather than treat this as a feat, I think you should homebrew it as a branching path for the fighter's samurai archetype. Swap out the courtly benefits at levels three and seven for a more combat-oriented build that you're going for with Iaijutsu Master.

[Ignimortis]

Lets break this down.

Most people would say that GWM is too strong, right? Or at least that it's the upper edge of what a combat feat should be allowed to do.

GWM is -5/+10, and a bonus attack once in a while. It doesn't really combo with anything except sort of with PWM.

Iajutsu Focus is +6-7/+6-7, a +1-2 to initiative, but requires a bonus action to use each round. It also lets you use a reaction attack with a sheathed weapon. If comboed with alert, this changes to +11-12 to both attack and damage.

Let's assume for the moment that attack and damage are roughly equal in value. In reality, scaling bonuses to attack are way more important than scaling bonuses to damage, but whatever. GWM 'adds' +5 to each attack and Iajutsu focus 'adds' +12->+24 value to each attack at the cost of a bonus action.

This feat is r i d i c u l o u s.

vHuman Hexblade 8. Iajutsu, GWM, alert.

Wins initiative, unsheathes greatsword, attacks twice with greatsword with +10(+3+3+(3+1+5)-5) to attack for 2d6+25(+3+3+(3+1+5)+10) damage for a total of 64 damage that round.

The funny thing is, a vhuman barbarian with GWM does about the same damage without this feat. Two attacks at +4 (assuming a +1 weapon) for 2d6+18 (10 GWM+5 STR+2 Rage+1 enchant), but with advantage, which makes it rather likely to score a hit even at +4, which averages at 25 per attack. If it's not the first round, then as soon as the barb drops anyone or gets a crit (which is likely with advantage), he gets a third attack, too, for 75 average if all attacks hit, not counting the crit.

While this feat is indeed too powerful, if it could be restricted further to prevent using shields or offhand weapons with it, it would only take minor nerfs to bring it in line.

[Greywander]

Change the "sheath as bonus action" section to "Draw and Stow one weapon of choice as part of an attack."
Interestingly, this makes this feat great for throwing weapon builds, too, since you can draw each individual throwing weapon as part of your attack with it. Wait, no, I think I might have misread what you wrote. Oh well, I do think it might be a good idea to rewrite it so that it did work that way.

So maybe something like this:

Iaijutsu Master
You have mastered the art of attacking as you draw your weapon, granting you the following benefits:
You can draw or stow a weapon as part of an attack with that weapon.
On your first turn in combat, you may add your proficiency bonus to the damage of one weapon attack you make against a creature that hasn't taken their turn yet.
Whenever you score a critical hit with a weapon you drew this turn, that attack deals an additional 1d8 damage.
As a bonus action, you may use a free hand to draw a one-handed weapon, make an attack with that weapon, and sheathe that weapon (thrown weapons aren't sheathed).


Thoughts? It gives drawing/stowing weapon as part of an attack (thematic for iaijutsu, good for throwing weapon builds), bonus damage on your first attack (limited, but almost always useful), bonus damage on a crit with conditions (uncommon but nice when you trigger it), and a bonus action attack (competes with other bonus actions, has some limitations on when/how it's used).

Actually, this really does seem more geared toward throwing weapon builds than it does sword builds. Not that it isn't good for them, too.

[sophontteks]

What part of the feat is it that you want to keep?
As its written its broken, its just a name, but if we knew what you wanted from it, then something could be thought up.

[mgshamster]

You can draw or stow a weapon as part of an attack with that weapon.

Just as an FYI, that's part of the base rules. You can already do that. You can always draw one weapons or stow one weapon as part of a movement or attack action.

The Dual Wielder feats grants drawing or stowing two weapons when you take an attack or movement action. If you don't have this feat, you'd have to draw one weapon as part of your move, and then draw the second as part of your attack, giving you the bonus action attack on your next turn.

This feat, as I proposed it earlier, allows you to draw AND stow as part of an attack action. It's not strong, but it is flavorful. :smallsmile:

[bid]

The funny thing is, a vhuman barbarian with GWM does about the same damage without this feat.
At -5 to hit. Quite the opposite of the +5 to hit of this feat.

As an aside, you could base this feat on DW. If you waste your BA to activate the feat and the extra damage from attacks is more-or-less what you'd get from DW BA attack (aka 1d8), then you're close enough.

[Greywander]

Just as an FYI, that's part of the base rules. You can already do that. You can always draw one weapons or stow one weapon as part of a movement or attack action.
Not so. You get one Object Interaction per turn, and it can be used to draw or stow a weapon. If you want to draw or stow a second weapon, or draw and stow a weapon, you have to use your Action to do so.

What I was proposing was that you would draw or stow a weapon as part of an attack. Meaning that you can draw or stow as many weapons as you have attacks, and still have your Object Interaction to use for something else.

[xanderh]

Just as an FYI, that's part of the base rules. You can already do that. You can always draw one weapons or stow one weapon as part of a movement or attack action.

The Dual Wielder feats grants drawing or stowing two weapons when you take an attack or movement action. If you don't have this feat, you'd have to draw one weapon as part of your move, and then draw the second as part of your attack, giving you the bonus action attack on your next turn.

This feat, as I proposed it earlier, allows you to draw AND stow as part of an attack action. It's not strong, but it is flavorful. :smallsmile:

You only get to do this once per turn. Drawing/stowing a weapon as part of an attack is an "interact with object action", and you get one for free per turn. Any more, and you'll have to spend an action on it.

[mgshamster]

Not so. You get one Object Interaction per turn, and it can be used to draw or stow a weapon. If you want to draw or stow a second weapon, or draw and stow a weapon, you have to use your Action to do so.

What I was proposing was that you would draw or stow a weapon as part of an attack. Meaning that you can draw or stow as many weapons as you have attacks, and still have your Object Interaction to use for something else.

Ah yes. I misremembered. You are correct.