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View Full Version : DM Help Mounts for kobold and goblin cavalries?



Shackled Slayer
2018-04-30, 10:04 PM
So i have this homebrew magic item, the grab bag of madness: you reach in, roll on a table (1d12 for list, 1d100 for item number, so far. Hoping to get to 20 lists by fall) and your result determines what you pull out. Two of the options are a group of 20 goblins or kobolds who can be convinced to follow one of the players. And here's the crux of my dilemma;

I plan for these goblins/kobolds to be a platoon of diverse, well trained warriors who are uncharacteristically brave, smart and coordinated, and they include members trained for mounted combat. Now i know as a pathfinder-preferring-player that goblin dogs are always an option for the goblins, but those aren't always readilly available.

So for our pint sized cavaliers, what would be a number of good medium size category monsters that would make good mounts? Im currently considdering hyenas, worgs, or a homebrew modification of crocodiles that resemble a smaller version of a prehistoric galloping crocodile.

17arkOracle
2018-05-01, 12:36 AM
Worgs for goblins, definitely.

For kobolds, it depends a little on how you want to theme them. Something reptilian makes sense, or dragon-y if you take them in that direction. Hyenas might work if you want your kobolds to be a bit desert-themed. Crocodiles aren't a bad choice, though like you suggested they might need to be modified a bit (they are very close to the ground). Maybe monitor lizards? Ooo, a dinosaur would work quite well, too.

Kaptin Keen
2018-05-01, 01:03 AM
Well, traditionally, it's wolves, spiders, lizards - right?

What else comes to mind? Flightless birds, bats, some sort of large viper, constructs, summons. I once played a goblin ranger who rode into combat on a giant ape.

Shackled Slayer
2018-05-01, 01:33 AM
Worgs for goblins, definitely.

For kobolds, it depends a little on how you want to theme them. Something reptilian makes sense, or dragon-y if you take them in that direction. Hyenas might work if you want your kobolds to be a bit desert-themed. Crocodiles aren't a bad choice, though like you suggested they might need to be modified a bit (they are very close to the ground). Maybe monitor lizards? Ooo, a dinosaur would work quite well, too.

Worgs were definitely one of the first things i thought of, as well as the hyenas and possibly even boars. These characters are coming from a coastal area and im not sure how likely worgs are to patrol beaches, would need to refer to the bestiary. But also these mounts don't come with the mobs, so im just trying to think of a varied group of possible mounts.

The kobolds are definitely being themed as ex dragon minions, but old ex minions, like they've been out of service to a "lord" for a couple years when they are pulled out of the bag. They would have been holed up in an old, abandoned small fort, either in an old forest or on a sarenghti type plains. The idea i have going for them is something like a smaller version of this;
http://www.iflscience.com/plants-and-animals/galloping-crocodiles-ate-dinosaurs-north-africa/
But i am looking for really unique ideas so feel free to throw wild concepts or some of the more oddball critters from monster manuals.


Well, traditionally, it's wolves, spiders, lizards - right?

What else comes to mind? Flightless birds, bats, some sort of large viper, constructs, summons. I once played a goblin ranger who rode into combat on a giant ape.

Flightless birds would definitely be cool, though i doubt the critters could survive wrangling something like a moa. Maybe and ostrich?

Illogictree
2018-05-01, 01:48 AM
Hmm... if you want to make it a bit more unusual, you might consider giant insects as mounts. Maybe giant locusts, with the commander riding a giant praying mantis. I actually considered for one of my settings giving the goblins a critter that was essentially a giant flea with really long legs as a mount.

As for kobolds... isn't there historical precedent in earlier D&D editions for them using giant weasels as mounts? It makes sense in a way, they're just as adept as kobolds at squirming into small spaces and also just as tenacious. Plus it's memorably bizarre, which I think is why it's stuck in my mind.

Shackled Slayer
2018-05-01, 01:51 AM
Hmm... if you want to make it a bit more unusual, you might consider giant insects as mounts. Maybe giant locusts, with the commander riding a giant praying mantis. I actually considered for one of my settings giving the goblins a critter that was essentially a giant flea with really long legs as a mount.

As for kobolds... isn't there historical precedent in earlier D&D editions for them using giant weasels as mounts? It makes sense in a way, they're just as adept as kobolds at squirming into small spaces and also just as tenacious. Plus it's memorably bizarre, which I think is why it's stuck in my mind.

Excellent suggestions, i particularly like the giant locusts idea.

Shackled Slayer
2018-05-01, 02:01 AM
I once played a goblin ranger who rode into combat on a giant ape.

Dis you? Lol

http://conceptartworld.com/artists/matt-kohr/attachment/matt_kohr_08a/

Xuc Xac
2018-05-01, 02:37 AM
Horses. And don't trot out Tolkien's stupid line about Hobbits being too short to ride horses. Humans ride elephants in the real world. Nobody complains about humans riding dragons in fantasy settings. Goblins can ride destriers.

Kaptin Keen
2018-05-01, 02:54 AM
Excellent suggestions, i particularly like the giant locusts idea.

Or dragonflies. Dragonflies are way cool.


Dis you? Lol

http://conceptartworld.com/artists/matt-kohr/attachment/matt_kohr_08a/

Mine was cooler:

https://alzrius.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/pfgiantape.jpg

I have no skill for images - a friend of mine pasted a goblin atop it. The concept was frankly way OP, the GM eventually needed to simply dismiss the idea. No 'tamer' for me =(

hamishspence
2018-05-01, 07:35 AM
Races of the Dragon favours "dire weasel" as the standard kobold cavalry mount.

gkathellar
2018-05-01, 08:08 AM
Worgs for the goblins, definitely. There are wolves in most natural settings, even some deserts, so I don't think being on a beach is a problem.

As for kobolds, what about some kind of monitor lizard, with the kobolds riding low to the thing's body to decrease their profile? It's be a bit slow, but also pretty stealthy.


Horses. And don't trot out Tolkien's stupid line about Hobbits being too short to ride horses. Humans ride elephants in the real world. Nobody complains about humans riding dragons in fantasy settings. Goblins can ride destriers.

The mechanics of riding an elephant are completely different from riding a horse, and in warfare centers more on the use of the elephant as a 2,000+ kg mobile battle platform. I'd find halflings on elephants far more plausible than halflings on horses.

In contrast, a whole lot of equestrianism is done with the legs, especially in warfare, where steering with the knees is a huge deal and the stirrup creates a huge cavalry advantage. A small creature could probably ride a horse, but definitely not well. Horses are also notoriously skittish, moody, and vengeful. These are not ideal traits in any domestic animal, but especially not when your head barely reaches its stomach.

IIRC, Tolkein trained horses for the military during WW1. This is a topic he actually knew a lot about.

Concrete
2018-05-01, 08:31 AM
Horses. And don't trot out Tolkien's stupid line about Hobbits being too short to ride horses. Humans ride elephants in the real world. Nobody complains about humans riding dragons in fantasy settings. Goblins can ride destriers.

Goblins riding horses like we ride elephants sounds kinda cool. With a platform saddle or something, or just several of them hanging from regular saddles. It'd be real interesting fighting them like that.
I can imagine this huge, crazy-eyed warhorse, half mad with fear and rage and the goblins hollering and pulling it this way and that with their shifting weight.

Lapak
2018-05-01, 08:41 AM
I am a fan of the giant insects and flightless birds. When you described the kobolds as potentially being from a forest I instantly thought 'Dire Flying Squirrel Death Squadron!' - stat the squirrels as Dire Weasels, but replace Blood Drain and Attach with Climb speed and Glide a la Raptorans. Show me a party that wouldn't be delighted by kobolds skittering around the canopy on squirrel-back and raining missiles from above. Not such a good fit for coastal areas, though. There I'd stick to goblins on some kind of region-appropriate canine mount.

Nifft
2018-05-01, 08:54 AM
Goblins riding horses like we ride elephants sounds kinda cool. With a platform saddle or something, or just several of them hanging from regular saddles. It'd be real interesting fighting them like that.
I can imagine this huge, crazy-eyed warhorse, half mad with fear and rage and the goblins hollering and pulling it this way and that with their shifting weight.

Two goblins on top, plus another goblin hanging on each side (each poking out from a saddle bag).

Dogfight configuration: the 2nd goblin on top and both saddlebag riders have shortbows, and shoot arrows every turn as the horse tries to run away.

Chicken configuration: the 2nd goblin on top and both saddlebag riders have lances, and the horse is urged unto ramming speed.

Skirmish configuration: the 2nd goblin on top has a pair of heavy crossbows, the two saddlebag goblins have spears. If nobody approaches, one of the saddlebag goblins re-loads one of the heavy crossbows. If someone approaches, that saddlebag goblin uses the spear.

-- -- --

On a more serious note, are these squads of 20 supposed to be 20 combatants, or 20 personnel total?

I could easily see an elite cavalry unit as a squad of 8 riders, 16 mounts, and 12 support goblins (animal keepers / blacksmiths / squires / quartermaster / cook).

Or did you intend each squad of 20 to be like a small army? 10 infantry, 2 cavalry, 2 support casters, 2 healers, 2 leaders, and 2 rooks?

You'd get more table entries if you specialized the squads.
- Light Infantry
- Heavy Infantry
- Light Cavalry
- Heavy Cavalry
- Artillery
- Flying Artillery
- Sappers
- Skirmishers
- Scouts
- Submarine Infantry
- Air Cavalry
- Deep Cavern Sappers
- Liquid Magma Scouts
- Ethereal Skirmishers
- Anti-Air Artillery
- Archers
- Flying Archers
- Skeleton Archers
- Underwater Archers (... somehow)
- Magma-Surfing Dragon Cavalry
... etc.

Lord Torath
2018-05-01, 09:53 AM
Are Xytar still a thing? Six-legged, fire-breathing, desert-dwelling lizards? First seen in the 1986 D&D Creature Catalog, they are 8' long with 5+1 HD, and a speed of 120'/40' (fast as a standard human). AC:3 (17 in ascending AC, I think), Int: 4 (smart for an animal!), Morale: 8 (2-12 scale - braver than a horse, which generally has morale 4-5), plus has a 10'c30' cone of 3d6 fire they use on average 30% of the time. They're intended to be used as mounts for desert-dwelling lizardmen. Figure they'd be perfect for the kobolds.

Goblins and kobolds could also ride big cats: Pumas (catamounts, mountain lions, cougars, etc), leopards, and jaguars are all about the right size.

Grim Portent
2018-05-01, 12:54 PM
From a simple logistics standpoint alone I'd have them ride ponies. Easier to feed and handle than most animals of similar size, and ponies have a relatively stable back especially when compared to something like a cat or wolf. They also make good pack animals and are able to be hitched to small carts.

For a more fantastical mount I'd probably go for large goats. Still easy to feed, but much harder to handle than a pony would be and with a much less stable back.

Something like a panther would generally lead to me spending too much time trying to figure out how the hell they can feed the thing. Carnivores need a lot of food that takes a lot of effort to get compared to herbivores.