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OgresAreCute
2018-05-04, 05:43 PM
So, after my previous character died to a group of Shocker Lizards I have to make a new one. One thing I've wanted to try for a while is a class that specializes in summoning. I'm personally not super enthused by spellcasters. A binder with Zceryll would be perfect for what I'm looking for, but that comes online at level 10 at the earliest, and my new character will be starting at level 4. Therefore, I'm looking for advice on what options I have for a summoning build that can start summoning at low levels without waiting until level 9/10 before the summoning part comes online. As far as I know, the best option would be to go for something like a Conjuration Wizard or a Druid with Greenbound Summoning.

Most 3.5/3.0 content is (probably) not banned, no PF content and stuff from Dragon will probably be banned if it's too crazy.

Venger
2018-05-04, 05:49 PM
binder with zceryll is great, but if you don't want to wait, roll malconvoker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?528090-Mastering-the-Malconvoker)

mabriss lethe
2018-05-04, 06:48 PM
Summoning at low levels is also rather frustrating: the spells themselves have a long casting time and generally only last for 1 round/level. Starting out, that's not a very good use of time. (later on, it's a much better deal with more resources to mitigate the drawbacks, but if you're starting at 4, things will be a little tight)

Falontani
2018-05-04, 07:04 PM
Unearthed Arcana has alternate summoning rules where you can create your own list of summons. If you can get access to these rules you can populate your list with summons based on a theme.
Your Summon Monster CR per level should look like:
CR 1/2
CR 1
CR 2
CR 3
CR 4-5
CR 5-6
CR 7-8
CR 9-10
CR 11-13
Now with this you can choose what you summon.
For instance at level 1 you could choose to summon a CR 1/2 Teifling with a single NPC level (because creatures with non NPC-class levels require the Champion build which auto pushes them up by 1 CR)
With this when you get Summon Monster 2 you could Summon a CR 1 Teifling Barbarian.
Now this isn't great by itself but thats the general way it works. Now to augment it.

Summon Desert Ally summons a single creature from the same CR range, but applies the Dustform Template onto your creature. So at level 1 you could summon a CR 1/2 Dustform Goliath. A Dustform Goliath would have a Slam attack and a strength of 18. If you have the Augment Summoning feat (easily accessible at level 1) You have a Dustform Goliath with a 1d8+9 Slam attack and 40 Hit Points. (because a goliath counts as 1 size larger whenever it benefits them)

this allows you much leeway with what you summon.

Kelb_Panthera
2018-05-04, 07:52 PM
Variant conjurer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#conjurerVariants) into malconvoker seems a pretty direct route. There's also ToMs fiendbinder, if you want to try something different.

Zaq
2018-05-05, 10:03 AM
It’s going to be tricky to do much summoning without being a caster of some stripe (though a Shaper Psion might be a good alternative if you dig psionics more than slot-based magic).

Let’s think outside the box a little. It’s not quite the same thing, but an Evil-aligned Incarnate can start using the Crown bind of the Necrocarnum Circlet as early as level 2, and that gives you a (really nice) incarnum zombie. It’s created from a corpse rather than summoned out of nothing, but it’s still a fun disposable minion, and incarnum zombies are way, WAY nicer than regular zombies (for one, they’re smart!). The Soulspark Familiar is also available—I’ll be honest and tell you that it’s a little bit weaksauce, but it’s still thematic if you want pets, and you can probably find a use or two for it.

As I said, Shaper Psions are pretty sweet. You can get all the summoning you need with one power (Astral Construct), and then you don’t have to spend more resources on it unless you choose to. (You can technically get Astral Construct on any character with the Hidden Talent feat, but since your ML doesn’t scale unless you take levels in a manifesting class, this is a bad choice.)

The Water Devotion feat got unnecessarily nerfed to be only 1/day for some reason (talk to your GM about houseruling past that), but it’s available to any character who isn’t, like, ideologically opposed to water. It lets you summon a water elemental that scales with level. The main benefit is that it’s just a feat that anyone can take, no casting required.

If you’re cool with items, the MIC has some very cheap items (I think they’re called the Amber Amulets? AFB) to summon reasonably powerful vermin 1/day. Honestly, you won’t be summoning every single round, but a few well-chosen Amber Amulets and the Water Devotion feat can add a pretty noticeable summoning focus to a low-level character of any class. You could start as a Binder and use things like that to make up the difference for a while until Zceryll comes online, though I recognize that there’s stil a bit of a donut hole in that build.

Alternatively, there’s always Anima Mage.

Bullet06320
2018-05-06, 01:15 AM
Variant conjurer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#conjurerVariants) into malconvoker seems a pretty direct route.

yup, one of the most straightforward builds, that does what you want from the get go

Conjuration speacialist with the rapid summons ACF, focused specialist ACF is an option, pick up summon elemental Reserve feat when you can, make sure you dump a few points into bluff for malconvoker, and don't dump charisma, it comes in handy for both bluff skill and planar binding later on, going masterspecialist for few levels before malconvker gives a few good extras.
banned schools should probly be necromancy, evocation and either illusion or enchantment, enchantment can be handy for planar binding, illusion can get you shadow evocation though, so take your pick there do not ban abjuration, you need that for magic circle for planar binding, and transmutation has too much buff spells to lose

theres no problem that cant be solved with the proper summons or planar binding

and here are sum guides to that may help

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?498825-the-Conjurer-s-Handbook
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?527203-Summoning-Handbook&p=22092940#post22092940
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?444042-Legal-3-5-Summonable-Monster-List
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?255219-The-Summoner-s-Desk-Reference-D-amp-D-3-5
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?528090-Mastering-the-Malconvoker

the one single piece of advice for summoning that is proby the most important, keep index cards of your critters stats prepared ahead of time so your not book diving and running the numbers in mid combat to keep the game flowing as smoothly as possible

radthemad4
2018-05-06, 02:51 AM
I rather like the imbued summoning metamagic (Player's Handbook II, p. 92) that lets you stick low level buffs on summons at the same time you summon them. I don't think it's worth the metamagic cost for normal casting, but it's nice as a metamagic rod (3000 GP as a lesser (3rd level spells and lower) ). Here's a list of spells it works with (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?137090-Imbue-Summoning).

The Conjurer Variants are worth looking into. Especially standard action summons and trading scribe scroll for Augment Summoning without Spell Focus: Conjuration. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#conjurerVariants)

The Nexus Method Feat (Dragon #319) is better than the Spontaneous Summoning variant as it lets you convert spells into Summon Monster spells of the same level rather than lower, but it's a regional feat.

The Beckon the Frozen feat (prereqs: Spell Focus: Conjuration, Augment Summoning) gives you the option to give (non fire type) summons the cold subtype (cold immunity, but +50% damage from fire) and +1d6 cold damage to natural attacks which is nice for creatures with lots of attacks. The major downside is the prereqs, but I'd skip it if I was short on feats.

Greenbound Summoning is ridiculously powerful, but if you're in a high power table, go for it I guess.

If you go Druid, Ashbound ( Eberron Campaign Setting, p. 50) doubles your summon nature's ally durations and adds +3 to their attacks.

noce
2018-05-06, 03:32 AM
If you want to be a Summoner at lvl 4, go Druid.
There's a 2nd level druid spell that lasts for minutes/lvl: Summon Dire Hawk.
The summoned hawk is not bad, either.

Eldariel
2018-05-06, 07:04 AM
Druid and Focused Specialist Conjurer are your best bets. Druid creatures are somewhat better while Conjurer gets more slots. On low levels, Summon Desert Ally [Sandstorm] outmuscles Summon Monster and Summon Nature's Ally (without Greenbound Summoning) rather effortlessly due to Construct bonus HP and some crazy-good creatures (Serval on SDAI for instance) so consider using that. Conjure Ice Beast [Frostburn] is also really good (Cleric-only) but sadly it's Conjuration (Creation) so things like Augment Summoning, Rapid Summoning and company do not benefit it leaving it actually worse off than Summon Desert Ally for a dedicated summoner. That said, Druid summons are the best early on due to Greenbound Summoning. That feat alone is better than everything else combined. Later on they get Rashemi Elemental Summoning though arcane casters can use that too (but SNA has elementals on a lower level than SM). However, other than that, Wizards are really good (Rapid Summoning in particular is a huge point in Wizards' favour).

So yeah, you didn't miss much. Wizard for the slots, standard action summoning and such or Druid for just simply better summon spells, better summons and the awesome that is Greenbound Summoning. Druid has a bit of a hard time getting standard action summons; Golden Desert Honey [Complete Mage] can be used with an individual spell and Ring of the Beast goes a long way.

radthemad4
2018-05-06, 01:31 PM
Conjure Ice Beast [Frostburn] is also really good (Cleric-only)Nope. Druids get those too. Also Rangers and Consecrated Harriers, whatever those are.

Goaty14
2018-05-06, 01:40 PM
Also Rangers and Consecrated Harriers, whatever those are.

Consecrated Harriers are a PrC. Rangers are a PHB base class...

Eldariel
2018-05-06, 01:53 PM
Nope. Druids get those too. Also Rangers and Consecrated Harriers, whatever those are.

Ah yeah, fair. Still, it doesn't rank very high on the Druid list.

Elrak
2018-05-08, 08:12 AM
Just throwing it out there as a possible alternative, the Savage Bard variant gets access to SNA which allows him to qualify for Greenbound Summoning one of the most OP feats out there (assuming Forgotten Realms is allowed).

It is not as powerful of a summoner as a Druid or a Focused Specialist Conjurer would be but it has quite a few other features to play around with if you want and can be played fairly early on.
Of note would also be, that normally Bardic music does not work on the plant summons which however can be overcome if you are willing to invest the appropiate rescources into it.